Some rules I followed to get better, by LunInSpectra

[Sora Keyblade Master]

You don't seem arrogant you just seem stupid >_> how much money did you lose to FLT over a joke again, 70$?

Joke ? what are you talking about ? there was no joke involved with FLT..... I just clearly stated I was joking around with the members of this site during the 40 pages of this forum. Arent you mike brookman... you were one of the one i was debateing with ? how could ask something stoopid like that ? Not to mention I made all of that money back the same day in a tournament for a" SVC Chaos" .

 

[Randall00]

If had the chance to join this site and start over diferently, ill do the samething all over again.

I think that says "If I had the chance to join this site and start over differently, I wouldn't." Seriously? Have you learned nothing?

 

[Mcscruff]

just wondering.... is sora keyblade master that guy who made a thread saying he was the best at smash, and that he can beat ken? i thought that was the funniest thing i ever read in my life...

 

[Sora Keyblade Master]

just wondering.... is sora keyblade master that guy who made a thread saying he was the best at smash, and that he can beat ken? i thought that was the funniest thing i ever read in my life...

Never said that i was the best. Never said i could take ken either.

 

[felix45]

I think really the biggest part of mindgames is having the right mindset (much like the first post states, but kinda shortened up really)

1st thing going into any match is being confident in yourself, so long as you tell yourself you are worse you will be worse. really that simple. anyone can beat anyone any day given the right mindset, no thanks to miracles.

2nd thing is keeping your cool at all times. you cant lose it all because someone just did some crazy technical combo on you and let it get to you. many times in videos I have noticed people come back on their 2nd to last and last stock and take the win because they begin to catch onto their opponent. this leads into the 3rd thing...

3rd is patience. you gotta have the patience to notice what your opponent is doing. I know personally I will always try to find something that works on a particular opponent and do it over and over and over again. if it works and they aren't countering it, do it. (this part I believe is what sets apart pros from everyone else, they catch on much quicker and are able to exploit weaknesses much faster than the average player) should you find your opponent doing this to you, stop them, counter their counter. sirlin explains this well in his rant on how scrubs will always be scrubs so long as they keep their mindset (when he talks about chain grabbing)



from what I have seen in 2d fighters as well, pressure is key in many cases (if not all). if you can keep the pressure on and make the opponent lose their patience, this in itself is a mindgame, and one of the best. that why it is so important that you do something that may be looked down upon by others.

Taunting your opponent (for the most part) is one of the best things you can do when you kill them. give them no rest, no break from the mental pressure, even in their death. make them lose their patience, you will always have the upper hand.

granted taunting only works should you have the mental capacity to get flamed to death during, before, and possibly after the match, because it really is frowned upon to rag on your opponent. I generally dont do it unless I know it could be the difference between a win and a loss, and due to me sucking really I hardly try to piss others off during a match.


but, should it ever become the difference between $2k and $500 for me, I am sure as hell going to be making fun of my opponent every chance I get.

 

[nytcrawler]

AHHHHH i read ur **** article now... im enlightened next to build that ... haha i kinda figured things like that .. by like talking ot mahself.. i got to focus on the mechanics being needed before u can fully apply the mindgames ... muahahah PLAY ME i wanna DESTORY U .... sumday.. ill put taht as a goal like "eagle"

 

[the_air_up_there7]

how can you go pro anyways??

 

[LunInSpectra]

Easy way to become at LEAST as good as LunInSpectra: (HAHAHAHAHA)

-Get really high tech skill so you don't worry about pressing buttons
-Sharpen up your spacing & movement so you land/evade everything correctly
-Find out the best thing to do against each individual characters
-Stop doing unnecessary techniques (infiniting)
-Think of different styles and practice them
-Learn some mind-games/tricks (run behind and fsmash)
-Watch videos of yourself and find out what you're doing wrong, and stop doing it.

 

[Balloon]

Great thread, Lunin. It has helped my game a lot. That is all my input.

 

[Aaron_Sketch]

Cool little mindgame guide. A fun read, but technical...ness... basically requires mindgames in itself in order to implement them correctly. Example:

Game and watch. Horrible running speed. Yazi has his ganonloaf coming at me on Corneria. My damage is too high to cc, my shield to crappy to block, my jump too laggy to utilize, so instead, I wavedash backwards while facing Ganon. When he comes in with his Fair, I'm already waiting with my Match.

Which you can't do with dashing, because dash attacks generally suck. Unless you're Shiek or Spamus.

And as you can see, wavedashing requires mindgames in order to be actually useful. I had to realize that Ganon had no projectiles so that wavedashing away would actually be useful, I had to anticipate the fair, and I had to pick an according punishing move. Yay.

And so yeah. Tech skill =mindgames. You must master one to utilize the other.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

Hey Guys to the one asking why this thread isnt stickied, Im guessing its because of the my saga. But yea, I now believe luin made this forum with every thought of it being stickied but because of 40 pointless pages of me joshing around and haveing fun with flames and 2 cents collection from many difrent people. I believe it was not. Which is why i made my own forum so tha luin's could get back on track. Dont mistaken me, im not apologizing for what i done. If had the chance to join this site and start over diferently, ill do the samething all over again. But I am apologizeing Ruining luin's thread. Take it how you want it. If Iseem arrogrant, then cool. But if you see my point then thats cool too.

Also Luin, couldnt you make a new thread with this same info and have that stickied ?since the admins know what happen to this. Im sure they would allow you to.

Well,it seems you have changed in a more positive manner....

Easy way to become at LEAST as good as LunInSpectra: (HAHAHAHAHA)

-Get really high tech skill so you don't worry about pressing buttons
-Sharpen up your spacing & movement so you land/evade everything correctly
-Find out the best thing to do against each individual characters
-Stop doing unnecessary techniques (infiniting)
-Think of different styles and practice them
-Learn some mind-games/tricks (run behind and fsmash)
-Watch videos of yourself and find out what you're doing wrong, and stop doing it.

HAHA..Fairly noted.

 

[Big Burn]

very interesting stuff... good analysis...

 

[Delphiki]

*runs in from GSC thread*

sticky sticky sticky sticky

Why is this not stickied?

*runs off to own thread*

 

[cradmazy_SKAG]

If Iseem arrogrant, then cool. But if you see my point then thats cool too.

haha of course your arrogant and stupid. your from texas...

oh man... hate me for it.

g regulate said it best. east coast is too good.

oh yeah very nice first post by the way... you know, the one about the 7 habits... anyone remember that one??

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

From the amount of knowledge spewing from this thead,it deserves a...


BUMP!!11

 

[captainlukey]

agreed karthik...
but thinking ahead isn't too bad either.
i just don't think that people sit there with some kind of a spreadsheet anayzing video or just watching video to get better *cough*lunin*cough*

it's all about the player style...
if you don't have your own style, then you do have to take these things into consideration because you don't have the experience behind the style... making the need for this,,,

i predict this thread will be locked >.>;;

once again people fail to see the point, this thread is so correct and down to earth and reflects wat people think while playing either conciously or subconciously.
only noobs play without thinking cough*Flamestar cough cough jerk

 

[Sync99]

My friend Jeff always uses Falcon--it's amazing how much of a mind games character he is, which is probably why this guide is meant more for characters like Falcon and Fox than for Falco, who really doesn't need to think this much in battle about his approach.

 

[[Deuce]]

Wow rey, nice work! I agree with everything you've mentioned, and it all makes perfect sense too, those mental habits really do define a skilled player. i agree with gameangel in that smashers today tend to lean more towards their 'technical flashiness' sure, a guy can wavedash and lcancel perfectly all the time, but is it still considered skillful if u wavedash perfectly into my "FALCOOOOON PUUNNNNCHHH!'???? I think not =P

indeed indeed!

 

[omegablade]

all i say is to be spontaneos, dont freak out and just kick alot of *** XD

 

[thesage]

Isn't Flamestar666 = Mofo (one of the Ness Saninn?) OMFG reading this will hurt my Ness game #gouges eyes out#.

Very helpful guide. Helped me a lot. Every noob should read it.

 

[KevinM]

The Guide was very helpful i just wish is could be stickied that would be something that all smashers should read

 

[Big Burn]

yes it was very informative

 

[Lesheik]

You put too much thought into it.

I believe that most smashers do these things subconciously; only a few are aware.

Not true he put enough thought into it. True.

I think most of us act on impulse, do things because of experience.

True with some people. Acting on impulse can get you killed. For example: Think before you cross the street! Don't let your feet control you! Worry about the risks that can happen if you execute that action of walking across the street without watching out for moving cars, bumps, etc. Your goal is to get across the street. Isn't the best way to cross the street crossing the street safely? Same thing goes with Smash.

Experience only makes you exposed the common battle-tactics that you allows you to clearly predict what your opponent is going to do in battle depending on the character.

 

[Flamestar666]

Isn't Flamestar666 = Mofo (one of the Ness Saninn?) OMFG reading this will hurt my Ness game #gouges eyes out#.

Very helpful guide. Helped me a lot. Every noob should read it.

No? Wtf are you talking about?

 

[SPAWN]

He must be thinking of MasterofFlames. This topic is too good.

 

[xelad1]

well at least someone tried teach something about these "mindgames"(if you will), but in a way i think most of it is common sense

Sometimes "common sense" ideas need to be brought to the attention of people though. Saying something is common sense does not mean that everyone does the most logical thing all the time. Most people do what is most comfortable to them without necessarily thinking about it beforehand, and this leads to stagnation. Its like playing an instrument. If there is one thing I've noticed is that people who practice an instrument, when they start procrastinating often play something easy and cool sounding that they've learned, and basically just screw off. Its a short term effect, just like a fox who goes in for a drillshine hoping it will lead to an infinite over and over just so they can get that gratifying feeling of pulling one off even if it looses the match. The only way to improve is to analyze and push yourself to do things that are not comfortable, and heck they may even lose you matches at first because you spend too much time thinking, but eventually it should become second nature and make you a better player.

I don't find this any different than developing technical skill. What if we all just got frustrated the first time we tried to wavedash or shine combo or whatever. I know that when I first started learning my technical abilities I would lose WORSE and more frequently than before, because I spent too much time thinking about it. But how could I say it wasn't worth it now that my technical abilities are second nature and have improved my gameplay leaps and bounds. "Mindgames" are no different, and they should require some conscious thought to develop.

Most amateur players don't take these considerations into effect when they actually play, they often go on "autopilot" which doesn't get them anywhere. I think many smashers have experienced playing against a noob who does better than expected because of this factor. They don't factor in things like measuring the predictability of their opponent, or punishing repeated mistakes.

By the way I will say one piece of advice. No matter who your main is, a lot can be learned from playing captain falcon. I find that with a lot of his game centering around techchasing, grab games and whatnot that he helps develop some of the skills lunin has outlined here. I main falco and fox most of the time but after picking up falcon and forcing myself to consciously pay attention to my opponent's patterns of behavior it has carried into my overall abilities. Playing a competitive falcon requires more thinking to get up to par with a good technical fox or falco (I'm not saying they don't require thought, but their technical advantages can carry you pretty far, so that you aren't forced to develop a strong mindset for a while).

Either way awesome post lunin, we should play sometime I've heard from a friend that used to go the Sacramento Biweeklies that you live in daly city, and I'm in SF not too far away/

 

[PIMPSLAP]

using your mind control thing i call it your advice inproved my game at least 40% i am very gracious to you thanks

 

[thesage]

Sometimes "common sense" ideas need to be brought to the attention of people though. Saying something is common sense does not mean that everyone does the most logical thing all the time. Most people do what is most comfortable to them without necessarily thinking about it beforehand, and this leads to stagnation. Its like playing an instrument. If there is one thing I've noticed is that people who practice an instrument, when they start procrastinating often play something easy and cool sounding that they've learned, and basically just screw off. Its a short term effect, just like a fox who goes in for a drillshine hoping it will lead to an infinite over and over just so they can get that gratifying feeling of pulling one off even if it looses the match. The only way to improve is to analyze and push yourself to do things that are not comfortable, and heck they may even lose you matches at first because you spend too much time thinking, but eventually it should become second nature and make you a better player.

I don't find this any different than developing technical skill. What if we all just got frustrated the first time we tried to wavedash or shine combo or whatever. I know that when I first started learning my technical abilities I would lose WORSE and more frequently than before, because I spent too much time thinking about it. But how could I say it wasn't worth it now that my technical abilities are second nature and have improved my gameplay leaps and bounds. "Mindgames" are no different, and they should require some conscious thought to develop.

Most amateur players don't take these considerations into effect when they actually play, they often go on "autopilot" which doesn't get them anywhere. I think many smashers have experienced playing against a noob who does better than expected because of this factor. They don't factor in things like measuring the predictability of their opponent, or punishing repeated mistakes.

By the way I will say one piece of advice. No matter who your main is, a lot can be learned from playing captain falcon. I find that with a lot of his game centering around techchasing, grab games and whatnot that he helps develop some of the skills lunin has outlined here. I main falco and fox most of the time but after picking up falcon and forcing myself to consciously pay attention to my opponent's patterns of behavior it has carried into my overall abilities. Playing a competitive falcon requires more thinking to get up to par with a good technical fox or falco (I'm not saying they don't require thought, but their technical advantages can carry you pretty far, so that you aren't forced to develop a strong mindset for a while).

Either way awesome post lunin, we should play sometime I've heard from a friend that used to go the Sacramento Biweeklies that you live in daly city, and I'm in SF not too far away/

This is the situation I used to be in. I eventually realized what I was doing and I'm playing much better!

 

[darkshy]

This is a great guide. Before you downsize size his theory (I'll call it that). To be good you need to evaluate the situation in any form as well as adapt. I mean let me use Ken. When he's in the final match for 11-ty million dollars, do you think is only going to play on impulse alone? Trust me I can see it alot when I watch the vids on YouTube. It works.

 

[xelad1]

everyone should check out the mookierah thread on observing your opponent too, helped me a lot.

 

[Professor Pro]

i think all of its true what u said but mostly its just expierence i think

 

[Ixninjax]

some ppl have limited access to ppl to play with, forcing yourself into this analytical mindset early in your smash career can help you progress much faster with what little competition you may have. Although your still going to have seek out other smashers and expose yourself to other styles of play, using this mindset you'll be able to understand new styles and how to defeat them much more quickly. Some smashers stay stuck on autopilot and never progress their skills regardless of their experience level. Sometimes mindgames just don't "click" with these ppl. Ppl say that things in this thread will simply come with experience, but why would you want to waste your own time when you could use this advice and get good right from the start?

 

[RBinator]

Bump, for great justice!

 

[SCOTU]

This is a hella good guide btw, LunIn. Great work.

 

[PIMPSLAP]

some ppl have limited access to ppl to play with, forcing yourself into this analytical mindset early in your smash career can help you progress much faster with what little competition you may have. Although your still going to have seek out other smashers and expose yourself to other styles of play, using this mindset you'll be able to understand new styles and how to defeat them much more quickly. Some smashers stay stuck on autopilot and never progress their skills regardless of their experience level. Sometimes mindgames just don't "click" with these ppl. Ppl say that things in this thread will simply come with experience, but why would you want to waste your own time when you could use this advice and get good right from the start?

wow true words i would be 6 times better now if i played people in my area like TGM sideffect and mouf or GABE but i don't so it's hard to learn these tactics against my friends.... thats why brawl will be awesome i mean awesome wifi i so call first match with ken j/k

 

[mikeHAZE]

"make yourself need to win."

-luninspectra 1988-2008

 

[Vodage]

Can u say robot

If you think about it enough, these all fit into what professional smashers do. The reasons these are all TRUE is because its only based upon 1 aspect :: Mind Games.

1) Prediction <--Can Ken/Isai/Chu/PC Predict you?
2) Case Constructions <--Does Ken/Isai/Chu/PC know your options?
3) Spontaneity <--Do Ken/Isai/Chu/PC always do what you expect?
4) Dynamic Reactions <--Do Ken/Isai/Chu/PC always respond the same way?
5) Patience <--Are Ken/Isai/Chu/PC stupid aggressive or smart agressive?
6) Unpredictability <--Can you predict Ken/Isai/Chu/PC easily?
7) Strong Mindset <--Do you think Ken/Isai/Chu/PC has a weak perception of smash?

I like how u left m2k out. If anyone is processing ratios and stats and the chance of what ur gonna do next during a match, it's him.

 

[Grunt]

This is 2006.
Ya know, like PC vs Ken stuff.

 

[Tee ay eye]

I like how u left m2k out. If anyone is processing ratios and stats and the chance of what ur gonna do next during a match, it's him.

Well, think about when he posted it. He made the post in mid 06; at that point, Mew2king was still REALLY GOOD, but I don't think he was held in such high regards as he is now. Mew2king is THE god of smash right now, and pretty much anyone who doesn't live under a rock (smash-wise) would (somewhat at least) agree with you on that, but I don't think he obtained this reputation until like, late 06-all 07.

 

[vinni57]

Wow! that was well thought out and put. I will try to keep some of those habits in mind when battling my friend, etc.