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[Dyllybirdy]

It's a dream come true.

ヒホ乱闘 pic.twitter.com/5QwLH9t2vN

— きくどん (@Kicdon_smash) June 9, 2019

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

It's a dream come true.

ヒホ乱闘 pic.twitter.com/5QwLH9t2vN

— きくどん (@Kicdon_smash) June 9, 2019

Link just wants to eat some curry pff

 

[SnakeFighter64]

It's a dream come true.

ヒホ乱闘 pic.twitter.com/5QwLH9t2vN

— きくどん (@Kicdon_smash) June 9, 2019

I want this. How much?

 

[Aurane]

He isn’t new. He’s been here before. Guess he created a new account and deleted his old one? Not sure.

He's new to me.

 

[Deleted member]

Not even close. Banjo isn't a relative unknown worldwide. Erdrick is an unknown in 2/3rds of the regions.

They're completely different situations. Banjo has nothing to overcome here. Erdrick does.

We're also talking about the JRPG phenomenon in Japan that would be able to cover the DLC sales in itself because of how big it is over there, ignoring any potential western sales. It regularly sells millions in Japan Identically, Banjo would be well received outside of Japan but would do poorly inside.

Also can someone or anybody provide sales for Banjo-Kazooie and Tooie for Europe? I can't find them for some reason.

idk if you can really compare the sales of a 2017 game to that of a 1998 game

That's a fair point, but then it goes into my second thought over how being a worldwide candidate means jack for Smash Bros:

Banjo was dead and his last real game was in 2008. How is that marketable to Japan?

 

[Knight Dude]

Found some nice fan-art.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Im egarly awating a demo for Dragon Quest Builders 2

 

[SnakeFighter64]

idk if you can really compare the sales of a 2017 game to that of a 1998 game

No. But you CAN compare the sales of a 1998 game with a 1988 game. Because remember, Erdrick specifically hasn’t been in a game since then. They haven’t even used him for crossover stuff like the Dragon Quest Heroes Games. Despite somehow being the most recognizable character from the franchise.

I still believe, just a tiny bit, in the idea of Luminary and that other girl from X (I think) being skins for him and her respectively.

 

[Deleted member]

No. But you CAN compare the sales of a 1998 game with a 1988 game. Because remember, Erdrick specifically hasn’t been in a game since then. They haven’t even used him for crossover stuff like the Dragon Quest Heroes Games. Despite somehow being the most recognizable character from the franchise.

I still believe, just a tiny bit, in the idea of Luminary and that other girl from X (I think) being skins for him and her respectively.

It's not true that he's not in crossovers. The Monster Battle Road games (granted, being jp only) feature all the series protagonists.
Outside of that he has made cameos in other DQ games, but any more detail on that would be spoiler territory.

 

[Aurane]

Im egarly awating a demo for Dragin Quest Builders 2

Dragin. Dragout. Dragin. Dragout.

It's the new waxing meme.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

I still want Erdrick to be voiced by Sean Schemmel in English and for female Erdrick to be voiced by Colleen Clickenbeard.

It's not true that he's not in crossovers. The Monster Battle Road games (granted, being jp only) feature all the series protagonists.
Outside of that he has made cameos in other DQ games, but any more detail on that would be spoiler territory.

Ok. Spoiler tag it or DM me. I don’t care about spoilers.

 

[BlueMonk]

We're also talking about the JRPG phenomenon in Japan that would be able to cover the DLC sales in itself because of how big it is over there, ignoring any potential western sales. It regularly sells millions in Japan Identically, Banjo would be well received outside of Japan but would do poorly inside.

Also can someone or anybody provide sales for Banjo-Kazooie and Tooie for Europe? I can't find them for some reason.


That's a fair point, but then it goes into my second thought over how being a worldwide candidate means jack for Smash Bros:

Banjo was dead and his last real game was in 2008. How is that marketable to Japan?

keep in mind that there are a lot less people in Japan. 400,000 is pitiful in the US, but actually pretty good in Japan. for comparison, fire emblem awakening sold around 455,000 it's first year in Japan, and that is undoubtedly a very popular game. Smash itself has sold around 13 million copies worldwide, around only 3 million of which come from Japan. In physical sales that is, I haven't found anything for digital.

 

[praline]

Im egarly awating a demo for Dragon Quest Builders 2

Yeah I hope there’s one!

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

It's not true that he's not in crossovers. The Monster Battle Road games (granted, being jp only) feature all the series protagonists.
Outside of that he has made cameos in other DQ games, but any more detail on that would be spoiler territory.

And that's the thing too. In the crossovers, they're JP only. They aren't promoting him as a crossover option in the West. That's telling that he's not as likely to be chosen as a face or character. They don't believe in him that much.

It also doesn't help that they aren't promoting the Heroes of any kind outside of JP crossovers. The idea we'd get Slime instead isn't all that unrealistic either.

Though I think Banjo is most likely Brave anyway at this point. Fits easily just as well.

 

[Deleted member]

I still want Erdrick to be voiced by Sean Schemmel in English and for female Erdrick to be voiced by Colleen Clickenbeard.



Ok. Spoiler tag it or DM me. I don’t care about spoilers.

I'll start with the non-spoiler stuff, such as his outfit appearing as an extra costume for the protagonists in Heroes 1.

Spoiler: Spoilers for DQ11

The main example I had in mind is DQ11's post credits scene after the true ending straight up being the intro to DQ3, with the hero's mom going to wake him up to see the king on his 16th birthday. The good ol' spiky hair is seen in bed before cutting to black.

 

[praline]

Frankly we should get the hero of 8 as the playable representation. His outfit was in Dragon Quest 11 out of any heroes.

Also anyone who thinks Dragon Quest doesn’t deserve to be in Smash needs to get help. Even if it’s not the biggest thing over here it still is influential to pretty much every rpg series that exists.

 

[Deleted member]

Regarding sales of BK and DQ, remember that comparisons are hard to do and in most cases come in DQ favor if only due to being a series with titles being constantly released on its 30 year history. Both DQVIII in 2004 and DQIX in 2009 surpassed a million units on the west and the DS port of DQVI surpassed Golden Sun Dark Dawn and Issac is one of the most popular characters in the fandom, which means that sales have little to do with online popularity. The closest I would think of an equivalent in the west for DQ sales/genre wise it would be Halo due to how predominant the FPS are here and the sales of both franchises being around the same. Popularity-wise is difficult to measure.

BK has a lot more limited appeal that people think of due to the most popular games being the N64 ones and anything after that never reaching the same level of popularity, people overestimate how well known the pair is but at the same time due to Joker and Bayo being in the game already there's nothing that says that the character must be a juggernaut to be in Smash Bros.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

I'll start with the non-spoiler stuff, such as his outfit appearing as an extra costume for the protagonists in Heroes 1.

Spoiler: Spoilers for DQ11

The main example I had in mind is DQ11's post credits scene after the true ending straight up being the intro to DQ3, with the hero's mom going to wake him up to see the king on his 16th birthday. The good ol' spiky hair is seen in bed before cutting to black.

Spoiler: Sooooo....

Dragon Quest 3 HD Remake?

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Everyone needs to play PQ2

Spoiler

 

[BlueMonk]

Frankly we should get the hero of 8 as the playable representation. His outfit was in Dragon Quest 11 out of any heroes.

Also anyone who thinks Dragon Quest doesn’t deserve to be in Smash needs to get help. Even if it’s not the biggest thing over here it still is influential to pretty much every rpg series that exists.

I'm not trying to say it doesn't "deserve" to be in smash. It's a very influential series with a large fanbase. All I'm trying to say is that it's status as a series that's largely only popular in Japan goes directly against what Sakurai has said in the past about what third parties get into smash.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I will say it one more time.

There’s no reason that Banjo coming at E3, if it ends up being the case, means Erdrick isn’t in. The Erdrick doubts are coming because one dude doubts it, despite several other people who have had information saying he’s still happening.

Not pointing fingers at anybody in particular, because it’s across the Smash fandom, but I would argue the biggest reason people are now doubting Erdrick, and immediately believing Banjo is in, is simply because they want Banjo, and are indifferent to/don’t want Erdrick.

For example, if it’s true that Erdrick is considered “hearsay” then what does that make Banjo? It makes Banjo the same exact thing, a character considered in the game entirely based on hearsay.

The difference is, more people in this particular community, and in this part of the world, have played Banjo-Kazooie and not Dragon Quest. They come across as more willing to accept Banjo than Erdrick, not because things make more sense for Banjo, but because they want to believe Banjo is in, and not Erdrick.

I get it, because we’ve all been there. But this anti-Erdrick stuff is silly.

Not saying insiders know everything. But I trust the people I know. Besides, Dragon Quest is massive in Japan. Square Enix wants to push it in the West. Considering Smash is huge everywhere, it’s a great opportunity to expose Dragon Quest to Smash, and add a legacy series.

There’s no downside.

EDIT: Not to say this is 1:1 the same as the Grinch leak, but the part that reminds me is that something some folks don’t want to believe is getting crapped on, while everyone flocks to the thing they want.

The other part is that “insiders are wrong!”, “they don’t know anything!”.

May I remind you all how that turned out, lol. I have the feeling Banjo is in, so i’m not telling you not to believe that. But it’s basically interesting to say, “Insiders saying Banjo is in are legit, but not when it comes to Erdrick.”

It’s hypocritical.

 

[Deleted member]

Spoiler: Sooooo....

Dragon Quest 3 HD Remake?

Spoiler

It could very well happen. Parts of DQ3 were actually remade in the development of 11 so the developers could test out the new engine. Horii also said that he'd like to do a remake but wants to focus on DQ12 for the time being

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

despite several other people who have had information saying he’s still happening.

Actually, just two really.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Actually, just two really.

And me.

That makes at least 3, and there are people who have heard the same.

Then there’s people who don’t say anything about it, but know it.

Verg says “Banjo is 99% in” so everybody thinks Banjo is in.

Verg says, “Erdrick is still in”. Fans say, “Hmm. I don’t know. I don’t think he is”.

The difference is people here find Banjo more hype.

Just because Shinobi didn’t say anything about Erdrick doesn’t mean he isn’t in. There’s no connection.

 

[Deleted member]

PETA Uses Wooloo To Spread Their Agenda But Gets Shot Down By Fans https://t.co/3wXAtgryCE pic.twitter.com/98PN7TOAOL

— NintendoSoup (@ninsoup) June 9, 2019

Serves them right.

 

[Wyoming]

Depends who brave is. If it is Banjo then Erdrick does lose a point that was argued for him.

What I find odd is how long it is taking from leak to reveal if it happens. I know the fighters pass was finalized months ago and they are slow onthe reveals but I find that fascinating.

I still think both are in regardless, although I wont say no to being completely blindsided and we get neither at E3.

 

[SneakyLink]

Is it weird I want Erdrick to be revealed at E3 just so the fans can finally move on from him/her?

I won’t say no to a Banjo reveal or even a complete surprise though.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

And me.

That makes at least 3, and there are people who have heard the same.

Then there’s people who don’t say anything about it, but know it.

Verg says “Banjo is 99% in” so everybody thinks Banjo is in.

Verg says, “Erdrick is still in”. Fans say, “Hmm. I don’t know. I don’t think he is”.

The difference is people here find Banjo more hype.

Just because Shinobi didn’t say anything about Erdrick doesn’t mean he isn’t in. There’s no connection.

So, are you supposed to be a leaker or something? Got a track record?

Also, let's not generalize people around what some may think of Vergeben, since Smasg DLC certainly doesn't revolve around the jerk currently.

it weird I want Erdrick to be revealed at E3 just so the fans can finally move on from him/her?

Speaking as an Erdrick supporter, admittedly the mantra of Erdrick supposedly bring inevitable based off non-concrete evidence has gotten annoying over the months.

 

[drag0nscythe]

PETA Uses Wooloo To Spread Their Agenda But Gets Shot Down By Fans https://t.co/3wXAtgryCE pic.twitter.com/98PN7TOAOL

— NintendoSoup (@ninsoup) June 9, 2019

Serves them right.

Ah peta. The perfect example of what happens when the far left loses its mind.

I hate peta. Does more harm then good.

 

[osby]

And me.

That makes at least 3, and there are people who have heard the same.

Then there’s people who don’t say anything about it, but know it.

Verg says “Banjo is 99% in” so everybody thinks Banjo is in.

Verg says, “Erdrick is still in”. Fans say, “Hmm. I don’t know. I don’t think he is”.

The difference is people here find Banjo more hype.

Just because Shinobi didn’t say anything about Erdrick doesn’t mean he isn’t in. There’s no connection.

This. People stopped believing Vergeben for a long time but now he's credible again for saying Banjo's in?

 

[Deleted member]

This. People stopped believing Vergeben for a long time but now he's credible again for saying Banjo's in?

Vergaben is full of hot crap if you ask me.

 

[Gentlepanda]

This. People stopped believing Vergeben for a long time but now he's credible again for saying Banjo's in?

every insider's a hack fraud unless they back a character i want in which case their track record is spotless

 

[Cutie Gwen]

VIZ MEDIA BLEEPED OUT THE MONA LISA LINE FOR KIRA. LET DC DOUGLAS SAY ****

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Depends who brave is. If it is Banjo then Erdrick does lose a point that was argued for him.

What I find odd is how long it is taking from leak to reveal if it happens. I know the fighters pass was finalized months ago and they are slow onthe reveals but I find that fascinating.

I still think both are in regardless, although I wont say no to being completely blindsided and we get neither at E3.

Brave was honestly the worst point for Erdrick too. It's an extremely vague codename when we have zero consistent patterns with the other codenames as is. There's no way to tell. Until we find out who Brave actually is, we don't even have a remote pattern for the actual Fighter's Pass DLC. Only Packun Flower was a straight codename. Not even Jack and Doyle are clearly connected to each other directly. One is a specific character name. The other could be multiple things tied to Joker. And that's ignoring Jane, as that was removed entirely, removing any consistency.

The codenames are likely not tied at all to any other ones and are just whatever they can find that quickly works as a fun idea. They don't have to beyond heavily tie to a character either. Just loosely is enough to work as a legitimate one. For an example, Cyrax and Sektor were known as Mustard and Ketchup. Literally nothing special beyond the same coloring. That's quite literally it. That's how loose it can be. Until we get Brave, which is pretty much fighter 72, as they were worked on the most after Jack, we have no idea what the hell the codename is trying to get at. We didn't know Jack or Doyle either. We had nothing on Jane yet till we had a theory Kasumi might've been her at one point, and for all we know, Jane was turned into a later MIi costume or separately downloadable Echo Fighter to be released later. We're lacking in information via the datamine bad.

Spoiler

The leakers at least have given us more concrete information in comparison. And it's still iffy on what's going on. Banjo in some way is coming, apparently to Smash. But that's specific to e3 with Shinobi's wording and context, along with Sakurai's. Erdrick could be coming at any point, but there's absolutely zero leakers saying he's coming towards e3 at all.

 

[BlueMonk]

I didn't even mean to start an erdrick vs banjo argument, I think Erdrick's in, just that the lack of worldwide appeal is a point against him

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

So, are you supposed to be a leaker or something? Got a track record?

Also, let's not generalize people around what some may think of Vergeben, since Smasg DLC certainly doesn't revolve around the jerk currently.


Speaking as an Erdrick supporter, admittedly the mantra of Erdrick supposedly bring inevitable based off non-concrete evidence has gotten annoying over the months.

I’m not a leaker. I simply have heard similar information from friends who have gotten leaks before.

There are also a few people here, in this very thread, who have heard the same information.

If there’s a real reason to doubt it, i’ll be right with some of the folks not thinking he’s in. But for now, there’s no reason to doubt Erdrick/Dragon Quest being in Smash via DLC.

 

[CosmicQuark]

I will say it one more time.

There’s no reason that Banjo coming at E3, if it ends up being the case, means Erdrick isn’t in. The Erdrick doubts are coming because one dude doubts it, despite several other people who have had information saying he’s still happening.

Not pointing fingers at anybody in particular, because it’s across the Smash fandom, but I would argue the biggest reason people are now doubting Erdrick, and immediately believing Banjo is in, is simply because they want Banjo, and are indifferent to/don’t want Erdrick.

For example, if it’s true that Erdrick is considered “hearsay” then what does that make Banjo? It makes Banjo the same exact thing, a character considered in the game entirely based on hearsay.

The difference is, more people in this particular community, and in this part of the world, have played Banjo-Kazooie and not Dragon Quest. They come across as more willing to accept Banjo than Erdrick, not because things make more sense for Banjo, but because they want to believe Banjo is in, and not Erdrick.

I get it, because we’ve all been there. But this anti-Erdrick stuff is silly.

Not saying insiders know everything. But I trust the people I know. Besides, Dragon Quest is massive in Japan. Square Enix wants to push it in the West. Considering Smash is huge everywhere, it’s a great opportunity to expose Dragon Quest to Smash, and add a legacy series.

There’s no downside.

EDIT: Not to say this is 1:1 the same as there Grinch leak, but the part that reminds me is that something some folks don’t want to believe is getting crapped on, while everyone flocks to the thing they want.

The other part is that “insiders are wrong!”, “they don’t know anything!”.

May I remind you all how that turned out, lol. I have the feeling Banjo is in, so i’m not telling you not to believe that. But it’s basically interesting to say, “Insiders saying Banjo is in are legit, but not when it comes to Erdrick.”

It’s hypocritical.

While the rumors circulating around Banjo & Kazooie have been the best indication they may be in, it's helpful to remind ourselves that they are still just rumors. Same with Erdrick. People should not mistake likely chances with certainty, which has recent history of ending in disappointment. It's special in Banjo & Kazooie's case because of how much of a pipe dream many thought it was not too long ago. It's a much further jump from virtually impossible to being considered likely, than in the case of Erdrick, going from possible to likely. And I think that huge change can inflate people's expectations regarding the duo's chances.

It's also been interesting seeing the flip with Erdrick and Banjo, despite both having similar evidence* (e.g., the word of insiders), especially since unlike Steve, they're not at odds with each other. Despite being a big fan, I'm still taking the possibility the insiders are mistaken, to lessen the shock if it's not true. And that's been difficult, especially given rational and otherwise skeptical insider's seeming consensus around Banjo. I wonder how much is because there's so much evidence in Banjo & Kazooie's favor, publicly and privately available, and how much of it is group think. We'll find out soon enough.

*It's remarkable how closely they align. Insiders: Verge for both Erdrick and Banjo, Tansut for Erdrick, Shinobi for Banjo. Speculative evidence: Datamined Brave for Erdrick, Datamined Rare spirits for Banjo. They mirror each other in a lot of ways.

 

[Deleted member]

Vergaben is full of hot crap if you ask me.

Vergeben is an ass I won't deny that but at the same time he gets legit info from time to time.

I didn't even mean to start an erdrick vs banjo argument, I think Erdrick's in, just that the lack of worldwide appeal is a point against him

Just like it was a point against Joker or Bayo?

Brave was honestly the worst point for Erdrick too. It's an extremely vague codename when we have zero consistent patterns with the other codenames as is. There's no way to tell. Until we find out who Brave actually is, we don't even have a remote pattern for the actual Fighter's Pass DLC. Only Packun Flower was a straight codename. Not even Jack and Doyle are clearly connected to each other directly. One is a specific character name. The other could be multiple things tied to Joker. And that's ignoring Jane, as that was removed entirely, removing any consistency.

The codenames are likely not tied at all to any other ones and are just whatever they can find that quickly works as a fun idea. They don't have to beyond heavily tie to a character either. Just loosely is enough to work as a legitimate one. For an example, Cyrax and Sektor were known as Mustard and Ketchup. Literally nothing special beyond the same coloring. That's quite literally it. That's how loose it can be. Until we get Brave, which is pretty much fighter 72, as they were worked on the most after Jack, we have no idea what the hell the codename is trying to get at. We didn't know Jack or Doyle either. We had nothing on Jane yet till we had a theory Kasumi might've been her at one point, and for all we know, Jane was turned into a later MIi costume or separately downloadable Echo Fighter to be released later. We're lacking in information via the datamine bad.

Spoiler

The leakers at least have given us more concrete information in comparison. And it's still iffy on what's going on. Banjo in some way is coming, apparently to Smash. But that's specific to e3 with Shinobi's wording and context, along with Sakurai's. Erdrick could be coming at any point, but there's absolutely zero leakers saying he's coming towards e3 at all.

One thing is how Smash handles codenames and other is how MK handles them. Brave can be used as a noun and is used in the translation from Japanese to English for Yuusha, Jack and Doyle only need to be linked to Joker and Arsene respectively. Jack can be used with Joker in a couple of ways like card suites, one of the multiple aliases of DC's Joker (Jack Napier) or Actor allusion (Jack Nicholson) and Doyle for Arthur Conan Doyle. Codenames are not meant to be found and it could be something simple or something complex but it all depends on the perception of whom makes them.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

I know you guys are talking about Erdrick for the thousandth time but I want to show everyone that the interactions between Yu and Ren are amazing and we need more of it

Spoiler

 

[Opossum]

Believing that Banjo is Brave instead of Erdrick is baffling to me.

Erdrick's literally called the Brave. If the Banjo=Brave argument comes down to "uhhhh Banjo is pretty brave" then that's straw grasping, as that can be said of practically any video game character ever.

I think both Erdrick and Banjo are in, but thinking that Brave is Banjo is ludicrous imo.