SSB4 Rumours and Leaks

[kataridragon]

Greninja is just the coolest looking starter in X and Y. Also he is one of the coolest water starters but I cant forget empoleon from pearl and diamond. He is dope!

 

[Oblivion129]

Doubtful, given that he had no problem naming Wii Fit Trainer.

True, though Villager was "Animal Crossing guy". It makes me wonder if the tipper sees images or names.
If he sees images he would be able to describe some things. If he sees names he would be able to say Villager and Greninja instead of a vague description.

What if he gets placeholder names? Villager could have been his official name later on, and the X and Y Pokemon could have been decided after the release of the game.

The only Pokemon with any degree of promotion for X/Y have been the starters, the box legends and Sylveon.

No one knew that Greninja existed until leaks of him surfaced on 4chan in... late September I think.

Makes me think he was added after the release. (Plot twist: Sakurai himself leaked the Greninja image after he decided to add him)

 

[papagenos]

True, though Villager was "Animal Crossing guy". It makes me wonder if the tipper sees images or names.
If he sees images he would be able to describe some things. If he sees names he would be able to say Villager and Greninja instead of a vague description.

What if he gets placeholder names? Villager could have been his official name later on, and the X and Y Pokemon could have been decided after the release of the game.

Makes me think he was added after the release. (Plot twist: Sakurai himself leaked the Greninja image after he decided to add him)

Also possible we have an american/english speaking leaker seeing japanese gamefootage/roster and having to name things the best they can.

 

[Shroob]

Kind of ironic when you think about it: Greninja has been the subject of two (maybe) leaks for two separate games.

And it hasn't even been a year between the two leaks.

 

[TheTuninator]

I'm very doubtful that the leaker sees images. If he saw images and knew that the Pokemon was from X&Y, he'd be able to identify Greninja in a heartbeat.

It almost seems like the leaker has his own source that he's getting information from.

Also possible we have an american/english speaking leaker seeing japanese gamefootage/roster and having to name things the best they can.

Doubtful, as if so he has managed translations of most of the other names and could easily post his attempt at translating Greninja.

 

[kataridragon]

Ya know now that I think about it dont greninja and villager have different names in japanese? Morabito and gekkouga? maybe thats why the informant cant pinpoint their actual names...

 

[Oblivion129]

It almost seems like the leaker has his own source that he's getting information from.

I'm leaning on this and/or receiving placeholder names.

 

[TheTuninator]

Ya know now that I think about it dont greninja and villager have different names in japanese? Morabito and gekkouga? maybe thats why the informant cant pinpoint their actual names...

I really doubt that it's a translation issue, seeing as he knew that the pokemon was from X&Y and a quick google search of "gekkouga" brings up Greninja.

 

[papagenos]

I'm very doubtful that the leaker sees images. If he saw images and knew that the Pokemon was from X&Y, he'd be able to identify Greninja in a heartbeat.

It almost seems like the leaker has his own source that he's getting information from.



Doubtful, as if so he has managed translations of most of the other names and could easily post his attempt at translating Greninja.

well maybe he RECOGNIZES some of them and not others

Ya know now that I think about it dont greninja and villager have different names in japanese? Morabito and gekkouga? maybe thats why the informant cant pinpoint their actual names...

exactly.

 

[TheTuninator]

The likeliest explanation for any discrepancy is that the leaker himself is funneling information from another source to Sal. This theory also goes a long way toward explaining how the leaker could have incorrectly predicted 3 announcements for E3.

 

[kataridragon]

Tuninator I feel like your making a lot of assumptions. Occams Razor. The simplest explanations with the fewest assumptions are more likely to be true.

Yes I too am making assumptions but I'm not necessarily grasping for them. They fit the model given.

I think it's safest to assume that sals informant has first hand knowledge albeit not direct. He knows certain popular characters by name but can't read japanese. Simple. He obviously speaks English.

 

[alien803]

Maybe the reason that the leaker said "Pokemon form X and Y" instead of Greninja is because he got his information early on in the planning process? That would also explain why he got Villager's name wrong, it was a placeholder name. Sakurai knew he wanted to put in a newcomer from Pokemon, but the game wasn't out yet, so he just put "Pokemon from X and Y".

 

[SubparSmashBrother]

I'm very doubtful that the leaker sees images. If he saw images and knew that the Pokemon was from X&Y, he'd be able to identify Greninja in a heartbeat

Maybe he saw a pokemon he wasn't familiar with and just assumed it was from the most recent game?

 

[ES. Dinah]

Hey Sal. I just want to say that I love your site so much. Gematsu really has grown! Anyway I joined recently and have been a long time lurker. I want to say that I checked out the rumour on gematsu and it seems legit. We got Greninja who easily fits X and Y. Yes, I think whoever is giving him information might be a secret spy or something.

I believe the leak and I also believe Sal's post here. It sounds really hard to just guess wii fit trainer.

 

[TheTuninator]

Tuninator I feel like your making a lot of assumptions. Occams Razor. The simplest explanations with the fewest assumptions are more likely to be true.

How is "the leaker has a source, which is why he sometimes gets things wrong" any more of an assumption than "the leaker is being given only Japanese character names and can't read Japanese despite giving us most of the other character names accurately"?

Maybe he saw a pokemon he wasn't familiar with and just assumed it was from the most recent game?

In that case, wouldn't it make sense for him to provide some physical characteristics of the Pokemon? No real reason not to, since he was not discomfited by the idea of revealing any other characters accurately.

 

[kataridragon]

How is "the leaker has a source, which is why he sometimes gets things wrong" any more of an assumption than "the leaker is being given only Japanese character names and can't read Japanese despite giving us most of the other character names accurately"?




In that case, wouldn't it make sense for him to provide some physical characteristics of the Pokemon? No real reason not to, since he was not discomfited by the idea of revealing any other characters accurately.

None of the other leaked characters have alternate japanese names. Marshal may be the exception though. Hence "choir boy"

However "frog pokemon" would have been way more descriptive.

 

[papagenos]

How is "the leaker has a source, which is why he sometimes gets things wrong" any more of an assumption than "the leaker is being given only Japanese character names and can't read Japanese despite giving us most of the other character names accurately"?




In that case, wouldn't it make sense for him to provide some physical characteristics of the Pokemon? No real reason not to, since he was not discomfited by the idea of revealing any other characters accurately.

I was in Japan about 3 weeks ago.

most things, including smash rosters and such, are written with our alphabet NOT japanese letter/characters

however some names to certain characters (smash bros nintendo characters, not letters) in japan are different than they are here, such as greninja and villager.

IF the leaker was not familiar with the new pokemon and knew the name was the japanese version they might just say something like "a new pokemon from x and y".

its not farfetch'd (heh pokemon) its an extremely plausible situation.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

http://smashboards.com/forums/greninja.469/

@ The people discussing Greninja:

"Greninja is kool" posts can go in that forum somewhere please.

 

[TheTuninator]

I was in Japan about 3 weeks ago.

most things, including smash rosters and such, are written with our alphabet NOT japanese letter/characters

however some names to certain characters (smash bros nintendo characters, not letters) in japan are different than they are here, such as greninja and villager.

IF the leaker was not familiar with the new pokemon and new the name was the japanese version they might just say something like "a new pokemon from x and y".

its not farfetch'd (heh pokemon) its an extremely plausible situation.

Again, simply typing "Gekkouga" into Google brings up Greninja.

The fact that he knew the pokemon was from X&Y really makes me doubt a language issue. He could have simply said "a new Pokerep", but he specified X&Y. As such, a degree of identification of the character clearly occurred.

 

[IsmaR]

None of the other leaked characters have alternate japanese names. Marshal may be the exception though. Hence "choir boy"

However "frog pokemon" would have been way more descriptive.

That's just as subjective. My initial reaction to the X/Y Greninja leak was that it was some kind of hipster-Lati@s . Didn't even think of it as a "ninja" much less a frog, plus if it were the case everyone would be split between Politoed and Croagunk in addition to Greninja.

I'm not giving him the benefit of the doubt, but imagining myself in his shoes for previous games, I'd be hard-pressed trying to come up with a description for the blue/red-haired "Sword Guys" in Melee, or the infamous Dragoon parts leak in Brawl (I would've just said some Kirby thing).

 

[Bauske]

You seem dead set on convincing everyone this leak is wrong. Everyone's free to speculate. As I've said myself, I'm not 100 percent on my source. But there are a few things I should tackle.

Little Mac, Pac-Man, and Mii Missing E3

I'll be the first to admit, I have no idea. There are literally tons of reasons as to why this person could've thought the trio would appear at E3. But even so, things happen, and not everything always goes according to plan. And Little Mac eventually showed. The guy is still backing Pac-Man and Mii, too. So, much like the rest of the rumor, time will tell there.

Pokemon from X and Y

Again, I don't know. This is what the guy told me, so it's what I posted. I don't know how involved he is in the game's development, or how 'inside' his insder knowledge is. There are, again, tons of reasons as to why he might not have known or been able to say the Pokemon's name. Or even describe him at that. Depending on the guy's involvement, it's possible he was only told about a "Pokemon from X and Y" being in the roster.

Safe Guesses

I see this term tossed around a lot. I honestly don't think there's any such thing. There are no safe guesses when it comes to naming a roster. Wii Fit Trainer wasn't a safe guess, as you'll admit, and I don't know how 'likely' (again, this would be a synonym of a safe guess, which doesn't really apply as this newcomer thing can be pretty darn random) Mega Man, Villager, and Little Mac were, but this guy's 4 for 6 on his E3 leaks so far. Which is pretty darn good.

Leaker Not Leaking Other Things Like Stages, etc.

I don't know, I'm not the leaker. Why is this guy only telling me newcomers? Again, I don't know.

Posting a Baseless Rumor

"First, he didn't say he had a source because he wasn't sure that the source was credible. Of course, this is silly because all new sites post rumors regardless of their credibility."

I'm sorry, I'll try to maintain a crappier website.

Seriously, though, that second sentence is silly in itself. If I get an e-mail from "blahblah@mailservice.com" with a list of characters said tipster claims will be in the game, would you expect me to just run with it without first attempting to verify the guy? If I cared more about hits and less about credibility, sure. But that's not me.

Making Things Up

Let's get one thing straight, and long-time followers of my site will attest to this. I don't make things up. Not for traffic, not for anything. My site exists to provide game news in the most excellent way possible. I don't fabricate information. I'm just like all of you in this, and I'd be pretty pissed off if anyone did something like that. Again, I'm still not 100 percent on my source, but so far he's in the green with his 'leak.'

"In otherwords, Sal's website is very no name. How can you improve searches? Why, have a fake rumor of course. And since he got Wii Fit Trainer right, it's even better. Now you can drive hits to your site."

The site is pretty big actually. More hits would be nice, sure. But we average many more hits than I think you'd imagine per day. It's okay, though. You didn't know.

To Everyone Else

I think my talk with Star, as well as what I've written above, just about sums up everything I can think to say. But yeah. No one has to believe the leak. It's fun to discuss, but being dead set on proving these things true or false without further evidence is not really doable at the moment. Unfortunately it's a waiting game and that's what we'll all just have to do. But I'll tell you now, this isn't something I've gone and pulled out my sleeve for hits. There's no debating that.

Edit: Also, to clarify some more, I've tried contacting this guy for more information. When Star mentioned the leaker being too busy to respond, what I said specifically was that the guy seems to operate on his own schedule, e-mailing me when he wants to rather than what I want him to. Star can attest to that.

Oh man, Sal actually coming onto the boards to say his share and shutting SmashChu down? That made my night. :D No offense or anything, SmashChu, you do seem like you have good intentions, but you tend to come off logical to the point of fallacy and a bit on the negative side.

As for Sal, many props to you for sharing your side of the story. I, as well as many others I'm sure, appreciate it greatly. Information tends to get skewed out there and people tend to twist things into something they're not, and the leaks you've provided have been discussed to ridiculous lengths here. So far, the leaker who's giving you info seems to know exactly what he's doing, both to entice the fans and to keep his job, and again, I appreciate you helping to explain that. People sometimes forget that this is a real person who is working close to the project in some form or another and probably wants to ensure the safety of their job. If a leaker just came out and blabbed every little detail to us, sure we would all be happy, but that person would lose the profession they've undoubtedly had to work incredibly hard to achieve. It's a bit selfish on our parts to expect it, but that's the internet for ya.

Again, thanks. This information was awesome, and gave me more reason to believe said leaker is legit. I fully expect to see Pac-Man at E3, and possibly Shulk or Palutena as well.

 

[TheTuninator]

That's just as subjective. My initial reaction to the X/Y Greninja leak was that it was some kind of hipster-Lati@s . Didn't even think of it as a "ninja" much less a frog, plus if it were the case everyone would be split between Politoed and Croagunk in addition to Greninja.

I'm not giving him the benefit of the doubt, but imagining myself in his shoes for previous games, I'd be hard-pressed trying to come up with a description for the blue/red-haired "Sword Guys" in Melee, or the infamous Dragoon parts leak in Brawl (I would've just said some Kirby thing).

Describing Marth as a "blue-haired man in blue with a sword and a crown" already goes a long way toward identifying him. Even saying "a purple Pokemon from X&Y" would have largely cemented the second wave of predictions as undeniably accurate.

I just don't see how somebody with access to images of the roster could have provided such a vague prediction. Literally 30 seconds in Google gives you Greninja's identity if you know what he looks like and that he's from X&Y.

To be clear, I'm not arguing that making a vague prediction completely discredits him, just that it suggests he doesn't have direct access to the game.

 

[Wanderer from Roseyard]

Again, simply typing "Gekkouga" into Google brings up Greninja.

The fact that he knew the pokemon was from X&Y really makes me doubt a language issue. He could have simply said "a new Pokerep", but he specified X&Y. As such, a degree of identification of the character clearly occurred.

Agreed; since Greninja is #9 in the new index order, it should have taken only a few seconds to spot him. It sounds more like the source was afraid to hazard a guess that could be debunked in a heartbeat.

 

[IsmaR]

Therein lies another problem. I would've said "blue-haired swords-woman with a tiara." Ignorance is bliss, while hype is a hell of a drug.

I don't believe any of the leaks, for the record.

 

[kataridragon]

I think e3 will be very telling in regards to the validity of these leaks. It's gonna be exciting!

 

[TheUnsullied]

I really do hope that the official roster gets leaked. It's not lot they are going to build up any more hype for the Wii U version since they decided to release the 3DS version first.

 

[powerprotoman]

2 thing
1: im gussing there have been no new leaks
and 2:

Even saying "a purple Pokemon from X&Y" would have largely cemented the second wave of predictions as undeniably accurate.

greninja is blue

but ya this is getting out of hand with the lack of leaks

 

[Deleted member]

None of the other leaked characters have alternate japanese names. Marshal may be the exception though. Hence "choir boy"

However "frog pokemon" would have been way more descriptive.

"Choir Men" is the Japanese label for the Choir Kids of Rhythm Heaven's Glee Club game.

These three.

NOT this guy.

 

[Shroob]

"Choir Men" is the Japanese label for the Choir Kids of Rhythm Heaven's Glee Club game.

These three.

NOT this guy.

However, he's already said "Animal Crossing Guy" and "Pokemon from X and Y". We can't assume he's saying the exact characters.

 

[Deleted member]

However, he's already said "Animal Crossing Guy" and "Pokemon from X and Y". We can't assume he's saying the exact characters.

That's literally like saying he could mean Lucina instead of Chrom.


And also ignoring the plurality of the label.
"Chorus MAN" = One; could be referring to Marshal
"Chorus MEN" = More than one; NOT referring to Marshal.

 

[Shroob]

That's literally like saying he could mean Lucina instead of Chrom.


And also ignoring the plurality of the label.
"Chorus MAN" = One; could be referring to Marshal
"Chorus MEN" = More than one; NOT referring to Marshal.

The thing that makes me skeptical about this entire thing, is just that however. "Men".

I have a hard time seeing three characters at once being playable, but that's just me.

 

[NintenRob]

Do you tink that this AR card could hint at how Palutena could play? Sakurai might have wanted to include her in this when developing KI: U

http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb...a_(special).jpg/200px-Paulatena_(special).jpg

 

[Deleted member]

In the context of the game they come from, I would imagine you only literally control one. The other two would be there for you to keep in rhythm with for some gimmick based on timing that I'm too tired to think deeply about.

 

[Moldy Clay]

I think e3 will be very telling in regards to the validity of these leaks. It's gonna be exciting!

Not necessarily.

E3 could easily bring us Mii, Pac-Man & Palutena and then everyone will be convinced the leak was real.

But then Chrom, Shulk or "Chorus Men" get revealed as assist trophies right before the game comes out.

The fact of the matter is: Chrom, Mii, Pac-Man, and Palutena are on TONS of people's lists. Even without the Sal leak planting it, people were expecting most of them from day 1, even if they don't want them.

So a reveal of ANY of those 4 characters would not prove anything for OR against the leaks outside of proving the Palutena leak.

Shulk & Marshal/Chorus Men are the characters that people need to look out for. And unfortunately, if they ARE in the game, I am almost positive they would be secret. So I don't think we'll ever know if they're in the game until the game itself breaks street date/releases.

So even if the leak is an elaborate "lucky guess" and a lie/false, it probably won't be proven false (or true) until release... unless one of those characters are revealed as an Assist Trophy.

It's anyone's guess though. True or false, the leak has enough walls around it where it can ride on being reliable to the very end if things work out.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

In the context of the game they come from, I would imagine you only literally control one. The other two would be there for you to keep in rhythm with for some gimmick based on timing that I'm too tired to think deeply about.

The fact that the choir boys and Marshal have basically the EXACT same design makes the specifics not really matter. A lot of people are arguing the fact that the leaker doesn't have the exact names to every character since he didn't specify the names of Greninja or Villager. It is very possible he is just going off of visuals, and if that is the case, I wouldn't be surprised if the guy had NO idea who the Chorus men are. Honestly I never even heard of these characters, or marshal, until their names were mentioned here.

 

[NintenRob]

So what are your thoughts on my Palutena theory, do you guys think its plausible? its like a leak Sakurai himself let out before the game was even in development.

 

[Deleted member]

The fact that the choir boys and Marshal have basically the EXACT same design makes the specifics not really matter. A lot of people are arguing the fact that the leaker doesn't have the exact names to every character since he didn't specify the names of Greninja or Villager. It is very possible he is just going off of visuals, and if that is the case, I wouldn't be surprised if the guy had NO idea who the Chorus men are. Honestly I never even heard of these characters, or marshal, until their names were mentioned here.

It's been said numerous times that the leaker is not getting these characters from visuals.

And yes, it really does matter.
Basic grammar dictates that "men" is AT LEAST 2 individuals. A single individual cannot be "men"; only "man".

That alone should be enough for people with an understanding of the English language to grasp that "Chorus Men" actually means the "Chorus Men" or "Chorus Kids" as they're known in the US, and not Marshal.

"Animal Crossing Guy" refers to a single individual. Villager is an individual.
"Pokémon from X/Y" can refer to either a single individual or multiple individuals given how the term "Pokémon" is used. However, if I'm not mistaken, it was used in context of a single individual. Which Greninja is.
"Chorus Men" refers to more than a single individual. Marshal is a single individual. The Chorus Kids/Men are more than a single individual.

 

[TheAnvil]

My biggest gripe with the leak, is for the life of me I can't think of a position that someone would be in to know that a pokemon from x and y was going to be in it, and can name every other character by name but not Greninja or even a brief description of him.

"pokemon from x and y" was too open ended and vague to trust him at this point in time.

 

[soviet prince]

I'm more so skeptical of Sal's leaker than Sal himself, especially given that the leaker has provided incorrect information in the past.

what was incorrect if it's just that they were not shown at e3, that don't mean much

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Do you tink that this AR card could hint at how Palutena could play? Sakurai might have wanted to include her in this when developing KI: U

http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb...a_(special).jpg/200px-Paulatena_(special).jpg

Discussion for how Palutena plays does not go here.

Try the character thread or her support thread.