Sumting Sumting Maifa | Game Over

[Jackrito]

I waited because I wanted to see if you really cared about receiving an answer, or if you just asked the question to appear as if you were scum hunting.

Xivii is actively trying to solve the game. I think D1 was not an especially good day for him with the end dominated by his argument with Ranmaru. But I see Xivii looking at the game from a wide perspective, considering multiple possibilities, reevaluating and seeing where it leads him.


Why do you assume Trisscar is town in this scenario?

Yet all paths always led to me funny that. Xivii has not being actively trying to solve the game as much as you make out. He has created distrust and confusion towards our likely cop just to push foward a tunnelled agenda on me. Like I said earlier even if Xivii thinks I'm scum the better play as town would be to go for my teammates in that world since easier to get a lynch on them most likely. Doing this as town is game throwing because of being biased or the more likely option they are scum trying to force through a mislynch or failing that cause enough distraction that we mess up anyway

 

[Xivii]

How are you differentiating his will to win as coming from town rather than scum? As I said, his conclusions haven’t changed. This suggests that his “bouncing of ideas” etc is just for show. For example, he’s twice now had a “Triss is scum” epiphany only to retract it off flimsy reasoning a couple of posts later (the first because Logic was pushing her, the second or twtbw).

fontisian

 

[Xivii]

Xivii: Fonti, DB, Jack
bessie: DB, Jack
Jack: Xivii, bessie
DB: Fonti, Jack
Triss: bessie

 

[Xivii]

if Xivii thinks I'm scum the better play as town would be to go for my teammates in that world since easier to get a lynch on them most likely. Doing this as town is game throwing because of being biased or the more likely option they are scum trying to force through a mislynch or failing that cause enough distraction that we mess up anyway

You have the strongest chance of being scum. Today’s not the day for going for anything less. If it comes down to it I will certainly compromise, but as of now I think lynching you is the best has the most solid foundation.

 

[fontisian]

We are not going to agree on a lynch are we. Not a shock when we likely only have one more town then scum, I would only do a lynch on Bessie Xivii and Mala. I can maybe go to DB also but not as confident in that as I was start of the day.

We'll compromise, because we have to. Or we'll force scum to hammer a partner or risk being outed.

 

[fontisian]

fontisian

By looking at his process, the same thing you are refusing to give me.

 

[Xivii]

I like how literally it’s my three scum picks that are gunning for me

 

[Xivii]

By looking at his process, the same thing you are refusing to give me.

How about an actual answer. What changed between you investigating him and now

 

[Spak]

Hey all, sorry for showing up so late today, but I got called by some friends I hadn't talked to in a while and they wanted to play League. I'll be reading up now.

 

[Spak]

We know for certain, however, that one of those scenarios must be true (not necessarily that Jack is GF but that there is a manipulation role), otherwise Fonti would not be alive. So Fonti either has to be scum or scum has a way to mess with Fonti's results, whether that be GF, Tailor, Framer or else. Do you agree?

Not necessarily; I don't think that Z necessarily would've been a target going into D2 since they were a popular wagon in the first phase, the Boom shot made sense if they were dodging a possible doc (or if scum has some sort of investigative role/picked up on some crumbing that Boom was doing, since an innocent child going into LyLo is bad for scum), and at the start of toDay, the Logic shot made sense to me because he seemed most likely to put 2 and 2 together during last phase and was actively scumhunting.

I don't expect Fonti to live much longer (unless feeding your theory is a good enough reason for scum to keep her around), but while I'd say one or both scenarios are possible, the second is most likely (and I don't have any strong reason to disbelieve it). With that said, I don't think they're the only two possibilities.

 

[Xivii]

Logic was killed by Sab

 

[Spak]

Also if Jack is scum, the probability of him being GF or tailored is 1/4 not 1/15.

Fair enough, but dropping the assumption that he's scum, it's 1/8. It could be that scum isn't scared of Fonti because they have role manip, but they haven't been looekd at yet.

 

[Xivii]

townslip?

 

[Spak]

Logic was killed by Sab

Oh, good catch. I assumed that scum wouldn't want to kill Toko because his slot was scummy as heck from my view of them lol.

 

[fontisian]

townslip?

No. We're not giving out townslips for something that /easy/ in lylo.

 

[Spak]

I'll explain my reasoning again. I thought that since I had put myself in a situation where I could very easily be lynched tomorrow, scum would not shoot me unless I was putting pressure on a member of scumteam.

Okay, starting from the top. Why did you think that you'd get shot if you put pressure on a member of the scumteam? I don't think anyone was intimidated by your slot at the time, so I can't think of a context in which you'd think you were going to be a shot. Even if you were a shot, why didn't you put it on someone who had a wagon, so we would at least have something to look into at the start of D2? I'm sorry if it was just a bad shot and you end up being town, but it doesn't look like a town play to me (especially after his claim).

 

[Spak]

NGL I'm still upset at Spak for being a big cause behind the switch from logic to pythag since we could of just lynched logic and shot pytah to confirm if he was bullet proof instead of doing it the other way around, so that's why I'd probably switch him in for Mala, but I'll have to go back and look at Pythags case on him again. You would think fewer people left would mean Id be able to remember this stuff lol.

I felt like Logic was more strongly town than Pythag was, but I openly said that I didn't think either were scum. I switched to Pythag to save Logic, but then the vig took him out anyways and scum took out another town slot, so it was just a lose-lose-lose phase for Town in my book.

Also, you put the man at L-1 literally two minutes after his claim and he died a minute later to a sudden Triss hammer; I wasn't even around for the claim, so I don't see how you can blame this on me lol.

 

[Jackrito]

I felt like Logic was more strongly town than Pythag was, but I openly said that I didn't think either were scum. I switched to Pythag to save Logic, but then the vig took him out anyways and scum took out another town slot, so it was just a lose-lose-lose phase for Town in my book.

Also, you put the man at L-1 literally two minutes after his claim and he died a minute later to a sudden Triss hammer; I wasn't even around for the claim, so I don't see how you can blame this on me lol.

I was not around for this but from what I remember a lot of people did not even know you voted because of the colors so not sure how DB is blaming you for the lynch.

 

[Jackrito]

Okay, starting from the top. Why did you think that you'd get shot if you put pressure on a member of the scumteam? I don't think anyone was intimidated by your slot at the time, so I can't think of a context in which you'd think you were going to be a shot. Even if you were a shot, why didn't you put it on someone who had a wagon, so we would at least have something to look into at the start of D2? I'm sorry if it was just a bad shot and you end up being town, but it doesn't look like a town play to me (especially after his claim).

I also agree with all of this.

 

[Spak]

Xivii Just as a heads up, I think you forgot Mala as one of Jack's lynch options toDay.

My list would be DB/Malak. I'll prioritize DB over Mala because it at least appears that Mala's trying toDay, but I still think that his play matches that of a coaster D1-D3, and while we may be coming at the game from different angles (he's trying to challenge possibly wrong assumptions that we've made, etc.), I don't see the conclusions he's coming to as following with the more overarching gamestate. If Xivii is trying to challenge assumptions in a positive way (by analyzing mechanics, albeit while tunneling Jack), Malak is trying to challenge the same beliefs but with a line of reasoning that is a stretch and a half at best imo.

My opinion on DB has been negative since the claim D2, then positive for like two days due to my changing perception towards Sab and his opinion on the whole situation (as the Vig), then negative again once I realized that Pythag was a town self-protective role (which I assumed was DB's role in the power balance). Interactions with him since then haven't impressed me as his explanations for his actions haven't made a whole lot of sense to me, and his gameplay (only really showing up when he's received heat, not actively pursuing much outside of immediate interactions, not frequently asking follow-up questions after an initial line of questioning showing a lack of meaningful scumhunting, primarily defensive play, etc.) makes him a likely candidate for scum in my book.

I'll obviously try to prevent a NL if at all possible, but I don't think we'll have an issue coming up with majoriy on something so long as everyone casts a commitment vote.

 

[Spak]

Seeing as I'm the only person still viewing the thread, I'm gonna head to bed. I'll check back over my lunch break tomorrow!

 

[Xivii]

Xivii: Fonti, DB, Jack
DB: Fonti, Jack, Spak
bessie: DB, Jack
Jack: Xivii, bessie
Mala: Jack, Spak
Triss: bessie

 

[Deadbananas]

Okay, starting from the top. Why did you think that you'd get shot if you put pressure on a member of the scumteam? I don't think anyone was intimidated by your slot at the time, so I can't think of a context in which you'd think you were going to be a shot. Even if you were a shot, why didn't you put it on someone who had a wagon, so we would at least have something to look into at the start of D2? I'm sorry if it was just a bad shot and you end up being town, but it doesn't look like a town play to me (especially after his claim).

The whole point was I wasn't expecting to get shot, but if I was going to get shot that was the only possibility I could see for that being case.

I am a bit weirded out that people had more than 10 days to analyze this before, but are just now bringing it up in LYLO, but I'll be happy to defend this, and I guess all information is important. I will admit yes it was a bad decision in hindsight, but this is my first time with a power role as town if that adds any context to this.

 

[Xivii]

I like your case but I also think you're bussing due to PoE.

And why isn’t the fact that I don’t bus being taken into account.

 

[Sabrar]

I'm comitting to Jack or Malak. I'm against Spak or DB.

And why isn’t the fact that I don’t bus being taken into account.

Because I don't have the evidence for it.

 

[Deadbananas]

felt like Logic was more strongly town than Pythag was, but I openly said that I didn't think either were scum. I switched to Pythag to save Logic, but then the vig took him out anyways and scum took out another town slot, so it was just a lose-lose-lose phase for Town in my book.

Also, you put the man at L-1 literally two minutes after his claim and he died a minute later to a sudden Triss hammer; I wasn't even around for the claim, so I don't see how you can blame this on me lol.

To be clear I wasn't saying you were there when that happened, I was just upset at you for being the cause behind the switch to Pythag as I saw it. There was little talk of that before post #3262 then you brought it up and everything switched.

As for why I voted it was either that or another tie from how I saw it #3288 and you can see from the post below that its what other town thought too.

 

[Sabrar]

Xivii: Fonti, DB, Jack
DB: Fonti, Jack, Spak
bessie: DB, Jack
Jack: Xivii, bessie
Mala: Jack, Spak
Triss: bessie
fonti: DB, Xivii
Sabrar: Jack, Mala
DB: Spak, Mala

 

[Xivii]

Xivii: Fonti, DB, Jack
DB: Fonti, Jack, Spak
Jack: Xivii, bessie, Sab
Mala: Jack, Spak, Saab
bessie: DB, Jack
Triss: bessie

 

[Sabrar]

Xivii: Fonti, DB, Jack
DB: Fonti, Jack, Spak
bessie: DB, Jack
Jack: Xivii, bessie
Mala: Jack, Spak
Triss: bessie
fonti: DB, Xivii
Sabrar: Jack, Mala
Spak: DB, Mala

Corrected.

 

[Deadbananas]

Sabrar I'm not sure what this is. Are you doing the votes people have on them or the votes people have committed?

 

[Sabrar]

Jack - 5
DB - 4
bessie - 2
fonti - 2
Mala - 2
Spak - 2
Xivii - 2

 

[Sabrar]

I copied Xivii's list, I assumed it was who would vote for whom

 

[Xivii]

???

 

[Sabrar]

I might have read it wrong.

 

[Xivii]

The list I made is a vote count

 

[Deadbananas]

I assumed Xivii's list was who was getting voted by whom lol, I'm not willing to vote for Fonti, and the main two I have said was Xivii and Bessie

 

[Sabrar]

yeah, okay, i read it wrong. I'll let Xivii tabulate

 

[bessie]

I can check the thread before work but might not be able to check the last few hours before deadline.

 

[Xivii]

How many hours until deadline?

 

[Malakandra]

I think just a bit over 12