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[BlueMonk]

So I like Awakening. It was my first FE game, I put 100s of hours into it, and Chrom will always have a special place in my heart.

But 1) We already have a FE echo in the form of Lucina. Who thought it was a good idea to make another one?

2) Why pick Chrom as an echo? Like if we needed another FE echo, I'd rather have Lyn or Black Knight to represent other games from the series. Awakening already has two reps.

It bothers me as a fan of the series and Smash Bros.

I think they put him in just cause people wanted him and he was easy to add

 

[Wario Bros.]

Fill me in: What does it mean when a thread is "Temporary"?

 

[Guynamednelson]

I don't deny that. I'm saying Chrom as an echo bothers me. If he was a unique fighter, it would be nowhere near as bothersome, but I'd rather have an echo for a series that wasn't represented yet.

Echoes aren't about balancing the roster.

 

[Deleted member]

Because he's the main character and Roy's moveset fits him better anyway.

Look, saying he got Roy's moveset isn't a plus when Roy is already a semi-clone of Marth. I agree that having both protags from Awakening is cool though.

Neither had a fighter-ready model nor could they really work as an echo, unless Ike didn't drift away from being a true mighty glacier.

That's fair, but I'd rather have another series to have an echo instead of FE at that point, like I said.

 

[Noipoi]

Fill me in: What does it mean when a thread is "Temporary"?

Four months ago it meant we’d go back to the old thread in a week.

Now it means whatever you want it to mean!

 

[Gentlepanda]

Fill me in: What does it mean when a thread is "Temporary"?

it means, like all living things, it will eventually fade away into nothingness

 

[BlueMonk]

Fill me in: What does it mean when a thread is "Temporary"?

this thread is in danger of being destroyed at any given time

 

[Kirby Dragons]

If the rest of the DLC is mostly first-parties, then maybe (it's a big maybe) I'd accept another FE or Pokémon rep. But those series have been treated almost like kings in the past two games, so they could use a break. Plus, characters from other series have been in the running for a lot longer, with more fan support behind them.

 

[Deleted member]

I think they put him in just cause people wanted him and he was easy to add

Fair enough, but that doesn't make me like him.

Echoes aren't about balancing the roster.

I know. They're a cheap way to get fan requested characters on the roster. Doesn't mean another series having an echo instead of FE is a bad idea

 

[Cosmic77]

I don't deny that. I'm saying Chrom as an echo bothers me. If he was a unique fighter, it would be nowhere near as bothersome, but I'd rather have an echo for a series that wasn't represented yet.

I kind of agree.

And if we absolutely had to get another FE Echo, I would've preferred they made an Echo of someone besides Roy. I don't think Roy had enough differences from Marth to warrant getting an Echo over someone like Robin or Ike.

 

[Opossum]

I kind of agree.

And if we absolutely had to get another FE Echo, I would've preferred they made an Echo of someone besides Roy. I don't think Roy had enough differences from Marth to warrant getting an Echo over someone like Robin or Ike.

At the same time, people really understate how many differences there are between Marth and Roy. Literally half their attacks are totally different while their stats are completely different.

 

[Tako Tuesday]

These two thumbnails look suspiciously similar

I'm subbed to both of them, so I was really confused for a moment, as I thought they were the same video.

 

[Deleted member]

I kind of agree.

And if we absolutely had to get another FE Echo, I would've preferred they made an Echo of someone besides Roy. I don't think Roy had enough differences from Marth to warrant getting an Echo over someone like Robin or Ike.

Like they made the assets for Black Knight right? He would have been cool as an echo even if Chrom is more recignizable. Ike and BK are practically two sides of the same coin in Tellius duology so it makes sense and it would get us a villain in Smash.

Anyways, that's my rant for the day.

 

[Wunderwaft]

I have nothing to add to the FE discussion currently happening besides saying I want Dimitri and Lyn in Smash.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

So I like Awakening. It was my first FE game, I put 100s of hours into it, and Chrom will always have a special place in my heart.

But 1) We already have a FE echo in the form of Lucina. Who thought it was a good idea to make another one?

2) Why pick Chrom as an echo? Like if we needed another FE echo, I'd rather have Lyn or Black Knight to represent other games from the series. Awakening already has two reps.

It bothers me as a fan of the series and Smash Bros.

Chrom got in because, frankly, people asked for him. It was easier to make an echo that answered demand than it did to spend time on a unique character.

I’m working on a visual in roster maker to show what/who I think is in the running for any additional spots on the roster. This includes both First and Third party characters.

I don’t think First party characters are impossible. I simply think 3rd parties have more reach, do more to make it the “Ultimate” character game, and hit that record. That said, I’d say there’s a handful of 1st parties I could see added.

However, I don’t consider anyone who is a spirit or AT in the running whatsoever.

This is the type of thing that I will get flak for. But my feeling is that if Sakurai made a character in a role, it’s because he wanted them in that role. If he wanted to make Waluigi playable in Ultimate, then Waluigi would have been playable in Ultimate. That’s how I see it. It’s also how I see Spirits. Sakurai could add literally 10 quality characters without even touching characters already in the game.

Are there characters that are spirits and have demand? Yes, that can’t be denied. But they aren’t the only characters with demand.

Basically, I’d say Astral Chain, Sword & Shield, and Three Houses would have the best shot. Rex I could see, but he’s a spirit and Mii Costume.

I’ll maybe finish the visual later for what I could see, and upload it with rationale included. Depends on if I take a break from whatever I end up playing.

 

[Deleted member]

At the same time, people really understate how many differences there are between Marth and Roy. Literally half their attacks are totally different while their stats are completely different.

Look unless they revamped Roy's moveset like Link, I don't really think anything changes how he feels like a heavier Marth because that's literally how he was designed in Melee.

Hell nothing changes how there are three Links in Smash.

 

[Wademan94]

I kind of agree.

And if we absolutely had to get another FE Echo, I would've preferred they made an Echo of someone besides Roy. I don't think Roy had enough differences from Marth to warrant getting an Echo over someone like Robin or Ike.

Maybe Chrom should’ve been Ike’s echo with Roy’s neutral special?

 

[Dyllybirdy]

These two thumbnails look suspiciously similar

I'm subbed to both of them, so I was really confused for a moment, as I thought they were the same video.

Poor Banjo lol.

as sakurai would say, a "poor soul"

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

I just got cast to voice in an animated short as this little guy.

 

[Shadowwolflink]

Isn't Chrom, like Ken, one of the characters that pushes the boundaries on what an echo is? Like, Lucina, Daisy, and Richter are essentially cut and pasted onto a different model with a tweaked property or 2. Chrom feels pretty different from Roy to me.

 

[Deleted member]

Chrom got in because, frankly, people asked for him. It was easier to make an echo that answered demand than it did to spend time on a unique character.

Again, I never denied why Chrom was in. He's just in and I don't like how he works.

 

[Cosmic77]

At the same time, people really understate how many differences there are between Marth and Roy. Literally half their attacks are totally different while their stats are completely different.

I wouldn't say "totally different". A majority of their moves function very similarly, like their Smash attacks and specials.

Regardless, I think making an Echo of any semi-clone is a questionable decision, especially if the character the semi-clone was derived from already has an Echo.

I'm glad Chrom's supporters got their character, but I'll never consider it a practical decision on Sakurai's part. Just my opinion.

 

[Wunderwaft]

However, I don’t consider anyone who is a spirit or AT in the running whatsoever.

This is the type of thing that I will get flak for. But my feeling is that if Sakurai made a character in a role, it’s because he wanted them in that role. If he wanted to make Waluigi playable in Ultimate, then Waluigi would have been playable in Ultimate. That’s how I see it. It’s also how I see Spirits. Sakurai could add literally 10 quality characters without even touching characters already in the game.

Is it really that hard to believe Sakurai might change his mind on a character?
The project plan was finalized in 2015/2016. It's possible he might have changed his mind since then after he saw all the craze and demand for Waluigi after his AT reveal.

 

[Gentlepanda]

However, I don’t consider anyone who is a spirit or AT in the running whatsoever.

This is the type of thing that I will get flak for. But my feeling is that if Sakurai made a character in a role, it’s because he wanted them in that role. If he wanted to make Waluigi playable in Ultimate, then Waluigi would have been playable in Ultimate. That’s how I see it. It’s also how I see Spirits. Sakurai could add literally 10 quality characters without even touching characters already in the game.

feel like it's worth noting that to sakurai, ATs/spirits are that character being 'in' smash - from the way he's spoken in directs to interviews, he considers participation in any form (assists or as spirit teams) as 'joining the battle' just the same as the playable fighters

so while he could prove me wrong about 'promotions', i don't think it's happening because in his mind they're already in

 

[Deleted member]

feel like it's worth noting that to sakurai, ATs/spirits are that character being 'in' smash - from the way he's spoken in directs to interviews, he considers participation in any form (assists or as spirit teams) as 'joining the battle' just the same as the playable fighters

so while he could prove me wrong about 'promotions', i don't think it's happening because in his mind they're already in

Tbh he did say that before he realized his soul was sold to more DLC. I'd say anything he said beforehand is off the table.

 

[Zinith]

There's still wiggle room with Spirits that are VARIANTS of characters

 

[Opossum]

I wouldn't say "totally different". A majority of their moves function very similarly, like their Smash attacks and specials.

Regardless, I think making an Echo of any semi-clone is a questionable decision, especially if the character the semi-clone was derived from already has an Echo.

I'm glad Chrom's supporters got their character, but I'll never consider it a practical decision on Sakurai's part. Just my opinion.

Marth and Roy's only shared smash attack is their down smash though.

 

[Deleted member]

Marth and Roy's only shared smash attack is their down smash though.

You can tell me the properties of Marth and Roy's swords are different, but you'll never convince me it's not just two dudes swinging their swords in very similar motions. Not everybody studies the comptetive scene to care about this.

 

[Shadowwolflink]

I just got cast to voice in an animated short as this little guy.
View attachment 237242

Do you ever watch Achievement Hunter videos? I hear Michael's "baby" voice when I see that picture.

Also,

Conglaturation !!!
You have compelted a great game(hiring process).
And prooved the justice of our culture.
Now go and rest our hero !

 

[Cosmic77]

I couldn't tell you what this means for ATs and Spirits.

For now though, both sides should be careful. I think we should all acknowledge that it's not impossible and could very well happen, but also keep our expectations low since there's nothing to confirm that they're still in the running either.

 

[Slime Master]

Isn't Chrom, like Ken, one of the characters that pushes the boundaries on what an echo is? Like, Lucina, Daisy, and Richter are essentially cut and pasted onto a different model with a tweaked property or 2. Chrom feels pretty different from Roy to me.

He's slightly more different from those you mentioned because of up-B and slight animation tweaks so he's not holding his sword in reverse grip, but he's nowhere near Ken's level of difference. He'd certainly be used as an example of pushing the limits if Ken didn't exist though.

 

[Deleted member]

I couldn't tell you what this means for ATs and Spirits.

For now though, both sides should be careful. I think we should all acknowledge that it's not impossible and could very well happen, but also keep our expectations low since there's nothing to confirm that they're still in the running either.

Assist trophies sound debunked. I think them actively already being "characters" is pretty hard to justify their chances.

Spirits function more like trophies and stickers, and Smash 4 showed us why this doesn't harm a characters chances (Mewtwo).

 

[BlueMonk]

Chrom got in because, frankly, people asked for him. It was easier to make an echo that answered demand than it did to spend time on a unique character.

I’m working on a visual in roster maker to show what/who I think is in the running for any additional spots on the roster. This includes both First and Third party characters.

I don’t think First party characters are impossible. I simply think 3rd parties have more reach, do more to make it the “Ultimate” character game, and hit that record. That said, I’d say there’s a handful of 1st parties I could see added.

However, I don’t consider anyone who is a spirit or AT in the running whatsoever.

This is the type of thing that I will get flak for. But my feeling is that if Sakurai made a character in a role, it’s because he wanted them in that role. If he wanted to make Waluigi playable in Ultimate, then Waluigi would have been playable in Ultimate. That’s how I see it. It’s also how I see Spirits. Sakurai could add literally 10 quality characters without even touching characters already in the game.

Are there characters that are spirits and have demand? Yes, that can’t be denied. But they aren’t the only characters with demand.

Basically, I’d say Astral Chain, Sword & Shield, and Three Houses would have the best shot. Rex I could see, but he’s a spirit and Mii Costume.

I’ll maybe finish the visual later for what I could see, and upload it with rationale included. Depends on if I take a break from whatever I end up playing.

Personally I feel like spirits at the very least won't deconfirm for this second pass or whatever, I thought so for the first pass but I think its entirely possible he could have changed his mind on some characters at this point.

 

[Arcanir]

Like they made the assets for Black Knight right? He would have been cool as an echo even if Chrom is more recignizable. Ike and BK are practically two sides of the same coin in Tellius duology so it makes sense and it would get us a villain in Smash.

Anyways, that's my rant for the day.

I feel the big thing with BK is that he probably required a few too many changes. His AT gives the impression that they probably would've designed him as a super heavyweight with slower speed and other similar parameter tweaks, and considering even Ken didn't have that many they probably opted against him.

Personally I would've loved to see BK as well, but I can understand that he may've just not been feasible for the team to do with the resources they had.

 

[Kirby Dragons]

Speaking of , it will always bug me that he's playable despite being in 's Final Smash. They at least could've had Pair Up use another Awakening character when Chrom is in the battle.

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

Do you ever watch Achievement Hunter videos? I hear Michael's "baby" voice when I see that picture.

Also,

Conglaturation !!!
You have compelted a great game(hiring process).
And prooved the justice of our culture.
Now go and rest our hero !

This is the first time I have heard of it.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

You don't honestly think someone like Edelgard, Dimitri, or Claude would play anything like the existing Fire Emblem characters, do you? None of them even use swords.

Even Byleth wouldn't. Despite using a sword they'd be closer to Simon than Marth.

A lot of this post screams of ignorance tbh.

I haven’t played three houses. Nor do I intend to. It’s not my cup of tea in gameplay, setting, or aesthetic. He’s done Fire Emblem 7 other times. I wanna see something new. Not just a new weapon. A new thing period.

I think you might as well say that you don't want any more first-party characters. You haven't outright said it, but everything you've said seems to imply that.

Nothing wrong with feeling that way, but your arguments aren't making much sense.

Wonderful 101
Eternal Darkness: Sanity’s Requiem
Astral Chain
Dillon’s Rollin Western
Rhythm Heaven.
Mysterious Murasame Castle
Golden Sun
Arms
Devils World
Famicom Detective Club
Mach Rider

Plenty of new toys to play with without needing to raid someone else’s toy box. And without breaking out the same playset for the eighth time. I don’t care what be excessories you bought. I wanna play with something else.

I’m gonna run this analogy into the GROUND

Zelda and Mario, I feel, should be considered effectively off the table. Especially Zelda. Like, it's Zelda. We've seen what he can do with that series. Best to move on. Could characters from these franchises be added in future smaller games? Sure. But not here.

Well yeah. This is true too. Well, at least for Mario. Maybe not Zelda. But definitely Mario.

Forgot about Geno. Damn it.

Pokemon, maybe

Three Houses is a hard disagree. That game is way different from your average FE experience and has a lot of new things Sakurai can implement.

All four lords have severely unique traits that separste them from each other and previous lords from the series.

Like what? A different protagonist with a different personality? A new weapon? Not enough. Because it’s still Fire Emblem.

 

[Deleted member]

I couldn't tell you what this means for ATs and Spirits.

For now though, both sides should be careful. I think we should all acknowledge that it's not impossible and could very well happen, but also keep our expectations low since there's nothing to confirm that they're still in the running either.

Assist trophies sound debunked. I think them actively already being "characters" is pretty hard to justify their chances.

Spirits function more like trophies and stickers, and Smash 4 showed us why this

I feel the big thing with BK is that he probably required a few too many changes. His AT gives the impression that they probably would've designed him as a super heavyweight with slower speed and other similar parameter tweaks, and considering even Ken didn't have that many they probably opted against him.

Personally I would've loved to see BK as well, but I can understand that he may've just not been feasible for the team to do with the resources they had.

Functionally, Dark Samus is nowhere close to fighting like Samus in Metroid Prime or even as an Assist Trophy (Smash 4), but they took liberties and I'm fine with that. A character in Black Knight's game commented how he moves surprisingly fast in that armor and its totally unfair, so I can see him being a slightly slower Ike.

Like what? A different protagonist with a different personality? A new weapon? Not enough. Because it’s still Fire Emblem.

At that point, you might as well just judge their skin color holy crap. How does it being from Fire Emblem objectively matter when you admit to knowing jack **** about the series?

Speaking of , it will always bug me that he's playable despite being in 's Final Smash. They at least could've had Pair Up use another Awakening character when Chrom is in the battle.

Robin should have summoned Grima for his final smash. That **** would have been lit.

 

[SnakeFighter64]

I just had a thought. You know how Sonic does a twitter takeover every time a new game releases? What if they did one for Mario and Sonic at the Olympics with Charles Martinet? Nintendo would never let it happen. But it would be very cool.

 

[Wademan94]

Can we get an F in the chat for Sans?

There was a problem fetching the tweet

His time was short lived.