Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!
You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!
In 64/Melee he looks like a Fox who has seen some ****. Which is fine because he has seen some ****. The one in Brawl looks so trendy, it just feels like they sold out with him and made him more streamlined and "kawaii".
That is a completely different type of 'modernization.' Besides, both sides of this argument is based on opinion and personal likes and dislikes. Clearly fox has graphically improved. His design? That's a personal preference. I like Melee Fox's Head shape more (it is more fox like, but his newer face design is still okay), but the outfit I prefer Smash 4's design overall.
Yeah but if we just accept every change as a change of the times at what point will characters not be themselves anymore?
There's like 3 other recent games where he isn't scared at every little thing.
You can blame that on Command/recent appearances' design and the artstyle of brawl/smash 4 adding more details to plainer characters (like olimar's suit.) In some aspects it is 'modernization' because the hardware's capabilities are better graphically, but it is more of an adaption to the art style of the last two recent smashes. They have strengthened his character with more of that cowardice/ shadowed awkward brother vibe recently.
Yeah, Roy and Pichu sure made me feel nostalgic when I played Melee. And Lucas, Lucario, Olimar and Ike made me super nostalgic about Brawl. Don't get me started on Rosalina and Wii Fit Trainer. So much nostaaalgiaaaaa!!!
I would agree it is more about nintendo vs. Nostalgia, but we do get little bursts of nostalgia each sequel with the ice climbers, Mr. Game & Watch, stages, etc. Nintendo is so heavily tied with nostalgia and the childhoods of many it is bound to happen. Anyways this is kinda off topic when talking about graphic comparisons.
You're focusing on the last minute additions for Melee look at literally every other character, you could very well feel nostalgic for Lucas (Japanese people can anyhow) and Olimar. Lucario I'll give you, the Pokemon company is probably a ***** to work with but you'll notice the 4 other Pokemon characters are nostalgia city. Rosalina came out in 08 it is 2014 that's 6 years you can be nostalgic for something that happened 6 years ago, same for the trainer similar time.
It did look like Falco, the thing is Falco kinda looks like a parrot.
The thing about command is that its a spin off really. It'd be like if they based DK off of that GBA game where you climb on pegs and not DKC.
Well sadly it's all starfox has gotten lately minus the remake of Star Fox 64. Also really? I always viewed them as tired eyes and he was always like the kind of cowering younger brother who always wanted to be like his older brother and looks up to him and his adventures. I do agree that luigi does stand out and he is my favorite mario brother.
I wish Mario didn't look so angry all the time. It would change things up if he looked more similar to 3d worlds official art then just a reskined brawl model(he has a wider head than in smash imo). Same goes for and .Pikachu's nose got smaller. Theres not much they can do with him.I wish they could change around the StarFox team a bit more though. All they did for the most part is change the color of his boots.quite a bit. but not other than his eyes being brown.looks better in this one. I like the smirk he has all the time. It stays true to his character. These three have the best changes currently
But Brawl took a lot from Melee, too. Characters like Mario, Luigi, Bowser, Marth, Pikachu, Jigglypuff, Kirby, Ice Climbers and Ness didn't change designs from Melee to Brawl.
Yes. they changed a lot. Icees, Bowser, Marth, Mario, and Luigi changed from Melee to Brawl. Icees got a little thinner and taller imo. Melee to Brawl was a big jump. This game doesn't seem to have that big of a jump between designs and the characters overall look. Mario compared melee to brawl look very different. You can tell its the same character sure but the skin tone, eyes, and a bunch of other little things changed to make a big difference.
Actually, Peach's Brawl dress is completely different, not even close to Melee. But Mario and ICs still look the same to me..
Yea I was kinda reaching with Peach. lol. I never really thought that she looked the same until this conversation. And I didn't bother to look at a peach comparison either.
I don't get it.
It just doesn't seem fresh you know? I'd like it to be like when you look at a character you can say "hey thats the Mario from smash 4! Hey thats the Mario from brawl!" Sure its the same Mario but its more exciting to see how they can make a character look different but still retain the same "look" thats all. I'm fine with how it looks. I'm not like, against this games graphics. I just wish for there to be a little more diversity between generations thats all.
Yea he hasn't changed much. Most of them haven't but it's exciting to see how the characters change looks when a new smash comes out. More so than just color swapping. If they made him look more like this
Well, yea I'd say it matters. Not that its completely necessary but it help make the game feel new. The way the characters look in comparison to the past ones helps the way the game seems like its progressed. Remember this moment?
You are forgetting the 'big graphical change' of smash 4 is the HD. So the rendered stills like character art don't seem like that big of a jump, but playing it will feel different. Also the washed out Brawl color scheme will be more evident when playing the new smash. Another thing is Nintendo is very strict on how mario looks in game so there wasn't going to be a huge art style difference to the point of changing his proportions. (Remember this mario is based more so on the Wii generation than this generation.)Well, yea I'd say it matters. Not that its completely necessary but it help make the game feel new. The way the characters look in comparison to the past ones helps the way the game seems like its progressed. Remember this moment?The first time I saw it at least. I got really excited. All of the characters looked cool and new! (except Kirby lol) But with Smash 4 the most advertised character (mario) looks pretty much the same. I was kinda disappointed. Just look at the DK comparison. Has DK changed the way he looks in his games? No, not really. but they still changed his design enough to make it seem fresh and interesting. But I mean its a new game so why shouldn't the characters look new too? Thats all. I'd prefer them to change so maybe the next smash mario will look a little more different.
And I know that most of the characters have changed quite a bit. In fact haha (I've noticed this since her reveal) Peach's lips look different lol. that space in between her lips and nose looks different than before. It keeps her face from looking so flat. Yea either way I'm satisfied with the graphics but my preference is that the character designs would change between games.
Well if HD is the big graphical change then why did they bother changing any of the other characters models? I'm not asking for mario and others to look completely different. I'd just want Mario to look different but still like Mario (like they did with DK, Bowser, etc.). Nintendo was obviously aware of Wii U games seeing as how we have stages from Wii U games. In fact, some of the stages are from Wii U games that came out before 3d World and other newer Mario games. Mario's look isn't necessarily based on any specific generation its just that they wanted Mario to look a certain way. I certainly don't remember Bowser looking so evil in a Wii game. This game is rushed so I'm sure they are going to cut corners where they want.
Exactly. If they are trying to save time then it proves that its being rushed. Them asking Bandai Namco to help make the game proves that its being rushed as well. This game has been rushed ever since they announced it back in 2011. Brawl took 2 years to make too. That game was extremely rushed. 3 landmasters. Sakurai mentioned adding remixes of old songs to Green Hill zone and Hyrule temple. But there was only one per stage all the rest were ports. I honestly don't see how this game isn't being rushed as well. You kinda undid your own statement. You said it wasn't rushed but then implied that they'd be losing content if they didn't borrow character models from Brawl. If the game wasn't being rushed like you said then they wouldn't need to borrow character models.
Actually yea most of them are a lot better I'd say lol. Just Mario, Luigi, Diddy, Lucario, and Fox don't seem to have changed too much. I guess Lucario and other Pokemon can't change too much. Though if Ivy comes back I hope they don't make him as wide. I feel like he should have a skinnier look to him like in his official artwork.
To fit the more colorful art style, so mario, kirby, etc. already fit. Bowser, Samus, etc. Didn't fit the clean polished looks as much so they were changed. Some characters don't get games as often so their designs stay fairly similar. It will be like Melee to Brawl how some got slight alterations instead of a full revamp to the physical design (Not talking about the art style changes.)
You do know how game development works, right? Having Namco Bandai members on the team doesn't equal them rushing. You do know Brawl had several smaller companies helping with the dev team, but they weren't a big brand name like Namco Bandai. I have a feeling it was a marketing move to announce the partnership with Namco Bandai to appease fans that this game will be more balanced and less casual focused like Brawl. The models are not ripped for the playable characters, I agree with whoever said earlier on in the thread that their designs have become more consistent over the years. Another thing that Brawl had to deal with was tons of pre-rendered fully animated cut-scenes which took a lot of time to make, although they have publicly stated that the hardware was having technical issues and some things had to be altered in the final product for Brawl. We do know that the newest smash was planned since around the release/reveal of the 3DS when Sakurai was throwing around the idea of a portable smash bros. Also about the songs there were unused songs in the data for Brawl, and I knew a lot of them were actually for mother so maybe that is evidence for trying to add more remixes/renditions of songs to preexisting stages. Overall we do not know if it is being rushed or not; it is just speculation either way.
I don't think that all the changes were made to fit the art style of the game. I think bowsers color changed because of the art style but they also changed his posture and many other things about him that go beyond the art style. I don't think they changed Samus just because of her art style. Sakurai said that it was inspired by Other M. Sure it fits the art style just fine but I don't think the sole purpose of changing her was to fin the art style.
I didnt mean samus was changed because of the new art style, I meant they decided to use her other M design as her smash design over her more iconic designs because it fit. They probably would have used it anyways because it was the last game in the series. They can't keep changing characters though and have them still be the same characters. The big pull seems to be fox's new fur. Ice climbers and pit are different compared to fox since fox is one of the flagship mascots and he is part of a larger franchise than the others. Pit was designed as if he changed throughout the years like link. I personally think Fox looks fine. It isn't like they could change much more and keep him consistent or better than his last appearances and with how he looks in Brawl.
Oh ok, Yea they seem to be taking characters to their newest designs. Yea they can keep changing characters and have them still be the same. Fox's new fur is only detailed in his artwork not in gameplay. They did change his boots though... They can change Fox though. There is a lot of creativity in these people. Saying that they can't come up with a new altered design is like saying that they can't come up with StarFox song remixes anymore. Art is art whether in character designs or music, creativity can't be contained. Its not as difficult as you think to just make a character look a little bit more different than the last time while still retaining the characters look. Its the same thing with Mario. If they changed him a little bit more then its not like we would forget that its Mario.
I don't think Bowsers canon counterpart has changed either but they changed how he looks. Yes the 3d world artwork Mario and Sm4sh Mario do look different (head size, eye size etc.). But the point is that they can change how he looks and he will still be Mario. I'm not asking for a big change, just minuscule details that add up to a change. Just like with DeDeDe. Its possible or them to do it.
Smash's bowser never looked like Mario's bowser fully. They kind of had to play catch up and fix it. Also the fur is updated in gameplay compared to Brawl for fox and I meant a full redesign like melee to brawl. You lose a lot in a character if they change drastically every generation especially if you lose some of their iconic image. I never said they couldn't do it, I just disagree that yet another redesign would be best for fox. Also there really is no reason to redesign fox. Most people that dislike the design either want Melee fox back or dislike a single feature like his head shape or shoe shape.
He is based on the Mario & Luigi RPGs Bowser. My point was that Mario doesn't have other appearances to be based on. You could think that he does have different designs, just like how I pointed out that Mario & Luigi RPGs feature characters with different designs, but Mario's morphology in those games would impact the gameplay in Smash (he seems taller and thiner, and Luigi even moreso) and Mario, being the all-around character, doesn't need to be reworked like Bowser was by changing design.
Even though I don't think they're different, fair point, though I can't see what appearance they can base it off, since DDD was based on the anime. If they were to make Mario feel different, they need to add their own touch. Maybe they should? That's what they did with Peach and Rosalina!!
That's what I mean, because there are a lot of recent DK games, but they don't all make him look the same, Retro studio DK looks a bit different compared to Mario Spin-off DK. And Mario Spin-off DK is the same as DK when not by Retro studio or in JungleBeat. The only thing Smash DK has that normal DK doesn't is the fur.
Mind you, I, too, actually like Brawl DK
, but I was mostly referencing what some other people think around here, because Brawl's realism made him realistic (big surprise 
) and the general idea is that he looked "weird" or "bad" to some, compared to the "actual" one in Mario games. So by "bad" I meant it more like how he looks different, and I think that some 3DS characters look a lot like their Brawl self, including DK (but this is all opinion), I'm sorry, I didn't mean "bad" so literally.
I don't think they are really trying to play catch up by making Bowser's design different. I agree that his stance and colors are more Mario-esque but I think they were more focused on buffing him and his posture redesign is in correlation to his buffs.
but it was still a good talk.I feel like when people say that each character is based on specific things then you can kinda get lost with which game its based off of or it limits what they can do (I know you probably don't think that it limits it but to me it just sounds like it). While yes its obvious that Samus is based on Other M and Marth is based on his latest game, other characters don't have to be based on a specific game. I really don't think that Bowser is supposed to look like he does in the RPG's. I think they just decided to make Bowser look mean in Smash Bros. His color scheme looks like how it does in most Mario games. So, bringing it back to Mario, they don't have to make Mario based on any specific game. They just need to make him look like Mario. They can change how he looks without changing how he plays too. I agree with your point on Bowser though.He is based on the Mario & Luigi RPGs Bowser. My point was that Mario doesn't have other appearances to be based on. You could think that he does have different designs, just like how I pointed out that Mario & Luigi RPGs feature characters with different designs, but Mario's morphology in those games would impact the gameplay in Smash (he seems taller and thiner, and Luigi even moreso) and Mario, being the all-around character, doesn't need to be reworked like Bowser was by changing design.
Just in case I worded it weird, I don't mean that he was reworked because of the new design, more that SINCE he was reworked they gave him a new design
Even though I don't think they're different, fair point, though I can't see what appearance they can base it off, since DDD was based on the anime. If they were to make Mario feel different, they need to add their own touch. Maybe they should? That's what they did with Peach and Rosalina!!
That's what I mean, because there are a lot of recent DK games, but they don't all make him look the same, Retro studio DK looks a bit different compared to Mario Spin-off DK. And Mario Spin-off DK is the same as DK when not by Retro studio or in JungleBeat. The only thing Smash DK has that normal DK doesn't is the fur.
Mind you, I, too, actually like Brawl DK
I also don't claim to officially know what design inspired the Smash DK, but like I said earlier, doesn't look like Retro Studio or JungleBeat, and aside from these, there's pretty much only one other DK design, the Mario universe one.
. But they should change it a bit more with each game. I'm not saying they should change Mario too much. Just enough to make him look the same... but different.... if you catch my drift... lol.