Starting roster already revealed (SamuraiPanda's Conspiracy Theoracy) [Final Update]

[Shadow2011]

Hey man i like your theory and all but uh....dont you know that's just the e for all demo roster he used as a pic for us?

 

[xbrinkx]

I had supporting facts though. You can try to kill it all you want, but it goes hand in hand with Conspiracy Theoracy. You can believe it or you can't. We'll see who's right in the end. I just wanted to show my viewpoint on Brawl. Trust me, I'd love to have more characters in Brawl then ever, but from my view it's hard to see them having more much more. Seriously, all the characters on Brawl are starters? C'mon. That's just impossible.

I forgot to touch on Shiek in Brawl. I just need to say that TP has had a VERY HEAVY influence on Brawl. So it's a little hard to see TP Zelda changing into OoT Shiek. Some say she'll change to Midna. That's kinda weird.

 

[PineapplePete]

You make some exceptional arguments, though I'm still not convinced. The biggest reason for this is that I believe, if Sonic were a starter, he would definitely be on the cover. How many people would pick up the game after seeing Sonic on the box of a smash bros game? In my mind, the only reason he would not put him on the box is if he were unlockable. We're pretty sure that this is the final boxart, of course. In your post, you speak of the boxart, but please address Sonic's absence. I'm not sure if this has been said yet..

 

[RegalBuster]

Even if i didn't see the e for all videos i'd still know that that's not the starting roster, Sakurai would have to be pretty stupid to put Meta=Knight as a starter and not kirby, nor put Dedede(who's obviously starter) Zelda and Ice Climbers(why wouldn't they be starters, and Pokemon Trainer(He's on the ****ing cover art).

 

[Boofer]

I had supporting facts though. You can try to kill it all you want, but it goes hand in hand with Conspiracy Theoracy. You can believe it or you can't. We'll see who's right in the end. I just wanted to show my viewpoint on Brawl. Trust me, I'd love to have more characters in Brawl then ever, but from my view it's hard to see them having more much more. Seriously, all the characters on Brawl are starters? C'mon. That's just impossible.

I forgot to touch on Shiek in Brawl. I just need to say that TP has had a VERY HEAVY influence on Brawl. So it's a little hard to see TP Zelda changing into OoT Shiek. Some say she'll change to Midna. That's kinda weird.

I wouldn't say impossible. Yeah, thinking that is probably a bit optimistic though. But I don't know, I really do think that all but a few characters are starters. I find it really hard to believe that we'll only have 5 more characters than melee.

Clones you say are out? Probably, but I don't think he's going to get rid of most of those characters. Rather he's going to give some of them new movesets. You are really considering that Luigi might be gone? Really though? I would bet a large amount of money that luigi is returning, and I don't even really care about Luigi.

Really though, I think that the unrevealed veterans alone will bring the roster up to about 30, let alone all of the unrevealed characters.

 

[Hippochinfat]

Oh man you fail.

 

[Hippochinfat]

haha that idiot said he thinks there will only be 30 characters! HAHAHA HE IS SO DUMB. Stupid xbrinkx

 

[xbrinkx]

I wouldn't say impossible. Yeah, thinking that is probably a bit optimistic though. But I don't know, I really do think that all but a few characters are starters. I find it really hard to believe that we'll only have 5 more characters than melee.

Clones you say are out? Probably, but I don't think he's going to get rid of most of those characters. Rather he's going to give some of them new movesets. You are really considering that Luigi might be gone? Really though? I would bet a large amount of money that luigi is returning, and I don't even really care about Luigi.

Really though, I think that the unrevealed veterans alone will bring the roster up to about 30, let alone all of the unrevealed characters.

I'm considering he may be gone sadly. I'm braced for it if this is true. I never said that clones would come back with new movesets, remember me talking about Ganondorf? I'd prefer that. I'm hoping clones come back uncloned and completely original. Although this seems unlikely since how much work would go into so much tweaking and changing and all for already done characters. (Talking to everyone here.) Trust me, if you don't want to be completely disappointed then look at it from a different standpoint. If I'm right then look at it this way. All of the characters in Brawl will have a completely original edge and won't have unnecisary clones that take up game space. I seriously wish we had more characters though.

EDIT: Hippo, go jump in a lake. you won't be so happy when you're disappointed at your extraneous expectations. Btw, I actually think the roster we have so far actually would be completely good to me. I don't expect "put in exact amount of characters" for Brawl. If you could think of how hard that they work for the game in its entirety then you'd see how ridiculous 40 characters is.

 

[susu_atari]

My personal opinion of this is that they are just using the demo roster as a placeholder if character selection needs to be demonstrated.

Also, there's this quote from the same Dojo update:

"If one of your opponents chooses a character you haven’t unlocked yet, it will be spoiled for you immediately."

This implies that no hidden characters have been spoiled already, does it not?

Despite Sakurai stating later that he is "not being too hung up on hidden characters", these last paragraphs do seem to roughly imply that no hidden characters have been revealed already.

 

[RegalBuster]

The roster went from 12 to 26...i can see it jumping from 26 to 45-50. Only 30 characters? We'd get no unlockable newcomers.

 

[Pluvia's other account]

I highly doubt that's the starting roster. I can't believe people actually think it is.

It doesn't matter too much. I'm completely satisfied if this is the starting roster (Sonic doesn't even deserve a spot in the game, why the hell should he be unlockable?). Besides, most of us will have very character within two weeks of owning the game.

2 Weeks?!?

If it's anything like Melee, then it'll be 2 days!

 

[susu_atari]

Something just crossed my mind. This roster is unlikely to be the actual starting roster, but if they're still keeping the starting roster secret, then there must be more characters still to be put on it.

 

[Boofer]

I'm considering he may be gone sadly. I'm braced for it if this is true. I never said that clones would come back with new movesets, remember me talking about Ganondorf? I'd prefer that. I'm hoping clones come back uncloned and completely original. Although this seems unlikely since how much work would go into so much tweaking and changing and all for already done characters. (Talking to everyone here.) Trust me, if you don't want to be completely disappointed then look at it from a different standpoint. If I'm right then look at it this way. All of the characters in Brawl will have a completely original edge and won't have unnecisary clones that take up game space. I seriously wish we had more characters though.

So basically, you're "predicting" this because you don't want to be dissapointed, correct? I don't think you should really call it a theory if that's the case. It's pretty much the opposite of what most people do; most people would make faulty predictions based on what they WANT to happen.

When predicting what clones will come back, don't simply write them ALL off; consider how important they are to their series. Trust me, Luigi will stay. Captain Falcon will stay(I don't even know why he's on your list of people to be gone, because he's not even a clone). Ganondorf will stay. There's really no reason to get rid of those characters, considering their roles in their respective series'. Personally, I think Pichu, Dr. Mario, and Roy are definitely out. Falco and Young Link are kind of iffy. All of the non-clone secrets will probably return.

The final roster will probably be like 38 or so. I think that's very realistic.

 

[doppimus]

“But even without this mode, given the proliferation of the Internet these days, the existence of hidden characters is going to get exposed anyway.
So, this time I’m moving in the direction of not being too hung up on hidden characters.
You can earn most characters by playing through Adventure Mode: The Subspace Emissary. For those of you who look forward to those encounters, I recommend you clear this mode before playing Basic Brawl.”


I'm sure you all read this over and over. The information you can logically pull from this translations is thus. (that have to do with characters of course)
1. There are hidden characters.
2. Most but not all hidden characters can be unlocked by Adventure Mode.
3. They are unlocked through "encounters". "those of you who look forward" suggests that he is keeping the New Challenger Approaches way of unlocking. Though there could be others aswell.
4. He doesn't want to reveal the hidden characters even though he knows they won't stay "hidden" for very long. Thanks to the internet.

One can then assume that the picture he showed to show the character select screen had all characters from the starting roster. One could even go as far as saying he has not revealed any hidden characters thus far. (no luigi update?, jigglypuff?, cpt falcon? and god I hope Ness?) Wait a minute. Those are all 4 hiddens from 64...Some of which were hiddens in melee, coincidence???

Now I read that all 3rd parties were going to be unlockable. So what is the deal with revealing Sonic and Snake. You've already said it. Hype. Sakurai himself said he isn't that worried about it. But that doesn't mean he's just gonna give away the hidden characters unless his bosses boss tells him they need to hype the game up more. Perhaps right before an event like E for All. I'm not gonna check on snake but I wouldn't be suprised if he was revealed right before some event aswell.

I'm expecting a lot of characters in brawl. More than you would think to put in this game.

 

[xbrinkx]

The roster went from 12 to 26...i can see it jumping from 26 to 45-50. Only 30 characters? We'd get no unlockable newcomers.

Umm, I believe you're seeing it from the point of view that the starting roster is all we've gotten on the Dojo so far. That's a highly unlikely claim and Sakurai said himself that he wanted to reveal all of the hidden characters first. As I said in Rumor Zoomer theory this goes hand in hand with SP's Conspiracy Theoracy, which states that we got the starting roster in With Anyone Basic Brawl update. Meaning that there are about 8 unlockables in the game so far if this is true.

Here we go again with the pattern theory again. You can not say there is a definite pattern in the games because there have only been 2 games so far. Meaning this has happened once and is not a reliable theory. I wish this theory would go away because nothing really points towards it besides one common misconseption. There can't possibly be twice as many characters in Brawl than there were in Melee.

To counter you Boofer, I'm just trying to lower the EXTRAVAGANTLY HIGH expectations for Brawl so everyone isn't like, "Wow that was less exciting than I expected... " Trust me I am very hyped about the game. I really can call it a theory because of the many theories I'm showing to be too blown out of proportion to be less than they appear. Take for instance the 'pattern' theory. Think I should make a new thread? Anyways, I'm not writing them off for good. I'm just saying Sakurai's said that he wanted to get rid of the clones. I didn't mean CF as a clone, I'm just pointing out that CF and Ganondorf are two very big characters to Smash and if they both have the same moves and that if clones are out of the questions then CF and Ganondorf are fighting for the role. Unless of course Ganondorf could get an original moveset which could fix this entire thing.

 

[PrettyGoodYear]

Still not convinced, SP. Sorry. Individually, you make a few good points, but I don't see it all coming together.

 

[Iceman12]

I'm considering he may be gone sadly. I'm braced for it if this is true. I never said that clones would come back with new movesets, remember me talking about Ganondorf? I'd prefer that. I'm hoping clones come back uncloned and completely original. Although this seems unlikely since how much work would go into so much tweaking and changing and all for already done characters. (Talking to everyone here.) Trust me, if you don't want to be completely disappointed then look at it from a different standpoint. If I'm right then look at it this way. All of the characters in Brawl will have a completely original edge and won't have unnecisary clones that take up game space. I seriously wish we had more characters though.

EDIT: Hippo, go jump in a lake. you won't be so happy when you're disappointed at your extraneous expectations. Btw, I actually think the roster we have so far actually would be completely good to me. I don't expect "put in exact amount of characters" for Brawl. If you could think of how hard that they work for the game in its entirety then you'd see how ridiculous 40 characters is.

40 characters is not ridicoulous at all, far from it infact. Brawl has been in development well over 2 years, so its not all that out there to think there will be greater than 40 characters. The entire world would be extremely pissed at a 30 character Brawl roster considering the fact its been in development for 2 years and some change.

 

[RegalBuster]

You know what's even dumber than the pattern theory? The theory that that's the starting roster. Melee's demo had a fraction of the starters, it didn't have them all and also in that demo Kirby wasn't playable. Until sakurai makes a "Starting Roster" update that's not the starting roster

 

[xbrinkx]

Ah, RegalBuster, but this is in the update, not in the demo. See first post, it's hard to explain. -.-

 

[RegalBuster]

Ah, RegalBuster, but this is in the update, not in the demo. See first post, it's hard to explain. -.-

it's the demos roster and it has no ice climbers, zelda, kirby, wario and pokemon trainer which makes it not the starting roster.

 

[shadowyoshi2345]

If the E for All Demo is the starting roster, that would be ridiculous, the theory has strong points, but we'll just have to wait untill saturday for the coro coro magazine to see how true this theory is

 

[KrystalRules]

If the E for All Demo is the starting roster, that would be ridiculous, the theory has strong points, but we'll just have to wait untill saturday for the coro coro magazine to see how true this theory is

why i wouldnt mind it. i would love to unlock tons of characters. and im saying 35 characters!

 

[doppimus]

it has no strong points.

 

[KJC2004]

5 more days.........

IM CONVINCED, HES NOT GUILTY!!!

*ill give a cookie to whoever can tell me where that quote was from

 

[Firebert]

I wasn't sure about this until I heard it on SMYN. That made me really think about it and decide to agree with it. However, I too wish that his weren't true.

 

[Darkraid]

Very nice theory, but doesn't hold water. Kirby is not in the starting roster!!! It's impossible man. I say the the chars in the dojo are starters, including sonic and snake.

 

[shadowyoshi2345]

If unlocking characters is too easy by just playing through the SSE, it almost wouldn't be as fun as trying to accomplish a difficult task, and kirby has to be a starting charcater, unlocking him in the first level of the SSE would just be pointless

 

[doppimus]

not all unlockable characters will be unlocked in SSE. Just "Most" will

 

[xbrinkx]

Not necessarily. Possibly Kirby's a hook to SSE. You would certainly play it to unlock your favorite characters right? To me it makes perfect sense for a different perspective.

 

[perpetual ownage]

I don't agree with your theory. There is no logical reason why Kirby wouldn't be a starter. Also, I believe that Captain Falcon is a starter and that Sakurai showed the E for All roster because he didn't want to spoil any other characters that haven't already been announced. King Dedede will be in the starting roster. Proof, the event match update. I don't agree but I like your theory.

 

[Darkpaladin of Chaos]

Sakurai also used the demo's stage selection screen, so that's more evidence that he was using what was already available from the demo as an example. I don't think it's likely that Rumble Falls, for one, is a hidden stage.

And then there's the fact that Ice Climbers and Zelda are shown in the other screenshots.

But I would actually be fine if this were the real starting roster. I mean, all the characters are still going to be there.

 

[shadowyoshi2345]

just the fact of starting with 14 characters, which is the same amount we started with in ssbm seems unlikely to me

 

[Darkraid]

Very true ^^

 

[UrajKingofDarkness]

No logical reason for Kirby to not be a starter? Tell me the logic for him HAVING to be a starter other than "he was already a starter twice before". This is the third game in the series; just because in the 2nd game they made all the original starters available from the get-go doesn't mean by any stretch that they MUST include him right off the bat.

If, as SamuraiPanda speculates, he was unlocked just by playing the very first match in SSE, then he's as good as a starter anyways. If you just HAVE to play as Kirby the moment you get the game and need to unlock him first, I doubt it'll kill anyone to play SSE for two minutes. Same goes for Dedede, if he's indeed unlocked from Event Mode.

 

[perpetual ownage]

No logical reason for Kirby to not be a starter? Tell me the logic for him HAVING to be a starter other than "he was already a starter twice before". This is the third game in the series; just because in the 2nd game they made all the original starters available from the get-go doesn't mean by any stretch that they MUST include him right off the bat.

If, as SamuraiPanda speculates, he was unlocked just by playing the very first match in SSE, then he's as good as a starter anyways. If you just HAVE to play as Kirby the moment you get the game and need to unlock him first, I doubt it'll kill anyone to play SSE for two minutes. Same goes for Dedede, if he's indeed unlocked from Event Mode.

Well, I am aware that Dedede could very well be unlocked from the very first event. I was going to put that in my first post. Anyways. I still think that the E for all roster was used because there are other characters, not yet revealed, that will be in the original roster, and Sakurai didn't want to spoil it. e.g Falcon. Also other possible not yet revealed newcomers could also be in the starting roster.

 

[Boofer]

No logical reason for Kirby to not be a starter? Tell me the logic for him HAVING to be a starter other than "he was already a starter twice before". This is the third game in the series; just because in the 2nd game they made all the original starters available from the get-go doesn't mean by any stretch that they MUST include him right off the bat.

If, as SamuraiPanda speculates, he was unlocked just by playing the very first match in SSE, then he's as good as a starter anyways. If you just HAVE to play as Kirby the moment you get the game and need to unlock him first, I doubt it'll kill anyone to play SSE for two minutes. Same goes for Dedede, if he's indeed unlocked from Event Mode.

Hmm.. I don't know, MAYBE THE FACT THAT KIRBY IS THE MAIN CHARACTER IN THE SERIES. Isn't that logical enough? Uhh...also, Metaknight and not Kirby. You're calling the "he was a starter twice before" illogical, yet Panda's reason for including Metaknight and no Kirby logical? Makes no sense at all...

 

[RegalBuster]

No logical reason for Kirby to not be a starter? Tell me the logic for him HAVING to be a starter other than "he was already a starter twice before". This is the third game in the series; just because in the 2nd game they made all the original starters available from the get-go doesn't mean by any stretch that they MUST include him right off the bat.

If, as SamuraiPanda speculates, he was unlocked just by playing the very first match in SSE, then he's as good as a starter anyways. If you just HAVE to play as Kirby the moment you get the game and need to unlock him first, I doubt it'll kill anyone to play SSE for two minutes. Same goes for Dedede, if he's indeed unlocked from Event Mode.

Kirby's the ****ing character that the series is named after! why would his sword weilding clone be a starter before himself?

 

[perpetual ownage]

No one should be forced to unlock Kirby even if it is just the first Subspace Emissary battle. If every character were unlocked in Subspace Emissary, then there would be alot of "new challenger approaching" screens after you complete it.

 

[doppimus]

kirby is not the main character in the series.

 

[perpetual ownage]

kirby is not the main character in the series.

If Kirby isn't the main character, then who is? Meta knight sure isn't.