Sonic General Discussion/Social thread

[Solharath]

Wizzy is that your way of saying "Screw Sonic, I'm becoming a bat!"? 'Cause that'd be cool, y'know. More Sonic glory for me, 'n all.

Anywho, Nair hitbox seems to last a lot longer, or I never considered hitting with the weak hitbox before, either way it's an amazing gimp tool and I very much recommend it in any scenario where you don't quite trust Fair to hit.

Also, the hitbox at the top of Sonic's arc just at the start of fair is super strong. I killed Bowser around 60% from the edge of Wario Ware and Green Hill. I know they're close edges, but still. Bowser and 60%. Not too bad.

Jiggles gets WRECKED by it.

 

[Nazo]

Wizzy is that your way of saying "Screw Sonic, I'm becoming a bat!"? 'Cause that'd be cool, y'know. More Sonic glory for me, 'n all.

Anywho, Nair hitbox seems to last a lot longer, or I never considered hitting with the weak hitbox before, either way it's an amazing gimp tool and I very much recommend it in any scenario where you don't quite trust Fair to hit.

Also, the hitbox at the top of Sonic's arc just at the start of fair is super strong. I killed Bowser around 60% from the edge of Wario Ware and Green Hill. I know they're close edges, but still. Bowser and 60%. Not too bad.

Jiggles gets WRECKED by it.

I've noticed this as well. You can Juggle with Fair after Uthrow on certain characters.

I'm also starting to enjoy the smaller stages as Sonic (Wario Ware, Yoshi's story, ect.).

 

[DireDrop]

Homing attack sets up for fair well too, especially off stage.

 

[Sonjicboom]

I'm still finding that jab -> dtilt -> utilt can be a great source of early pressure in spite of the slew of nerfs. Furthermore, if timed well enough, it seems that Sonic can land a short-hopped fair nigh immediately following the utilt. SHFF out of the Fair, dash, Fair again. SHFF'd Uair out of dashing seems to be a solid means of pressing an opponent horizontally (I feel like I'm playing brawl Sonic again).

Now I'm going to play my back-up copy of 2.5b and live in ignorant bliss.

 

[Ekcho]

Homing attack sets up for fair well too, especially off stage.

Yeah, that's a prime way of KO'ing for Sonic in 2.6. Also it sets up for U-air in certain cases. I've knocked stocks off of Peach like this multiple times already, and Sheik here and there.

 

[Solharath]

The complete lack of kill power in some regards leaves many of my opponents living until 150% or more.

This really is some Brawl Sonic shenanigans and really lowers the fun. I mean, 150% is not Melee levels... Really, in the end, it seems you need a mid-percent kill combo to take out your opponent before they can react, 'cause once you hit ~100%, it's just a matter of getting in with a kill move you don't have.

Although maybe just baiting and Fsmashing might work? I dunno, Dtilt with FSmash to follow might work on spacies, but with DI I don't think that's very possible. I could really go for my sparring partner to be here now so I can practice against a live opponent.

 

[Ekcho]

The complete lack of kill power in some regards leaves many of my opponents living until 150% or more.

This really is some Brawl Sonic shenanigans and really lowers the fun. I mean, 150% is not Melee levels... Really, in the end, it seems you need a mid-percent kill combo to take out your opponent before they can react, 'cause once you hit ~100%, it's just a matter of getting in with a kill move you don't have.

Although maybe just baiting and Fsmashing might work? I dunno, Dtilt with FSmash to follow might work on spacies, but with DI I don't think that's very possible. I could really go for my sparring partner to be here now so I can practice against a live opponent.

Yeah, I get where you're coming from on that one :/ Although at midpercent is where I feel combo comfortable, that's just me though. If it gets to ~100% then that's when I get them off stage and do everything I can to keep them off. I usually B-throw to F-air or SHFFL B-air to HA after they double jump. But that's just me.

 

[Wizzrobe]

Wizzy is that your way of saying "Screw Sonic, I'm becoming a bat!"? 'Cause that'd be cool, y'know. More Sonic glory for me, 'n all.

Anywho, Nair hitbox seems to last a lot longer, or I never considered hitting with the weak hitbox before, either way it's an amazing gimp tool and I very much recommend it in any scenario where you don't quite trust Fair to hit.

Also, the hitbox at the top of Sonic's arc just at the start of fair is super strong. I killed Bowser around 60% from the edge of Wario Ware and Green Hill. I know they're close edges, but still. Bowser and 60%. Not too bad.

Jiggles gets WRECKED by it.

Im saying MK is a godlike character and one of Sonic's worst MU's

 

[Sonjicboom]

Im saying MK is a godlike character and one of Sonic's worst MU's

What makes it one of his worst?

 

[Ekcho]

What makes it one of his worst?

Combo ability, he's able to finish those combos, and maybe his ability to rack up damage. That's what I've experienced so far.

 

[Wizzrobe]

What makes it one of his worst?

Also, his Nair out prioritizes everything u have and its hard to finish him off it seems.

 

[Ariyo]

Well, I'm pretty salty about the new Sonic. I find myself camping quite a bit as some have said already. The bit of priority he had seems to be completely gone and so has just about any good tech dealing with downB. Why was the ability to shield cancel downB taken? Other than that, everything else has been addressed already.

 

[Wizzrobe]

Well, I'm pretty salty about the new Sonic. I find myself camping quite a bit as some have said already. The bit of priority he had seems to be completely gone and so has just about any good tech dealing with downB. Why was the ability to shield cancel downB taken? Other than that, everything else has been addressed already.

Cause it takes away commitment to the move.

 

[Ariyo]

Commitment sent Sonic to low tier

 

[Ekcho]

Commitment sent Sonic to low tier

I feel that once people adjust to him, he'll get better. That's what I'm trying to do and he few that have decided to try an get good with 2.6 Sonic.

 

[Nazo]

He's not bad, you just have to get used to the idea that you can't abuse specials...
or kill...
or jump out of spin dash charge...


You can still spin shot, though. Very useful for recovery.

 

[DireDrop]

Having such low priority again is going to be really unpleasant to adjust to. He's so mobile though... I feel like it may not be as frustrating to bait all day as it was in Brawl. He's much better at baiting and he can actually do something once he finally catches someone off guard. Even if that something isn't as glorious as, say... Falcon knee.

 

[Wizzrobe]

I feel that once people adjust to him, he'll get better. That's what I'm trying to do and he few that have decided to try an get good with 2.6 Sonic.

I feel like Sonic is becoming a better character it's just MK is his biggest problem for me right now.

 

[SAX]

I feel like Sonic is becoming a better character it's just MK is his biggest problem for me right now.

Plup op

 

[Ariyo]

He's not bad, you just have to get used to the idea that you can't abuse specials...
or kill...
or jump out of spin dash charge...


You can still spin shot, though. Very useful for recovery.

He runs circles around characters, still. But I feel like thats it. I never seem to get clean hits or kill in the least. Especially since HA was my dominant go to kill move. I do like strong part of fair tho. Its as close to a kill move than every other move.

 

[GeZ]

I feel like Sonic is becoming a better character it's just MK is his biggest problem for me right now.

Mad props Wizzy. Glad you're digging the new Sonic. He's not getting the same recession from most people so it's good to hear you're still on board.

 

[MrBigstuff]

I feel like Sonic is becoming a better character it's just MK is his biggest problem for me right now.

Wizzy has spoken.

 

[Neptune Shiranui]

I love how Homing Attack can setup for combos now.

 

[Wizzrobe]

I love how Homing Attack can setup for combos now.

You mean less? HA has more cooldown so it's not even a frame trap anymore, or it is less of a frame trap.

 

[Nazo]

Blast attack sets up for combos, assuming you're good at aiming it.

HA is a gimmick tool mainly used offstage to swat the opponent. Dair does a better job of cutting the opponent off from recovery than HA does.

 

[ScubaF_ingSteve]

So I've been avoiding picking up sonic before 2.6 as to not get too heartbroken when he's nerfed and now I feel like I've missed something great. I love playing sonic (as a marth main) and he's a blast. My only problem, a problem I see you guys facing too is killing. I can't kill anything before like 150 on any stage that isn't like warioware or yoshi's. I like the way he feels, but I can't seem to kill quick enough.

 

[Nguz95]

So I've been avoiding picking up sonic before 2.6 as to not get too heartbroken when he's nerfed and now I feel like I've missed something great. I love playing sonic (as a marth main) and he's a blast. My only problem, a problem I see you guys facing too is killing. I can't kill anything before like 150 on any stage that isn't like warioware or yoshi's. I like the way he feels, but I can't seem to kill quick enough.

Ftilt man, it kills quickly. If you can land a nair or a spike fair, that should take care of them at highish %.

 

[Nazo]

So I've been avoiding picking up sonic before 2.6 as to not get too heartbroken when he's nerfed and now I feel like I've missed something great. I love playing sonic (as a marth main) and he's a blast. My only problem, a problem I see you guys facing too is killing. I can't kill anything before like 150 on any stage that isn't like warioware or yoshi's. I like the way he feels, but I can't seem to kill quick enough.

From my experience, I've found a couple of decent ways to kill my opponent (mainly gimps):

-Slicing the opponent with Dair offstage. Use spindash to get a farther horizontal distance before Dairing.
-Ftilt while the opponent is recovering, repeatedly (Fsmash works fine as well).
-Nair sweetspot offstage; again, using spindash to get the horizontal distance to pull this off.
-Hitting a grounded opponent with Fair can set up for a nice Usmash, which kills decently on stages with lower blastzones.
-Jab reset into Fsmash, extremely reliable.
-Blast attack > Fair does wonders as well. Spring should delay their attempts to recover while you get back to the stage to gimp them.

 

[DireDrop]

Ftilt man, it kills quickly. If you can land a nair or a spike fair, that should take care of them at highish %.

In 2.5 it could kill quick, but in 2.6 it's much less powerful. Nair suffered a similar nerf. Fair is your best bet in 2.6 it seems, because of the buffed upper hitbox.

 

[Nguz95]

I guess I'm outdated then. I have been too busy being distracted by 2.6 Lucario and Ike to check out Sonic. The new fair sounds deadly though.

 

[DireDrop]

It's not a huge buff, but it's something. Killing is definitely his weakpoint now. However (and funny you should mention Lucario), I was able to go to a friends house a fight a decent Lucario recently, and I found that although I had trouble getting kills, he also had trouble killing me! Sonic vs Lucario was one of my least favorite matchups in Brawl. He could set up these stupid walls of pain that you had to bait him out of as the Sonic player, and it was an absolute chore. One false move and you got punished hard, and you were rarely rewarded with very much damage if he messed up (if he did). But in 2.6, you have SO many more tools available to you. Something I am happy to see didn't get nerfed very much in 2.6 is his Up B. That move is stupid good. Got yourself in a tight spot? Just Up B and you're out of there. And since his dair shoots him down so fast, you still have a great way to get back to the ground. And of course, wavedashing and dash dancing are extremely powerful, especially in a character with such a could run. He may not have the same offensive power he had in 2.5, but Sonic still has a giant arsenal of defensive tools that allow him to stay safe while remaining a threat.

 

[Sonjicboom]

I hate to ask, but what exactly is Sonic's blast attack as opposed to the homing attack? I thought the two were synonymous .

 

[Kally Wally]

Press A (or whatever you have set as normal attack) during homing attack's startup. Sonic will immediately launch downward at an angle, which has considerably less cooldown on hit.

 

[Sonjicboom]

Press A (or whatever you have set as normal attack) during homing attack's startup. Sonic will immediately launch downward at an angle, which has considerably less cooldown on hit.

Thanks a bunch!

 

[leelue]

Even more reason for why I think moves with "hidden extra inputs" like sonic's HA or Squirtles Side B should have a graphical cue to clue people in.

 

[DireDrop]

Are you having trouble seeing when other people do it? Or are you not sure if you've done it? A major difference between Homing Attack and Blast Attack is that Blast Attack does not auto-target.

Try doing a Blast Attack while Sonic is right next to the opponent, but not facing them. If you do the move right, Sonic should immediately launch in the direction he's facing, leaving the opponent unharmed. If he smashes into the opponent behind him, then you didn't do a Blast Attack, you did a regular Homing Attack.

At certain percentages, Blast Attack can combo into itself! Go to training mode, select Lucario as your opponent, and go to Final Destination. Set Lucario's damage to 40%, walk right up to him (facing him) and try doing 3 Blast Attacks in a row. All of them should connect, and you can finish with a fair at the end for good measure.

 

[leelue]

I don't think he knew that blast attack existed at all, not that he didn't know it when he saw it.

 

[Sonjicboom]

I don't think he knew that blast attack existed at all, not that he didn't know it when he saw it.

He's right; I had no clue that it existed. Now that I know it's a thing, I can clearly see when it's used (and why it's so bloody useful). The reason I thought they were synonymous is because the blast attack in Sonic 3D blast was technically a homing attack. Thanks for the help, guys!

 

[DireDrop]

Even more reason for why I think moves with "hidden extra inputs" like sonic's HA or Squirtles Side B should have a graphical cue to clue people in.

Then I vote that Blast Attack sets people on fire. Just like how Falcon's knee electrifies people if you sweet spot it.

 

[leelue]

No, I meant that moves that have a second part (zss down b, squirtle side b, sonic Nb, lucas down smash, wtc) should have a cue to alert new players that there is another input. Even something as simple as a tiny spark effect, or the graphic that shows up when Ike misses the OHKO. Something not distracting, but still people could notice.