Super Smash Bros 4 (Wii U/3DS) Topic

[Moon Monkey]

So wait, Swamp and Habanero gave me two different answers... So which is it?

Also, I'll check out Harmoknight, though I lack the 3DS atm..

It's All the above and a bit more. Some levels are rhythm based:

Spoiler

...some are traditional platfromer levels:

Spoiler

...and some are crazy chase levels; where you chase a treasure chest through some intense levels that require some BOSS reflexes:

Spoiler

Also there this is an all new WiiU specific game-mode where the characters is set to constantly run and you use the game pads to tap and drag environmental items to help the character as they run across the level:

Spoiler

 

[Deleted member]

Alright, well I'm convinced. Whenever I get around to getting a WiiU, I'll be picking this up.

 

[Wario Bros.]

So wait, Swamp and Habanero gave me two different answers... So which is it?

Also, I'll check out Harmoknight, though I lack the 3DS atm..

Swampasaur is only talking about the rhythm levels, which isn't the whole game. Like Habanero said it's three different level types: Normal, Music, and Murphy levels.

 

[ChronoBound]

Congrats to NOA for trolling Tharja and horny fanboys:

It will be even more delicious if NOE ends up censoring it too.

Truth be told, it was tasteless and out of place for FE to even include something like this to begin with.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Also in other news, my Brawl disk is busted. That thing has be worn down to the bone.

It will be even more delicious if NOE ends up censoring it too.

They kind of already did that, but they also censored some more stuff too.

 

[Opossum]

Huh. They actually censored it, go figure.

...just wondering, did they edit any of the other three?

 

[Moon Monkey]

I'm still wondering what they are going to do with Ezio in Rayman Legends.

 

[ChronoBound]

They kind of already did that, but they also censored some more stuff too.

View attachment 473

I wish they went one step further and actually removed Tharja and Nowi from the game (especially Nowi).

 

[ChronoBound]

It was disturbing in general that conversation existed at all in a FE game. That kind of crap belongs in lonely otaku games, not Fire Emblem.

Really, the plot, dialogue, and characters were among FE13's weakest points. Its really shameful the kind of stuff that happened with FE13.

 

[FlareHabanero]

I wish they went one step further and actually removed Tharja and Nowi from the game (especially Nowi).

But then how are we going to compliment Tharja's boingy bits hair?

It was disturbing in general that conversation existed at all in a FE game. That kind of crap belongs in lonely otaku games, not Fire Emblem.

Really, the plot, dialogue, and characters were among FE13's weakest points. Its really shameful the kind of stuff that happened with FE13.

Well, to be fair, the game is rated T, so stuff like that sneaking by is to be expected. However, the amount displayed might be a tad overkill considering the context of the series.

However, I kind of do like some of the characters in FE13, but mainly the side characters like Kellam, Henry, Gerome, and Say'ri. The main ones like Chrom and Lucina are uninteresting for the most part, aside from the brief wisecrack once every blue moon.

 

[Fastblade5035]

However, I kind of do like some of the characters in FE13, but mainly the side characters like Kellam, Henry, Gerome, and Say'ri. .

Agree, but Gerome... is an ass to everyone. I hate him.
But Kellam, Henry, and Say'ri are cool. Not my favorites, but definitely in my top 15.

 

[Pazzo.]

It was disturbing in general that conversation existed at all in a FE game. That kind of crap belongs in lonely otaku games, not Fire Emblem.

Really, the plot, dialogue, and characters were among FE13's weakest points. Its really shameful the kind of stuff that happened with FE13.

I don't know, the bit with the DLC was low, but I grew found of a few characters.... I guess it just depended on what supports you got.

EDIT: Oh, and I loved Henry and Owain too.

 

[Deleted member]

Lol. Boingy bits.
That's a new one.

 

[Gingerbread Man]

Nothing wrong with the dialogue and personalities of the characters. But the visual design and DLC can at times be especially disturbing....

 

[FlareHabanero]

Speaking of which, one thing that has bothered me about Nintendo games in general is that the side characters are more interesting then the main character. It doesn't help that most of the main characters a more silent then a pile of sand and just as developed. I like it when that is averted, which is why I appreciate games like Kid Icarus: Uprising and Xenoblade.

 

[Deleted member]

Haven't played Xenoblade; Shulk's actually an interesting main character?

 

[FlareHabanero]

Haven't played Xenoblade; Shulk's actually an interesting main character?

He's more interesting then a lot of RPG heroes out there that's for sure. In fact, pretty much everyone is pretty fleshed out, which is helped by the Heart-to-Heart feature which allows you to interact between two characters for character development purposes.

Xenoblade in general deviates a lot from typical Nintendo fare, which is nice.

 

[Jaedrik]

It was disturbing in general that conversation existed at all in a FE game. That kind of crap belongs in lonely otaku games, not Fire Emblem.

Japan.

Truth be told, it was tasteless and out of place for FE to even include something like this to begin with.

Japan.

Well, to be fair, the game is rated T, so stuff like that sneaking by is to be expected. However, the amount displayed might be a tad overkill considering the context of the series.

Japan.

Nothing wrong with the dialogue and personalities of the characters. But the visual design and DLC can at times be especially disturbing....

I agree, and I loved the dialogue, story, and characters. But Japan.

 

[Deleted member]

He's more interesting then a lot of RPG heroes out there that's for sure. In fact, pretty much everyone is pretty fleshed out, which is helped by the Heart-to-Heart feature which allows you to interact between two characters for character development purposes.

Xenoblade in general deviates a lot from typical Nintendo fare, which is nice.

Hmm. So you would say the game is rather character driven, yes?

 

[FlareHabanero]

Hmm. So you would say the game is rather character driven, yes?

It's pretty character driven, I could even argue it's one the most character driven game Nintendo has ever produced. Though that's not much of a competition considering Nintendo games that have a focus on characterization are few and far between.

 

[Big-Cat]

It was disturbing in general that conversation existed at all in a FE game. That kind of crap belongs in lonely otaku games, not Fire Emblem.

Really, the plot, dialogue, and characters were among FE13's weakest points. Its really shameful the kind of stuff that happened with FE13.

Oh, boo hoo. Why do you make such a fuss about these kind of things? I just find it funny.

It's pretty character driven, I could even argue it's one the most character driven game Nintendo has ever produced. Though that's not much of a competition considering Nintendo games that have a focus on characterization are few and far between.

And when they do outside of Zelda, it comes out awkward.

 

[ChronoBound]

I agree, and I loved the dialogue, story, and characters. But Japan.

There was actually some long-time FE fans in Japan that were complaining about the story and fanservice for FE13 too.

I posted some review score aggregates on a Japanese fan review game website for the entire FE series (sans FE1 and FE2), and the overall score for FE13 was lower than every FE game except FE8 and FE11 due to those particular long time fans being bitter about the direction that happened with FE13.

Oh, boo hoo. Why do you make such a fuss about these kind of things? I just find it funny.

Because its inappropriate for FE.

Also, you are not one to talk considering you have often complained about the direction that happened with Smash Bros., and there was at least a precedence for Smash Bros. going in the direction it did since Sakurai always tried to make Smash Bros. a sort of "anti-fighter".

 

[FlareHabanero]

And when they do outside of Zelda, it comes out awkward.

In my opinion, Nintendo can do characterization well if the effort is put into it. The problem is that traditions are preventing that from happening for the most part, and when it does take that direction they do it in an awkward way like with Metroid: Other M. However, that's mainly from the prospective of the protagonist, for side characters tend to avert the bland label more often due to the lack of "silent protagonist syndrome" preventing character development of any sort.

 

[---]

Kinda hope a new Star Fox game comes out so it can continue a bit of what Uprising did with it's script. Building off the memes from SF64, references like ROB.64, F-Zero, or Smash stuff, hell even making fun of "fanbases" would be pure gold.

With FE13 the things that ruined the plot would be poor structuring and My Unit. The Gaiden stuff wasn't needed at all and honestly would have been better spent as FE14 (Chrom (Marth) vs. Walhart (Alm) fighting each other in addition to arguing ideals would have been great story and gameplay wise). My Unit shouldn't be the main plot devise as it completely rubs out Chrom/Lucina, needs to be like FE7 or FE12. Shouldn't also alienate FE veterans and newcomers with rewriting stuff from past games or making heavy references to it.

 

[ChronoBound]

For those that might misinterpret my statements about FE13 in Japan, I am not saying that FE13 was not well-received, but rather there is a minority of FE fans that really did not like what was done with FE13 for its story and the DLC (they gave the game absurdly low reviews, which brought the overall score aggregate down).

 

[~automatic]

There are people like that everywhere. Even in this very thread.

 

[Big-Cat]

Because its inappropriate for FE.

Also, you are not one to talk considering you have often complained about the direction that happened with Smash Bros., and there was at least a precedence for Smash Bros. going in the direction it did since Sakurai always tried to make Smash Bros. a sort of "anti-fighter".

At least I'm constructive with my criticism. And I have never heard anyone except for maybe SmashChu say Sakurai calling it an "anti-fighter". It was always an alternative (with questionable design decisions), not an anti-fighter, whatever that means.

In my opinion, Nintendo can do characterization well if the effort is put into it. The problem is that traditions are preventing that from happening for the most part, and when it does take that direction they do it in an awkward way like with Metroid: Other M. However, that's mainly from the prospective of the protagonist, for side characters tend to avert the bland label more often due to the lack of "silent protagonist syndrome" preventing character development of any sort.

I think the whole silent protagonist thing is very overrated and arguably out of date at this point.

Though I question if the world is ready for a more vocal Link or not yet.

Kinda hope a new Star Fox game comes out so it can continue a bit of what Uprising did with it's script. Building off the memes from SF64, references like ROB.64, F-Zero, or Smash stuff, hell even making fun of "fanbases" would be pure gold.

With FE13 the things that ruined the plot would be poor structuring and My Unit. The Gaiden stuff wasn't needed at all and honestly would have been better spent as FE14 (Chrom (Marth) vs. Walhart (Alm) fighting each other in addition to arguing ideals would have been great story and gameplay wise). My Unit shouldn't be the main plot devise as it completely rubs out Chrom/Lucina, needs to be like FE7 or FE12. Shouldn't also alienate FE veterans and newcomers with rewriting stuff from past games or making heavy references to it.

I'll agree that the Avatar getting so much attention is something that is nuisance. If you didn't know better, you'd think it'd be a well written self-insert fanfiction.

For those that might misinterpret my statements about FE13 in Japan, I am not saying that FE13 was not well-received, but rather there is a minority of FE fans that really did not like what was done with FE13 for its story and the DLC (they gave the game absurdly low reviews, which brought the overall score aggregate down).

Every thing has its haters so I don't see why FE13's negative minority is such a big deal. And this is the reason why we need to see the standard deviation for reviews of anything. It gives you a better idea of the common consensus.

 

[Deleted member]

It's pretty character driven, I could even argue it's one the most character driven game Nintendo has ever produced. Though that's not much of a competition considering Nintendo games that have a focus on characterization are few and far between.

Welp, that pretty much seals Shulk's fate for Smash, don't you think?
Sakurai was complaining about the lack of character-driven series during Brawl's development.


On an unrelated note, I just realized that Sonic Generations pretty much just killed the entire franchise unless the franchise is given a reboot.
Due to Generations, nothing post-Sonic 2 happened in the timeline. Why? Because Classic Eggman (Robotnik) is stuck in an empty void with Modern Eggman.

 

[Big-Cat]

I really hope they try harder on making their games more character driven. I think character driven TV and videogames are something that's start to become more of a norm now which is good.

 

[Banjodorf]

I have to agree you guys are getting a little too uptight about what "belongs" in a series that still holds true to its routes with gameplay and interesting characters (which are, by the way it's selling points). I find things like that amusing, and it seems so...pointless to get bent out of shape about optional content that doesn't impact the series as a whole.

It gets a little publicity, but any exposure is good exposure for a series that was so non-mainstream as FE was before Awakening.

Besides, I like Tharja, some people don't, but it's an archetype. The game covers lots of those. Then again, I know that sometimes members of SWF aren't very respective of other's opinions, not to name any names. Lets not have this evolve into that.

I'm also a person who really despises censorship in general, but hey.

 

[Big-Cat]

I like Tharja too. Compared to other Nintendo characters I'm familiar with, she was a breath of fresh air. Reminded me of a more reserved Juri.

And the censoring is so freaking obvious, and it's not even that bad. You see that much skin on girls at the beach.

 

[Gingerbread Man]

Kinda hope a new Star Fox game comes out so it can continue a bit of what Uprising did with it's script. Building off the memes from SF64, references like ROB.64, F-Zero, or Smash stuff, hell even making fun of "fanbases" would be pure gold.

With FE13 the things that ruined the plot would be poor structuring and My Unit. The Gaiden stuff wasn't needed at all and honestly would have been better spent as FE14 (Chrom (Marth) vs. Walhart (Alm) fighting each other in addition to arguing ideals would have been great story and gameplay wise). My Unit shouldn't be the main plot devise as it completely rubs out Chrom/Lucina, needs to be like FE7 or FE12. Shouldn't also alienate FE veterans and newcomers with rewriting stuff from past games or making heavy references to it.

What ruined the plot structure was the fact that the whole game went off on a long tangent dealing with the conflict in Valm with Walhart. It diffused the focus of the game further when the game was already lacking the amount of detail put into previous installments. Overall it made the game seem sort of rushed and near end game battles/goals seeming slightly unfamiliar and out of the blue. The plot should have continued with Validar after Gangrel.

I'm not completely sure what your talking about with MU rubbing out chrom/lucina. He/she may have taken some spotlight just like any other character would have but the story surrounding the character fit in with Chrom and lucina's just fine.

 

[Big-Cat]

Walhart reminded me so much of Sagat, it wasn't funny.

 

[ChronoBound]

At least I'm constructive with my criticism. And I have never heard anyone except for maybe SmashChu say Sakurai calling it an "anti-fighter". It was always an alternative (with questionable design decisions), not an anti-fighter, whatever that means.

I have used constructive criticism about FE13's flaws in other threads. However, it does not take a rocket scientist to figure out how something like Nowi is absolutely inappropriate.

Secondly, Sakurai has specifically talked about making Smash Bros. diametrically different from most other fighters, with one of the key things he has complained about other fighting series being "accessability".

 

[FlareHabanero]

Sakurai was complaining about the lack of character-driven series during Brawl's development.

I've never heard of a statement like that. I'm aware of the one about there being a lack of feasible fighters between Pikmin and Brawl, but not he's looking for a series that's character-driven. But, maybe I'm just missing something.

As for the statement in particular, I can see why he had that mentality. Between those games, most of the new IPs released were more niche and laid back with very few of the characters showing extensive combat. It doesn't help that during that time Nintendo was going through a more casual mentality and releasing stuff like Brain Age, Nintendogs, Wii Sports, and Electroplankton. I think the only ones that could of worked in theory is Starfy from The Legendary Starfy and the hero/heroine from Magical Vacation.

This time around however, it might be averted. Stuff like Xenoblade, Pandora's Tower, The Last Story, and Dillon's Rolling Western can provide the characters that would be feasible fighters without a catch.

 

[Deleted member]

I've never heard of a statement like that. I'm aware of the one about there being a lack of feasible fighters between Pikmin and Brawl, but not he's looking for a series that's character-driven. But, maybe I'm just missing something.

As for the statement in particular, I can see why he had that mentality. Between those games, most of the new IPs released were more niche and laid back with very few of the characters showing extensive combat. it doesn't help that during that time Nintendo was going through a more casual mentality and releasing stuff like Brain Age, Nintendogs, and Electroplankton. I think the only ones that could of worked in theory is Starfy from The Legendary Starfy and the hero/heroine from Magical Vacation.

He was more or less saying that there hasn't been many, not so much that was a requirement he was looking for.

It’s an incredible number of characters and a group of really well-known series. And to think that they all had their beginnings in Japan...wow!
When they’re all lined up like this, it becomes obvious that there is roughly 6-year blank before and after Pikmin. While there have been big series since then like "Animal Crossing," "Brain Age: Train Your Brain in Minutes a Day," and "Wii Sports" it does seem that coming up with a completely new character-driven series has gotten more difficult recently.

 

[Metal Overlord]

That's the same thing that he just said though lol

Different from most fighters = alternative choice

 

[Big-Cat]

That's the same thing that he just said though lol

Different from most fighters = alternative choice

And an alternative does not mean an opposite choice like the term "anti-fighter" would imply.

On the topic of Smash's direction, do you feel that the decision to use tilts and Smashes was a good idea, especially from an accessibility standpoint?

 

[FlareHabanero]

He was more or less saying that there hasn't been many, not so much that was a requirement he was looking for.

Well if we're looking at the more expansive games, yes his statement makes more sense. While it's true that technically speaking that there have been roughly a dozen new IP's have been released between Pikmin and Brawl, extremely few of them could provide the substance for stuff like characters, stages, music, trophies, and such. Again debatable, but only The Legendary Starfy and Magical Vacation could provide that in theory.

 

[Banjodorf]

I have used constructive criticism about FE13's flaws in other threads. However, it does not take a rocket scientist to figure out how something like Nowi is absolutely inappropriate.

I suppose we just feel differently about this sort of thing. I just sort of find Nowi's personality amusing. I've seen Lolis show up other places, and it really doesn't bother me I suppose. Different levels of passion, maybe?