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Sunrise, Sunset - Isaac for Smash Ultimate #GoldenSunday

Jak_spoon

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 14, 2013
Messages
236
So I’ve been thinking about how Smash helps some character’s game popularity but not others. I wonder if that is just because Smash attracts certain types of players. I believe Smash cemented Mother’s legacy as a cult classic, it did wonders for FE, but I don’t think it changed Pikmin or Animal Crossings status. I think the addition of Shulk established Xenoblade as an official recognized Nintendo game while the likes of chibi robo and Rythem heaven are considered niche. Anyways in these thoughts I thought one Golden sun would be helped by Isaacs inclusion for sure but then I started feeling like the roster has gotten so big at this point I wonder if it is now having diminishing returns for advertising Nintendo series. Like sakurai said in his recent article most people only play like five characters then stick with just one and then stop. I wonder if newer generations will become interested in series like mother like I did because ness is in the roster or if he will now just get lost in the crowd. Then my final thought was do you think this will be one of the reasons the roster will shrink in Smash 6? Anyways what do you all think.
 
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ThoughtfulWanderer

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 5, 2018
Messages
1,054
So I’ve been thinking about how Smash helps some character’s game popularity but not others. I wonder if that is just because Smash attracts certain types of players. I believe Smash cemented Mother’s legacy as a cult classic, it did wonders for FE, but I don’t think it changed Pikmin or Animal Crossings status. I think the addition of Shulk established Xenoblade as an official recognized Nintendo game while the likes of chibi robo and Rythem heaven are considered niche. Anyways in these thoughts I thought one Golden sun would be helped by Isaacs inclusion for sure but then I started feeling like the roster has gotten so big at this point I wonder if it is now having diminishing returns for advertising Nintendo series. Like sakurai said in his recent article most people only play like five characters then stick with just one and then stop. I wonder if newer generations will become interested in series like mother like I did because ness is in the roster or if he will now just get lost in the crowd. Then my final thought was do you think this will be one of the reasons the roster will shrink in Smash 6? Anyways what do you all think.
At least during this prerelease speculation phase, the effect of this may not be as noticeable since there are fewer newcomers being added and thus, it's harder to ignore who is joining.

Sure, in gameplay, it's easy enough to ignore most of the roster, but just the fact a character is getting added means there's going to be a huge buzz around it that'll get people looking into who they are. Moveset showcases from Sakurai, reaction videos, articles from gaming sites, and other such pieces will make it impossible to ignore the exposure. That alone may be advertisement enough that gets companies like Camelot thinking about capitalizing with new games. Those new games will be announced and given their promotion which only helps with exposure. These may not cover all the casuals who don't spend time on these corners of the Internet, but they focus on series like Mario, Pokemon, Zelda, and Animal Crossing anyways.

With veteran characters like Ness, they may already have enough of a legacy that any new faces to Smash curious about them and their games will hear it from those who have been playing Smash/Nintendo for a while.
 

NoOtherPersona

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 25, 2018
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So I’ve been thinking about how Smash helps some character’s game popularity but not others. I wonder if that is just because Smash attracts certain types of players. I believe Smash cemented Mother’s legacy as a cult classic, it did wonders for FE, but I don’t think it changed Pikmin or Animal Crossings status. I think the addition of Shulk established Xenoblade as an official recognized Nintendo game while the likes of chibi robo and Rythem heaven are considered niche. Anyways in these thoughts I thought one Golden sun would be helped by Isaacs inclusion for sure but then I started feeling like the roster has gotten so big at this point I wonder if it is now having diminishing returns for advertising Nintendo series. Like sakurai said in his recent article most people only play like five characters then stick with just one and then stop. I wonder if newer generations will become interested in series like mother like I did because ness is in the roster or if he will now just get lost in the crowd. Then my final thought was do you think this will be one of the reasons the roster will shrink in Smash 6? Anyways what do you all think.
For the most part animal crossing didn't need smash for publicity and pikmin I'm not sure about but i think it could work for golden sun in the sense that only die hard fans that played the first two and the slient minority that played 3 and only that. They may want to see the series represented in some form.
 

lordvaati

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So going by how Ike turned out in Ultimate, if Isaac got in would we expect teen and adult skins for him as well?
 

SorrowOfAcheron

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 22, 2014
Messages
381
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Gales
So going by how Ike turned out in Ultimate, if Isaac got in would we expect teen and adult skins for him as well?
I think it could be a possibility if Sakurai and the team decide to give alts different sizes.
Adult Isaac is a bit taller and bulkier than his young counterpart so I'm leaning towards 'not happening'.

You never know, maybe I'm 110% wrong and they pull it off looking great.

Also, I think Ike works because there isn't much size different in overall build, just a bit more muscle.
But in my mind, going from teen --> mature adult and staying with kinda similar proportions is questionable.
 
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Jak_spoon

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 14, 2013
Messages
236
I’m having a hard time with Smash speculation this time around. Just a little info about me, I’m 27 and I’ve been playing smash since the first one came out. I’m not great, I’m more the kind of guy who loves it for Nintendo lore. It was the game that got me to try all these Snes and Nes games I missed as a kid. It also got me into speculating which I’ve gotten really good at. Anyways I’ve only wanted three characters Isaac, Skull Kid, and Paper Mario. So each game has been sort of a let down for me character wise. I’ve always wondered how excited you would feel when that character you’ve wanted for years finally got in. And now, I’m actually pretty confident that all three of my most wanted characters have the best chance they have ever had. I’ve been looking over my lists like mad trying to see if it’s confirmation bias but I can’t find it. The real joke is going to be on me when it’s revealed that Simon is the only other new character. Ugh, I really can’t go through the disappointment again. Smash 4 was brutal. At least Sakurai isn’t being a big jerk like last time.
 
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NoOtherPersona

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Jun 25, 2018
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I’m having a hard time with Smash speculation this time around. Just a little info about me, I’m 27 and I’ve been playing smash since the first one came out. I’m not great, I’m more the kind of guy who loves it for Nintendo lore. It was the game that got me to try all these Snes and Nes games I missed as a kid. It also got me into speculating which I’ve gotten really good at. Anyways I’ve only wanted three characters Isaac, Skull Kid, and Paper Mario. So each game has been sort of a let down for me character wise. I’ve always wondered how excited you would feel when that character you’ve wanted for years finally got in. And now, I’m actually pretty confident that all three of my most wanted characters have the best chance they have ever had. I’ve been looking over my lists like mad trying to see if it’s confirmation bias but I can’t find it. The real joke is going to be on me when it’s revealed that Simon is the only other new character. Ugh, I really can’t go through the disappointment again. Smash 4 was brutal. At least Sakurai isn’t being a big jerk like last time.
I wouldn't say he's being a jurk but i get how you feel when i saw bayo as the final smash 4 character i was pissed off lol i love her but i didn't vote for her and i had a feeling it wasn't because of votes but marketing
 

Skyblade12

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I think Isaac has a good chance. I’m not sure about the others. Paper Mario had good ballot support, and would be a fun character, but I’m still hesitant on him.
 

Isaac: Venus Adept

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So going by how Ike turned out in Ultimate, if Isaac got in would we expect teen and adult skins for him as well?
I don't really think Adult Isaac would be included as a skin. They'd probably make the skins focused on the other protagonists like Matthew and Felix similar to the way Alph works for Olimar or as echo fighters
 

Skyblade12

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I don't really think Adult Isaac would be included as a skin. They'd probably make the skins focused on the other protagonists like Matthew and Felix similar to the way Alph works for Olimar or as echo fighters
Well, they might be having more skins this time. Several old ones were missing from the demo. And, despite having 8 skins, there were no Meta-Ridley options like we saw in his trailer.
 

Isaac: Venus Adept

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Well, they might be having more skins this time. Several old ones were missing from the demo. And, despite having 8 skins, there were no Meta-Ridley options like we saw in his trailer.
I also saw an interesting theory that you can buy or unlock more skins since there was footage of being able to open a seperate screen for alt colors.
 

lanky_gunner

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I don't really think Adult Isaac would be included as a skin. They'd probably make the skins focused on the other protagonists like Matthew and Felix similar to the way Alph works for Olimar or as echo fighters
I think this too, I can see Isaac having his alts based on characters from the series, maybe even Matthew taking on an Alph-like role.
 
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D

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Sorry for not uploading a comic earlier.



THIS…IS…PUNACCEPTABLE!!!!! ONE MILLION YEARS PUNGEON!!!!
 

Falgor

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Clearly he was exposed to the rays of the Golden Sun.
Not enough to be grateful about it though. :v

As an update, the team for the management of the IsaacForSmash account is almost complete for now! We're waiting for an answer from the 4th person we wanted to help us, and then we'll introduce ourselves (but you already know two of us of course :cool: )

I have a question for you all: Which big (and relatively less big of course) Youtubers do you know have already shown support for Golden Sun and/or Isaac in Smash?
I'm asking because asking them to get involved would be a very clever move but I think
we need to carefully plan this and not ask them too soon because we might only get one chance at this.
First we need to constitute a list that's long enough. I know Gnoggin loves Golden Sun, for example, and I just found that Farod, a big French Youtuber (815K subs) supports Isaac For Smash.
 
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Sabrewulf238

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Anyways I’ve only wanted three characters Isaac, Skull Kid, and Paper Mario. So each game has been sort of a let down for me character wise. I’ve always wondered how excited you would feel when that character you’ve wanted for years finally got in. And now, I’m actually pretty confident that all three of my most wanted characters have the best chance they have ever had.
I think Isaac and Paper Mario have reasonable chances.

I'm kind of hesitant to think Skull Kid will get in, yes he's a very "fan favourite" kind of character but there are lot of those kind of character queuing up to get into Smash. (and they can't all get in)

If the Legend of Zelda gets any new character I think it'll be Impa. (as an echo of Sheik)

Not enough to be grateful about it though. :v

As an update, the team for the management of the IsaacForSmash account is almost complete for now! We're waiting for an answer from the 4th person we wanted to help us, and then we'll introduce ourselves (but you already know two of us of course :cool: )

I have a question for you all: Which big (and relatively less big of course) Youtubers do you know have already shown support for Golden Sun and/or Isaac in Smash?
I'm asking because asking them to get involved would be a very clever move but I think we need to carefully plan this and not ask them too soon because we might only get one chance at this.
First we need to constitute a list that's long enough. I know Gnoggin loves Golden Sun, for example, and I just found that Farod, a big French Youtuber (815K subs) supports Isaac For Smash.
I think Arlo supports Isaac for Smash. (in his Smash hopes video he said something like it was a tragedy that the Golden Sun series was wallowing in obscurity and that it had as much potential as the Xenoblade series)
 

MysticKnives

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 21, 2014
Messages
811
So I’ve been thinking about how Smash helps some character’s game popularity but not others. I wonder if that is just because Smash attracts certain types of players. I believe Smash cemented Mother’s legacy as a cult classic, it did wonders for FE, but I don’t think it changed Pikmin or Animal Crossings status. I think the addition of Shulk established Xenoblade as an official recognized Nintendo game while the likes of chibi robo and Rythem heaven are considered niche. Anyways in these thoughts I thought one Golden sun would be helped by Isaacs inclusion for sure but then I started feeling like the roster has gotten so big at this point I wonder if it is now having diminishing returns for advertising Nintendo series. Like sakurai said in his recent article most people only play like five characters then stick with just one and then stop. I wonder if newer generations will become interested in series like mother like I did because ness is in the roster or if he will now just get lost in the crowd. Then my final thought was do you think this will be one of the reasons the roster will shrink in Smash 6? Anyways what do you all think.
This comment brings interesting stuff to light. Your concern is pretty real. As Ness' inclusion made him more popular as a character, cemented his series as a cult classic, and had it re-released on VC where it was a popular game on the market. But then you get to someone like Captain Falcon who got probably the biggest boost in popularity from Smash (just speaking on a character's popularity alone not their series), is one of the most iconic characters to the series, with a handful of memorable lines and moves (Falcon Punch, Falcon Kick, Knee of Justice, "Show me your moves!", "Yes!"), but it hasn't really done much for his series as a whole. I'd say there's nothing available at the moment to tell one way or another how it'd effect Isaac and Golden Sun in the event Isaac makes it in.
 

Billybae10K

Smash Ace
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Jun 15, 2018
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602
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I think Golden Sun might have a better shot at having a positive effect from Smash inclusion. Camelot is still an active game studio due to their Mario Sports Titles and Golden Sun is a much easier franchise to access than Mother. The Gameboy Advance and the DS are much easier to go back to and play games for, at least IMO. Plus, if Isaac's moveset is good enough, or dare I say it, Isaac ends up Top Tier in the competitive scene, Golden Sun would receive one heck of a boost on that exposure alone.
 

Kisae

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Not enough to be grateful about it though. :v

As an update, the team for the management of the IsaacForSmash account is almost complete for now! We're waiting for an answer from the 4th person we wanted to help us, and then we'll introduce ourselves (but you already know two of us of course :cool: )

I have a question for you all: Which big (and relatively less big of course) Youtubers do you know have already shown support for Golden Sun and/or Isaac in Smash?
I'm asking because asking them to get involved would be a very clever move but I think
we need to carefully plan this and not ask them too soon because we might only get one chance at this.
First we need to constitute a list that's long enough. I know Gnoggin loves Golden Sun, for example, and I just found that Farod, a big French Youtuber (815K subs) supports Isaac For Smash.

Really Farod supports Isaac? :o I never knew that ! In fact it's a very good idea. I don't really have seen any popular or not popular Youtuber loving Golden Sun or showing interest about Isaac for Smash or something similar =/
 

Spootondorf

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Is there anything approaching a consensus on what Isaac's moveset could be, should he get in? I'm working on modifying one that I wrote up for him prior to the ballot winner's announcement for U/3DS. After having seen the E3 Nintendo Direct, I'm taking inspiration from some of the changes being made to returning characters, as well as from DLC characters from the last game. With those as precedents, I believe a workable Djinn system could be constructed, while still leaving plenty of room for Psynergy and weapon unleashes.
 

Sabrewulf238

Smash Hero
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Ireland
I'm not sure if I've ever seen a "consensus" on what Isaac's moveset could be. Really the possibilities are so vast I could see Sakurai going any manner of directions with it.

I was thinking the other day (and it would never happen because it would be too much work) but it would be amazing if they actually implemented the Djinn system (or at least a basic version of it using only Venus Djinn) that allowed you to increase the power of your Earth attacks and even change your final smash based on the number of Djinn you have on standby.

I guess the idea would be that you would have four Venus Djinn at the start of the battle and they would each power a different Earth special. (Neutral, Up, Down and Side) Maybe they would work similar to Robins levin sword in that they would go into standby after you've used the attack enough times)

So Isaacs final smash would go from: Venus -> Ramses -> Cybele -> Judgement (the final smash would change depending on how many Venus djinn you have on standby when you get the smash ball)

They would only be different in power, they'd all be cutscene final smashes.

The Venus djinn would probably appear surrounding Isaac at the start of the battle and maybe during taunts. (but there would also be a visual on Isaacs % bar showing you which djinn were on standby)

Part of the reason why I want this....is of course Judgement looks cool....but honestly I love both Ramses and Cybele too and wish there was a way to incorporate them in Isaacs moveset.
 
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KMDP

Smash Legend
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Messages
12,199
Maybe that's why we've never gotten Isaac! He has so much moveset potential Sakurai doesn't know what to do with him! :laugh:
 

Spootondorf

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I'm not sure if I've ever seen a "consensus" on what Isaac's moveset could be. Really the possibilities are so vast I could Sakurai going any manner of directions with it.

I was thinking the other day (and it would never happen because it would be too much work) but it would be amazing if they actually implemented the Djinn system (or at least a basic version of it using only Venus Djinn) that allowed you to increase the power of your Earth attacks and even change your final smash based on the number of Djinn you have on standby.

I guess the idea would be that you would have four Venus Djinn at the start of the battle and they would each power a different Earth special. (Neutral, Up, Down and Side) Maybe they would work similar to Robins levin sword in that they would go into standby after you've used the attack enough times)

So Isaacs final smash would go from: Venus -> Ramses -> Cybele -> Judgement (the final smash would change depending on how many Venus djinn you have on standby when you get the smash ball)

They would only be different in power, they'd all be cutscene final smashes.

The Venus djinn would probably appear surrounding Isaac at the start of the battle and maybe during taunts. (but there would also be a visual on Isaacs % bar showing you which djinn were on standby)

Part of the reason why I want this....is of course Judgement looks cool....but honestly I love both Ramses and Cybele too and wish there was a way to incorporate them in Isaacs moveset.
Those are good ideas. I was thinking of something slightly similar, myself. Since Cloud's Limit Gauge can be seen next to his damage percentage, I was thinking of showing Djinn down there, as you mention. Whether those icons would better correspond to Set or to Standby Djinn, however, I'm not sure.

Below is a gigantic description of a partial moveset, incorporating my new Djinn system.

What I had actually considered was making the Djinn system involve solely Neutral B, and it could be implemented after the fashion of Shulk's new system for choosing his active Monado Art. First of all, tapping B uses a Set Djinni and then puts it into Standby, which removes it from a train of three invulnerable Djinn following Isaac around on the stage. Holding the button, however, allows you to input a direction on the stick that determines what happens next: down gives you the Venus summon; forward, Ramses; and up, Cybele. If you push the stick backwards, instead, you reset the last Djinni used (and to avoid chaos and greater complexity, the Djinn can only be used in one order; also, the first will always be Flint, for series recognition).

Why reset? Because the fewer Djinn Isaac has Set, the more damage he takes from enemies, the less damage his own attacks deal, and his side special degrades to a less powerful Psynergy. However, when Djinn are used for summoning, Isaac will get a temporary boost to the power of whatever Psynergies he has available until the final Djinni in Recovery switches back to Set (with each Djinni taking a set amount of seconds to switch back). The tradeoffs inherent in the Djinn system would certainly need precise tuning to make it feasible for Smash, but it could be done easily enough. And I should note here that none of the three summons mentioned would be overpowered. No, that remains for Judgment. Once Isaac breaks open the Smash Ball, he gains Ground as a fourth Djinni. Pressing B will put Isaac's other three Djinn on Standby and will use Ground, making opponents within a certain area in front of Isaac unable to move, and they will get the KO blow that the center of Judgment's blast will deal. Everyone else will eat the blast wave, though it can be dodged if your reaction time is sufficient.

A feasible variant of the above could be that holding B just summons the strongest Venus summon possible given the number of Djinn you have on Standby. And because of this, there would be no option to reset Djinn. So it would be down to the player's choice (first option), or to easier programming (if ever so slightly) and greater predictability in battle (this option). I would be fine with either one. And in fact, the second option would lend more strategy to matches. It would probably be the preferred path for Sakurai and his team, now that I think about it more.

What would Isaac's other specials be? For starters, I want to address the elephant in the room that is Super Smash Flash 2: while Move and the Psynergy hand are what Isaac is known for in Brawl, and thus in Smash in general, SSF2 gives them too prominent of a role. A giant floating hand and the Golden Sun abilities that can be performed with it almost perfectly correspond to what one would want out of a grab, pummels, and throws. Attack Psynergy, weapon unleashes, and Djinn are too important to be nixed in favor of the hand, as interesting as SSF2's implementation of it is.

Up Special: Megiddo
Obviously it needs to be adapted in the same manner as Ridley has been from previous Smash games to Ultimate. I had this as his recovery move in my last moveset, and nothing has convinced me to abandon it. Isaac leaps high into the air and slashes his sword downward. If B is held until the apex of the jump, a large-ish, flaming chunk of rock forms in the air where the apex will be, and Isaac slams it down diagonally at the ground, which does a pretty good amount of damage. Getting hit by Isaac's sword during the slam causes a diagonal spike along the future trajectory of the rock, causing the opponent to ricochet off the rock and diagonally into the air behind Isaac. Getting hit by his sword when no rock forms will cause a spike in the same initial direction (to the side at a steep downward angle). After the slash/slam, Isaac goes into freefall. This move is risky except when used as a recovery from almost straight beneath the ledge.

Side Special: Odyssey/Ragnarok/Sol Blade's Purgatory/Critical Attack
The identity of this move depends on how many Djinn are Set. If all three, the special will be Odyssey; if two, Ragnarok; if one, Sol Blade's Purgatory; if zero, then a mere critical attack with Isaac's sword. The strength of the move -- and its riskiness -- goes up with the number of Set Djinn. Whereas Odyssey requires time for two small Psynergy swords to pierce the air in front of Isaac before the large Psynergy sword smashes through them, Ragnarok is fairly quick (and its tip spikes diagonally downward at the conclusion of its motion). Getting hit with one of Odyssey's small swords causes a flinch; getting hit with both traps you into getting hit by the large sword. So as not to make Isaac overpowered, the Psynergy swords involved with these moves are much smaller than in the GS games. I'm open to Ragnarok and Purgatory being swapped, since I think the latter might be stronger in Dark Dawn.

Down Special possibilitiy 1: Move
I initially reserved this for resetting Djinn, but since I worked it into the Neutral B "system", this special slot has been freed up for something else. Why not Move, since people seem to want it?

Down Special possibility 2: Growth
As in SSF2, it will immobilize the opponent, though this version would come from the ground instead of from... Isaac's hands.... Does minimal damage and is mainly used to keep someone at bay.

Down Special possibility 3: Spire
When grounded, drops a rock spire on an opponent a few feet in front of Isaac. When used in the air, spires form underfoot that Isaac hops across; works as a horizontal recovery move, supplementing Megiddo's upward motion for getting back to the stage.

Down Special possibility 4: Grip
Only if tether recoveries are NOT in the game, because I would rather have it as a tether recovery. This would do no damage. The hand would go out horizontally and grab someone in front of Isaac, then bring Isaac to them, where he performs a strong slash with his sword.

Tether recovery: Grip (if possible; would free up the down special for one of the other options)

Isaac's other, more "earthy", Venus Psynergy will be used for his tilts and smashes (mostly, anyway) -- or, seeing as this is Smash Bros. and not a dedicated Golden Sun fighting game, I could compromise and have them only as smashes.

Up Smash: Gaia
The ground opens up several feet in front of Isaac and a volley of rocks erupts from the fissure. I'm open to this move happening on both sides of Isaac.

Side Smash: Thorn/Briar (the... "pokey plant" Psynergy, whatever it's called)
Erupts from the ground in a diagonal direction, with consequences for the opponent's trajectory thereafter.

Down Smash: Quake
Columns of earth erupt sinusoidally a few feet in front of Isaac. Has great upward launching potential at the center, but the extremes merely cause tripping.

Grab: Catch (mid-range)

Pummel: Slap (?; with the Slap Glove, of course)
A second hand appears alongside the Catch hand for this.

Up Throw: Lift
Another two-handed move.

Down Throw: Pound (buries opponent)

Forward Throw: Force

Backward Throw: Carry
Another two-handed move. Violently swings opponent behind Isaac at the same distance opponent was grabbed at and lets go.

Standing Hold-A attack: Dark Dawn Sol Blade's Centurion
Similar to Link's Standing Repeat-A attack from Melee.

Running Attack: Dark Dawn Sol Blade's Radiant Fire

Final note: My version of Isaac is a behemoth at mid-range, where most of his specials and smashes occur at, but -- depending on whether or not his Psynergy is also used for tilts -- only mediocre at close-range. Consequently, some of his moves aim at pushing his opponent away from him and into range of his Psynergy and summons. Supposing that his down special is Move, you can see how this might play out.

Edit:

Spot dodge: Cloak
Just your typical character animation, except that he goes completely black during the dodge, possibly with a dashed outline, as in the GS games.

Roll: Sand
Turning into sand and then reforming from it on the other side of your enemy seems rather entertaining. :p
 
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N3ON

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The only consensus I've ever seen regarding Isaac's moveset is the FS would be a Summon. And even then it's never been unanimous, as I've heard suggestions for the Megiddo unleash and even Odyssey.

Most people seem to agree the giant hand will be present. Possibly as Move, possible in the grabs/throws, sometimes even as Catch for recovery or something. I'd concur over its likeliness; that seems to be something Sakurai associates with Isaac, which is kind of funny considering before the AT, I don't think people really even entertained that utility stuff being part of the moveset, given how much Isaac has to work with.

And that myriad of potential moves really makes each moveset distinct. There's just so much to work with.
 

Spootondorf

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IMO, Megiddo would be a great summon if it weren't for the jump height's utility as a recovery move. However, summons represent GS better, and it would make more sense for the Final Smash to be connected to Djinn and Psynergy, rather than to a "mere" weapon.
 
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Billybae10K

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The only consensus I've ever seen regarding Isaac's moveset is the FS would be a Summon. And even then it's never been unanimous, as I've heard suggestions for the Megiddo unleash and even Odyssey.

Most people seem to agree the giant hand will be present. Possibly as Move, possible in the grabs/throws, sometimes even as Catch for recovery or something. I'd concur over its likeliness; that seems to be something Sakurai associates with Isaac, which is kind of funny considering before the AT, I don't think people really even entertained that utility stuff being part of the moveset, given how much Isaac has to work with.

And that myriad of potential moves really makes each moveset distinct. There's just so much to work with.
I think the hand is less associated with Isaac and more associated with Golden Sun in general, seeing as the hand is the main utility psynergy. Personally, I'd like to see it as a grab animation, though perhaps smaller than it was in Brawl so that it's less intrusive when playable.
 

Falgor

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Really Farod supports Isaac? :o I never knew that ! In fact it's a very good idea. I don't really have seen any popular or not popular Youtuber loving Golden Sun or showing interest about Isaac for Smash or something similar =/
Yup, he really does, he left a comment on a Smash Bros video (On one of Bronol's videos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUHVTWUf7ds) saying he wants to see Isaac playable.
 

Isaac: Venus Adept

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Whoops! Sorry Isaac: Venus Adept Isaac: Venus Adept for not replying earlier! I’m still working on the banner so it’s still a work in progress. Hopefully I can get it out soon!
Thank you so much for the update. At the moment I put the Golden Sun title screen as a place holder so the page wouldn't look too unappealing XD I'd love to see how your banner turns out =)
 
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NoOtherPersona

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how do you guys feel about the rumor that we're getting half a dozen characters? Also wouldn't it be so hype if they drop the trailer for Isaac on the anniversary of Golden Sun
 
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Organization XIII

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I'm one of those people who thinks Meggido should be his FS as throwing a literal sun at people just seems fitting for the main character of Golden Sun
 
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D

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I want to see him have a double Final Smash like Ryu, where long-range would be Judgment and close-range would be Megiddo
 

Eagle

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I know Isaac is commonly depicted with a sword but I wouldn't be fussed if they gave him an axe just to differentiate him a bit from everyone else. There was an earth axe IIRC in one of the GS games.
 

isaac3000

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I really like the idea of a Djinn moveset, that according to the number of Venus Djinn on standby, the final smash is a bit different!
 
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Skyblade12

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I know Isaac is commonly depicted with a sword but I wouldn't be fussed if they gave him an axe just to differentiate him a bit from everyone else. There was an earth axe IIRC in one of the GS games.
Isaac’s Themis’ Axe let out a howl! Stone Justice!

Given the way Smash operates, though, I’m esxpecting the Sol Blade. Though I hope he won’t use it much.
 

lanky_gunner

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I really like the idea of a Djinn moveset, that according to the number of Venus Djinn on standby, the final smash is a bit different!
I've always figured Issac would need a weapon in his moveset, but the more I think about it, the more I'm down for a moveset that doesn't feature a weapon at all, and just centers on the Djinn and Psynergy aspects of Golden Sun.

I figure there's enough there to make a whole moveset off the idea. Maybe even if they need a weapon, you could infuse your attacks with a different Djinn, like Shulk does with his Monado Arts.

But I figure they will limit Issac to the Venus Djinn, as that is what's linked to him the most.
 
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Hydewell

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So I’ve been thinking about how Smash helps some character’s game popularity but not others. I wonder if that is just because Smash attracts certain types of players. I believe Smash cemented Mother’s legacy as a cult classic, it did wonders for FE, but I don’t think it changed Pikmin or Animal Crossings status. I think the addition of Shulk established Xenoblade as an official recognized Nintendo game while the likes of chibi robo and Rythem heaven are considered niche. Anyways in these thoughts I thought one Golden sun would be helped by Isaacs inclusion for sure but then I started feeling like the roster has gotten so big at this point I wonder if it is now having diminishing returns for advertising Nintendo series. Like sakurai said in his recent article most people only play like five characters then stick with just one and then stop. I wonder if newer generations will become interested in series like mother like I did because ness is in the roster or if he will now just get lost in the crowd. Then my final thought was do you think this will be one of the reasons the roster will shrink in Smash 6? Anyways what do you all think.
I hate to be that guy, but a friend of mine knew Pikmin thanks to Brawl and became one of his favorites franchises . So, hey, thanks to Smash, Nintendo sold 2 more copies of Pikmin games :p And to be fair, Smash couldn't change the Animal Crossing status. Their last entry, New Leaf, has sold 11 millions of copies.

But, anyways, I think the inclusion of Shulk helped to boost the Xenoblade popularity, considering his meme status like Captain Falcon. It has gone from selling like 200k globally to 1 million in a successful hardware. Also, I don't know if Rhyhm Heaven is a niche series when Rhythm Paradise from DS sold 3.04 million copies.

But, anyways, like someone said before, if a newcomer gets a meme status, or it has an interesting moveset to be outstanding, it'll probably help his series rather than a newcomer with a dull moveset and/or appearance.
 
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