Sunrise, Sunset - Isaac for Smash Ultimate #GoldenSunday

[N3ON]

Supposed leak from a neogaf user: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/supe...te-updated-character-videos-and-more.1463068/

Newcomers: Simon, K. Rool, Isaac, and then says he doesn't know the rest. It's post number 31 from user WhisslBlank. User says the post will be deleted soon.

As with every 'leak' that has Isaac, I hope it's real. lol

I'd like to believe every leak that has Isaac on it, but Soren? From Fire Emblem? Really?

 

[StormC]

Supposed leak from a neogaf user: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/supe...te-updated-character-videos-and-more.1463068/

Newcomers: Simon, K. Rool, Isaac, and then says he doesn't know the rest. It's post number 31 from user WhisslBlank. User says the post will be deleted soon.

As with every 'leak' that has Isaac, I hope it's real. lol

Seems almost too safe, like he's hedging his bets on three characters that seem to have a good shot. I'd be totally fine with this of course.

Soren as an echo is kinda crazy but somehow makes it more believable because it is that crazy.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Supposed leak from a neogaf user: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/supe...te-updated-character-videos-and-more.1463068/

Newcomers: Simon, K. Rool, Isaac, and then says he doesn't know the rest. It's post number 31 from user WhisslBlank. User says the post will be deleted soon.

As with every 'leak' that has Isaac, I hope it's real. lol

I'm copying it before it gets deleted

I might delete this post soon since I don't want to cause the source I got this information from any trouble though I can't help it to share this information out of curiosity, even if it won't stay here for too long.

Here is some basic information that I've got:

- The Fire Emblem Series won't receive any newcomers but 2 who are based on existing fighters
- The Legend of Zelda Series won't receive any newcomers
- The Pokemon Series won't receive any newcomers
- Something about an addition to Cloud was mentioned, though I don't know for now if it's gonna be another Final Fantasy character or some other Square Enix character

There are gonna be 12 newcomers in total from which 5 of them are going to be based on other fighters.

For the new ones I only got information on 3 characters who should appear in this title:

- Simon Belmont
- King K. Rool
- Isaac
- X
- X
- X
- X

As for the 5 who are based on other fighters I could also just get the name of 3 of them:

- Chrom based on Roy (appearently with other effects than flames?)
- Soren (I don't know about any changes but he willl be based on Robin)
- Ken ( Based on Ryu with Flame effects)
- X
- X

Some of those will be announced very soon.

Take it or leave it I don't care, I will delete this post soon anyways.

 

[N3ON]

Seems almost too safe, like he's hedging his bets on three characters that seem to have a good shot. I'd be totally fine with this of course.

Soren as an echo is kinda crazy but somehow makes it more believable because it is that crazy.

Tbh the only safe parts seem to be K. Rool and Simon. Isaac, Soren (who doesn't use a sword - so has as about as much business being a Robin echo as Micaiah), no new Pokemon... they're not common claims these days. So while I don't believe this leak, it's interesting at least.

 

[ThoughtfulWanderer]

I was talking to somebody on another thread who says they see almost nothing but K. Rool/Isaac/Elma leaks on 4chan and I have to wonder if anybody else has had a similar experience while leak hunting? I myself struggle to find a lot of leaks with Isaac in them.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Supposed leak from a neogaf user: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/supe...te-updated-character-videos-and-more.1463068/

Newcomers: Simon, K. Rool, Isaac, and then says he doesn't know the rest. It's post number 31 from user WhisslBlank. User says the post will be deleted soon.

As with every 'leak' that has Isaac, I hope it's real. lol

wow thats actually believe able

as for the additon to cloud thing

Geno sakurai wants that character and square enix is more coperative this time

 

[N3ON]

I was talking to somebody on another thread who says they see almost nothing but K. Rool/Isaac/Elma leaks on 4chan and I have to wonder if anybody else has had a similar experience while leak hunting? I myself struggle to find a lot of leaks with Isaac in them.

There are a handful of leaks that have Isaac in them, but given the general volume of these fake leaks, they're still very much in the minority.

Some guy posts the same "leaked" roster on different sites, the one with Simon, K. Rool, Isaac, Saki, Elma, and a Pokemon.

 

[StormC]

Generally speaking I think echoes will be "counterpart" characters. Characters deliberately designed to reflect who they echo.





That's why I'm not sure about Chrom being an Echo. It could easily be characters like Shadow or Ken or Dark Samus instead. So Soren would be strange.

But we've seen stranger things in Smash, I guess?

 

[Troykv]

Tbh the only safe parts seem to be K. Rool and Simon. Isaac, Soren (who doesn't use a sword - so has as about as much business being a Robin echo as Micaiah), no new Pokemon... they're not common claims these days. So while I don't believe this leak, it's interesting at least.

Oh wow; these are some mad predictions hahaha... at least I'll give points to this "leaker" for originality xD

At least Micaiah being a Zelda Echo I can see it kind of working

 

[LasermasterA]

Supposed leak from a neogaf user: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/supe...te-updated-character-videos-and-more.1463068/

Newcomers: Simon, K. Rool, Isaac, and then says he doesn't know the rest. It's post number 31 from user WhisslBlank. User says the post will be deleted soon.

As with every 'leak' that has Isaac, I hope it's real. lol

Atleast one good thing about Smash Ultimate speculation is more leaks mentioning Isaac than Smash 4 leaks xD

The 'leak' sounds believable enough but one "sore(n)" point that stands out me is Soren lol. His inclusion in the leak seems really odd considering he isn't THAT popular and isn't a lord or lord-like (Robin) character (but, he is the tactician for Ike's party). Although I guess in CYL2 rankings for FEH, he did rank 20 or so, so take that as you will. Having Micaiah mentioned in this would have sounded more plausible in my opinion.

Otherwise having newcomers in the form of "Echoes" could be legit since they won't have much development time and will mainly pad out the roster so that the number of newcomers seems more than it actually is.

Edit: Oops guess I forgot to read the most recent posts. Soren indeed stands out as a weird inclusion to others as well.

 

[Organization XIII]

I gotta say Soren in Smash would be weird especially as an echo but considering he's one of my favorites I'd be more than ok with him joining the roster.

 

[N3ON]

I don't really know Soren well enough to be annoyed that they weren't implementing him faithfully...

Generally speaking I think echoes will be "counterpart" characters. Characters deliberately designed to reflect who they echo.





That's why I'm not sure about Chrom being an Echo. It could easily be characters like Shadow or Ken or Dark Samus instead. So Soren would be strange.

But we've seen stranger things in Smash, I guess?

Yes, I suppose we'll see, but an interesting litmus test would be whether they could be plausible as an alt. Those three could be. Chrom of Roy? Not so much. Soren of Robin? Not at all.

But we still need to see where further echoes take us.

 

[Troykv]

Generally speaking I think echoes will be "counterpart" characters. Characters deliberately designed to reflect who they echo.





That's why I'm not sure about Chrom being an Echo. It could easily be characters like Shadow or Ken or Dark Samus instead. So Soren would be strange.

But we've seen stranger things in Smash, I guess?

Well; you're right... these 6 characters (Lucina, Dark Pit, Daisy, Shadow, Ken and Dark Samus) have something in common... their designs were created since the beginning with their original version in mind.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

I'm copying it before it gets deleted

It's a bit strange that they mention there are 5 characters based off other characters but they only know about 3 however they also straight up ignore Daisy.

Actually now that I look at it the 12 newcomers doesn't seem to include Ridley, Inkling and Daisy. (if you count all the characters + the x ones)

 

[Altais]

Until proven wrong, I'm calling shenanigans on the above leak.

Soren would have made a bigger impact during the pre-brawl days, when the Radiant Duet was still a big deal. Although, I personally wouldn't mind seeing him playable, since he's one of mine favourite Fire Emblem characters of all time. If he was a Robin Echo, then he could use knives instead of swords. For those whom haven't played Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance, when a Mage is promoted to a Sage, he/she has the option to wield either Knives or Staffs--whichever the player chooses. Though the Staff, quite frankly, is the more pragmatic choice.

I'd rather Chrom be an Echo of Ike, not Roy. That's the whole reason I'm supporting him after all. That said, I'm hoping this leak is a fake.

As for Ken, I could see him working as an alternate costume, but not a separate character. Echo or no, if Ken was added, then people would want another Sonic character, and so on.

Anyway, to get back on topic, we have gotten a new Golden Sun song for each Smash game after Melee so far. That at least means Sakurai is still aware of Isaac and the Golden Sun series. That said, depending on how popular Isaac was during the Smash Ballot, I still have hopes for his inclusion. And until DLC is deconfirmed, I shall keep those hopes.

 

[isaac3000]

As for a new FE character, we now know the protagonists of Three Houses, isn't 6 months a lot of time to include Edelgard most likely (even though I want Dimitri more)? I assume Sakurai knew much earlier how the new characters looked like and what their fighting style is, to gain development time for them? Why Soren etc. when there are new characters to promote the new game (same with Roy and Corrin?).

Also DLC Deconfirmed? Never going to happen, Nintendo above all is a company that wants to make profit, DLC brings in more money so it is here to stay, not that I really mind it.

 

[Billybae10K]

God, I want that leak to be real, even though my better judgement is telling me it's not. If anything though, all these Isaac leaks are just bolstering the fan want if he doesn't make the base roster and we have to petition for DLC.

 

[ThoughtfulWanderer]

God, I want that leak to be real, even though my better judgement is telling me it's not. If anything though, all these Isaac leaks are just bolstering the fan want if he doesn't make the base roster and we have to petition for DLC.

The Isaac Twitter should hopefully be brimming with activity and followers if he doesn't show up in the base game. Gather up all the support even perhaps during these final months before December to make noise early in case he really isn't there.

 

[Bassoonist]

Well, it's nice to see Isaac in leaks, I suppose. (I don't remember this happening before) If only they could be leaks that end up with some credibility...

 

[Skyblade12]

Well, it's nice to see Isaac in leaks, I suppose. (I don't remember this happening before) If only they could be leaks that end up with some credibility...

Right now my favorite fake leak is the website one. It claims that characters are going to show up on the website, with dates for each one. Presumably from someone who got the fighter of the day info or something like that.

K. Rool is due to show up on July 9th, and Isaac is in August (I forget when).

It’s been nice pretending to only be looking forward to a day in July instead of a day in December for a while. But, unfortunately, this one’s time is nearly up, and then we’ll go back to the fretting of the usual wait.

 

[ThoughtfulWanderer]

Right now my favorite fake leak is the website one. It claims that characters are going to show up on the website, with dates for each one. Presumably from someone who got the fighter of the day info or something like that.

K. Rool is due to show up on July 9th, and Isaac is in August (I forget when).

It’s been nice pretending to only be looking forward to a day in July instead of a day in December for a while. But, unfortunately, this one’s time is nearly up, and then we’ll go back to the fretting of the usual wait.

Interesting. So instead of devoting Direct trailers to them, they'd just be uploaded to the website like Shulk was for western audiences? I guess I should be hopeful for it since it seems to mean monthly reveals, but I feel like they'd want to continue using presentations since it ensures people will be watching.

 

[Skyblade12]

Interesting. So instead of devoting Direct trailers to them, they'd just be uploaded to the website like Shulk was for western audiences? I guess I should be hopeful for it since it seems to mean monthly reveals, but I feel like they'd want to continue using presentations since it ensures people will be watching.

Unknown. From the way it was presented, they could be just uploaded randomly, or they could be revealed in another way first, and then get their “Fighter of the Day” update on that date.

So, if K. Rool is revealed between, say, Friday and Monday, and then gets either the Fighter of the Day or his own personal page put up for Monday, it would look good for that leak. Especially since most people are expecting the next reveal to be mid month.

But even if that one is right, we’d still have a long month waiting for Isaac. I won’t assume that one right piece of info means it’s all accurate.

And, again, it’s a text leak from 4chan, so it’s fake. I’m just happy to have something short term to look forward to.

 

[NoOtherPersona]

Unknown. From the way it was presented, they could be just uploaded randomly, or they could be revealed in another way first, and then get their “Fighter of the Day” update on that date.

So, if K. Rool is revealed between, say, Friday and Monday, and then gets either the Fighter of the Day or his own personal page put up for Monday, it would look good for that leak. Especially since most people are expecting the next reveal to be mid month.

But even if that one is right, we’d still have a long month waiting for Isaac. I won’t assume that one right piece of info means it’s all accurate.

And, again, it’s a text leak from 4chan, so it’s fake. I’m just happy to have something short term to look forward to.

i'd be a fool to believe in a leak but i hope its true

 

[KMDP]

Wouldn't the 'show the character first on the Smash Website' thing be going back to the way Brawl did things?

...I mean it's possible, I guess.

 

[ThoughtfulWanderer]

And, again, it’s a text leak from 4chan, so it’s fake. I’m just happy to have something short term to look forward to.

Funnily enough, this one little text leak on 4chan got everything right about Ultimate's E3 info. Obviously, you're digging for a diamond in the rough, but we might have a rogue leaker on the loose ready to spill the beans without any of us knowing it's them.

Wouldn't the 'show the character first on the Smash Website' thing be going back to the way Brawl did things?

...I mean it's possible, I guess.

Yes, for every newcomer past the E3 trailer sans Sonic, this was how they did it. I have a hard time believing they would return to doing this for a fanservice game filled with fanservice newcomers, though.

 

[KMDP]

Yes, for every newcomer past the E3 trailer sans Sonic, this was how they did it. I have a hard time believing they would return to doing this for a fanservice game filled with fanservice newcomers, though.

Yeah, they probably wouldn't go back to this model; they have Directs for this kind of thing now.

 

[Skyblade12]

Funnily enough, this one little text leak on 4chan got everything right about Ultimate's E3 info. Obviously, you're digging for a diamond in the rough, but we might have a rogue leaker on the loose ready to spill the beans without any of us knowing it's them.



Yes, for every newcomer past the E3 trailer sans Sonic, this was how they did it. I have a hard time believing they would return to doing this for a fanservice game filled with fanservice newcomers, though.

That one was also one day before the Direct.

 

[DjinnandTonic]

Funnily enough, this one little text leak on 4chan got everything right about Ultimate's E3 info. Obviously, you're digging for a diamond in the rough, but we might have a rogue leaker on the loose ready to spill the beans without any of us knowing it's them.

...I don't know how to react to this image. My first thought is 'it's not real.'

But... that would be pretty meta, doctoring a screenshot's date to look like you leaked accurate info that everyone already knows.

Hopefully this rogue is real and ready to tell us our favorite newcomer hopefuls are getting in?

 

[ThoughtfulWanderer]

...I don't know how to react to this image. My first thought is 'it's not real.'

But... that would be pretty meta, doctoring a screenshot's date to look like you leaked accurate info that everyone already knows.

Hopefully this rogue is real and ready to tell us our favorite newcomer hopefuls are getting in?

The thread also exists here. It's legit.

 

[Shin F.]

I don't hang around Smashboards much these days, but I'd like to reaffirm my support for Isaac. I feel conflicted on his chances, there are so many things pointing both ways for him. I feel more optimistic than I have since before Smash 3DS was released, though. He's still rating high in polls (like this one), the ballot is pretty much confirmed to have been for this game all along, his Assist Trophy is nowhere to be found (could he have been a planned Smash 4 fighter who didn't make it in time?), and the single most unlikely characters in Smash history has now made it (did Ridley get in by the ballot?!).

I wrote a neat moveset for him a while back that was inspired by Shulk's, where his neutral special would changed which Djinn he had set to himself and would affect his specials and Smash Attacks. I remember I had it so that F-Smash was called "Unleash" and would always unleash the djinn and put it on standby, and you'd have to wait a while before you could set it again. Same animation, but a different effect for each Djinn. There was one of each type of Djinn, and you could also choose not to use any at all, which mostly left him using the utility psynergy.

I do like the idea of him as a stage manipulator though. We saw an example of how that could work with Kragg in Rivals of Aether, and it'd be a really interesting archetype to bring to Smash.

Well, if we’re looking at those search trends...

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today 5-y&q=smash bros king k rool,smash bros isaac,Isaac Golden Sun

Adding “Isaac Golden Sun” to the list shows a more prominent trend.

But then just add “King K. Rool” and Isaac gets crushed.

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today 5-y&q=smash bros king k rool,smash bros isaac,Isaac Golden Sun,/g/122mqnh2

As I was reading up, I noticed something about this and there's an important note on the page that I feel I should point out since it changes the results a bit.

Spoiler

Basically, the K Rool search term included here is about the topic, not the term itself, which greatly increases the amount of results included due to including all possible translations of his name alongside it, and any other terms that are directly related / mean the same thing (like Kaptain K Rool, Kingu Kurūru , or even キングクルール , for instance). Meanwhile, if you use K Rool's name as a search term and not a topic, it's a bit of a different picture.

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today 5-y&q=smash bros king k rool,smash bros isaac,Isaac Golden Sun,/g/122mqnh2,King K. Rool

And even if you include K Rool as a topic instead of a search term, well, here's what happens with Golden Sun when you use it the same way.

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today 5-y&q=smash bros king k rool,smash bros isaac,Isaac Golden Sun,/g/122mqnh2,/m/028rvy

 

[Skyblade12]

I don't hang around Smashboards much these days, but I'd like to reaffirm my support for Isaac. I feel conflicted on his chances, there are so many things pointing both ways for him. I feel more optimistic than I have since before Smash 3DS was released, though. He's still rating high in polls (like this one), the ballot is pretty much confirmed to have been for this game all along, his Assist Trophy is nowhere to be found (could he have been a planned Smash 4 fighter who didn't make it in time?), and the single most unlikely characters in Smash history has now made it (did Ridley get in by the ballot?!).

I wrote a neat moveset for him a while back that was inspired by Shulk's, where his neutral special would changed which Djinn he had set to himself and would affect his specials and Smash Attacks. I remember I had it so that F-Smash was called "Unleash" and would always unleash the djinn and put it on standby, and you'd have to wait a while before you could set it again. Same animation, but a different effect for each Djinn. There was one of each type of Djinn, and you could also choose not to use any at all, which mostly left him using the utility psynergy.

I do like the idea of him as a stage manipulator though. We saw an example of how that could work with Kragg in Rivals of Aether, and it'd be a really interesting archetype to bring to Smash.


As I was reading up, I noticed something about this and there's an important note on the page that I feel I should point out since it changes the results a bit.

Spoiler

View attachment 151592
View attachment 151593

Basically, the K Rool search term included here is about the topic, not the term itself, which greatly increases the amount of results included due to including all possible translations of his name alongside it, and any other terms that are directly related / mean the same thing (like Kaptain K Rool, Kingu Kurūru , or even キングクルール , for instance). Meanwhile, if you use K Rool's name as a search term and not a topic, it's a bit of a different picture.

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today 5-y&q=smash bros king k rool,smash bros isaac,Isaac Golden Sun,/g/122mqnh2,King K. Rool

And even if you include K Rool as a topic instead of a search term, well, here's what happens with Golden Sun when you use it the same way.

https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today 5-y&q=smash bros king k rool,smash bros isaac,Isaac Golden Sun,/g/122mqnh2,/m/028rvy

So the search term for Isaac Golden Sun actually hits quite a bit higher than K. Rool as a search term. But K. Rool (fictional character), which includes extra matches, hits higher still. Good to know.

 

[Shin F.]

So the search term for Isaac Golden Sun actually hits quite a bit higher than K. Rool as a search term. But K. Rool (fictional character), which includes extra matches, hits higher still. Good to know.

Yep! I couldn't figure out how to get Isaac (fictional character) there mostly because typing Isaac had things like Isaac Newton or Isaac (Abraham's son) come up instead, lol. But Golden Sun (video game) is typically a lot higher than even K. Rool (fictional character), with one brief spike having K Rool surpass Golden Sun when his Mii costume was announced.

Then again, I don't even have to check to know that Donkey Kong (video game) would utterly smash Golden Sun (video game), lol.

I really wish I could get a direct topic comparison between K Rool including all languages and Isaac including his alternate names (Hans, Vlad, and Robin.)

 

[KMDP]

Yep! I couldn't figure out how to get Isaac (fictional character) there mostly because typing Isaac had things like Isaac Newton or Isaac (Abraham's son) come up instead, lol. But Golden Sun (video game) is typically a lot higher than even K. Rool (fictional character), with one brief spike having K Rool surpass Golden Sun when his Mii costume was announced.

Then again, I don't even have to check to know that Donkey Kong (video game) would utterly smash Golden Sun (video game), lol.

I really wish I could get a direct topic comparison between K Rool including all languages and Isaac including his alternate names (Hans, Vlad, and Robin.)

Hmm...

Did you try "Isaac (Golden Sun)" (including and not including quotations) in your hunt for "Isaac (Fictional Character)"? Because that might help.

I've never used Google Trends so I don't know fully how it works (I can make guesses though)

 

[DjinnandTonic]

“Hey Daddy Sakurai, please adopt me like these other children!”

I just really want the Djinni in Smash. They are so cute.

 

[SpiralGalaxies]

I've never played a golden sun game before, but Issac looks like he could be cool so he's got my support!

Do you think they'll do what they did with Ike and give him both his younger and older designs as costumes if he gets in?

 

[ThoughtfulWanderer]

I've never played a golden sun game before, but Issac looks like he could be cool so he's got my support!

Do you think they'll do what they did with Ike and give him both his younger and older designs as costumes if he gets in?

Welcome aboard! Older bearded Isaac is noticably taller, so not likely.

 

[SpiralGalaxies]

Welcome aboard! Older bearded Isaac is noticably taller, so not likely.

Would it be possible to average out the heights? or would it make the characters look weird?

 

[ThoughtfulWanderer]

Would it be possible to average out the heights? or would it make the characters look weird?

Sakurai really only alters canon heights if he has to (sizing up Kirby and Olimar, downsizing Ganondorf, Ridley, and Bowser). I don't think he would size up young Isaac's proportions just so old Isaac can be a costume. He was actually almost a head shorter than characters like Marth and Ike in Brawl, so Sakurai would stick to that.

 

[DjinnandTonic]

Was he really that much shorter than Marth? I thought Marth was canonically 16 years old, which is what I thought Isaac's age was, too? (though I guess with anime art, he could be anywhere from like... 12 to 22...)

 

[SpiralGalaxies]

ah oh well. Thanks for responding though!