[SPOILER ALERT] - The Sevens Squares. - A Square-Enix general support threads.

Who do you think is the most likely possible Square-Enix Newcomer? (Two Choices possibles)


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Legendary Spirit Tamer

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It's quite effed up that Square was surprised Sakurai asked for Cloud, despite the character and his game's overall impact on the industry. Makes me think they don't even know their own history.
Companies rarely think about Iconicness. They just want their latest and most relevant stuff in crossovers, with their big guns not always there.

They want to promote their latest games. There's a reason they didn't allow Cloud to be used for Playstation All-Stars. It was either Lightning or nothing. It's not really a lack of knowing their own history. It's them thinking about business first.
 

Shishœ

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Square: "So, what will be it, Mr. Sakurai? Do you want Cecil? Or Terra? Maybe some Slime? How about Sora, huh, get it? Speaking of the sky, how about Lightning?"
Sakurai: "Nah, I want the emo kid over there"
Square: "Th-the what?"
Sakurai: "You heard me."
Square: "You sure you din't wan--"
Sakurai: "Did I stutter?"
 

Nemuresu

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Companies rarely think about Iconicness. They just want their latest and most relevant stuff in crossovers, with their big guns not always there.

They want to promote their latest games. There's a reason they didn't allow Cloud to be used for Playstation All-Stars. It was either Lightning or nothing. It's not really a lack of knowing their own history. It's them thinking about business first.
Then why did Capcom even allow Mega Man instead of just forcing Ryu or some other mainstream character like Dante? Why would Namco let Sakurai use Pac-Man when they've got a more successful franchise in Tekken and more recurring one in Tales? I can get why they would've preferred to see a more recent character, but them not even remembering one of their most successful games, one that's very recurrent in pop culture, and more so coming from freaking Tetsuya Nomura, you know, the guy who's actually involved in a (existing?) remake of said game. It's not so much on them caring about business, but more on the fact that they seemingly didn't recognize their own top work to think: "well, it's true that Cloud is popular", seems quite embarrassing. God help them if Sakurai asks them for Sora a good chunk of years after Kingdom Hearts 3 released and nobody sees it as the big deal anymore.
 
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It's quite effed up that Square was surprised Sakurai asked for Cloud, despite the character and his game's overall impact on the industry. Makes me think they don't even know their own history.
Wasn't that just Nomura who said that?

Nomura: It was an opportunity for Cloud to appear in Smash, how could I turn it down?

Sakurai: This isn’t an exact number, but among the requests for a Final Fantasy character to appear in Smash, around ¼ to ⅓ of the requests we got from fans were for Cloud. [TN1] I really wanted to answer the desires of those fans, and even though I thought it would be impossible, I reached out anyway, just to try.

Nomura: When we first talked, I asked “are you sure you’re okay with Cloud?” He’s not a character from a new game, after all.
It doesn't really sound like a "corporate" response at all. He goes on and admits there probably isn't any other character worthy of adding, joking about how Strago and Fusoya are "worthy" of Smash Bros.

Again I say this...

We got a codename, a company (possibly) related to that codename, and potential names being thrown around.

That's it.

Just because more people are saying one name more than others, does NOT mean, in any way, that Erdrick is guaranteed to get in.

Anyone who's 100% confident in Erdrick and doesn't acknowledge the fact that he's nowhere near a lock, is doing themselves a disservice.

Because if the character turns out NOT to be Erdrick, you're gonna feel stupid for believing in that character and fall into the speculation trap that consumed many fans of other characters.
We have several Smash leakers saying that it is him, including the only person on earth who leaked Cloud for smash 4 DLC. The only other character who even comes close to Erdrick in having several people "confirm" him was Inceniroar, who famously dabbed on the Grinch's grave. The only example I can think of that would be comparable to Erdrick's run up who didn't get in was the Chorus Kids in Smash 4, from the infamous Gematsu leaks. And that wasn't one source, Erdrick has multiple sources. And I'm not falling for any "speculation trap" like that Golden Sun Doom Dragon nonsense that was clearly wishful thinking, we're talking about Leakers with decent track records. All of them are spelling out that it's Erdrick.

If I get BTFO I get BTFO, whatever, but the fact of the matter is that Erdrick is the closest thing to a lock since Inciniroar, not as close to a lock like Inklings, but still above 95%. Crazier things have happened though.
 
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We have several Smash leakers saying that it is him, including the only person on earth who leaked Cloud for smash 4 DLC. The only other character who even comes close to Erdrick in having several people "confirm" him was Inceniroar, who famously dabbed on the Grinch's grave. The only example I can think of that would be comparable to Erdrick's run up who didn't get in was the Chorus Kids in Smash 4, from the infamous Gematsu leaks. And that wasn't one source, Erdrick has multiple sources. And I'm not falling for any "speculation trap" like that Golden Sun Doom Dragon nonsense that was clearly wishful thinking, we're talking about Leakers with decent track records. All of them are spelling out that it's Erdrick.

If I get BTFO I get BTFO, whatever, but the fact of the matter is that Erdrick is the closest thing to a lock since Inciniroar, not as close to a lock like Inklings, but still above 95%. Crazier things have happened though.
I'm boutta BTFO you for double posting
 

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Then why did Capcom even allow Mega Man instead of just forcing Ryu or some other mainstream character like Dante? Why would Namco let Sakurai use Pac-Man when they've got a more successful franchise in Tekken and more recurring one in Tales? I can get why they would've preferred to see a more recent character, but them not even remembering one of their most successful games, one that's very recurrent in pop culture, and more so coming from freaking Tetsuya Nomura, you know, the guy who's actually involved in a (existing?) remake of said game. It's not so much on them caring about business, but more on the fact that they seemingly didn't recognize their own top work to think: "well, it's true that Cloud is popular", seems quite embarrassing. God help them if Sakurai asks them for Sora a good chunk of years after Kingdom Hearts 3 released and nobody sees it as the big deal anymore.
That's not remotely what happened.

Sakurai wanted a FF character. They thought he'd pick a different one.

Sakurai went for a specific character from a specific series. None of those companies were suggesting different series. He didn't go to Namco-Bandai for someone from Tekken. He went for Pac-Man. Why on earth would they say no to their company mascot? Same with Ryu and MegaMan. They're both mascots for the company. The reality is that Square-Enix was a different situation and had a ton of viable protagonists in their own opinion. Sakurai asked for the one that fit the least in Smash in their opinion(and many many people thought he made no sense due to little/no Nintendo relevance). Their response was actually very logical because it's a pretty special situation to be asked for a character completely irrelevant to a fighting game crossover focused on Nintendo. That's like asking for Mario in an Xbox Fighting Game Crossover. Nintendo would be weirded out and wonder why they aren't asking for someone who has more relevance to Microsoft that they own(for instance, Donkey Kong might be someone who they would think makes more sense due to the Rareware ties). I could go on, but relevance to the system the game is on is something people think about. It's not remotely surprising that Square-Enix did. All the other 3rd parties happened to have had Nintendo relevance(far more than Cloud, as even Joker had his own game on Nintendo by then, so he wasn't taken aback at all by people once they learned that. FFVII was never on Nintendo when Cloud got added. People aren't a fan of that, and some still are only accepting of Cloud just because FFVII is coming to the Switch).

It isn't the most logical, but there is logic to their reactions.
 

fleshdude.gov

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It doesn't really sound like a "corporate" response at all. He goes on and admits there probably isn't any other character worthy of adding, joking about how Strago and Fusoya are "worthy" of Smash Bros.
Nomura is not the head of Square Enix; there are higher-ups there who would be making those decisions. That's likely not a decision he was in charge of.

We have several Smash leakers saying that it is him, including the only person on earth who leaked Cloud for smash 4 DLC. The only other character who even comes close to Erdrick in having several people "confirm" him was Inceniroar, who famously dabbed on the Grinch's grave. The only example I can think of that would be comparable to Erdrick's run up who didn't get in was the Chorus Kids in Smash 4, from the infamous Gematsu leaks. And that wasn't one source, Erdrick has multiple sources. And I'm not falling for any "speculation trap" like that Golden Sun Doom Dragon nonsense that was clearly wishful thinking, we're talking about Leakers with decent track records. All of them are spelling out that it's Erdrick.
You can put several parrots in a room together and tell one of them the earth is flat and you'll end up with multiple sources saying the earth is flat. That doesn't mean it's true
 
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ryumo

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There's something bothering me about the stats, but does anyone knows where to check the datamined stats? I have a hunch as to what type of character "brave" is but need to check and compare something.

Nevermind...
 
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TheYungLink

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No one will sway me.

I will not fully 100% believe in Erdrick until I see that yes, they really are in. This is despite how much I really, REALLY want them.

I refuse to get burned. I've seen the pain Isaac and Shadow supporters went through. I don't want to experience that for myself.

...though I've always wondered what it felt like to really hope for a character, really want them with all your heart, to fully believe that they ARE in, and to have that suspicion confirmed, your wildest dreams proven true...

NO! I'm not raising my hopes up, no matter how amazing it would feel to have a dream want expected then confirmed. I can't take that chance.
 
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No one will sway me.

I will not fully 100% believe in Erdrick until I see that yes, they really are in. This is despite how much I really, REALLY want them.

I refuse to get burned. I've seen the pain Isaac and Shadow supporters went through. I don't want to experience that for myself.

...though I've always wondered what it felt like to really hope for a character, really want them with all your heart, to fully believe that they ARE in, and to have that suspicion confirmed, your wildest dreams proven true...

NO! I'm not raising my hopes up, no matter how amazing it would feel to have a dream want expected then confirmed. I can't take that chance.
Same man. It's hard to not fall into the trap of confirmation bias but I'm gonna be keeping it levelheaded.
 

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Sakurai went for a specific character from a specific series. None of those companies were suggesting different series. He didn't go to Namco-Bandai for someone from Tekken. He went for Pac-Man. Why on earth would they say no to their company mascot? Same with Ryu and MegaMan. They're both mascots for the company.
Why would them? For the same reason Cloud was apparently such a surprising request, because they weren't from new games. Hell, Sakurai himself mentioned he wouldn't have included Pac-Man had Namco forbid him from using his classic design. And that's what you brought up before, that companies seem to only care about their most recent stuff, yet two of them didn't hesitate the idea of their "old" characters appearing in a game.
Their response was actually very logical because it's a pretty special situation to be asked for a character completely irrelevant to a fighting game crossover focused on Nintendo. That's like asking for Mario in an Xbox Fighting Game Crossover. Nintendo would be weirded out and wonder why they aren't asking for someone who has more relevance to Microsoft that they own(for instance, Donkey Kong might be someone who they would think makes more sense due to the Rareware ties).
Except that's not even Square's (or more specifically, Nomura's) reason to react like that. The interview is quite clear on it, as helloiamhere helloiamhere pointed out is his own post. Sakurai was the one who mentioned Nintendo-associated protagonists, and never says anything that suggests Square expected to be asked for Bartz, Warrior of Light, Terra, or any of other of those character. All they say, is that Cloud wasn't a recent character, nothing more, nothing else. Purism had nothing with that.
 
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Erdrick is our most likely candidate right now.

However, he is nowhere near a lock.

Unless there’s something along the lines of a Roy/Ryu leak (which we’re more than likely to NOT have happen), nothing is going to confirm a character prior to the actual reveal.

Having more leakers on the same page makes someone seem more likely.

But convincing, fake info can spread just as quickly as correct info.

Man, I’m getting really tired of repeating the same thing over and over again. Can you just reveal the next character already Nintendo?
 

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Why would them? For the same reason Cloud was apparently such a surprising request, because they weren't from new games. Hell, Sakurai himself mentioned he wouldn't have included Pac-Man had Namco forbid him from using his classic design. And that's what you brought up before, that companies seem to only care about their most recent stuff, yet two of them didn't hesitate the idea of their "old" characters appearing in a game.
No. It's new Final Fantasy games that Square-Enix was weirded out about that that Sakurai wasn't interested in. Or, you know, ones with Nintendo relevance. Neither is applicable to Pac-Man because he already fully exists among the new and old games. Sakurai just wanted his old design, which is more iconic anyway.

Except that's not even Square's (or more specifically, Nomura's) reason to react like that. The interview is quite clear on it, as helloiamhere helloiamhere pointed out is his own post. Sakurai was the one who mentioned Nintendo-associated protagonists, and never says anything that suggests Square expected to be asked for Bartz, Warrior of Light, Terra, or any of other of those character. All they say, is that Cloud wasn't a recent character, nothing more, nothing else. Purism had nothing with that.
That's because that was a different quote. Let me find the other interview. He was talking to a different person in this case.

I'll edit in as soon as I can. He explains himself going straight to Square-Enix. It's separate from the Nomura bit that was cited.
 

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Is there a source on this? All I've seen is the Nomura quote about characters from newer games.
I'm looking for it. I don't know where the article is. Kind of weird. It explained what happened when he asked for Cloud specifically. I know SG has had site issues lately. It's possible it was lost or something. Let me look for a bit longer. I'll tag Push if necessary.

The Nomura stuff is fairly different and just makes a few notes of how he came to the conclusion of why Cloud is the best choice.
 

StormC

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I'm looking for it. I don't know where the article is. Kind of weird. It explained what happened when he asked for Cloud specifically. I know SG has had site issues lately. It's possible it was lost or something. Let me look for a bit longer. I'll tag Push if necessary.

The Nomura stuff is fairly different and just makes a few notes of how he came to the conclusion of why Cloud is the best choice.
I think what you're referring to is this interview from Nintendo Dream:

Sakurai: Exactly. And within the FF franchise, Cloud is without question the most popular choice. A number of people fixate on the fact his original game was never released on a Nintendo console, but if we were to limit our choices to characters who appeared on a Nintendo console, we’d end up with Bartz from FFV or the Onion Knight from FFIII—how would that work? Maybe they could change jobs or something… Actually, that would be kind of interesting (laughs).

(Everyone laughs)

Sakurai: At the same time, I think it’s only natural to prioritize the character who enjoys worldwide popularity. I might have had misgivings if Cloud had never appeared on a Nintendo console in any form, though.
This is the only time I think where Square characters with closer Nintendo connections were discussed.
 

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I think what you're referring to is this interview from Nintendo Dream:



This is the only time I think where Square characters with closer Nintendo connections were discussed.
Nope, it was a different one from that. I distinctly remember how different it was. He talks about how the company itself was wondering why he didn't want a character from a Nintendo-relevant FF.

And yeah, found where it was. I did misremember.

"Nomura: When we first talked, I asked “are you sure you’re okay with Cloud?” He’s not a character from a new game, after all.

Sakurai: But on the other hand, if you think about who to add from Final Fantasy, it’s hard to come up with a choice that’s not Cloud. We could have used Terra or Bartz, protagonists in their own right, but I feel like there would be some people who wouldn’t know who those characters are."

That's what I was thinking of. Which obviously I clearly remembered it wrong.
 

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Nope, it was a different one from that. I distinctly remember how different it was. He talks about how the company itself was wondering why he didn't want a character from a Nintendo-relevant FF.

And yeah, found where it was. I did misremember.

"Nomura: When we first talked, I asked “are you sure you’re okay with Cloud?” He’s not a character from a new game, after all.

Sakurai: But on the other hand, if you think about who to add from Final Fantasy, it’s hard to come up with a choice that’s not Cloud. We could have used Terra or Bartz, protagonists in their own right, but I feel like there would be some people who wouldn’t know who those characters are."

That's what I was thinking of. Which obviously I clearly remembered it wrong.
I rue the day Sakurai decided to use Cloud over my son Bartz.
We were this close to my favorte FF protagonist.
Fate is just too cruel.
 

ryumo

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Shower thought, but brave could also be a BlazBlue character. Blazblue in Japanese is written as bureiburu and the bolded part has the same pronounciation in Japanese as brave.
 
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I rue the day Sakurai decided to use Cloud over my son Bartz.
We were this close to my favorte FF protagonist.
Fate is just too cruel.
To this day my anger over that remains unparalelled.
Shower thought, but brave could also be a BlazBlue character. Blazblue in Japanese is written as bureiburu and the bolded part has the same pronounciation in Japanese as brave.
That's... actually an interesting thought. I don't know anything about BB but I know it has a decent amount of popularity with the crossover game releasing on Switch recently too.
 

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I rue the day Sakurai decided to use Cloud over my son Bartz.
We were this close to my favorte FF protagonist.
Fate is just too cruel.
Indeed. Who wouldn't want to have fun with some Buttz?
 

ryumo

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Pretty sure that's just a romanization of the word "blaze" and not meant to mean "brave".
Haha, I know as I was merely entertaining the idea. For some reason I remembered how Blazblue is written in japanese, and if you were to write brave in Japanese it would end up looking exactly as the Japanese Blazblue title minus the ru.

Obviously, more than likely it means nothing but just a random shower thought so to stop trying to guess codenames at least for me.
 

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I'm not gonna lie, I'm still annoyed to this day that Cloud got in before any of the SNES protagonists. It just doesn't feel right to me and I wish we could have kept the Nintendo thing going. Cloud simply isn't Nintendo no matter how you slice it.
If we could get more FF content, I wouodn't care as much but when the series is represented by one character, one stage and two music tracks that had never shown up in a Nintendo console outside of cameos, it just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

If it had been up to me, the choice would have been between Cecil, Black Mage and Terra/Celes.
 

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I'm not gonna lie, I'm still annoyed to this day that Cloud got in before any of the SNES protagonists. It just doesn't feel right to me and I wish we could have kept the Nintendo thing going. Cloud simply isn't Nintendo no matter how you slice it.
If we could get more FF content, I wouodn't care as much but when the series is represented by one character, one stage and two music tracks that had never shown up in a Nintendo console outside of cameos, it just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

If it had been up to me, the choice would have been between Cecil, Black Mage and Terra/Celes.
Isn't Cloud the most iconic FF character (?
 

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Cloud makes sense as the face of Final Fantasy, and he even kind of fits Smash in a Sonic-like "it's important to Nintendo that he wasn't on Nintendo" kind of way, but the Nintendo-associated Final Fantasy games not even being acknowledged makes it all feel very weird. I don't think people would be nearly so sour if FF got an assist trophy, spirits/trophies and music from other games in the series, particularly the first six.
 
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i think everyone would have been cool with cloud if we got more representation across the series instead of just 7 I feel bad for most people who haven't experienced the scores of older titles in the series hell even newer ones have great tracks I think it was a boneheaded move to just rep 7 and it didn't leave a good taste in the mouth of Nintendo fans who bought him even tho there's a bunch of legal crap and all that but they really should have tried to at least step it up for ultimate
 
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He had nothing to do with the ballot. He was chosen long before it.
Pardoneme? Never is it mentioned that Cloud was added before the ballot. What is mentioned is that he was the most voted for FF character. Obviously he was decided on well before the ballot ended.
Bayo was the ballot character.
And she's absolutely been confirmed to have been decided before the ballot ended. ABout 2 million votes in.
Cloud simply isn't Nintendo no matter how you slice it.
I thought you didn't care about that sort of stuff. Besides, he's been on Nintendo stuff before he got into Smash notably enough, and with this year, he'll be as "Nintendo" as you can get with having your game on a Nintendo platform.
I don't think people would be nearly so sour if FF got an assist trophy, spirits/trophies and music from other games in the series, particularly the first six.
The lack of those other things, we can easily blame on Square being stingy.
 
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Spin-off appearances though. That's my line of thinking. Their main games have yet to appear on a Nintendo system. Not yet at least.

If spin-off appearances count towards a prominent Nintendo appearance. What's to say as StormC said that a costume honoring Master Chief's legacy doesn't include Master Chief on the list of possibilities?

Whose to say Nintendo and Microsoft's close relationship wouldn't make them consider Master Chief? Sure, Steve makes a lot of sense more than Master Chief, but it doesn't negate the possibility either.
NOT TO MENTION
a random cameo in a Nintendo port or spinoff was not a sole reason Sakurai considered the character in the first place
A COURTESY.PNG

you even seen him saying "being on Nintendo platform" is nothing but a courtesy, than something "required"
 

MajoraMan28

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Pardoneme? Never is it mentioned that Cloud was added before the ballot. What is mentioned is that he was the most voted for FF character. Obviously he was decided on well before the ballot ended.

And she's absolutely been confirmed to have been decided before the ballot ended. ABout 2 million votes in.

I thought you didn't care about that sort of stuff. Besides, he's been on Nintendo stuff before he got into Smash notably enough, and with this year, he'll be as "Nintendo" as you can get with having your game on a Nintendo platform.

The lack of those other things, we can easily blame on Square being stingy.
OK. Just remember that the ballot hardly even began when Cloud was announced. And knowing S-E and how long it takes to develop a character, specially one of his caliber into the game (his mechanics were completely new, so it would take a longer time to make him work), it`s safe to say he wasn`t chosen for the ballot. Heck, Sakurai made it clear in interviews that he chose Cloud. There wasn`t any ballot to justify him, other than him being widely known as the most popular since the Brawl days. Fan polls were taken for more than a decade already, so he had data to look at possible FF characters.
Bayo was decided before the ballot ended, but she was decided bc of the data they have already gotten by that point. She was number 1 in Europe and very high up in the US and Japan, so it was a safe bet she was under those conditions for a while.
 
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