Super Smash Bros 4 (Wii U/3DS) Topic

[Deleted member]

Are we talking following the game's rules or just assumptions? Because at this point there's a theory that says that Genesect is a robotic Kabutops. Or that Entei, Raikou and Suicune are hyper versions of Flareon, Jolteon and Vaporeon.
Also, pokédex entries sometimes even contradict themselves in different games, just sayin'.

But the dex entries are Canon. You can't argue with canon facts even if it contradicts itself. Sometimes it could just be that it's contradictory because you aren't able to see the full picture yet. This is where fan-theories begin to crop up. But in all honesty, if it is deliberately stated in the games, it is true unless retconned. Thus, Entei, Raikou and Suicune could indeed be hyper versios of the orginal Eevee trio, unless retconned. Arcanine to this day is still labeled as a legendary pokemon in the dex, and Entei's dex entry is still cited as recently as Gen4 in SoulSilver, so imo, I'd say it holds true. Legendary Pokemon are not as rare as people want them to be. There are multiple versions of the same Legendary Roaming around, barring maybe Arceus, since it's the creator Pokemon.

And interesting theory also, is that Ditto are failed Mew clones, and that Mew is the Origin of all the Pokemon. Both make sense and are nice food-for-thought.

 

[Vintage Creep]

I agree pokétheories can be extremely interesting and appealing, but I think they're just the result of fans giving a lot of thought in what they like the most. As much as I like and respect GameFreak, my cynicism makes me think that they don't care that much about mythology and stuff, and all these theories are just coincidences which led people to think that were intentional.
Like in the show Lost, I don't know if you saw that. In the end, some things that were considered facts were just smoke, and the writers didn't even think about those at all.
Like, Mew in the first gens was basically the semi-official origin off all Pokémons. Then GameFreak created Arceus, why? Well because they had to sell the fourth gen, that's why.
The Clefable/Gengar theory: imho, one of the two is just a recolored sprite which was actually intended to be an evolution (or the male/female form?) of the other, but then GameFreak decided to use the artwork for a different pokémon entirely. To fill a spot, to not waste its design, you decide the actual reason. The "Gengar is Clefable's shadow" thing was born afterwards, and I'm fairly certain that even if fascinating and imaginative, it wasn't at all intended by GameFreak. The same goes for the Ditto theory.
In the end anyway we can absolutely don't care and take it as canon/official. It wouldn't surprise me if GameFreak actually recognized this theories as facts just to please the fans, it would be actually nice from them (like all the Hyrule timeline thing).

 

[Moon Monkey]

This is true, so far. But we've seen the mold break before, it could always happen again.

Also, I agree on that list. It's the generally accepted list so far. I'm only saying, Arcanine hits some fuzzy ground because of Dex entries. So we'll have to see if GameFreak either retcons that, or works with it thus extending the definition of a legendary even more.

You can gather a lot of $h!t from the Pokedex logs of these Pokemon. Arcanine is a Legendary Pokemon....in China.
[collapse= Pokedex Logs for Arcanine]
Red/Blue - A Pokémon that has been admired since the past for its beauty. It runs agilely as if on wings.
Yellow - A legendary Pokémon in China. Many people are charmed by its grace and beauty while running.
Stadium - A Pokémon whose beauty is legendary in China. It is said to run gracefully and lightly, as if it were flying.
Gold - This legendary Chinese Pokémon is considered magnificent. Many people are enchanted by its grand mane.
Silver - Its magnificent bark conveys a sense of majesty. Anyone hearing it can't help but grovel before it.
Crystal - An ancient picture scroll shows that people were attracted to its movement as it ran through prairies
Ruby/Saphire - Arcanine is known for its high speed. It is said to be capable of running over 6,200 miles in a single day and night. The fire that blazes wildly within this Pokémon's body is its source of power.
Emerald - This fleet-footed Pokémon is said to run over 6,200 miles in a single day and night. The fire that blazes wildly within its body is its source of power.
FR - A Pokémon that is described in Chinese legends. It is said to race at an unbelievable speed.
LG - A Pokémon that has long been admired for its beauty. It runs agilely as if on wings
D/P/Pl - Its proud and regal appearance has captured the hearts of people since long ago.
HG - This legendary Chinese Pokémon is considered magnificent. Many people are enchanted by its grand mane.
SS - Its magnificent bark conveys a sense of majesty. Anyone hearing it can't help but grovel before it.
B/W - Its proud and regal appearance has captured the hearts of people since long ago.
B/W 2 - The sight of it running over 6,200 miles in a single day and night has captivated many people.
[/collapse]

 

[Vintage Creep]

Lol even the fact that China is an actual country in the Pokémon world is... weird.

 

[Moon Monkey]

It is kind of weird. I know that Kanto was inspired by Japan and Unova was inspired by New York. But to flat out just mention China is weird I wonder if X/Y's region will be the China region

 

[Deleted member]

Oh, I agree entirely Vintage. Pokemon is nothing but wasted potential for a quick buck. It really is disappointing, because it could be SO much better.

You can gather a lot of $h!t from the Pokedex logs of these Pokemon. Arcanine is a Legendary Pokemon....in China.
[collapse= Pokedex Logs for Arcanine]
Red/Blue - A Pokémon that has been admired since the past for its beauty. It runs agilely as if on wings.
Yellow - A legendary Pokémon in China. Many people are charmed by its grace and beauty while running.
Stadium - A Pokémon whose beauty is legendary in China. It is said to run gracefully and lightly, as if it were flying.
Gold - This legendary Chinese Pokémon is considered magnificent. Many people are enchanted by its grand mane.
Silver - Its magnificent bark conveys a sense of majesty. Anyone hearing it can't help but grovel before it.
Crystal - An ancient picture scroll shows that people were attracted to its movement as it ran through prairies
Ruby/Saphire - Arcanine is known for its high speed. It is said to be capable of running over 6,200 miles in a single day and night. The fire that blazes wildly within this Pokémon's body is its source of power.
Emerald - This fleet-footed Pokémon is said to run over 6,200 miles in a single day and night. The fire that blazes wildly within its body is its source of power.
FR - A Pokémon that is described in Chinese legends. It is said to race at an unbelievable speed.
LG - A Pokémon that has long been admired for its beauty. It runs agilely as if on wings
D/P/Pl - Its proud and regal appearance has captured the hearts of people since long ago.
HG - This legendary Chinese Pokémon is considered magnificent. Many people are enchanted by its grand mane.
SS - Its magnificent bark conveys a sense of majesty. Anyone hearing it can't help but grovel before it.
B/W - Its proud and regal appearance has captured the hearts of people since long ago.
B/W 2 - The sight of it running over 6,200 miles in a single day and night has captivated many people.
[/collapse]

Yeah, that's what I'm saying. So far as much as we know, he's a common Pokemon, espiaclly in the Regions of PokeJapan and PokeAmerica, where it's commonly found and stuff. However, the dex is always citing China as the source of its legend. So we'll have to wait for a Pokemon game set in PokeChina to confirm it. I think we'll see Arcanine boosted to legendary status then. But that's what I'm saying, that some Pokemon are legendary simply because they have legends and are very rare in a certain region, but legendaries really can be as common as other Pokemon in other regions. We've seen gym leaders and stuff use Legendaries before so it's not too farfetched tbh.

It is kind of weird. I know that Kanto was inspired by Japan and Sinnoh was inspired by New York. But to flat out just mention China is weird I wonder if X/Y's region will be the China region

X&Y is in France.


In the trailer, Pika is shooting his bolt from Central Europe and you can see the Eiffel Tower and Le Louvre during the gameplay scenes.

 

[Vintage Creep]

It is kind of weird. I know that Kanto was inspired by Japan and Sinnoh was inspired by New York. But to flat out just mention China is weird I wonder if X/Y's region will be the China region

I repeat myself: it's because GameFreak doesn't care that much.
The important for them is the game itself, pokédex entries are just icing the cake.

 

[Vintage Creep]

Oh, I agree entirely Vintage. Pokemon is nothing but wasted potential for a quick buck. It really is disappointing, because it could be SO much better.

That's obvious. I think that's because Pokémon is, in the end, a product aiming to children. They should make a more mature version, maybe for the Wii U, with the engine by Creatures/GameFreak/IntelligentSystems (I don't remember which of those actually makes the gameplay part of the game) but with a completely different software house working on the artistic part, such as story, a new style of graphics, and a bunc of these mythology theories been confirmed.

 

[Moon Monkey]

Yeah, that's what I'm saying. So far as much as we know, he's a common Pokemon, espiaclly in the Regions of PokeJapan and PokeAmerica, where it's commonly found and stuff. However, the dex is always citing China as the source of its legend. So we'll have to wait for a Pokemon game set in PokeChina to confirm it. I think we'll see Arcanine boosted to legendary status then. But that's what I'm saying, that some Pokemon are legendary simply because they have legends and are very rare in a certain region, but legendaries really can be as common as other Pokemon in other regions. We've seen gym leaders and stuff use Legendaries before so it's not too farfetched tbh.

I kinda messes with the canon though doesn't it? Isn't there suppose to be 1 of every Legendary? Having two Arceuses existing is earth-shattering to those of the Arceus faith! It's like having two Jesuses! Except Jesus is always shiny, and has crazy Sp, ATK growths. Eh, it's a game so I'm probably reading too much into it lol.

X&Y is in France.

In the trailer, Pika is shooting his bolt from Central Europe and you can see the Eiffel Tower and Le Louvre during the gameplay scenes.

Oh yeah, I forgot. How quickly have I forgot about the trailer. lol.

 

[Deleted member]

That's obvious. I think that's because Pokémon is, in the end, a product aiming to children. They should make a more mature version, maybe for the Wii U, with the engine by Creatures/GameFreak/IntelligentSystems (I don't remember which of those actually makes the gameplay part of the game) but with a completely different software house working on the artistic part, such as story, a new style of graphics, and a bunc of these mythology theories been confirmed.

Well, the premise alone, of Monster Collecting a very good one. I don't think Nintendo will ever make a franchise to compete with itself though. The best we have is SMT, which is amazing btw, but it's very different from Pokemon.

Perhaps Digimon could be tapped to be made into a better game...

 

[Moon Monkey]

Well, the premise alone, of Monster Collecting a very good one. I don't think Nintendo will ever make a franchise to compete with itself though. The best we have is SMT, which is amazing btw, but it's very different from Pokemon.

Perhaps Digimon could be tapped to be made into a better game...

I think Digimon has hit a wall it (Like Pokemon imho) needs a re-boot. Where else can you go from fusing with your trainer?

 

[Deleted member]

I kinda messes with the canon though doesn't it? Isn't there suppose to be 1 of every Legendary? Having two Arceuses existing is earth-shattering to those of the Arceus faith! It's like having two Jesuses! Except Jesus is always shiny, and has a crazy Sp, ATK growths. Eh, it's a game so I'm probably reading too much into it lol.

I think Arceus is the exception. It is the God of all Pokemon after all. Though I would like to see other God-like Pokemon... The fan theory goes like this. Arcues created Mew, which replicated, and then morphed into all the Pokemon species. In RBY, they tried to clone Mew to because of it's unique abilites, but all of the experiments failed, resulting in Ditto, however, eventually Mewtwo was born. But it seems that there was at some point more than one Mew, the one in the movie that birthed Mewtwo, is just one of the few remaining ones.

 

[Moon Monkey]

I think Arceus is the exception. It is the God of all Pokemon after all. Though I would like to see other God-like Pokemon... The fan theory goes like this. Arcues created Mew, which replicated, and then morphed into all the Pokemon species. In RBY, they tried to clone Mew to because of it's unique abilites, but all of the experiments failed, resulting in Ditto, however, eventually Mewtwo was born. But it seems that there was at some point more than one Mew, the one in the movie that birthed Mewtwo, is just one of the few remaining ones.

Mew birthed Mewtwo? I thought Mewtwo was man-made. Developed by Team Rocket scientists with the DNA of Mew? It's been quite a while since I saw the first Pokemon movies.
I would love to see GameFreak explore outer space and alien Pokemon.

 

[Deleted member]

Mew birthed Mewtwo? I thought Mewtwo was man-made. Developed by Team Rocket scientists with the DNA of Mew?

That's what I mean by 'birthed.' It's all genetics bro.

Well, since we were having the Pokemon talk, I'll end it with some nostalgia:

 

[Diddy Kong]

Oh, so this is where we are supposed to post now?

 

[FalKoopa]

Yeah, this is where we can as off-topic as we want. NO REGRETS.

 

[Moon Monkey]

That's what I mean by 'birthed.' It's all genetics bro.

Well, since we were having the Pokemon talk, I'll end it with some nostalgia:

Oh okay, just wanted to be clear. Speaking of birthed Kangiskahn always confused me, it's literally born with a baby
That clip is classic

 

[Deleted member]

Yeah, this is where we can as off-topic as we want. NO REGRETS.

 

[Deleted member]

Oh okay, just wanted to be clear. Speaking of birthed Kangiskahn always confused me, it's literally born with a baby
That clip is classic

I'm surprised we still don't have a Kangiskid.


Anyway, on the Digimon deal, I was referring to the fact that the way Digimon does monster collection is similar enough to Pokemon, while still being different. Unless you go the MonHun route and hunt them or something.

I dunno, I would like to see another monster collecting game like Pokemon, where it's very much about the environments and habitats and stuff, where the mons are based off animals, and folklore and legends.

 

[Metal Overlord]

DAT WHAT KIND OF POKEMON ARE YOU video

beautiful :'(

 

[Big-Cat]

Also, on SMG2. SMG1 was WAYYYYYYY better. I remember SMG1 being more of a challenge. So far SMG2 has been so easy it's rather boring. And once it STARTS to get difficult, you get the solution way too quickly and the challenge is over.

For example, compare the Manta Ray Surfing Star in SMG1 to the Bird Gliding Star in SMG2. The one in SMG1 was a decently challenging start that had me going for it till I mastered it. The bird one was a bit tricky at first, but you quickly got the hang of it, and then it ended. There were no crazy loops or tough challenges once you got the hang of it, it was very disappointing, much like every level so far in SMG2 really. It's funny too because everyone said it was harder and better than the first. So far I disagree...

Wait until you beat the main campaign. All the stars after that are a total *****. I'm still 10 stars short to this day.

 

[Deleted member]

Well, I'm still a long ways from that...

Anyway, here's an interesting question for everyone.

If you could reinvent any Nintendo franchises, which would you choose?

For me, it'd definintely be Smash Bros. Pokemon and Zelda.

 

[bobadz]

What do you mean by reinvent? If your talking about formula and gameplay I'll defiantly agree with all three needing to be reinvented.

 

[Deleted member]

What do you mean by reinvent? If your talking about formula and gameplay I'll defiantly agree with all three needing to be reinvented.

Yeah, Smash being more competitive, and drawing references from arcade fighters like Blazblue.

Zelda, getting more action focused, and allowing for a deep and immersive crafting system like the one in MonHun (well, maybe no THAT deep), and placing more focus in exploration.

And Pokemon, ALSO placing more focus in the evironment and exploration, becoming a sort of action RPG, and being more "realistic." (I'm sorry but Pokemon Alt Art is so cool).

 

[bobadz]

So, you want to turn Smash in to street fighter, Zelda into Dark Souls, and Pokemon into Monster Hunter?


I'm glad your not a Nintendo Executive.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Actually he wants to turn Super Smash Bros. into Guilty Gear/BlazBlue. Not that there is a problem with that to be honest.

 

[Big-Cat]

So, you want to turn Smash in to street fighter

More like this, really. Personally, I want some Virtua Fighter influences in the form of strings.

 

[bobadz]

I was gonna say I wouldn't mind the Zelda and smash parts after rethinking about it.

 

[Big-Cat]

Let's put it this way. It is sometimes more important to focus on quality than on trying to be unique for the sake of being unique. Smash Bros. at its very core is a unique game, but it has so many holes in its design (or rather big ones).

 

[Deleted member]

So, you want to turn Smash in to street fighter, Zelda into Dark Souls, and Pokemon into Monster Hunter?


I'm glad your not a Nintendo Executive.

I really should play Dark Souls...

But no, SS had a crafting system, and people liked it, I feel it should be expanded, MonHun is a great reference point imo. Zelda 2 is also very underrated, and the Combat system in Zelda with Z-Targeting has tons of posibilities, WW and TP can testify to that, both did wonders with the combat, but there was much more to be explored, especially with the functionality of secondary weapons like the Hookshot, Bow, and Ball and Chain. And at its roots, Zelda was about exploring Hyrule and tackling challenges with your wits. Not USE ITEM HERE for every puzzle and boss. Hell, Zelda 1 and 2 hardly even had puzzles. LttP was a great balance in that regard. Also, Zelda needs more sidequests, Majora's Mask got it right, SS was a step in the right direction.

On Pokemon, Monster Hunter is not an RPG, dunno where you heard that. It's an action game where you fight giant monsters. It's essentially, BOSS BATTLES, THE GAME. Pokemon should be about explioring a giant world, capturing creatures, raising them and travelling with them. The reason Emerald is my favorite Pokemon game, is because Hoenn had so many interesting nooks and crannies to explore that it was just a very immersive experience.

 

[FlareHabanero]

I thought I was the only one that thinks Emerald version was the best Pokemon game, but I guess this is a small world after all. Hoenn in particular was probably my favorite region due to the diversity of the environments and the Pokemon native there are among my favorites.

 

[Deleted member]

I thought I was the only one that thinks Emerald version was the best Pokemon game, but I guess this is a small world after all. Hoenn in particular was probably my favorite region due to the diversity of the environments and the Pokemon native there are among my favorites.

Hoenn is the best region in the series by far. Followed by the Shinou Islands (is that what they were called). The region was just so diverse, and had so many interesting areas that made you just wonder, "gee, lets go see what's over there" and go check it out, only to be rewarded by some rare Pokemon, a TM or whatever else, it was cool man. Yeah, people ***** about the trumpets, and the Wingulls, but really... Repels are in the game for a reason.

It funny too, because from what I hear, the best region to live in in Nippon is Kyuushu, the region Hoenn is based off of.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Skyward Sword did many things right yeah. I don't really get the hate for the game. Yeah, the overworld is empty. But is that really that bad considering the last Zelda, Twilight Princess had this even worse?

Fire Red was my favorite Pokémon game I think. But Emerald was also cool.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Hoenn Pride... I mean, which region gave us an equivalent of a lush rainy fields, ashy volcano lands, a desert, a treehouse city, an city under underwater ruins, diving... I could go on, but all in all I'm beyond glad to have born in the 3rd gen. (-lwl-)

Man, I wish we'll see the 3rd Gen Remakes coming in sometime soon...

 

[Deleted member]

Skyward Sword did many things right yeah. I don't really get the hate for the game. Yeah, the overworld is empty. But is that really that bad considering the last Zelda, Twilight Princess had this even worse?

Fire Red was my favorite Pokémon game I think. But Emerald was also cool.

I understand the dislike for Zelda, and it is well justified, as it has been VERY casualized and formulaic. However, it did MANY things right that people are not giving due credit. In many ways, SS is a step in the right direction. The casualization of Zelda is something ALL Nintendo IPs seem to be suffering these days, Galaxy 2 so far is even MORE casual than SS. That's why I feel Zelda should stop being less puzzle focused and more action oriented like its roots.

 

[Big-Cat]

Skyward Sword did many things right yeah. I don't really get the hate for the game. Yeah, the overworld is empty. But is that really that bad considering the last Zelda, Twilight Princess had this even worse?

Remember that 4Chan post with Miyamoto ranting about how Zelda fans don't know what they want and only say that the last game was better when the new one comes out?

I liked Skyward Sword more than Twilight Princess. My only complaints with that game were two small quests later on in the game that seemed like they were trying to fluff the game up a bit.

 

[Sharkarat]

Personally I don't think Zelda need to be reinvented just improvment of thing it has already done like for example:

• Less linear, like the original and Alttp where the only thing stopping you from doing temples was lack of item.
• Less "useless" item Like dominion rod, spinner. It's mostly the latest games i feel this has been a problem.
• world that feels alive. I think Majora's Mask did a good job at this.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Hoenn Pride... I mean, which region gave us an equivalent of a lush rainy fields, ashy volcano lands, a desert, a treehouse city, an city under underwater ruins, diving... I could go on, but all in all I'm beyond glad to have born in the 3rd gen. (-lwl-)

Man, I wish we'll see the 3rd Gen Remakes coming in sometime soon...

The true beauty of Hoenn: Secret Bases.

I had so much fun making these with a friend. Also, it had potential to give you maddd exp.

 

[Sharkarat]

I also agree with Hoenn being the best region.

 

[FlareHabanero]

The true beauty of Hoenn: Secret Bases.

I collected all of the Pokemon dolls for my bases.

******* don't know about my Venusaur doll.