STL 2.1 [Smash Lab Non-Public Copy]

[John12346]

Should we make a mention of characters who go through with their Jab combos while holding A, even if they're not hitting the opponent?

Such as Pit, Dedede, Link, Toon Link, Charizard*, ICs*, Olimar*, etc?

*Not 100% sure

 

[standardtoaster]

What about diddy kong?

 

[John12346]

Well, I was just stating some examples. Should we put in a column for characters who have auto-complete Jabs?

 

[Yikarur]

I just went through my list of potential changes I made few weeks ago and wanted to ask you what you think about it

I want to change the order of the subpoints of the table of contents:

[collapse=Table of contents]
Table of contents should have the following order:
1. General Terms
2. Movement
3. Standard Attacks
4. Tilts
5. Smashes
6. Aerials
7. Specials
8. Item Techniques
9. Shielding
10. Dodges
11. Grabs and Throws
12. Teching, Missed Techs, and Tripping
13. Ledge Movement
14. Hitbox and Hurtbox properties
15. Status Effects
16. Armour, Resistances, Weaknesses, and Immunities
[/collapse]

does anyone want to do this? I'm not knowledged with the table function.

does anyone know what the exakt maximum damage you can have is?
I have it atm like this:

"Damage - A measure of how much a character will be sent flying when struck. Damage can take any value in the range of real numbers up to 999%, at that point added damage will not be displayed but knockback will still rise until the maximum knockback is reached.
Decimal places are truncated for display (e.g. a damage of 14.67% will be displayed as 14%)."

this is true in praxis, but not true in theory (there must be a damage limit that we can't see)

funny thing is, the game also contains negative damage, in BrawMinus DKs sidetaunt heals him and I once healed over 6000% and I could hit DK with 10 Warlock punches (666%) without DK flinching. (negative damage = knockback decreases xD)
but I don't think there is anything like that in the real game lol

 

[Toomai]

I know a guy that once did a test where he compared the knockback of a target at 999% and a target at 999% plus about a minute's worth of pummelling, and found no difference. Would be worth verifying.

Negative damage is how stamina mode works, but yeah it can't happen in normal circumstances.

 

[MonkUnit]

Add the new meteor cancel find to the op?

 

[T-block]

this is true in praxis

i wtf'd

that's neat about negative damage though

 

[Toomai]

So are we going to publish the updated version or what? Because the current public version is comparetively lame.

 

[Yikarur]

I'm not going to call this version an updated one.
I have to re-write few things but I'm to lazy atm.
but I'll find my time this week.

 

[phi1ny3]

I don't know about you guys, but one term I've seen some disagreement on in denotation lately is "gimp/gimping". What are the thoughts of what constitutes a successful "gimp"?

 

[Yikarur]

gimping is a low% death, mostly by edgeguarding.
Low% is relative and could be about 100% too, just far outside the actual kill%.

 

[John12346]

Hitting the opponent(generally offstage) in a way that they do not die, but cannot recover back to the stage.

 

[Stealth Raptor]

i dunno if mk shuttle loops you and kills you at thirty offstage i consider that a gimp. i always thought that gimping was dieing at low percents where you shouldnt be dieing

 

[DeLux]

Gimp imo is like the equivalent of a slang term for Brawl, despite being pretty universal, and shouldn't be included in the STL.

If it is included, we should make a special section for like "common terms in brawl vernacular" like Socal DI, gimp, The Combo Video, etc etc etc

 

[Yikarur]

you can't compare gimp with socal DI lol

gimp is an absolute general used term, don't talk it so down.

 

[Indigo Jeans]

Gimp has been around since the Melee days, and the word entered our speech through the playstyle of Gimpyfish, a Bowser main most famous for his Melee play that includes -surprise!- a lot of gimping. As such it is not only a brawl term but also a Melee term and, to some extent, a 64 as well.

 

[MonkUnit]

I talked to Gimpyfish62. He said his name has nothing to do with the term "gimp".

 

[Indigo Jeans]

what, really? 'Cause I didn't just base my statement off of the mere similarity between the term and the name (that'd be incredibly dumb lol)...

Also a Google Insights search for both "gimp-program+super smash bros." and "gimpyfish62+super smash bros." shows both of them peaking first in May 2006 then being at their highest in March 2008 in terms of interest over time. A search for "Super Smash Bros. Melee" shows interest extremely high during 2004 (and presumably even before that, because Google Insights can only retrieve/gather data as far back as 2004 at the time), then going into hills and valleys at intervals (with one "hill" being during July 2006), before finally going into serious decline after July 2006. This lends some credibility to my statement.

[collapse=gimp-program+super smash bros.]

Link to Insights Page: http://www.google.com/insights/search/#q=gimp-program+super smash bros.&cmpt=q[/collapse]
[collapse=gimpyfish62+super smash bros.]

Link to Insights: http://www.google.com/insights/search/#q=gimyfish62+super smash bros.&cmpt=q[/collapse]
[collapse=Super Smash Bros. Melee]

Link to Insights: http://www.google.com/insights/search/#q=Super Smash Bros. Melee&cmpt=q[/collapse]

You'll notice that the first two graphs are extremely similar... which I find weird.

 

[MonkUnit]

[9:01pm] MonkUnit: AndroUser62: Smash Lab is discussing where the term "gimp" came from. I told them that you had nothing to do with the term. isnt it true that you have nothing to do with the term "gimp"
[9:01pm] AndroUser62: i have nothing to do with it

There you go, proof.

AndroUser62 = Gimpyfish62, btw.

EDIT:
[9:01pm] jiang: Gimp in RPGs to accumulate stats, atrubutes or skills is such a way that your character is almost useless.
[9:02pm] jiang: gimp is a really old term
[9:02pm] jiang: means someone that is handicapped

 

[Indigo Jeans]

Oh... well while I wouldn't quite agree with you had you just given me Gimpy's testimonial as proof (because it doesn't have to have been "endorsed" by him for it to spread), I do concede to your second point.

Edit: I just realised that the original argument was "Gimp"'s legitimacy as a term... though that's in no way intended to downplay your proving me wrong.

 

[MonkUnit]

Sorry, didn't mean to come off like that. lol

 

[Indigo Jeans]

Like how? You didn't come off as anything negative :L

 

[MonkUnit]

"though that's in no way intended to downplay your proving me wrong"

That's what I was referring to. I didn't mean for my post to sound like that.

 

[Indigo Jeans]

Welp, you were right and I was wrong. That's all there is to it. Stop feeling bad and making me feel bad!

 

[MonkUnit]

I'm just trying to be nice and polite and seeing the error in tone I used.

Anyways, I'm sure there are more terms stuff to discuss.

 

[Toomai]

So is this going to be updated outside the lab or what.

 

[Yikarur]

it will, I will update a lot later. I'm just that kind of a guy that I don't update anything without asking people for their opinion (if the change is not obvious)

something I want to address:

so we have

air dodge
and
spotdodge

two different writings, I would write air dodge without the space too, what do you think? (@everyone)

 

[DeLux]

It should have a space imo

 

[Yikarur]

why? it's one word for me and people use it like that all the time.
I rarely see it with space.

 

[Toomai]

Google sez:

"airdodge" 105,000
"air dodge" 89,200

"spot dodge" 63,000
"sidestep" 57,200
"spotdodge" 53,100
"side step" 8,010 (+asks if you meant "sidestep")

Expecting some consistency? TOO BAD FACTS TIME.

(FYI: Melee instructions use "Air Dodge" and simply "dodge", Brawl instructions and DOJO!! use "sidestep", SmashWiki currently uses "air dodge" and "sidestep")

 

[Yikarur]

if you search Spot dodge it seaches "spot" and "dodge" which will result in more hits.

but without space seems more popular in general

 

[Stealth Raptor]

im gonna assume he used quotes to get both together and not seperate

 

[Yikarur]

ah right
we should stick to the spaceless version.

 

[rPSIvysaur]

has the public version been completely updated with everything we added in here?

 

[Toomai]

I highly doubt it has been updated even a smidge.