Social Sora Unlocks the Door! The Sora Social Thread

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

For every one fan rule broken 3 more are created that's why

So, some folks in the fanbase are actually from HYDRA, then.

Spoiler

(I mean, Disney owns Marvel, so I had to do this joke)

In all seriousness though, even if licensed characters are a factor or not, Sora will probably be tough to include into Smash regardless. is the simplest SE character to include so far, and they had to negotiate with five companies/creators, and even then they could only afford Midi tunes for their soundtrack. basically had to get a package deal with to have any decent amount of content at all.

Meanwhile, Hashimoto had flat out said "no" about Sora being planned for Ultimate to a French interviewer:

https://www.reddit.com/r/KingdomHea...ji_hashimoto_states_that_sora_is_not_planned/

Yet he still deleted the tweet that he used as a response to a fan render a while back:

https://twitter.com/tahk0/status/1042920948570046464

Is he under NDA, or not wanting to raise fans' hopes?

 

[fogbadge]

basically had to get a package deal with to have any decent amount of content at all.

that’s not quite what happened

 

[Bobthealligator]

what precedent in what tweet?

The tweet showing all the games Sora had been in without Disney characters.

 

[fogbadge]

The tweet showing all the games Sora had been in without Disney characters.

the one I said wasn’t loading?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

It's a theory that FFVII content was held back for Sephiroth, and I think we had a rumor too at best. It's not confirmed in the slightest. It's not a bad theory, mind you. If Sephiroth was planned to be in, but they couldn't, but that also means Sephiroth was going to be playable as DLC at some point very early on or that he was meant for base(along with Steve) and then both became DLC characters intended before Fighter's Pass 2 was greenlit. We still have the rumor that Steve was discussed five years back for possibly being in.

Besides, a lot of times companies don't release background information unless it's positive. Any company that they weren't able to work with could be presented as "stingy" or anything that could make them look bad. What does that mean? It means other companies might not work with them or it could affect sales and such. So common business sense is to watch what you say. It doesn't stop various people from reporting bad stuff either, but yeah.

 

[Bobthealligator]

It's a theory that FFVII content was held back for Sephiroth, and I think we had a rumor too at best. It's not confirmed in the slightest. It's not a bad theory, mind you. If Sephiroth was planned to be in, but they couldn't, but that also means Sephiroth was going to be playable as DLC at some point very early on or that he was meant for base(along with Steve) and then both became DLC characters intended before Fighter's Pass 2 was greenlit. We still have the rumor that Steve was discussed five years back for possibly being in.

Besides, a lot of times companies don't release background information unless it's positive. Any company that they weren't able to work with could be presented as "stingy" or anything that could make them look bad. What does that mean? It means other companies might not work with them or it could affect sales and such. So common business sense is to watch what you say. It doesn't stop various people from reporting bad stuff either, but yeah.

It makes some sense and based on what Sakurai said there is some truth to it, because Square wanted Cloud to be DLC which is likely why the content problem wasn't remedied. But if this was true then we almost certainly would have got Sephiroth in the first pass.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Every time I see or hear this argument, I can't help but think that it's just an arbitrary excuse people use just so they can say that Sora isn't happening.

Thats because it is just that. A roundabout way of saying "I dont want sora"

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

It makes some sense and based on what Sakurai said there is some truth to it, because Square wanted Cloud to be DLC which is likely why the content problem wasn't remedied. But if this was true then we almost certainly would have got Sephiroth in the first pass.

Can somebody cite this particular bit? That Square wanted Cloud to still be DLC?

And this is keeping in mind DLC was not planned from Ultimate's start. That was something that came around 2017. So about halfway through production .If the rumor is true, then Sakurai said no from the start to the idea because DLC wasn't intended to happen. Which makes sense. Square wanted more money overall, and Cloud couldn't provide it. They would've negotiated for the extra base content like Spirits and the online icons. Though to be fair, online play was probably intended before DLC, since it was already a thing in three previous Smash games.

 

[fogbadge]

It's a theory that FFVII content was held back for Sephiroth, and I think we had a rumor too at best. It's not confirmed in the slightest. It's not a bad theory, mind you. If Sephiroth was planned to be in, but they couldn't, but that also means Sephiroth was going to be playable as DLC at some point very early on or that he was meant for base(along with Steve) and then both became DLC characters intended before Fighter's Pass 2 was greenlit. We still have the rumor that Steve was discussed five years back for possibly being in.

Besides, a lot of times companies don't release background information unless it's positive. Any company that they weren't able to work with could be presented as "stingy" or anything that could make them look bad. What does that mean? It means other companies might not work with them or it could affect sales and such. So common business sense is to watch what you say. It doesn't stop various people from reporting bad stuff either, but yeah.

the steve thing came from one of the people who make minecraft its not a rumour

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

the steve thing came from one of the people who make minecraft its not a rumour

Ah. Well, that makes sense. The question is if Sephiroth was the other character intended for the final DLC or not. Cause the way it would've been, I'm guessing they would be Bonus, so without music/stages/spirits. And I can't imagine either two being that. Maybe they were bonus challenger packs, not just characters, at one point? Sephiroth I could almost believe as that, but that entirely depends upon a rumor. As it's the only thing that suggests he'd have come with extra content, not be a bonus DLC.

 

[fogbadge]

Ah. Well, that makes sense. The question is if Sephiroth was the other character intended for the final DLC or not. Cause the way it would've been, I'm guessing they would be Bonus, so without music/stages/spirits. And I can't imagine either two being that. Maybe they were bonus challenger packs, not just characters, at one point? Sephiroth I could almost believe as that, but that entirely depends upon a rumor. As it's the only thing that suggests he'd have come with extra content, not be a bonus DLC.

that is a good question, we may never be sure. or sakurai will tell a tiny bit in a column and we’ll spend forever trying to work out what he meant

 

[Double0Groove]

In all seriousness though, even if licensed characters are a factor or not, Sora will probably be tough to include into Smash regardless. is the simplest SE character to include so far, and they had to negotiate with five companies/creators, and even then they could only afford Midi tunes for their soundtrack. basically had to get a package deal with to have any decent amount of content at all.

Meanwhile, Hashimoto had flat out said "no" about Sora being planned for Ultimate to a French interviewer:

https://www.reddit.com/r/KingdomHea...ji_hashimoto_states_that_sora_is_not_planned/

Yet he still deleted the tweet that he used as a response to a fan render a while back:

https://twitter.com/tahk0/status/1042920948570046464

Is he under NDA, or not wanting to raise fans' hopes?

As a Sora supporter, ofcourse I'd say "yes" to the NDA bit. But in a more objective sense, it's hard to say when you consider all the info we have on hand. Either way, the second Fighters pass was finalized in November of 2019, the tweet referenced in that Reddit thread was posted back in May of that same year, so as of right now, it's safe to argue that Hashimoto's deconfirmation is outdated at the very least (assuming he wasn't lying to begin with).


With all that being said, I don't think anybody here thinks Sora's rights would be easy to obtain, but that's not really something to concern ourselves with when that's an argument you could use against most 3rd party characters in the roster. The most difficult amongst them being . We barely even know the circumstances for the FF7 content we received outside of the fact that Nintendo had to go through several different companies to get it. An issue far removed from Sora because Nintendo only has to go through 2. At most. And both seem to already be on good terms with the company considering the support shown for the Switch, SEs content being promoted in Smash, and the collaborations Disney had with Nintendo.

 

[Perkilator]

With all that being said, I don't think anybody here thinks Sora's rights would be easy to obtain, but that's not really something to concern ourselves with when that's an argument you could use against most 3rd party characters in the roster. The most difficult amongst them being . We barely even know the circumstances for the FF7 content we received outside of the fact that Nintendo had to go through several different companies to get it. An issue far removed from Sora because Nintendo only has to go through 2. At most. And both seem to already be on good terms with the company considering the support shown for the Switch, SEs content being promoted in Smash, and the collaborations Disney had with Nintendo.

PREACH!

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Another possibility is that after the whole Hero leak incident, SE representatives were instructed to be really careful when talking about any character of theirs, on the off-chance that they might be considered and negotiated for Smash.

And seeing as we're talking about Shinji "loose lips" Hashimoto, that's a distinct possibility.

 

[fogbadge]

Another possibility is that after the whole Hero leak incident, SE representatives were instructed to be really careful when talking about any character of theirs, on the off-chance that they might be considered and negotiated for Smash.

And seeing as we're talking about Shinji "loose lips" Hashimoto, that's a distinct possibility.

speaking of leaks doesnt the minecraft ones sort of disprove the idea that sephiroth was meant for the base game? i mean the guy was adamant that we were getting minecraft stuff so their source must have known about the on going negotiations, so shouldnt they have also known about these supposed sephiroth talks?

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

speaking of leaks doesnt the minecraft ones sort of disprove the idea that sephiroth was meant for the base game? i mean the guy was adamant that we were getting minecraft stuff so their source must have known about the on going negotiations, so shouldnt they have also known about these supposed sephiroth talks?

Vergeben isn't exactly consistent, yeah. Anything involving DLC is unlikely to be accurately uncovered by his sources.

As for me, I was simply saying earlier that FF7's stuff in general has complex negotiations that took a while to sort out (seeing as Uematsu's not in the company often anymore).

 

[fogbadge]

Vergeben isn't exactly consistent, yeah. Anything involving DLC is unlikely to be accurately uncovered by his sources.

As for me, I was simply saying earlier that FF7's stuff in general has complex negotiations that took a while to sort out (seeing as Uematsu's not in the company often anymore).

do you mean 8? Cause I’m not sure uematsu worked on minecraft

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

do you mean 8? Cause I’m not sure uematsu worked on minecraft

...I wasn't talking about Minecraft in the latter sentence though. Just forget it.

 

[fogbadge]

...I wasn't talking about Minecraft in the latter sentence though. Just forget it.

but you said FP7 which is Steve hence why I asked if you meant 8 which is sephiroth

 

[TraaP]

but you said FP7 which is Steve hence why I asked if you meant 8 which is sephiroth

They said “FF7” not “FP7”

 

[PLATINUM7]

Ah crud, I missed it...


I've gotta ask, why do people insist on using this as if it's a genuine argument? I mean, honestly, even ignoring the fact that Sora's a Disney character himself or ignoring that the Kingdom Key actually addressing this issue, why is this such a fixation? He's made cameos in other games without other Disney characters (unless you count Riku) with little issue from Disney AND fans, we all know Sakurai has expressed not wanting to put in non gaming characters into the game, and to top it all off Kingdom Hearts has enough of its own identity to represent itself without the use of characters like Mickey, Donald, Goofy, ect.

Every time I see or hear this argument, I can't help but think that it's just an arbitrary excuse people use just so they can say that Sora isn't happening. It doesn't help that I never get an answer when I bring this stuff up with anybody. So I'll ask you, Why? What makes you think the kind of characters that Sakurai doesn't want in smash bros. are needed in order to properly represent Kingdom Hearts? Why they're needed here when they weren't ever needed any other time Sora made a cameo appearance. And why the likes of Riku, Kairi, Or the Organization aren't enough to properly represent the series they were created in?

If I have to play devil's advocate, with how people view Smash as a celebration of gaming and the games with characters in it, as well as speculation historically being so focused on getting reps moreso than characters, it's possible people feel KH in Smash needs the Disney content. That's different to what they might see as just a cameo in a FF game, as opposed to "representation" in a Smash game.

Not that I agree with that, I'm just trying to rationalise and understand what gets said.

 

[fogbadge]

They said “FF7” not “FP7”

woops

 

[Double0Groove]

If I have to play devil's advocate, with how people view Smash as a celebration of gaming and the games with characters in it, as well as speculation historically being so focused on getting reps moreso than characters, it's possible people feel KH in Smash needs the Disney content. That's different to what they might see as just a cameo in a FF game, as opposed to "representation" in a Smash game.

Not that I agree with that, I'm just trying to rationalise and understand what gets said.

I don't think that's it. That would also imply that they believe characters like Goofy and Donald are gaming characters first and foremost and should be celebrated as such, which isn't the case.
Well, that's assuming I'm reading your comment correctly. I'm afraid to admit it, but I had a hard time comprehending what you were trying to say.

 

[PLATINUM7]

I don't think that's it. That would also imply that they believe characters like Goofy and Donald are gaming characters first and foremost and should be celebrated as such, which isn't the case.
Well, that's assuming I'm reading your comment correctly. I'm afraid to admit it, but I had a hard time comprehending what you were trying to say.

No, it wouldn't necessarily imply that. What I'm saying is there could be a perceived difference in what's necessary to come with Sora in FF appearances and Smash. Smash characters tend to come with an array of content from their game/series to the point that people have seen them as reps. People ask for reps from a series to reflect what the series is about and bring some of its content over. If some people feel that to effectively rep KH you would need some Disney content, then they could feel that is a barrier to his inclusion.

 

[fogbadge]

No, it wouldn't necessarily imply that. What I'm saying is there could be a perceived difference in what's necessary to come with Sora in FF appearances and Smash. Smash characters tend to come with an array of content from their game/series to the point that people have seen them as reps. People ask for reps from a series to reflect what the series is about and bring some of its content over. If some people feel that to effectively rep KH you would need some Disney content, then they could feel that is a barrier to his inclusion.

yeah but its what sakurai thinks that matters not what the fans feel

 

[PLATINUM7]

yeah but its what sakurai thinks that matters not what the fans feel

Ultimately, yes but if we reduced all discussion to that there'd be no point talking speculation.

 

[fogbadge]

Ultimately, yes but if we reduced all discussion to that there'd be no point talking speculation.

i mean we could speculate over what he thinks

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

No matter what happens, Sak would bring up the Disney characters in the video presentation. When arrived, he namedropped some Kinnikuman characters, and I don't think he had to pay royalties to Yudetamago or Shueisha just to do that.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Happy Anniversary to this collection.

Kingdom Hearts HD 2.8 Final Chapter Prologue for PS4 was released on this day in North America & Europe, 4 years ago (2017) pic.twitter.com/9wpsoxnCIx

— OnThisDayInGaming (@OnThisDayGaming) January 24, 2021

 

[Perkilator]

Happy Anniversary to this collection.

Kingdom Hearts HD 2.8 Final Chapter Prologue for PS4 was released on this day in North America & Europe, 4 years ago (2017) pic.twitter.com/9wpsoxnCIx

— OnThisDayInGaming (@OnThisDayGaming) January 24, 2021

KH3 also released two years ago today in Japan!

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Aqua sketch.

Old Aqua sketch pic.twitter.com/a6m8tCFuom

— ScruffyTurtles (@ScruffyTurtles) January 26, 2021

 

[Cadillac]

A random thing I made

Do you think there's a chance that this might actually happen in the future?

 

[fogbadge]

A random thing I madeView attachment 300614
Do you think there's a chance that this might actually happen in the future?

well sora may be dumb enough to think hes owned by SE

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

A random thing I madeView attachment 300614
Do you think there's a chance that this might actually happen in the future?

Probably, yeah, seeing as FFVIII managed to get a remaster despite the source code for the original having allegedly been lost.

Although a remake would make it a little likelier, I think (after VII's is eventually completed).

Spoiler: This drawing is probably a summoning ritual for some of them.

~Decisions~ #SmashBrosUltimate #SuperSmashBros #FinalFantasy #DragonQuest #ChronoTrigger #SquareEnix pic.twitter.com/brmimsHoGm

— Stoic Seraphim (@Stoic_Miiverse) November 19, 2018

 

[Perkilator]

Can you believe it has already been two years since we launched #KingdomHearts III worldwide?

We fondly remember seeing old friends again, riding attractions, switching keyblades, cooking, formchanges, taking selfies and finally, all the new friends we made along the way! ❤️ pic.twitter.com/VKMYSjIRPQ

— KINGDOM HEARTS (@KINGDOMHEARTS) January 29, 2021

Two years already....I remember the wait feeling like forever and my hype increasing back in 2018, when the game entered its full marketing phase.

 

[fogbadge]

Can you believe it has already been two years since we launched #KingdomHearts III worldwide?

We fondly remember seeing old friends again, riding attractions, switching keyblades, cooking, formchanges, taking selfies and finally, all the new friends we made along the way! ❤️ pic.twitter.com/VKMYSjIRPQ

— KINGDOM HEARTS (@KINGDOMHEARTS) January 29, 2021

Two years already....I remember the wait feeling like forever and my hype increasing back in 2018, when the game entered its full marketing phase.

ah memories

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Can you believe it has already been two years since we launched #KingdomHearts III worldwide?

We fondly remember seeing old friends again, riding attractions, switching keyblades, cooking, formchanges, taking selfies and finally, all the new friends we made along the way! ❤️ pic.twitter.com/VKMYSjIRPQ

— KINGDOM HEARTS (@KINGDOMHEARTS) January 29, 2021

Two years already....I remember the wait feeling like forever and my hype increasing back in 2018, when the game entered its full marketing phase.

It's so weird to me that this game was revealed the same year as Smash 4's first reveal, and then released only a month after Smash Ultimate's release. We technically went through TWO Smash hype cycles in between this game's reveal and release.

 

[PLATINUM7]

I wouldn't say I fondly remember cooking lol but otherwise it was another fantastic entry in the series.

Completed 5 of the data battles on my critical mode playthrough. Aside from possibly getting my ass handed to me its nice knowing I timed the replay well.

 

[Deleted member]

Good to hear glad you enjoyed the game.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Dad talking about his adventures.

Explaining the Kingdom Hearts Lore pic.twitter.com/2ZFvi28w2l

— WitchParfait (@ImMisterPlow) February 2, 2021