Super Smash Bros 4 (Wii U/3DS) Topic

[Kaye Cruiser]

I didn't know of Fire Emblem or EarthBound until smash. I also thought Link's name was Zelda!

Also, I didn't know Metroid was owned by Nintendo until Smash 64, and I didn't know Mega Man wasn't owned by Nintendo until like 2000!

I think a good number of people didn't know about Fire Emblem until Melee.

I'm kinda confused on how you mixed up who owned Megaman, though. Capcom always loved slapping their name in big bold letters on the screen so you couldn't miss it. o.o

 

[Johnknight1]

Does anyone else wish the "random" button was an unlockable=???

Imagine in Brawl unlocking all 39 characters, and having 1 empty slot. You are excited about that final slot: is it Mewtwo? Roy? K. Rool? Dixie? Mega Man? Ridley? Geno? Pac-Man? Mrs. Game and Watch? And then, after all that wondering, after doing a hard accomplishment or two, you get a message "Challenger Approaching"... and you win without a fight. And it says "out of nowhere, the random button is playable" "Congratulations, you unlocked every character!"

Except Ice Climbers have files for both Popo and Nana while this only had one.

That doesn't de-confirm it. After all, it could have been scratched early in development.

 

[FlareHabanero]

pra

"p(u)rasu" = Japanese engrish "Plus"

mai

"mainasu" = Japanese engrish "Minus"

"P(u)rasaru_Mainumu" = "Plusle_Minum"

And that's basically everyone's logic on it being Plusle and Minum.

Three major problems with that.

1. If it was Plusle & Minun, why are the two sharing the same file? The characters files should be separated like how Popo and Nana are.
2. Minun when translated to Japanese is the same as in other languages, which is Minun マイナン. This is a contrast with Plusle, which is Prasle プラスル
3. Why would romanization of the Japanese names be used for Pluse & Minun, but not for other characters? Like, the files don't call Mewtwo Myuutsu ミュウツー or call Lucario Rukario ルカリオ.

 

[Diddy Kong]

There was never anything that stated Pit, Peach, and Meowth were planned for Super Smash Bros.

However, there is the implications that Pit was briefly considered for Melee, if the fiasco regarding to the Ice Climbers and wanting a character that represented the NES is taken into consideration. Along with pretty much any other characters that debuted on the NES.

Hence I also made the Melee Roster Reboot Thread. Many of the people posting there replace Ice Climbers with Pit on their rosters.

 

[Johnknight1]

I kinda want Breloom.

Grass/Fighting type could be interesting, and coupled with his fighting style (using stretchy punches to fling a shot long-distance), I think he could be a really fun character.

Breloom could be cool, but again, I don't think he's exactly Smash Bros material as much as say Plusle and Minun and a plethora of other potential newcomers.

I'm kinda confused on how you mixed up who owned Megaman, though. Capcom always loved slapping their name in big bold letters on the screen so you couldn't miss it. o.o

I thought Capcom was like Rare; owned by Nintendo.

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

Does anyone else wish the "random" button was an unlockable=???

Imagine in Brawl unlocking all 39 characters, and having 1 empty slot. You are excited about that final slot: is it Mewtwo? Roy? K. Rool? Dixie? Mega Man? Ridley? Geno? Pac-Man? Mrs. Game and Watch? And then, after all that wondering, after doing a hard accomplishment or two, you get a message "Challenger Approaching"... and you win without a fight. And it says "out of nowhere, the random button is playable" "Congratulations, you unlocked every character!"

Random turned out to be a character that morphs into different characters as it uses their moves, or morphs certain parts of it's body as it uses other attacks.

And it looks like this.

http://forums.kc-mm.com/Gallery/BrawlView.php?Number=25756

 

[Moon Monkey]

@ Moon
Even so, Meowth could do that for a few moves, but it would be repetitive, just like most of the smash 64 movesets (hence why I refer to those characters as "clones"), which is why everything was changed with those characters. The real interesting thing would be to see how Meowth has evolved since then.

So if Meowth (in this hypothetical situation) as well as the rest of the of 64 cast, had repetitive moves why should we hold this against Mewoth as a character?
And I agree it would have been interesting to see how Meowth would have evolved from 64 into Melee. Assuming that he would have pay day (for projectile use) and possibly fake out (as a possible counter) he may theoretically be a good character in Melee.

 

[Johnknight1]

I like how we all brought up previously mentioned characters that weren't playable without touching on the Forbidden Seven, sans me bringing up Dixie, and a few of us bringing up Plusle and Minun!!! I still wonder what in the heck that the Smash team could have done with Toon Zelda/Sheik (Tetra). That still perplexes me to this day.

I mean, I know what they could do with Dixie (with Diddy they would be a broken team), I am certain I know what Plusle and Minun would look like, but Toon Sheik (Tetra) is just a strange idea. What would that look like, and how would that even function=???

I find it funny that character almost made it into the game while people were still debating over Wolf Link and Midna (alone or separate), Zant, and Tingle!

 

[LiteralGrill]

Does anyone else wish the "random" button was an unlockable=???

Imagine in Brawl unlocking all 39 characters, and having 1 empty slot. You are excited about that final slot: is it Mewtwo? Roy? K. Rool? Dixie? Mega Man? Ridley? Geno? Pac-Man? Mrs. Game and Watch? And then, after all that wondering, after doing a hard accomplishment or two, you get a message "Challenger Approaching"... and you win without a fight. And it says "out of nowhere, the random button is playable" "Congratulations, you unlocked every character!"



That doesn't de-confirm it. After all, it could have been scratched early in development.

I just want a ditto character instead of a random button. Ditto is an obvious choice, but... heck, for those interested I wrote a blog thing about it a while back that is very interesting.

Spoiler

Hello everyone, I'm here to talk about an interesting idea: a Ditto Fighter for smash. A special thanks to Sinn who mentioned this idea on the Wii Fit Trainer boards during a discussion.

For those who might not know what this is, click this little link right here: Ditto Fighter

Essentialy, this character would be selected, then would become a random character during the match (or if programming could be amazing, change the character each stock).

Sinn specifically suggested Poo from Earthbound do to his Mirro ability, doing something like with with Miis was also suggested, along with the use of the old wire frame characters possibly (thanks to qdMbp for that one!)

Namco has put characters like this in several of their games, using them throughout the Tekken and Soul Calibur series. With them working on the new smash, might a character like this have a possibility of being in smash?

Another thought, might be the programming limitations of the 3DS make a character like this a problem. Sinn mentioned:

"I read somewhere that the time it takes Zelda to transform into Sheik is dependent on how fast the console loads her. I'm not sure if this is the same as for Pokemon Trainer's swap outs, but I imagine it probably is. From a data standpoint, the ditto character would need to load which characters it would be able to morph into for that particular fight (based on its opponents). Going on just the Brawl roster, the most complicated set up would be a fight with Zelda, Pokemon Trainer, and Samus, since that would give the ditto a total of seven different characters to change into at any point during the fight. Yet, from the perspective of RAM, those characters' data would already be active in the match, so I don't THINK it would use much more in terms of system resources. All it would do is swap one character out for another. In fact, loading it might actually be FASTER since the character the ditto is changing into would have to already be loaded and onscreen when it changes.

Anyway, that's just a theory. I could be completely mistaken on how the mechanics work. But I'm pretty sure that, compared to having a ditto fighter that just keeps the same character model the whole time, it would still be a LOT easier to make."
If this is true, a Ditto Fighter could very well be manageable in a smash game, if anyone has serious programming experience or might be able to explain the Sheik/PokeTrainer mechanics post below!
So, the biggest questions are:
Would you like to see a Ditto Fighter?
If we had a Ditto Fighter, which Nintendo character would be best to represent it?
That's my random thought today. I might pop out some more of these when I run into something curious, so keep a look out!
(Again a super special thanks to Sinn for inspiring me to write this up! Thanks for the cool ideas!)

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Breloom could be cool, but again, I don't think he's exactly Smash Bros material as much as say Plusle and Minun and a plethora of other potential newcomers.

I'm not saying I think it's all that likely, I just think it'd be a cool and original idea.

 

[Mr.Universe]

I kinda want Breloom.

Grass/Fighting type could be interesting, and coupled with his fighting style (using stretchy punches to fling a shot long-distance), I think he could be a really fun character.

Yeah, I can already see his moveset
Spore, Focus Punch, Substitute and Seed Bomb

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

Three major problems with that.

1. If it was Plusle & Minun, why are the two sharing the same file? The characters files should be separated like how Popo and Nana are.
2. Minun when translated to Japanese is the same as in other languages, which is Minun マイナン. This is a contrast with Plusle, which is Prasle プラスル
3. Why would romanization of the Japanese names be used for Pluse & Minun, but not for other characters? Like, the files don't call Mewtwo Myuutsu ミュウツー or call Lucario Rukario ルカリオ.

Because Japanese doesn't say Plus or Minus any other way. Plus, they don't have actual "l"s in their language, remember?

Which is odd cause their r's sound like l's and their l's sound like r's.

And there are plenty of files on the iso that DO use the romanization, actually.

Besides, Popo and Nana's files ARE one in the same for both their outfits, animations, and their movesets. I would know, I'm a moveset hacker and have dabbled with them before.

 

[Johnknight1]

So if Meowth (in this hypothetical situation) as well as the rest of the of 64 cast, had repetitive moves why should we hold this against Mewoth as a character?
And I agree it would have been interesting to see how Meowth would have evolved from 64 into Melee. Assuming that he would have pay day (for projectile use) and possibly fake out (as a possible counter) he may theoretically be a good character in Melee.

1. Meowth's claw attack would function like many attacks in Melee, like various characters' down air.
2. It definitely would be all about the evolution for Meowth. In Smash 64 he would have undoubtedly been not so good. Melee is a different story altogether.
3. I thought Fake Out first came into being in Gen III, which was after Melee...

 

[Jedisupersonic]

Yeah, I can already see his moveset
Spore, Focus Punch, Substitute and Seed Bomb

I actually saw Drain Punch haha.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Also, don't be surprised if My Player becomes reality.

Remember, there's going to be more of a focus on customization this time around for the next games.

 

[Johnknight1]

Hence I also made the Melee Roster Reboot Thread. Many of the people posting there replace Ice Climbers with Pit on their rosters.

Considering how bad Pit was in Brawl (just an awkward character) and how good the Ice Climbers have been in Melee and Brawl, that makes no sense.

That is literally like saying Pichu is a better smash bros. playable character than Sheik; it just makes no sense whatsoever.

Random turned out to be a character that morphs into different characters as it uses their moves, or morphs certain parts of it's body as it uses other attacks.

What if the random character/button (in either Brawl or Smash 3DS and Smash WiiU) was actually...

...NON-SPECIFIC ACTION FIGURE=???

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I actually saw Drain Punch haha.

Mach Punch/Sky Uppercut is a necessity, you fools.

 

[Moon Monkey]

Hence I also made the Melee Roster Reboot Thread. Many of the people posting there replace Ice Climbers with Pit on their rosters.

I don't know if I would like it if Pit made it in Melee. Based off the Trophy model at the time he would have looked like this:

Spoiler

I like his new reboot design that he received in Brawl

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Three major problems with that.

1. If it was Plusle & Minun, why are the two sharing the same file? The characters files should be seperated like how Popa and Nana are.

It could have been a starter file or a placeholder and would have later had two seperate files made for them after doing some work on them.

Nothing I have to argue on the other two though.

 

[FalKoopa]

Remember, there's going to be more of a focus on customization this time around for the next games.

But isn't the customization on the "dirctionality" of the attacks?

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I don't know if I would like it if Pit made it in Melee. Based off the Trophy model at the time he would have looked like this:

Spoiler

At the time I didn't like Pit just because of how he looked. I'm glad he was redesigned later.

 

[Johnknight1]

Also, don't be surprised if My Player becomes reality.

Remember, there's going to be more of a focus on customization this time around for the next games.

My Player=??? You mean a Mii=??? Although I doubt it will have a moveset you can make, because that would be stupid; if you disagree with me, go look how other fighting games create-a-character functions work, how it overshadows the other characters, and how often such characters tend to be beyond broken.

Also, I doubt a Fire Emblem character of the such would make it. We'll get Marth and Ike, plus either Roy, Chrom, both Roy and Chrom, or no one.

And that is enough Fire Emblem character discussion for me today, sans anything about how awesome Roy could be, or Ike and Marth returning!

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

RANDOM BRELOOM SUPPORT TIME.

 

[Johnknight1]

Mach Punch/Sky Uppercut is a necessity, you fools.

Lucario has Sky Uppercut as its' Up Smash in Project M, and it is awesome. It really increases his range, and it almost works for the air (above him) like how Lucario's down air works for the air below him (but obviously not as good). It really is a fun attack.

Also, Mach Punch would be an epic attack. It could be like Pikachu's/Luigi's/Ike's forward B, but instead, be a quick punch, possibly even able to make itself into a combo (with the forward B attack, which would obviously be its' input), much like Marth's forward B in Melee, only not as strong and more reliable.

 

[Pyra]

2. Minun when translated to Japanese is the same as in other languages, which is Minun マイナン. This is a contrast with Plusle, which is Prasle プラスル

Haha, "Mainan" and "Purasuru".

 

[Mr.Universe]

RANDOM BRELOOM SUPPORT TIME.

I'm really glad you posted that, because all these years I never knew how Breloom freaking punched.

 

[Johnknight1]

I just want a ditto character instead of a random button. Ditto is an obvious choice, but... heck, for those interested I wrote a blog thing about it a while back that is very interesting.

I think Ditto was actually considered as a "random" character for Melee. Actually, I'm pretty sure there is some Ditto data on the Melee disc leftover, actually.

Edit: This remix of Dr. Wily Castle 1 from Mega Man 2 is epic!!!!

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Breloom's arms are suppose to be able to stretch out a lot farther than what I saw from that video

 

[Moon Monkey]

1. Meowth's claw attack would function like many attacks in Melee, like various characters' down air.
2. It definitely would be all about the evolution for Meowth. In Smash 64 he would have undoubtedly been not so good. Melee is a different story altogether.
3. I thought Fake Out first came into being in Gen III, which was after Melee...

1) Mr. G&W Back + Air and Metaknight Forward + Air comes to mind when i think of the nature of Meowth's attacks.
2) I think given Meowth's size and the nature of his light multi-hit attacks. He would be at least Mid tier.
3) I think your right. Then for this case I'll substitute that Fake-Out with Faint Attack, since it basically will that fake out/sucker punch type of move by description

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I'm really glad you posted that, because all these years I never knew how Breloom freaking punched.

I think Breloom is also the only wild Pokemon in Hoenn that kicked Pikachu's *** in the anime.

@Psycho: They can, I'm sure, but that wouldn't really be balanced at all, now would it?

 

[Wario Bros.]

I think Ditto was actually considered as a "random" character for Melee. Actually, I'm pretty sure there is some Ditto data on the Melee disc leftover, actually.

Edit: This remix of Dr. Wily Castle 1 from Mega Man 2 is epic!!!!

In tournament mode, yes, Ditto was the random icon.

EDIT: and Ditto is an unused Poké Ball Pokémon in Melee with incomplete data.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

The chicken-Poke in the second match has a divekick. He's gotta be top tier.

@ John: Ahhhhhhhhhhhh Sixto Sounds. One of his many awesome remixes. Look for the one he did for Super Dodgeball, bro. It's ****ing amazing.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Johnknight1]

I'm really glad you posted that, because all these years I never knew how Breloom freaking punched.

I've seen clips from the anime, so I'm pretty used to the extendable arms by now.

Breloom's arms are suppose to be able to stretch out a lot farther than what I saw from that video

I think its' arms stretched out like 2 or 3 lengths of its' body, even. It had straight up Piccolo arms yo!!!

In tournament mode, yes, Ditto was the random icon.

And there is data for Ditto in Melee in the actual gameplay on the Melee disc.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

The chicken-Poke in the second match has a divekick. He's gotta be top tier.

@ John: Ahhhhhhhhhhhh Sixto Sounds. One of his many awesome remixes.

Smooth Criminal

I'm guessing you're referring to Combusken.

Also, I love the "lethal joke" character in Type: Wild.

 

[Wario Bros.]

And there is data for Ditto in Melee in the actual gameplay on the Melee disc.

Yep!

 

[Smooth Criminal]

I'm guessing you're referring to Combusken.

Yeah, sorry. I'm a little out of touch with later Gens. xD Thanks.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Johnknight1]

1) Mr. G&W Back + Air and Metaknight Forward + Air comes to mind when i think of the nature of Meowth's attacks.
2) I think given Meowth's size and the nature of his light multi-hit attacks. He would be at least Mid tier.
3) I think your right. Then for this case I'll substitute that Fake-Out with Faint Attack, since it basically will that fake out/sucker punch type of move by description

1. I was thinking more of a Bowser forward air/forward B for a forward air (albeit much weaker and quite a bit quicker, but still with some surprisingly good range).
2. In Smash 64, I doubt he'd be very good. In Melee, I doubt he would be bad.
3. Either way, both moves would be freak. Heck, have them both if Meowth is ever playable. Just don't keep everything conventional to scratching and clawing. Give him a few tail smacks, a few normal type attacks, and a bit of biting here and there to spice things up, and to keep the originality and uniqueness cooking!!!

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Gotta love this "lethal joke" character.

And yes, that is a Pinsir.

 

[Mr.Universe]

1. I was thinking more of a Bowser forward air/forward B for a forward air (albeit much weaker and quite a bit quicker, but still with some surprisingly good range).
2. In Smash 64, I doubt he'd be very good. In Melee, I doubt he would be bad.
3. Either way, both moves would be freak. Heck, have them both if Meowth is ever playable. Just don't keep everything conventional to scratching and clawing. Give him a few tail smacks, a few normal type attacks, and a bit of biting here and there to spice things up, and to keep the originality and uniqueness cooking!!!

And he should have Pay Day too!

 

[Johnknight1]

@ John: Ahhhhhhhhhhhh Sixto Sounds. One of his many awesome remixes. Look for the one he did for Super Dodgeball, bro. It's ****ing amazing.

I've actually already done it, and yeah, it was pretty amazing.

Also, if you never heard it, here's Ashane's take on a Ninja Gaiden II (NES) song called "Ninjascape." It is incredible, and just pure rock 'n' roll after the first 1:20 or so. I got this epic blasting mega awesome song on Wario Ware in Project M, without the intro... which despite being cut, is still an epic intro!