So why is Lylat considered a bad stage for Diddy?

[Player-1]

I've been playing Lylat a bit more recently, and I think it's a really good stage for Diddy. Obviously, I wouldn't use this stage on characters like MK, Snake, Marth, etc. I know Le Thien thinks well of this stage if I remember correctly.

Just some advantages I notice on this stage:

-Because of the tilt, it's easier to get tech chases going, grabs (especially bthrow) is easy to get that 'stage smacked' affect and start tech chasing. Bananas also make it easier and once you get to tech chasing, the bananas extend it.

-You have multitudes of angles you can shoot your barrels at unlike Fox, Falco, and Wolf who don't have as much control over their up-b so it's easier to gimp certain characters.

-The new instant ground throw and z catching **** on this stage and it's easy to mindgame people with it.

-Lylat destroys most camping and some spamming,

-Gives Diddy more approach options.

-Peanut gimps are easier to land and can crew people up on the stage if they're camping platforms.


To me, Lylat is what BF is to FD, but instead of FD, it's Lylat to BF. Battlefield is a VERY good stage for Diddy against a lot of the cast and it can be MUCH better than FD. Same thing for Lylat, Lylat is VERY good stage for Diddy against SOME of the cast and it can be MUCH better than BF. Your opinion?

-Utilt juggling is easier to land and more effective because of how small the stage is and the platforms, you can also Utilt them onto platforms and tech chasing once they get too much knockback and plop up on the platform above

 

[ADHD]

BC IT SUCKS. Recovery gimps... by the stage alone, thats pretty lame you gotta admit. Second, the little curved edges on the stage make the banana game a little more limited, platform tricks can only go so far. It's just a generally bad stage, i can't nail the exact reason but I always do horrible on this place.

 

[Player-1]

BC IT SUCKS. Recovery gimps... by the stage alone, thats pretty lame you gotta admit. Second, the little curved edges on the stage make the banana game a little more limited, platform tricks can only go so far. It's just a generally bad stage, i can't nail the exact reason but I always do horrible on this place.

Yes, but most of the cast don't have as good as a recovery as Diddy. I'm going to say 80% of the cast have a bigger disadvantage of being gimped than Diddy. Curved edges? If you mean the tilts, I just mentioned that banana game ***** for tech chasing when you're playing on the lower-tilted part of the stage. Yes the platform tricks are limited but it's not that bad. Maybe it's just you if you do bad on the stage.

 

[Luigi player]

The worst things are that some characters do REALLY well here, the edge sucks and the tilting can stop bananas. The platforms can also be annoying...

 

[Player-1]

The worst things is that some characters do REALLY well here, the edge sucks and the tilting can stop bananas. The platforms can also be annoying...

....Right, I just nullified every thing you said with the first post

 

[ADHD]

....Right, I just nullified every thing you said with the first post

Your tactic was naner-less diddy? You'd get destroyed by metaknights and robs that cp you to that stage NOT CONVINCED, btw ur face player 1.

 

[Player-1]

Your tactic was naner-less diddy? You'd get destroyed by metaknights and robs that cp you to that stage NOT CONVINCED, btw ur face player 1.

No, I was just playing you that way for fun. your face

 

[ADHD]

No, I was just playing you that way for fun. your face

orly, then what was the point other than your face

 

[iRjOn]

Lylat is all right imo I guess its an aquired likeing for the stage.
Once you learn what screening the stage tilts on and which side tilts then it'll become better.

I personally haven't done this but I will one day...

 

[ADHD]

I'm coming to the conclusion that this is diddy's worst stage. I realized brinstar and RC are good stages for diddy once you learn to fight there after alot of practice, but lylat is just naturally a sucky stage for diddy and I have no idea why. I do so horrible on this stage compared to EVERY single other stage on the stage list. I do better on LM, or norfair compared to lylat. I don't get it lol.

 

[white peachy]

How do you play on rainbow cruise with Diddy? Use more flip kick?
I just switch to Donkey Kong or Snake if I get cp'ed there.

 

[pastaboy]

because the middle platform is on the same level as the other ones, its like battlefield but better. more shorthop z catching ftw.

 

[Le_THieN]

The most common strand of complaint that Lylat Cruise receives as criticism is that this stage is supposedly "bad" for Diddy's recovery, yet I have seen more players (and definitely a greater variety of characters) gimp themselves in tournament on Pokemon Stadium #1 by a thousandfold. The reason for this is because PS1's ledges have significantly smaller edges, which in turn also makes the auto-snapping area effect much smaller. I've seen virtually every single type of vertical recovery get trapped underneath those ledges, and I've seen all sorts of horizontal recoveries breeze past auto-snapping range, even though most characters definitely look like they're at least touching the stage upon replay review.

Lylat, in the very least, has the benefit of having bigger-than-normal auto-snap ledges. I enjoy taking ROBs, MKs, Falcos and Olimars to this stage for various reasons. That, and it's also essentially Final Destination with three platforms. It really doesn't get much better than that if you operate in this frame of reference.

 

[DUB]

I'm coming to the conclusion that this is diddy's worst stage. I realized brinstar and RC are good stages for diddy once you learn to fight there after alot of practice, but lylat is just naturally a sucky stage for diddy and I have no idea why. I do so horrible on this stage compared to EVERY single other stage on the stage list. I do better on LM, or norfair compared to lylat. I don't get it lol.

Brinstar, good?
Cruise, good?
Lylat, bad?

I can agree there is things Diddy can do on RC and Brinstar and LM and NOrfair but seriously, they are not good stages. What ever happened to the neutral with little or no platforms being Diddy's best stages. Don't give a stage too much credit. The majority of the stages in Brawl are less favorable to Diddy.

 

[illinialex24]

This stage destroys any items, because they fall off due to the tilt. It also rotates around from a very aiming based recovery, so that can cause you to hit the platform and die. Finally, the platforms screw with small projectile spammers.....

Sound like anyone we known?

 

[DelxDoom]

I find Lylat to be a huge player preference stage.

To be successful here, the player must feel the tilt of the stage, and learn how to recover. There are a couple of tricks you can't do, and there are different available.

General tip is to stay on the lower tilt of the stage, and just own in general with tech chasing.

 

[DFEAR]

i find this stage to be my bst stage no matter the character o-o maybe diddy is at a disadvantage here but i think it leans more towards the players take on the stage itself. i say go lylat. more or less the reason to use these stages were obvious to player1 so why not take the opportunity and master it o-o

 

[ADHD]

I don't know, I play horrible on this stage no matter what I do or against any character. I'm just banning it, w/e. Brinstar is fairly good, diddy's got a great air game and his projectiles are really good on that stage with a little bit of creativity. Lylat is my worst stage, so I plan to never play there in a tourney. By the way RC is one of diddy's best stages.

 

[Kaptain Kong]

really, rainbow cruise? i can never use naners on rc, why is diddy good there

 

[chimpact]

RC is a good stage, but it is really high risk high reward. A kirby cp'd me there in a tourney and I did fairly well. I was up 2 stocks with 25% to his 1 stock. And I thought I could take him. But you have to really careful when the level is scrolling. If you don't have a banana in your hand (to make your opponent more cautious/Make him retreat) you could potentially lose a stock at really low %. When I didn't have a banana in my hand, I died from a Fsmash (to the left) when the stage was scrolling to the right. I eventually won the match, but I thought I would win much easier considering how much I was up.

I love when the stage is scrolling down because I banana to bthrow so they get stuck up there and get sky KO'd while I go back to the ship. It's great. It's pretty much a free KO.

 

[ADHD]

RC is a good stage, but it is really high risk high reward. A kirby cp'd me there in a tourney and I did fairly well. I was up 2 stocks with 25% to his 1 stock. And I thought I could take him. But you have to really careful when the level is scrolling. If you don't have a banana in your hand (to make your opponent more cautious/Make him retreat) you could potentially lose a stock at really low %. When I didn't have a banana in my hand, I died from a Fsmash (to the left) when the stage was scrolling to the right. I eventually won the match, but I thought I would win much easier considering how much I was up.

I love when the stage is scrolling down because I banana to bthrow so they get stuck up there and get sky KO'd while I go back to the ship. It's great. It's pretty much a free KO.

Just don't sd, don't make mistakes, and use your projectiles wisely and you'll beast.

 

[chimpact]

Just don't sd, don't make mistakes, and use your projectiles wisely and you'll beast.

Easier said than done.

Most opponent's SD more times in RC than diddy though.

 

[Player-1]

Rainbow is NOT one Diddy's best stages, it's a good stage for him when played right, but definitvely not one of his best stages. I would NEVER CP a Kirby or MK there in a tournament match, of course you can beat them, but you have a higher chance for mistake than they do, and when it comes to brawl, it seems that the player who makes the least wins.

 

[Le_THieN]

Just don't sd, don't make mistakes, and use your projectiles wisely and you'll beast.

LOL, this is kind of a silly statement which is universally applicable to all stages.

Rainbow is NOT one Diddy's best stages, it's a good stage for him when played right, but definitvely not one of his best stages. I would NEVER CP a Kirby or MK there in a tournament match, of course you can beat them, but you have a higher chance for mistake than they do, and when it comes to brawl, it seems that the player who makes the least wins.

Agreed.

 

[ADHD]

LOL, this is kind of a silly statement which is universally applicable to all stages.



Agreed.

Yes, but it works so I will repeat it because its been working since the beginning of smash thien Just don't sd, and use your projectiles wisely. Diddy is good in the air, and is decent on the ground. On rainbow cruise or brinstar you'll practically be dealing in the air as much as on the ground, and opponents are not grounded ever that cp you there. He's fairly good. Same for brinstar. It takes alot of practice, but it's worth it. Nobody can cp me to a stage with me being unprepared. I don't care if nobody here believes me about brinstar or RC. I have a harder time on lylat than any other stage for some odd reason, so I'm just going to ban it.

 

[Player-1]

I don't care if nobody here believes me about brinstar or RC.

It's just fact that these aren't Diddy's best stages, you can be better on these stages than FD, it depends on who you are, but it's still fact that those stages aren't his best, but whatever works for you, good luck CPing MKs to RC and DKs to Brinstar.

 

[Le_THieN]

Yes, but it works so I will repeat it because its been working since the beginning of smash thien Just don't sd, and use your projectiles wisely. Diddy is good in the air, and is decent on the ground. On rainbow cruise or brinstar you'll practically be dealing in the air as much as on the ground, and opponents are not grounded ever that cp you there. He's fairly good. Same for brinstar. It takes alot of practice, but it's worth it. Nobody can cp me to a stage with me being unprepared. I don't care if nobody here believes me about brinstar or RC. I have a harder time on lylat than any other stage for some odd reason, so I'm just going to ban it.

That's fine. I'm not saying it's bad advice, but it is somewhat vague and generalized to the point that there would be no possible way for an imperfect player like myself to live by such a statement literally. And I'm also not doubting that your comfort level on stages like Rainbow Cruise and Brinstar, but I will logistically argue that a more static and even-keeled stage like Lylat Cruise will be more likely to yield Diddy mains the victory. I don't mind fighting on either if I have to, but there's no way in hell I would ever actively counter-pick against pro-caliber players like M2K or Dojo with either of those stages.

If you have figured out a foolproof strategy to dispatch of Meta Knights of all skill levels on Rainbow Cruise, then I'd love to hear how it works. I'm not saying that such a methodology doesn't exist, but I can't piece together what you could possibly do on a jump-demanding stage against indisputably the best aerial character in the game. Otherwise, I will stick to to my ground-based game on neutrals or static counter-picks.

 

[ADHD]

That's fine. I'm not saying it's bad advice, but it is somewhat vague and generalized to the point that there would be no possible way for an imperfect player like myself to live by such a statement literally. And I'm also not doubting that your comfort level on stages like Rainbow Cruise and Brinstar, but I will logistically argue that a more static and even-keeled stage like Lylat Cruise will be more likely to yield Diddy mains the victory. I don't mind fighting on either if I have to, but there's no way in hell I would ever actively counter-pick against pro-caliber players like M2K or Dojo with either of those stages.

If you have figured out a foolproof strategy to dispatch of Meta Knights of all skill levels on Rainbow Cruise, then I'd love to hear how it works. I'm not saying that such a methodology doesn't exist, but I can't piece together what you could possibly do on a jump-demanding stage against indisputably the best aerial character in the game. Otherwise, I will stick to to my ground-based game on neutrals or static counter-picks.

That's fine, I'm comfortable with saying you can beat alot of players who cp you to that stage and maybe many of the better players. Eventually someone as you say pro-caliber may cp you to brinstar, maybe you won't beat them but it would be better you put up a great fight than not, right? Maybe I said "best" somewhere, but I rephrase that if I did. I mean good stages, because he can pull his own weight against metas, warios, and I'm even going to dare to say Game and Watches on brinstar or rainbow cruise. I have beaten decent game and watches who brought me to RC before. Btw you main kirby?

 

[Player-1]

That's fine, I'm comfortable with saying you can beat alot of players who cp you to that stage and maybe many of the better players. Eventually someone as you say pro-caliber may cp you to brinstar, maybe you won't beat them but it would be better you put up a great fight than not, right? Maybe I said "best" somewhere, but I rephrase that if I did. I mean good stages, because he can pull his own weight against metas, warios, and I'm even going to dare to say Game and Watches on brinstar or rainbow cruise. I have beaten decent game and watches who brought me to RC before. Btw you main kirby?

You said best....then I said good....then Thien agreed with me....so we're agruing with eacch other over nothing. I probably shouldn 't be speaking for Thien, but he never said that he wasn't comfortable on it or that he wasn't good on either stage. Yes I think Diddy can pull his weight on any stage, the way I see it, Diddy has no impossible match-ups or impossible stages. The only thing I fear againt MK is the MK player Uthrowing me and killing me like at 7% damage but the thing is, no MK does that to me =/. I, personally, feel comfortable playing on any stage, and not to be egotistical, but I believe I was the first Diddy mainer to actually come out and say (with evidence supporting me) that Diddy is beast on RC, and I'm even against being as great as you're putting it to be.


Look...the point is....Diddy **** on LC. Oh and Thien, I'd never bring ROB to LC because it's one of hist best stages, even a camping ROB. BF would be much better.

 

[Vyse]

I've always liked Lylat cruise. Ever since I watched NinjaLink beat that wolf on Lylat I've thought this. It's a good stage, Z-catching platform'd bananas really works. I feel like I can really work the stage while my opponent is trying to come to grips with a stage that's sorta all over the place. It just adds to Diddy's ability to lock an opponent down.

I don't think I've ever counter picked it though.

 

[AlphaZealot]

If I didn't have a habit of getting gimped/killing myself (by side-bing under the stage) then I would love this stage. If.

 

[ADHD]

I've always liked Lylat cruise. Ever since I watched NinjaLink beat that wolf on Lylat I've thought this. It's a good stage, Z-catching platform'd bananas really works. I feel like I can really work the stage while my opponent is trying to come to grips with a stage that's sorta all over the place. It just adds to Diddy's ability to lock an opponent down.

I don't think I've ever counter picked it though.

z-catching and platform tricks only goes so far, and a smart opponent would use it against you so you're at a standstill. Diddy is decent on this stage, but its really hard to shine here. It's somewhat easier to get gimped here, since you're already nervous about aiming your up b and getting back on safely, and the offstage area is somewhat small and perfect for metaknight's dair to just hit you in the face.

 

[OmegaXF]

Probaly because of the stage tilting up and down. But other than that it's pretty good.

 

[The Sauce Boss]

shrugs''" I like lylat.

To me, Lylat is what BF is to FD, but instead of FD, it's Lylat to BF.

this is like really confusing but somehow makes -perfect- sense lol.

 

[Silent Laughter]

Diddy is gay

 

[Vlade]

If I end up on Lylat as a starter, I wouldn't really mind.

Not a stage I would counterpick though.

 

[DelxDoom]

Main problem is that I don't think it's normally a legal neutral.

But yeah, player preference. If you like Lylat, counter Lylat, if you like Luigi's counter Luigi's, if you like neutrals, go ahead, if you can do FD (I personally dislike that stage, which is why Diddy is one of my mains hah)

Then there are the stages which usually won't be that great for the Diddy - Rainbow Cruise and Brinstar mess with banana game, but you can definitely work on playing on these stages to maximize your success, as Chrome has done ^_^

 

[Kamikaze*]

It's pretty easy to avoid bananas there.

 

[Cold_Trax]

I agree with illinialex24, all of Diddy's moves are limited but basically it's a matter of changing mind- games.
Camping is out of the question, items are useless here, and diddy's recovery is horrible. However chaining with the dash attack > uair does wonders here. It's all about mind-games, and controlling the stage with Diddy

 

[The (L)aw]

i hate everything about lylat. the tilt screws me up when im using bananas, the tilting up and down make me get stuck under the edge, and i lose 95% of the time i play there.