Spot Dodge Help?

[Johnthegalactic]

Since about six months before Brawl was released I have really been expanding the variety of moves and techniques I use in SSB.
There is one thing I have learned to utilize, the spot dodge.
I know it is useful but could really use some words of wisdom on this simple move that I am to stupid to use.
Thanks for ready, if you help me you are awesome.

 

[SativaJoe]

I got in the habit of spotdodging whenever I felt like using a grab (i used to be grab happy in melee) and it's saved my *** so many times.

 

[Benjamin Linus]

spot dodging is a bad habit to develop if you are using it too often. i think it should only be used when you truely know when an opponent is going to do a single pronged attack and you can punish after its lag. this is very hard to determine and so you should rarely ever use it. in low levels of play you may see that it is really helpful because weaker players are predictable with their attacks, however against pro players or stronger players they will bait it and punish you for it.

try to use it sparingly but don't cut it out all together.

 

[fkacyan]

Spotdodging with Zamus isn't that great of an idea. The frames of invincibility you get vary from character to character.

 

[Waddle]

Spot dodge when you wanna dodge a move. Simple as that....

 

[Johnthegalactic]

Spot dodge when you wanna dodge a move. Simple as that....

I figured that out on my own, if you read the above posts, they told me to dodge moves with lag after the attack, ie. Dededes side smash.
If I want to dodge any generic move I will do a barrel roll.

 

[FrostByte]

Don't roll unless you want to get punished by Falcon.

 

[Sliq]

Don't use spot dodge. It is much more effective to just shield attacks and retalitate.

 

[Johnthegalactic]

Don't use spot dodge. It is much more effective to just shield attacks and retalitate.

There are attacks that can push me off the ledge when I sheild, thus a spot dodge may be handy there.

 

[Sliq]

There are attacks that can push me off the ledge when I sheild, thus a spot dodge may be handy there.

No. IF you spot dodge, your opponent will read it, and punish you horribly for it. Don't do it.

 

[petrie911]

^Unless you're playing ROB, whose spot dodge to dsmash is nigh unpunishable.

 

[Sliq]

^Unless you're playing ROB, whose spot dodge to dsmash is nigh unpunishable.

False. If I can punish it with Ganon, you can punish it with EVERY OTHER CHARACTER IN THE GAME.

 

[St. Viers]

when you want to dodge, either sheild, throw out your fastest attack, or simply walk back out of range.

Those are all better options than spotdodging. I use it only to dodge dash attack/grabs

 

[Ayaz18]

i find doing a running shield then mashing down on the control stick to give me a moving spot dodge is an effective way to approch and utilize my spot dodge, however i main Falcon so it's predictable that approch defensivly

 

[kenkowtow]

Don't use spot dodge. It is much more effective to just shield attacks and retalitate.

This really is the best option. If fact, with the more lenient power shield system, it would be much better to PS and then retaliate. Granted that you must PS big knockback attacks to punish them, but PS isn't that hard to do.

I suppose that spot dodging is good as a more "safe" way to do things.
If you must, then use it when you can predict things from the opponent. If you don't get what I mean then just try running into the enemy into a spot dodge, normally you're gonna dodge something (assuming you're not at pro level play). If you only have one person to practice on then eventually he/she should be able to catch on and will learn not to attack when you run at him, or at least do a multi-hit attack, etc. From there you should just develop instincts for the dodge.

Also I forgot to mention, spot dodges do have an advantage over shielding when your opponent is aiming to grab you, especially with the removal of the JC grab, dash grabs are really easy to punish. ... but this is kind of obvious...

 

[Devil7]

Spot Doadging is the new SDing. Spacing, Timing, Shielding. The triforce of perfection in competative gaming

 

[Foxy]

A general rule of thumb is to shield weaker attacks because you can shield-grab them, as they won't knock you back very far.

However, stronger attacks both knock your shield back, damage your shield heavily, AND have large ending lag, allowing you to punish much more effectively if you spotdodge.

Practice spotdodging against slow moves that you can see coming, or if an opponent is using the same tactic repeatedly. Once you're comfortable with the occasional implementation you can try to throw it in more effectively.

One last note: don't forget that you can't shield a grab! Therefore if you have a grab-happy opponent, try to lean towards spotdodging over shielding.

 

[Sliq]

A general rule of thumb is to shield weaker attacks because you can shield-grab them, as they won't knock you back very far.

However, stronger attacks both knock your shield back, damage your shield heavily, AND have large ending lag, allowing you to punish much more effectively if you spotdodge.

Practice spotdodging against slow moves that you can see coming, or if an opponent is using the same tactic repeatedly. Once you're comfortable with the occasional implementation you can try to throw it in more effectively.

One last note: don't forget that you can't shield a grab! Therefore if you have a grab-happy opponent, try to lean towards spotdodging over shielding.

No. If you spot dodge, at all, people will see it, wait for it, and hit you with a move you have no business being hit with.

Furthermore, timing a spot dodge to avoid a slow move...why not just powershield the move if you are spot dodging on move reflex? 0 lags of cool down.

Trust me on this, punishing spot dodgers is easy ****.

 

[bioniclekid8]

the only time spot dodging is super useful is to avoid a dragoon fireing cpu. yes there ARE people who play with items and ENJOY playing with them O.O *GASP*

Also to avoid Gannon punches and kirby FS's and many other things

 

[Johnthegalactic]

Alright, I got an idea of how to use the spot dodge, sparingly, and I'll just ignore Sliqs rambling.

 

[Sliq]

Alright, I got an idea of how to use the spot dodge, sparingly, and I'll just ignore Sliqs rambling.

I'll watch out for you not placing high in tournaments, then laugh maniacally.

 

[Pughead]

I often use it to avoid dragoon and links FS along with other OHKO moves

 

[Nitrix]

Spot-Dodge is for dodging Marth's Shieldbreaker, grabs, and attacks that hurt your shield like smashes.

 

[Rapid_Assassin]

Try spacing properly - You wouldn't need to spotdodge nearly as often as you might think you do.

If your opponent is grabbing a lot, space outside of his grab range and/or use attacks that are faster than the grab. Otherwise, he'd probably wait for the dodge to end, and get that grab he wanted to get anyway.

If your opponent is using slower attacks that would kill your shield, get out of the way or attack him first. Many of these attacks (shield breaker, fsmash, etc.) can be charged, leading to your opponent charging the attack just a second longer next time (after waiting for your dodge).

It is useful OCCASIONALLY, but if you get into any habit of spotdodging as opposed to spacing properly, getting out of the way, or attacking first in about 99% of all situations that you might think it's useful, you'll probably regret it as soon as you play someone who knows how to punish it.

 

[St. Viers]

Necromancy!!!!!!

?

 

[nickTAS]

I always looked at spotdodging attacks as a mindgames. Yea there are some instances where you could use it to just dodge an attack but your opponent would have to be pretty stupid in order to make such a bad move.

The mindgame part comes in when you almost start to guess when your opponent is going to for an attack. The spotdodge is very situational though. You dont just run up to someone, bring your shield up and spotdodge and expect it to work.

The best time to use a spotdodge is after making a mistake. For example, I play Fox. Fox's best combo starter is his Dair(and his Dair combos into a lot of stuff). However sometimes if I jump to far the downair will hit them but most of the attack will go over them becase I jump. This gives my ooponent enough time to turn around and grab me. I still have to frame advantage to use a spotdodge though. So right after I realized that I made a mistake by jumping to far, I should spotdodge almost by instinct since im taking a good guess that my opponent is going for a grab.

That's how I look at it. Also, at sliq, shielding is a good idea almost all the time, but the thing is, you can be grabbed while you are in your shield. In a situation like I just explained, putting your shield up because you made a mistake isn't really a good idea.

 

[Koala]

I spot dodge way too much for my own good. I have started to cut down on the habbit because when I played against my friends, it was good because they were not smart enough to consistently punish it, but if you are going to play some of the better smashers out there, they will punish excessive spot dodging. I am working on trying other options such as shielding and then attacking afterwards because it seems like a better and safer option for getting out of the way of attacks.

 

[mountain_tiger]

Spot dodging should generally be used if you sense a grab coming, but high lag attacks are worth spot dodging too. Don't use it too often, though.

 

[Sliq]

I always looked at spotdodging attacks as a mindgames. Yea there are some instances where you could use it to just dodge an attack but your opponent would have to be pretty stupid in order to make such a bad move.

The mindgame part comes in when you almost start to guess when your opponent is going to for an attack. The spotdodge is very situational though. You dont just run up to someone, bring your shield up and spotdodge and expect it to work.

The best time to use a spotdodge is after making a mistake. For example, I play Fox. Fox's best combo starter is his Dair(and his Dair combos into a lot of stuff). However sometimes if I jump to far the downair will hit them but most of the attack will go over them becase I jump. This gives my ooponent enough time to turn around and grab me. I still have to frame advantage to use a spotdodge though. So right after I realized that I made a mistake by jumping to far, I should spotdodge almost by instinct since im taking a good guess that my opponent is going for a grab.

That's how I look at it. Also, at sliq, shielding is a good idea almost all the time, but the thing is, you can be grabbed while you are in your shield. In a situation like I just explained, putting your shield up because you made a mistake isn't really a good idea.

Grabs do not setup for anything in Brawl, and they also do not kill (unless you are playing a bad character like Ness). The only character to really worry about being grabbed by is D3, and that isn't a deal if your character doesn't get CG'd.

 

[Brinzy]

What is this whole "don't spotdodge" sentiment? Just hug your shield? Enjoy getting grabbed all the time.

Spotdodge grabs and high lag attacks, which has be said already.

 

[nickTAS]

Grabs do not setup for anything in Brawl, and they also do not kill (unless you are playing a bad character like Ness). The only character to really worry about being grabbed by is D3, and that isn't a deal if your character doesn't get CG'd.

Except for that fact that some grabs do setup for other moves more than any other kind move in brawl like tilts or even jabs(ever heard of a grab release?), that grabs come out faster than strong attacks, that they have less ending lag then strong attacks, that some grabs deal good damage.

Yea, grabs are a bad idea in general. Just get rid of your Z button people.

 

[Inaphyt]

Since about six months before Brawl was released I have really been expanding the variety of moves and techniques I use in SSB.
There is one thing I have learned to utilize, the spot dodge.
I know it is useful but could really use some words of wisdom on this simple move that I am to stupid to use.
Thanks for ready, if you help me you are awesome.

Sometimes you can dash in spot dodge a smash attack and then punish, however sometimes with multihit moves you get hit out of the hitbox because of your initial dash and can punish small jab strings even if you get hit.

 

[.AC.]

Grabs do not setup for anything in Brawl, and they also do not kill (unless you are playing a bad character like Ness). The only character to really worry about being grabbed by is D3, and that isn't a deal if your character doesn't get CG'd.

just ignore them,if they didnt listen to a good explanation the first time,or the second time they wont listen to you a third time regardless of you being right,you wont see these people place in tournes anytime soon with such punishable habits.

if you want visuals as to why you shouldnt spotdodge instead of spacing or using any of the multiple options watch this match.specially the end.it will cost you matches.notice how the snake doesnt spotdodge.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTXh3Yh30Fc

 

[mountain_tiger]

Grabs do not setup for anything in Brawl, and they also do not kill (unless you are playing a bad character like Ness). The only character to really worry about being grabbed by is D3, and that isn't a deal if your character doesn't get CG'd.

Oh wait, you were being serious....

Hoenstly, though, getting grabbed is a big deal with most characters. For a start, you missed the obvious Ice Climbers, who can essentially take away one stock once they've grabbed you. And there are other characters with chaingrabs that don't eliminate a whole stock, but are deadly nonetheless (e.g. Falco, Pikachu etc.). And there are grab release issues too. If you're playing as Wario, if you get grabbed then you're liable for grab releases, sometimes even infinites (though a good Wario shouldn't get grabbed anyway...) and to a much lesser extent this also applies to Meta Knight. And if you're Ness or Lucas, you definitely want to avoid getting grabbed, especially if you're playing against Marth, Charizard or Squirtle.

On most characters throws can set up for combos and other tricks and stuff. And pummels refresh your moves very well. All in all, grabs ARE useful.

 

[Throwback]

just ignore them,if they didnt listen to a good explanation the first time,or the second time they wont listen to you a third time regardless of you being right,you wont see these people place in tournes anytime soon with such punishable habits.

if you want visuals as to why you shouldnt spotdodge instead of spacing or using any of the multiple options watch this match.specially the end.it will cost you matches.notice how the snake doesnt spotdodge.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTXh3Yh30Fc

except that the snake does spot-dodge...

 

[Kitamerby]

Grabs do not setup for anything in Brawl, and they also do not kill (unless you are playing a bad character like Ness). The only character to really worry about being grabbed by is D3, and that isn't a deal if your character doesn't get CG'd.

Grabs can lead to massive damage that wasn't there before, as well as a positional advantage (having your opponent above you/offstage/near the edge/in an airdodge trap) which can lead into even more damage or even a kill.

They also mess with shield spammers hard.

 

[.AC.]

except that the snake does spot-dodge...

lol he only spotdodges like 3 or 4 times,noe if you look at the dd and see how many times he got punished because of it you will see a difference,spotdodging is just another bad habit you can exploit very easily,but do what you want you´ll get nowhere by spotdodging frequently anyways.

 

[Sliq]

Except for that fact that some grabs do setup for other moves more than any other kind move in brawl like tilts or even jabs(ever heard of a grab release?), that grabs come out faster than strong attacks, that they have less ending lag then strong attacks, that some grabs deal good damage.

Yea, grabs are a bad idea in general. Just get rid of your Z button people.

Grab releases are only great against Wario, and even then Wario has no place being defensive in the first place. Just air camp and space all day. If you get grabbed as Wario you're bad.

Grab's do not setup for anything...nothing in Brawl sets up for anything.

But fine, don't listen to me. I'll laugh as I watch you get killed at 5% every stock because Snake waited for you to spot dodge and just up tilted you out of it instead of grabbing and throwing you, doing little damage and not coming close to killing you.

Oh wait, you were being serious....

Hoenstly, though, getting grabbed is a big deal with most characters. For a start, you missed the obvious Ice Climbers, who can essentially take away one stock once they've grabbed you. And there are other characters with chaingrabs that don't eliminate a whole stock, but are deadly nonetheless (e.g. Falco, Pikachu etc.). And there are grab release issues too. If you're playing as Wario, if you get grabbed then you're liable for grab releases, sometimes even infinites (though a good Wario shouldn't get grabbed anyway...) and to a much lesser extent this also applies to Meta Knight. And if you're Ness or Lucas, you definitely want to avoid getting grabbed, especially if you're playing against Marth, Charizard or Squirtle.

On most characters throws can set up for combos and other tricks and stuff. And pummels refresh your moves very well. All in all, grabs ARE useful.

The Ice Climbers can just as well read a spot dodge and grab you after it. Spamming spot dodge against Ice Climbers is in no way a good idea.

Wario should never get grabbed, and if he does, he is bad.

If you are playing a character that CG's you, you ought to know better than to put yourself into a position to be grabbed. It isn't hard to constantly space aerials to the point that your opponent has to be offensive, and if your opponent is being offensive then you aren't being grab out of retaliation.

If you keep up a constant pressure their should be no reason for you ever to shield, sans baiting attacks and punishing.

Grabs can lead to massive damage that wasn't there before, as well as a positional advantage (having your opponent above you/offstage/near the edge/in an airdodge trap) which can lead into even more damage or even a kill.

They also mess with shield spammers hard.

Grabs lead into "massive damage" about as much as anything else in brawl does, but the one thing most grabs don't do is kill, which is why shielding a kill move or getting grabbed is better than dodging a grab or spot dodging into a kill move and being killed.

I'll take the 1 grab, please.

I don't really care if any of you guys listen to me or not. I just don't think you should be telling other people wrong things, spouting nonsense.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Grabs do not setup for anything in Brawl, and they also do not kill (unless you are playing a bad character like Ness). The only character to really worry about being grabbed by is D3, and that isn't a deal if your character doesn't get CG'd.

You main bowser, don't you?

Grab->Pummel->Grab Release->Character Dependant ****. On Wario, it leads to a bowser fsmash.

Plenty of good chars have throws that can set up (MK fthrow/dthrow to shfa or fhfa), chaingrab (falco dthrow, DDD dthrow) or just outright **** (DDD Bthrow, Diddy F and Bthrow).

Spotdodging can be useful. Camping all the time in your shield isn't a good idea unless your opponent has a crappy grab range.

 

[nickTAS]

Only Wario is affected by grab releases? Grab release options are made by the character who is releasing not the one being released. Marth can nail you with a Fair no matter what character you are using.

Getting killed at 5 percent? Hey way to actually make this a good arguement rather then being sarcastic.

Also, if you read my first post, you would see that you should only spotdodge when its a last resort and when you dont have time for anything else anyways.

I rather be up tilted by snake at 5% then be grabbed and down throwed possibly getting chain grabbed or SETUP for a forward tilt.