Sunrise, Sunset - Isaac for Smash Ultimate #GoldenSunday

[mynameisBlade]

I'm not really convinced King K. Rool would have gotten in if it wasn't for the support behind him. I'm not even sure Ridley would have become playable if people hadn't demanded it. It sounds like they had a hard time getting Ridley to work right....effort they might not have gone to if he wasn't as popular.

I mean I'd imagine Sakurai thinks plenty of characters that aren't playable are important to Nintendo, so when they get promoted to playable it's not really surprising that he has more to say about them other than "I did it because the fans said so".

Their inclusions seem like the result of a "perfect storm" sort of situation rather than any one individual thing. Though I do think fan demand was the foundation supporting their inclusion.

This is how most felt... The only people who thought he would be in were not as big of fans of the character... Being a big fan of your own character, especially when that character hasn't been main stream for 20 years.....makes it near impossible to even imagine what they would even look like in the game... This is why I truly believe nobody in their right mind saw K. Rool coming. (Can't include the big streamers who just start calling out names and hope to get it right.)

 

[JaidynReiman]

To be fair, nobody realistically knew about K. Rool either until 24 hours before the August direct when the contents were leaked practically. I think our boy still definitely has a chance. I'm also on the bandwagon that Sakurai is downplaying how many popular characters he's adding to subvert our expectations. No I don't expect 20 unique newcomers, but I expect nearly 10, with echo fighters filling that gap for this exact reason.

I have a feeling everyone is going to get a little of something of what they wanted

As far as I'm aware it wasn't leaked then either. I haven't seen anything come out post-Direct that leaked the entire contents of the Direct shortly before it aired.

NOW THERE'S A FAKE LEAK I CAN GET BEHIND!

All you needed was to make a Golden Sun logo and that would have been 100% believable

Or maybe I intended it that way because without the GS logo it deconfirms Isaac, just adding a new track. :D


But seriously, inserting a new logo was much harder. I'd need a good looking logo and a source I could keep it at and pull it in, or I would've had to have edited the logo onto the image after the fact, but I didn't want to do that. I just wanted a straight snapshot from the website.


EDIT:

This is how most felt... The only people who thought he would be in were not as big of fans of the character... Being a big fan of your own character, especially when that character hasn't been main stream for 20 years.....makes it near impossible to even imagine what they would even look like in the game... This is why I truly believe nobody in their right mind saw K. Rool coming. (Can't include the big streamers who just start calling out names and hope to get it right.)

Eric (one of the guys who runs Kremling Kampaigner) and myself were both absolutely sure he was coming. I got scared right before the Direct due to the Castlevania leak, but I was very optimistic about K. Rool this time.

Granted, I didn't actually think he'd happen in that Direct. I thought he was likely to show up in just about any Direct, but then the moment I heard about the Castlevania music leak I figured it was probably over this time, with a slim chance of it happening earlier in that Direct. It shot up for me once Simon got revealed first, but was still thinking we could see a different character entirely. I was feeling K. Rool when Klaptrap showed up, and knew it was him the moment the rivals section occurred (because like seriously, who else could they announce there? )

I kinda laughed a bit watching other people's reactions where they thought they'd end it with a story mode after Sakurai just said he couldn't talk about this super secret mode right now. It was obvious it would end on a character and the mode would come later.

 

[StormC]

After Ridley and knowledge of the 2015 design document (not to mention the Bayonetta datamine) I had K. Rool at 75% chance. I thought he was the most likely Nintendo newcomer. So I don’t think his inclusion exactly shocked me, it was more just a validation of my thought process.

What did shock me is putting him out as early as August.

 

[XenoWarriorX]

I'm pretty sure that part of Isaacs outfit is blue not purple...

It's kinda hard to see but it definitely looks blue to me.

Crap. Now i have to post it.

So, KM and i talked, and we actually found it was a light indigo. It's pretty close to the chair color, but not quite.

Also, the Yellow hair is exactly the same tone as the Yellow chair.

(And here's the crappy image for reference. Judge my observation for yourself, but take it with a grain of salt.)

 

[TiaSilvia]

Looks like diablo 3 for switch was spoiled by Forbes. If it is true, we should expect a Direct really soon.

 

[mynameisBlade]

What's controversial about Gardevoir? (or Chorus Kids for that matter)

I think Magolor could end up being Japans Shovel Knight. Considering he had next to no presence in the West during the ballot voting period. (he has the benefit of being 1st party but then again he has a con of having to compete with Bandana Dee. I doubt we'll get two Kirby newcomers)

Makes me wonder if K. Rool was the Japan pick for the Ballot. He topped too many of them to count and Europe got Bayo with Westerners getting Ridley. I have always seen Isaac's name up with Rool and Rids. I don't see why Sakurai would stop the fan demand train after Rool.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Looks like diablo 3 for switch was spoiled by Forbes. If it is true, we should expect a Direct really soon.

I'm already calling one early September.

Crap. Now i have to post it.

So, KM and i talked, and we actually found it was a light indigo. It's pretty close to the chair color, but not quite.

Also, the Yellow hair is exactly the same tone as the Yellow chair.

(And here's the crappy image for reference. Judge my observation for yourself, but take it with a grain of salt.)

View attachment 158010

Yeah sorry, I did see it, and a couple of people also saw it.

Isaac's outfit is definitely supposed to be blue, I think, but the lighting gives it a purple color. But yeah, it is interesting. I don't think the chairs mean anything in general, and IMO, this only proves that you can take the chairs to mean whatever you want.

If Sakurai's "eyes are a little red" comment was a legit hint, that's a far more obvious hint, given "Bloody Tears" as well as K. Rool's bloodshot eye. Similarly, the screenshot Sakurai shared from the website is a far more obvious hint than those chairs IMO.

Makes me wonder if K. Rool was the Japan pick for the Ballot. He topped too many of them to count and Europe got Bayo with Westerners getting Ridley. I have always seen Isaac's name up with Rool and Rids. I don't see why Sakurai would stop the fan demand train after Rool.

I don't think there is any "insert region here fan favorite". Its just characters who did well in general.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

The question, to me, is less "Did he do well on the ballot" and more "How many ballot/overall popular characters is Sakurai adding?" I want him to death too, but we should prepare for the worst and hope for the best.

 

[iam8bit]

Because seriously it only took me like 10 minutes to do this using developer tools in Google Chrome. I probably also could've inserted a fake GS icon as well if I really wanted to go further, though it wouldn't be an svg like on the site so it wouldn't look quite as good.

Ha! This is exactly what I wanted to point out. Chrome's Dev Tools allow you to directly change the text so all you need to do is find that Galaga song and replace its title and voilá. New leak,

If you want to go further, just save the page and edit the code yourself, order the song wherever you like and subsitute its icon for one of the many existing fanmade ones out there.

 

[mynameisBlade]

IMO, K. Rool was likely (despite many K. Rool fans insistence that he was just never going to happen). However, the reason why he was on all the leaks isn't because he was "likely". Its because he was "expected" after Ridley. There's a difference.

I have to say for those who actually expected K. Rool to happen after Ridley...were just plain crazy... Up until K. Rools reveal, every character has seemingly gotten in because of relevance. Even Ridley had Metroid: Samus Returns as a recent title. K. Rool had squat. Him getting in was wishful thinking at best. I still can't believe they gave him to us...lol

 

[XenoWarriorX]

Isaac's outfit is definitely supposed to be blue, I think, but the lighting gives it a purple color. But yeah, it is interesting. I don't think the chairs mean anything in general, and IMO, this only proves that you can take the chairs to mean whatever you want.

If Sakurai's "eyes are a little red" comment was a legit hint, that's a far more obvious hint, given "Bloody Tears" as well as K. Rool's bloodshot eye. Similarly, the screenshot Sakurai shared from the website is a far more obvious hint than those chairs IMO.

I think it's Indigo. Doesn't really strike me as Blue.

And if there is no meaning to the chairs, it's really distracting for objects that are meant to compliment the background.

 

[JaidynReiman]

I have to say for those who actually expected K. Rool to happen after Ridley...were just plain crazy... Up until K. Rools reveal, every character has seemingly gotten in because of relevance. Even Ridley had Metroid: Samus Returns as a recent title. K. Rool had squat. Him getting in was wishful thinking at best. I still can't believe they gave him to us...lol

The "Ridley has Samus Returns" argument falls flat when you realize that Ridley was a late addition to Samus returns and Sakurai finalized the roster at the end of 2015. People vastly overestimate how far Sakurai can anticipate things in the future. Its completely ridiculous. Sakurai planned Ridley for Smash long before Ridley was ever conceived as the final boss of Samus Returns.

The question, to me, is less "Did he do well on the ballot" and more "How many ballot/overall popular characters is Sakurai adding?" I want him to death too, but we should prepare for the worst and hope for the best.

If he's right behind K. Rool he's in, guaranteed. The question honestly is if he really placed that well.

Ha! This is exactly what I wanted to point out. Chrome's Dev Tools allow you to directly change the text so all you need to do is find that Galaga song and replace its title and voilá. New leak,

If you want to go further, just save the page and edit the code yourself, order the song wherever you like and subsitute its icon for one of the many existing fanmade ones out there.

Or Firebug if you use Firefox.

I think it's Indigo. Doesn't really strike me as Blue.

And if there is no meaning to the chairs, it's really distracting for objects that are meant to compliment the background.

People wanted to believe there was meaning to the trophy quiz as well. There wasn't.

 

[Organization XIII]

Aw, i liked path of radiance.

That's fine because actually the Tellius series is usually listed among the best in series

 

[True Blue Warrior]

I have to say for those who actually expected K. Rool to happen after Ridley...were just plain crazy... Up until K. Rools reveal, every character has seemingly gotten in because of relevance. Even Ridley had Metroid: Samus Returns as a recent title. K. Rool had squat. Him getting in was wishful thinking at best. I still can't believe they gave him to us...lol

Honestly, looking back at the first trailer, it definitely gave off the impression that roster decisions would seemingly be the same as Smash 4. Things are turning out a whole lot different from what initial expectations were.

 

[mynameisBlade]

I'm already calling one early September.



Yeah sorry, I did see it, and a couple of people also saw it.

Isaac's outfit is definitely supposed to be blue, I think, but the lighting gives it a purple color. But yeah, it is interesting. I don't think the chairs mean anything in general, and IMO, this only proves that you can take the chairs to mean whatever you want.

If Sakurai's "eyes are a little red" comment was a legit hint, that's a far more obvious hint, given "Bloody Tears" as well as K. Rool's bloodshot eye. Similarly, the screenshot Sakurai shared from the website is a far more obvious hint than those chairs IMO.



I don't think there is any "insert region here fan favorite". Its just characters who did well in general.

I have to say I was banking on the Red Eyes meaning Ashley, because why would it be the character who I have wanted since Brawl that Nintendo forgot about? I was in the deepest dungeons of doubt before that Direct. Even when I saw DK and Diddy in the treehouse I was skeptical. Seeing Dedede fool me then the real thing felt...like a weight was lifted that had been there for awhile. Anyone who got as deep as I did into speculation in 2015 onward felt what I did all these years. I always saw Isaac as more likely believe it or not..that is why I am betting he is next.

 

[StormC]

I have to say for those who actually expected K. Rool to happen after Ridley...were just plain crazy... Up until K. Rools reveal, every character has seemingly gotten in because of relevance. Even Ridley had Metroid: Samus Returns as a recent title. K. Rool had squat. Him getting in was wishful thinking at best. I still can't believe they gave him to us...lol

I’ve always been of the opinion that Ridley was a harder sell to Sakurai than K. Rool. Ridley had gameplay issues that twice prevented his inclusion. There’s never actually been a rule saying characters who were dropped by their series will never get in...it just hadn’t happened before. K. Rool has universal support from the ballot, especially from Japan, who Sakurai often gave preferential treatment.

Plus Ridley wasn’t exactly a hot commodity during the 2015 document. His last appearance was in the hugely controversial Other M in 2010. K. Rool’s last appearance was 2008.

 

[iam8bit]

Or Firebug if you use Firefox.

So no one, basically.

I kid. I work on web development too, by the way. And I'm glad I missed that chat about ages in the GS fandom because I only saw 1 or 2 other people around my age.

 

[KMDP]

Crap. Now i have to post it.

So, KM and i talked, and we actually found it was a light indigo. It's pretty close to the chair color, but not quite.

Also, the Yellow hair is exactly the same tone as the Yellow chair.

(And here's the crappy image for reference. Judge my observation for yourself, but take it with a grain of salt.)

View attachment 158010

Like I said in the PM, the colour similarities become really apparent when you invert the colours.

Like so.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

I’ve always been of the opinion that Ridley was a harder sell to Sakurai than K. Rool. Ridley had gameplay issues that twice prevented his inclusion. There’s never actually been a rule saying characters who were dropped by their series will never get in...it just hadn’t happened before. K. Rool has universal support from the ballot, especially from Japan, who Sakurai often gave preferential treatment.

Plus Ridley wasn’t exactly a hot commodity during the 2015 document. His last appearance was in the hugely controversial Other M in 2010. K. Rool’s last appearance was 2008.

K. Rool also had to deal with the whole "vocal minority" argument, more so than any other character. Of course, given how many views his trailer got within a couple of days (even surpassing Simon Belmont), we all know how legitimate those arguments were.

 

[N3ON]

Like I said in the PM, the colour similarities become really apparent when you invert the colours.
View attachment 158015
Like so.

Don’t make me post the Pepe Silvia gif, now.

 

[XenoWarriorX]

People wanted to believe there was meaning to the trophy quiz as well. There wasn't.

Then maybe i am reaching.


It's just strange though.

 

[jweb23]

I have to say for those who actually expected K. Rool to happen after Ridley...were just plain crazy... Up until K. Rools reveal, every character has seemingly gotten in because of relevance. Even Ridley had Metroid: Samus Returns as a recent title. K. Rool had squat. Him getting in was wishful thinking at best. I still can't believe they gave him to us...lol

Not trying to say I expected King K Rool but after e3’s direct I had a gut feeling that all the newcomers were the top ballot choices. Back during the ballot I was frequenting many sites and forums trying to see who fans really wanted. Excluding cut veterans and third parties the top names were:
Ridley
King K Rool
Inkling
Isaac
Bandana Dee
Dixie Kong
Krystal
Various Rhythm Heaven characters
Various Pokémon

Interestingly enough Chrom, Daisy and Dark Samus were getting a good amount of votes too. So at this point I’m 100% sure the newcomers in the base roster are fan voted from the ballot and DLC will be used for more relevant and promotional characters after launch.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

I think it's Indigo. Doesn't really strike me as Blue.

And if there is no meaning to the chairs, it's really distracting for objects that are meant to compliment the background.

I talked about this a bit in the Skull Kid thread but I feel really conflicted about those chairs. On one hand it's ridiculous to think they mean anything....but on the other hand they do seem unusual. They're not very common colour chairs and they would stand out on their own let alone placed next to each other.

Then there's the fact that in the E3 direct Sakurai just happened to have a barrel in the room with him. There's nothing conclusive obviously but it does make me wonder.

 

[iam8bit]

Wait. Which Reddit poll?

Sorry for the late reply, but here you go.

BTW, has everyone here voted already? (That includes you too, lurkers )

 

[StormC]

I don’t think K. Rool fans even talked about the barrel until after he was in. Hindsight is 20/20 and all that.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

Anytime I see that I have 10+ alerts I know I've been visited by Isaac: Venus Adept .

 

[TiaSilvia]

https://mobile.twitter.com/loz183/status/1029838277686321158

First he says Isaac may not be in the game. Then he posts this. This guy is just trolling from now on.

 

[KMDP]

Don’t make me post the Pepe Silvia gif, now.

IT'S ALL CONNECTED, NEON! IT'S ALL CONNECTED!

THE TWEET! THE CHAIR! THE SCARF!

ISAAC IS COMING!
---------
Okay, but seriously, the yellow is a very similar shade of Yellow to Isaac's scarf.

Is there any videogame character, Nintendo or otherwise, for whom Purple is a significant colour in their design?

The only one I can think of is Vaati (and Waluigi, but he's disconfirmed).

 

[XenoWarriorX]

https://mobile.twitter.com/loz183/status/1029838277686321158

First he says Isaac may not be in the game. Then he posts this. This guy is just trolling from now on.

Loz is just speculating.

Though, he needs to make up his mind.

Okay, but seriously, the yellow is a very similar shade of Yellow to Isaac's scarf.

Is there any videogame character, Nintendo or otherwise, for whom Purple is a significant colour in their design?

The only one I can think of is Vaati.

Rayman.

 

[JaidynReiman]

https://mobile.twitter.com/loz183/status/1029838277686321158

First he says Isaac may not be in the game. Then he posts this. This guy is just trolling from now on.

Do we even know that's the real Loz? He claims to be but for all we know he's just a faker.


Yeah, I think his contact got fired and he's out of the leaking business.

IT'S ALL CONNECTED, NEON! IT'S ALL CONNECTED!

THE TWEET! THE CHAIR! THE SCARF!

ISAAC IS COMING!
---------
Okay, but seriously, the yellow is a very similar shade of Yellow to Isaac's scarf.

Is there any videogame character, Nintendo or otherwise, for whom Purple is a significant colour in their design?

The only one I can think of is Vaati.

Waluigi. And yes, (some) Waluigi fans legitimately thought he was going to happen because of it.

Honestly, looking back at the first trailer, it definitely gave off the impression that roster decisions would seemingly be the same as Smash 4. Things are turning out a whole lot different from what initial expectations were.

Inklings didn't really affect anything for me because they were basically a lock to happen no matter what. They are both popular and relevant.

I don’t think K. Rool fans even talked about the barrel until after he was in. Hindsight is 20/20 and all that.

There was a barrel and ladder, right? The ladder could definitely be considered (maybe) a reference to Flying Kroc. Barrel is obvious considering how associated they are with DK.

Then maybe i am reaching.


It's just strange though.

Its possible it is a nod. Its hard to say. Its also possible that the red eyes comment was a real hint to the characters to be revealed in the Direct.

I have to say I was banking on the Red Eyes meaning Ashley, because why would it be the character who I have wanted since Brawl that Nintendo forgot about? I was in the deepest dungeons of doubt before that Direct. Even when I saw DK and Diddy in the treehouse I was skeptical. Seeing Dedede fool me then the real thing felt...like a weight was lifted that had been there for awhile. Anyone who got as deep as I did into speculation in 2015 onward felt what I did all these years. I always saw Isaac as more likely believe it or not..that is why I am betting he is next.

Yeah I've seen other people like you. One in particular is like this in the K. Rool Discord. Not to the extent of seeing Isaac more likely than K. Rool I don't think, though.

 

[StormC]

Is there any videogame character, Nintendo or otherwise, for whom Purple is a significant colour in their design?

 

[DogManStar]

Like I said in the PM, the colour similarities become really apparent when you invert the colours.
View attachment 158015
Like so.

It matches, but I think this is even more of a reach than it being a Skull Kid hint or the Rathalos pic being a GS hint. I don't think the chairs really mean anything honestly.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Is there any videogame character, Nintendo or otherwise, for whom Purple is a significant colour in their design?

Captain Syrup.

 

[mynameisBlade]

Do we even know that's the real Loz? He claims to be but for all we know he's just a faker.


Yeah, I think his contact got fired and he's out of the leaking business.



Waluigi. And yes, (some) Waluigi fans legitimately thought he was going to happen because of it.



Inklings didn't really affect anything for me because they were basically a lock to happen no matter what. They are both popular and relevant.




There was a barrel and ladder, right? The ladder could definitely be considered (maybe) a reference to Flying Kroc. Barrel is obvious considering how associated they are with DK.


Its possible it is a nod. Its hard to say. Its also possible that the red eyes comment was a real hint to the characters to be revealed in the Direct.



Yeah I've seen other people like you. One in particular is like this in the K. Rool Discord. Not to the extent of seeing Isaac more likely than K. Rool I don't think, though.

Made the reveal all the sweeter! People saying that the literal golden sun in the background hints at Isaac toward the end of K. Rools trailer.... Ya I never noticed the barrel. Who knows?! (shrugs) I honestly never see Waluigi happening due to threats being sent to Sakurai about that character... yikes..

 

[Thirdkoopa]

If he's right behind K. Rool he's in, guaranteed. The question honestly is if he really placed that well.

I... Wouldn't know. Regardless, I don't want to assume things like that. Bassoonist and I have been at this for over ten years, so we're really trying to not get too optimistic.

Regardless, this is Isaac's time.

Not trying to say I expected King K Rool but after e3’s direct I had a gut feeling that all the newcomers were the top ballot choices. Back during the ballot I was frequenting many sites and forums trying to see who fans really wanted. Excluding cut veterans and third parties the top names were:
Ridley
King K Rool
Inkling
Isaac
Bandana Dee
Dixie Kong
Krystal
Various Rhythm Heaven characters
Various Pokémon

Interestingly enough Chrom, Daisy and Dark Samus were getting a good amount of votes too. So at this point I’m 100% sure the newcomers in the base roster are fan voted from the ballot and DLC will be used for more relevant and promotional characters after launch.

Interestingly, most of these have been acknowledged in some fashion.

https://mobile.twitter.com/loz183/status/1029838277686321158

First he says Isaac may not be in the game. Then he posts this. This guy is just trolling from now on.

LoZ18 REALLY needs to be clear on what he's speculating and what he's leaking, lol

 

[Isaac: Venus Adept]

I never thought about inverting the colors for the chairs. But again I'm still not too sold on it. In the end we need to be open to the possibility that these clues could be coincidences but also be aware that Sakurai has hinted in the past for Brawl and Smash 4

Anytime I see that I have 10+ alerts I know I've been visited by Isaac: Venus Adept .

Haha I'm the Wise One watching over you

 

[NessAtc.]

So, I'm fairly certain that Isaac did about as well overall as the fan polls would suggest. The reason I say this is because if you take a look at the documentation, you will see that almost every single character that got added to the game was on our fan poll results. The only two characters not documented are Dark Samus, who Sakurai said was actually a requested character, and Richter, who is by far the most popular Belmont basically ever aside from maybe Julius. This chart includes every single veteran that wasn't added in smash at the time, and Bayonetta falls into 10th overall. This is entirely consistent with how the reveals have been panning out thus far.

Spreadsheet in question: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...pw5m-b4JHJ0_cGRKU15KYlTe1E/edit#gid=729442469

 

[Tetiro]

I'm wondering if the chairs are just that? Chairs and had no actual hint whatsoever

 

[StormC]

I found out the real explanation.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I found out the real explanation.

I won't lie; this feels a bit too much in bad taste.