Social Swamp's Social Thread 3 - And now, the end is near, and so I face the final curtain...

[Chrono.]

Red
Orange
Yellow
Green
Blue
Indigo
WE NEED A VIOLET
WENEEDTHERAINBOW

[insert Rayman here]

 

[Deleted member]

Red
Orange
Yellow
Green
Blue
Indigo
WE NEED A VIOLET
WENEEDTHERAINBOW

Spyro, as unlikely as I feel he is, would be purple, which is close enough.

 

[Arcadenik]

The only two rules left are no real world fire-arms and must be a game character. And I'm not so sure about them now either.

Team Rocket with Meowth and Wobbuffet. So what if they originated in the anime... the Pokemon and the villainous organization still originated in video games... oh, and Pokemon Yellow is coming out next year... that makes Team Rocket Meowth relevant again!!!

I know many of you secretly want Team Rocket Meowth to get in... just like many people secretly wanted Cloud to get in. Only reason Cloud wasn't supported was because of the self-imposed rule about third-party characters having to have history with Nintendo... and main reason Meowth isn't supported is because of the no anime rule (that actually applies to actual anime characters like Goku, Naruto, etc. and not anime characters based on video game characters like Team Rocket Meowth). That and the self-imposed rule about having to represent each and every generation.

For real life guns, Advance Wars rep please.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

While Cloud isn't exactly my favorite character, and FFVII isn't exactly my favorite RPG, I absolutely love the precedence that this sets. All the rules and assumptions that the fan have created and contrived have all been thrown out the proverbial window. Let's not forget that Nintendo is a business. Cloud's inclusion will not only attract sales, it may even attract new fans to the series (which translates to even more sales).

Well played, Nintendo/Sakurai, well played.

On the other hand, the assumption that third-party characters needs to be iconic has strengthened even more.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

How much crap would Sakurai get from fan boys and girls if he added a Lightning Mii costume?

Which is possible considering he likes her.

 

[Khoru]

So, 3 tracks+obviously the victory screen theme+OWA and Prelude for obvious reasons

nah the victory fanfare is probably its own song
it extends into the part with the chocobos
i think the opening theme might not be in though
there have been trailer-exclusive songs before

 

[Arcadenik]

Or we could just give Team Rocket real life guns. Kills two birds with one stone.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

How much crap would Sakurai get from fan boys and girls if he added a Lightning Mii costume?

Which is possible considering he likes her.

Not too much in comparison to making her playable.

 

[Champ Gold]

How much crap would Sakurai get from fan boys and girls if he added a Lightning Mii costume?

Which is possible considering he likes her.

Lighting is super popular in Japan.

The salt will be there but she's a Mii Costume, you can just NOT buy it

 

[Deleted member]

How much crap would Sakurai get from fan boys and girls if he added a Lightning Mii costume?

Which is possible considering he likes her.

Wait, he does?
NO SAKURAI, FOR ALL THAT IS PURE IN THE WORLD
DON'T
O
N
'
T

Spoiler

Jk I can just not buy her costume

nah the victory fanfare is probably its own song
it extends into the part with the chocobos
i think the opening theme might not be in though
there have been trailer-exclusive songs before

From newcomers trailers I think the only one was a remix in Little Mac's trailer
All the other songs played during them made into the game

 

[CatRaccoonBL]

I feel like I should say this. Cloud didn't break any rules. Cloud was always possible. It was always brought up how Cloud did appear on nintendo systems. The only thing was that he was unexpected. Why was he unexpected? Because we thought characters with more Nintendo history were always more likely. But that wasn't a rule. We just thought it made them more likely.

But now suddenly everyone is being said to be possible. We are even dropping the idea that the character has to be iconic. But Cloud is still an icon. Heck, like I said even the "has to be on a Nintendo system" thing wasn't broken.

Honestly, the "has to be on a Nintendo system" is weird though because a large chunk of icons appeared on Nintendo systems. Like Crash and Spyro are thought to be icons, and they have appeared on Nintendo systems. The only two I can think off the top of my head that are icons that haven't been on a Nintendo system are Master chief or Minecraft Steve. Master Chief is most likely out because firearms. (And no this is something that Sakurai mentioned he didn't want. Unless he really does have a moveset that he can have without fire arms that can still represent a shooter game), and as for Steve...Eh. Not to sure what to make of it honestly. He's 50/50.

So I mean yeah, a lot of people are throwing their hands in the air like "Now that the Nintendo rule is broken, anything possible" when no rules were broken and even if they were, barely anything changes.

My problem isn't what you guys believe, it is how the only reason the conclusion was reached seems to be because cloud was unexpected.

 

[Bedoop]

From newcomers trailers I think the only one was a remix in Little Mac's trailer
All the other songs played during them made into the game

Kirby Air Ride's opening theme -
When Mario gets hurdled to space at the beginning of Galaxy 1 -
Mario Galaxy 1 opening theme -
Just to name a few~

 

[Khoru]

From newcomers trailers I think the only one was a remix in Little Mac's trailer
All the other songs played during them made into the game

villager's had the title to animal crossing, wft's had the yoga theme (and i think the other song too?), rosalina's had the kirby air ride theme, and junior's had a song from galaxy that i don't remember the name of

oh and ryu's had the sf2 theme

 

[Deleted member]

I'm hyped for Cloud but this made me laugh because I'm pretry sure this is how it went

Kirby Air Ride's opening theme -
When Mario gets hurdled to space at the beginning of Galaxy 1 -
Mario Galaxy 1 opening theme -
Just to name a few~

Basically, **** Galaxy

villager's had the title to animal crossing, wft's had the yoga theme (and i think the other song too?), rosalina's had the kirby air ride theme, and junior's had a song from galaxy that i don't remember the name of

oh and ryu's had the sf2 theme

Ok, maybe there were more than I thought...

 

[Kenith]

From newcomers trailers I think the only one was a remix in Little Mac's trailer
All the other songs played during them made into the game

Nope.
Bowser Jr.'s Fleet theme from Super Mario Galaxy, Kirby's Air Ride music and the intro theme from Fire Emblem Awakening are played in trailers but not featured in the game.

 

[SlickWylde]

I've never played any of the FF games, but my friend was joking saying "They should make his final Smash where he realizes he's not the cool hero he thinks he is and goes into a coma". Apparently that's part of the plot of FFVII? Is that true? If so, that's weird. I also didn't know that Cloud is ONLY in that one game. Weird how he became such a mascot for the whole series.

 

[SmashChu]

If the character is iconic, and well known then I believe they not only have a good shot but a better shot than most of the choices we have as a community.

#SteveForSmash
#MasterChiefForSmash
#CrashBandicootForSmash
#SpyroForSmash
#JillValetineForSmash

And that is ultimately the problem with the series now.

Super Smash Brothers is the only crossover where folks want and expect that the game should add content outside of it. You didn't see fans of Marvel vs Capcom asking for DC characters. Or fans of Heroes of the Storm asking for Red Alert characters. But in Smash, asking for Nintendo is seen as a bad thing. The fact that someone who wants the series to focus on Nintendo, the point of the games, is seen as a purist, is telling.

Through out all of this, I have really only seen maybe 2 folks legitimately excited for Cloud, one of which is a friend of mine who loved FF7. Most people are excited about the character only because he is an "icon". They would have been the same had MasterCheif been added. They don't care who the character is so long as its iconic.

There is an old marketing saying "Try and appeal to everyone and appeal to no one." FF fans aren't going to drop their PS4s just to get Cloud in Smash. You can't keep adding outside characters because it gets costly. Of the 26 series in the game, 5 of them are third party. 5 more stages. 5 more sets of music and trophies. I saw someone on Twitter question why he wasn't excited for Cloud. Its hard to get excited when "an icon" has been added 6 times before.

The series succeeded, in part, because it focused on Nintendo. Smash Bros appeal to Nintendo fans. There is no issue adding Nintendo characters because most of your target audience knows who they are. There is this weird assumption we have to have everyone else, and I think it's coming from a fact that these fans can look at the game and say "look at these characters" Cloud honestly looks like a boring character, which is partly why no one is excited for that. I wouldn't say I'm a purist. I'm the base. I want the Nintendo crossover to be about Nintendo. Sonic is one of my favorite game characters, but I would not bat an eye if he was cut because he's not suppose to be in Smash. Give me Sonic and Sega All Stars instead (didn't like Ralph in that game either). To put it another way, I don't want mechs and spaceships in high fantasy game. I see nothing wrong with the Nintendo fighting game being about Nintendo.

EDIT: Glad folks liked this post. I had a few typos as I did it from my phone.

 

[Bedoop]

Something I wanted to note

Remixes of Splattack and some other battle theme
I think they're pretty cool
But in all honesty
First thing I thought of when I heard the Splattack one was "Sakurai did you do this"
Mainly because the Smash + Splatoon Wii U Bundle is such a perfect little cinnamon roll

Also
Masahiro Sakurai hired Takahiro Sakurai to voice Cloud
Takahiro Masahiro
Literally 2 letters off
Japan is kooky

 

[Chrono.]

The trailer has a lot of tiny references like this it's great.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

My favorite bit is him stealing Wario's bike.

 

[Jdaster64]

Kirby Air Ride's opening theme -
When Mario gets hurdled to space at the beginning of Galaxy 1 -
Mario Galaxy 1 opening theme -
Just to name a few~

Don't remind me how much I hated that trailer for doing that. At least Mario got a lot of good music in the game anyway.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

I was thinking even if there's a no firearms law several characters from famous shooter games could still be in.

Here's an incomplete moveset for the Soldier from Team Fortress 2. His gimmick is having powerful AOE projectiles that he needs to replenish and can hurt him if not careful

A combo: Shovel Strike
Dash: Pain Train
Strong Side:
Strong Up:
Strong Down: Disciplinary action- uses the riding crop to sweep across the ground, high range low attack power
Side Smash:
Up Smash: Kamakaze (NOT!)- Performs his grenade explosion taunt from in game except he lets go of the stupid thing above his head rather than exploding in his hand
Down Smash:

Neutral Air: Spins horizontally
Forward Air: Strikes forwards with the Market Gardener, does double damage straight out of a rocket jump
Up Air:
Down Air: Fires a rocket Downward

Special: Rocket shot- Fires up to four rockets in a row. can he held an aimed
Side Special: Weapon Pickup- tosses his rocket launcher forward and picks up a new one, takes longer than reloading but changes the RL's properties as he swaps between different models
Up Special: Rocket Jumper- Fires a rocket jumper at his feet to gain height before deploying the B.A.S.E. jumper parachute
Down Special: Reload- Reloads Rocket Launcher. As Kirby doesn't have his move when copyining after Kirby has used 4 rockets he loses the power

 

[YeppersPeppers]

"I want to make the number one character-based fighter in the world." - Sakurai, E3 2014

Source: http://www.usgamer.net/articles/e3-2014-a-reminder-of-the-true-value-of-smash-bros

This isn't about just Nintendo anymore. Sakurai practically confirmed that with this statement. I can understand being upset at the loss of Nintendo focus, but I consider this an evolution of the series.

 

[RawstyleEevee]

So how many characters are all of you expecting from now on?

I'd say 2 more is pretty reasonable, but it could be 1 for all I know.

Personally I think including Cloud, 4 characters in total is not

You can buy Mewtwo, Ryu, Roy & Lucas as one pack afterall in the Eshop & I do see some simularities with Cloud & Ryu already in that they come with a home stage & that they are high profile 3rd parties aka the highlight among the DLC pack.

I see it like this way

Ryu = Cloud (the out of nowhere suprise choice of the DLC pack, that nobody deemed possible)
Roy/Lucas = Wolf (All 3 where highly requested Veterans that are not time consuming to create)
Mewtwo = Snake( Extremely popular Veteran requests & both are Gaming Icons(not saying Wolf isn't one though )
Unless Sakurai gives us Pichu for trolling I bet the last spot could go the Ballot winner & Snake can be swaped with a tweaked Ice Climber or Inkling

I'm very confident in Wolf getting in though, he is imo the most likely Veteran, but Snake's chances also skyrocketed after Clouds reveal

 

[wedl!!]

Sounds like a sort of interesting concept even if I don't like TF2 anymore (1200 hours of pain).

Too bad that he'll never be in the game because that's the most preposterous thing I've ever heard.

 

[SlickWylde]

Lighting is super popular in Japan.

The salt will be there but she's a Mii Costume, you can just NOT buy it

Sure you can. I haven't bought a single Mii costume haha. I couldn't care less about them!

 

[Chrono.]

Tbh I don't feel the Nintendo focus is lost at all.

5 guests in 50+ Nintendo roster is pretty reasonable.

Not to mention these particular characters are huge gaming juggernauts.

It's not like Viva Piñata or Blinx got in or something.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Sounds like a sort of interesting concept even if I don't like TF2 anymore (1200 hours of pain).

Too bad that he'll never be in the game because that's the most preposterous thing I've ever heard.

You weren't around for the Shrek or Goku jokes were you?

 

[Roaring Salsa]

We're talking iconic third parties, eh?


Gordon Freeman's a shoo-in! He'll be announced for Smash to coincide with the announcement of Half-Life 3.

But man...do you ever get that feeling where some of your most wanted characters are either hated or otherwise not even recognized by the Smash fanbase, so when you think about their hypothetical reveal you worry about public reception? I do sometimes. Like I'd be hyped as **** for Chrom or Henry Fleming, but at the same time I feel so many others wouldn't be. I mean they both have like no shot anyway but hey neither did Cloud amirite but still.



I ramble.

Coming from someone who supports Henry Fleming and Tingle, I totally get you

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

Even though Cloud himself hardly has any ties with Nintendo the series he comes from at least has a lot of ties with Nintendo. That's more than you can say for Snake.

 

[AncientTobacco]

Are people seriously expecting Master Chief or Steve now?

Sigh.

 

[Chrono.]

There was a problem fetching the tweet

The HD remaster looks serviceable enough.

People really need to learn the difference between remaking and remastering.

 

[Kenith]

Even though Cloud himself hardly has any ties with Nintendo the series he comes from at least has a lot of ties with Nintendo. That's more than you can say for Snake.

Yeah, while Cloud is the star of a game that's never been on a Nintendo console, he's the face of a series that has a LONG history with Nintendo...so I guess it checks out.

This probably just sounds like hindsight bias or something though...even though I support an indie character.

 

[SlickWylde]

KenboCalrissian I got that new level ready for you...

 

[NintenZ]

And that is ultimately the problem with the series now.

Super Smash Brothers is the only crossover where folks want and expect that the game should add content outside of it. You didn't see fans of Marvel vs Capcom asking for DC characters. Or fans of Heroes of the Storm asking for Red Alert characters. But in Smash, asking for Nintendo is seen as a bad thing. The fact that someone who wants the series to focus on Nintendo, the point of the games, is seen as a purist, is telling.

Through out all of this, I have really only seen maybe 2 folks legitimately excited for Cloud, one of which is a friend of mine who loved FF7. Most people are excited about the character only because he is an "icon". They would have been the same had MasterCheif been added. They don't care who the character is so long as its iconic.

There is an old marketing saying "Try and appeal to everyone and appeal to no one." FF fans aren't going to drop their PS4s just to get Cloud in Smash. You can't keep adding outside characters because it gets costly. Of the 26 series in the game, 5 of them are third party. 5 more stages. 5 more sets of music and trophies. I saw someone on Twitter question why he wasn't excited for Cloud. Its hard to get excited when "an icon" has been added 6 times before.

The series succeeded, in part, because it focused on Nintendo. Smash Bros appeal to Nintendo fans. There is no issue adding Nintendo characters because most of your target audience knows who they are. There is this weird assumption we have to have everyone else, and I think it's coming from a fact that these fans can look at the game and say "look at these characters" Cloud honestly looks like a boring character, which is partly why no one is excited for that. I would say I'm a purist. I'm the base. I want the Nintendo crossover to be about Nintendo. Sonic is one of my favorite game characters, but I would not bat an eye if he was cut because he's not suppose to be in Smash. Give me Sonic and Sega All Stars instead (didn't like Ralph in that game either). To put it another way, I don't want mechs and spaceships in avhigh fantasy game. I see nothing wrong with the Nuntendo fighting game being about Nintendo.

I've got to say, I think we've gotten enough third-party characters this time around. I think the remaining characters should be ones from Nintendo.

 

[Bedoop]

This controller I got is very strange, to say the least.

• D-Pad doesn't function normally, but it is functional once you enable it on a Control Options panel in a game or something
• There's a button that makes the D-Pad function in the Left Stick's place and disables the Left Stick
• Right Stick inputs Left when I flick it Up, inputs Right when I flick it down, and Left and Right don't function unless Control Options does a thing
• Clicking the Left Stick is Start, Clicking the Right Stick is Select, pressing Start does what clicking the Left Stick is SUPPOSED to do, and there isn't a Select Button at all
• L and R buttons are present, but they function as L2 and R2, buttons 5 and 6 function as actual L and R
• Controller isn't 360, it's moreso a fat vertical rectangle, but it does do the full 360 well, think the Gamecube Controller

Luckily all it's silly slip-ups (Minus the fat rectangle) are easily avoided as long as I'm able to edit the Control Scheme in the game I'm playing

 

[KenboCalrissian]

KenboCalrissian I got that new level ready for you...

Lay it on me, brother!

 

[PK_Wonder]

Even though Cloud himself hardly has any ties with Nintendo the series he comes from at least has a lot of ties with Nintendo. That's more than you can say for Snake.

This is the most important thing to point out to any detractor. The first six games in the series were exclusive to Nintendo (and a couple are recognized as two of the best jrpgs/games ever made), and the seventh represents a move to their biggest rival, while still considered one of the best jrpgs/games ever made. The PSone wouldn't have been even close to the success it was without FFVII. and I don't think Nintendo minds this at all. It's more about representing an insanely popular character from one of the greatest games of all-time from a franchise that has a deep history with Nintendo than it is "LOL we got a Sony character."

(Though this better mean we get FFVII HD on NX)

 

[SlickWylde]

A little off topic, but I couldn't find reliable info on google: Can you plug in 2 gamecube adapters for Smash Bros and play with 8 gamecube controllers?

 

[Kenith]

There was a problem fetching the tweet

The HD remaster looks serviceable enough.

People really need to learn the difference between remaking and remastering.

Personally, I think it looks great.
That being said, as GameXplain pointed out in their discussion, the gameplay looks better than the cutscenes.
I'd say this is because they did something similar to The Wind Waker HD with the lighting, where the change is extremely noticeable in some areas (outdoors) but almost no different from the GCN version in other places (like caves).

However it's more subtle.
With so little updating of the graphics, I'm really hoping to see some good gameplay changes.