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Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

Almost one month has passed since release. In retrospect....

  • This is by far the best Smash ever. Like, I don't even know how they will top this.

  • Pretty freakin' good; I have a few qualms over things like internet play, balancing issues, etc.

  • It's ok, but [insert Smash game here] is better.

  • I'd rather play Parcheesi.


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JacobLeBeauOFFICIAL

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What kind of damage control would there be?
Well that depends. If the leak is real, they could be lying to make sure the surprise isn't ruined, and if it's fake they could be toying with up by saying they aren't sure when they know it's fake.
 

Smashoperatingbuddy123

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The fact is that source may be on the same boat as gemusatu was if it’s real

Didn’t know about the character that’s missing was cut during development

I mean I’m almost positive the case won’t be closed till the next reveal
 

beans

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What does context that this very page including my previous posts about Ryce, the guy who leaked pretty much everything about Marvel VS Capcom Infinite, claims this is bull have to do with Ant Man? Hmmmm, can't say

Say what you want but Ant Man getting cut was what ruined the game. Yes, Ant Man had stolen the good graphic assets on his way out
The only good thing he didnt steal was the post credits scene with Thanos doing (spoiler)
The best thing about that game honestly
 

Shyy_Guy595

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*sigh*

Honestly, part of me wants some of these smug "insiders" and their smug supporters to be wrong in this case.

Something is telling me that they're likely not lying though, which is why I don't really state my stance on this whole fiasco.
 
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Chrollo.

fka president wario
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Would they be allowed to use characters they don’t have the rights to for that?
I’m not sure. IIRC Xander Mobus said he told to record some stuff for Rayman, so it may apply to fake murals. However if they made fake murals as leak bait, I feel like they didn’t include any 3rd Parties that weren’t in the game.
 
D

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I can believe some of the clouds were smudged a bit by the camera + lighting and such, but there are 100% some actual changes to the background, the missing castle and right crystal formation being the most notable ones. Whether that's a significant hit to the leak is up to each individual, I don't personally think it's enough to put the leak down, but it's for certain not just all camera stuff.
Things go missing, because the contrast hides them. How is that hard to understand? Things "move" because they're screenshots from a MOVING camera, and that causes blur. Not to mention, the paper it's printed on CLEARLY has a convex curve, which is obviously gonna distort the placement of elements on the image. These points have been brought up again and again and again and again and AGAIN to counterargue this dumb point, but people STILL insist that NO, this debunks the Grinch leak. There's WAYY to elements affecting the quality of the leak image, that it's honestly more impressive that it lines up to such a degree at all. If anything, the images being so SIMILAR proves it's legit, not the other way around. Not to mention the possibility existing that Nintendo, for whatever reason, simply decided to update the background art.

It's like, goddamn, of all the points people could latch onto, the background one is possibly the dumbest dead end of them all. It's LITERALLY the same dumb nonsense as "Shulk is a photoshopped L.Mac," and "Wario's face" from the ESRB one. Is this REALLY the hill you wanna die on, where are potentially more interesting angles that you guys could use to debunk this leak?
 

KMDP

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Insiders aren't colliding. Every insider we keep track of says something is wrong. And it is my oppinion and my choice to believe that means this ain't it.
See the post by Ryce brought here by Chrono. Chrono. Which I quote in my post right above yours.

Whoever was informing the "insiders" (who aren't insiders at all, the people informing these guys are the insiders) might have given them a list that was real up to a point (making them seem legit), and then full of lies after Isabelle.

This is not an impossibility.
 
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SkywardStriker16

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In other words, he's not willing to admit that him and his source were fed bait leaks to hide the final surprise of the roster from the public. The only way to make people believe fake leaks, or that the sources with those bait leaks are legit, is by making part of those leaks be true so people think they're legit.

That's pretty much what's happening here. No characters were omitted. His information simply isn't fully accurate, and intentionally so. Why is so hard for "leakers" to admit this simple possibility is very plausible given the circumstances?
See the Gematsu leak. I totally think this is plausible.
Heck, Vergeben didn't predict Richter and King K. Rool. His information wasn't fully accurate either. There is no denying that.
 

Troykv

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Who knows how Incineroar will end.

Into something random I hadn't mentioned yet... I hope Shadow is playable, I kind of like Sonic's moveset, but I would like the Shadow's approach xD.
 
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ButterGeek

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This is the main thing I’m intrested in, so yall’s opinion would be nice.
I’m definetly TeamFake and if it’s Fake, then I’m Pretty sure Inci is in.
How Big do yall think are Incineroar’s chances of being in if it’s Real? As DLC, a character missing from the poster or something. The worst timeline for me would be if Inci was leak bait all along, that would feel cruel to the fans lol.
 

Nap_

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Yes.
As a graphic designer /illustrator or whatever I am, arguments about graphic effort, Grinch stuff around, differences in the backgrounds, or whatever related is a sure dead end. I know how that **** work and how most of these arguments got an easy an credible counterpoint.
There could be more than one background version for various formats making easier the work or just for personalitation addding characters or logos (pop-ups, posters, cards, circular **** like the one which is shown, screen stuff...) a graphic designer can work very well without being good at drawing, (somebody who only control the press even better) or being someone very good at it who works in a small print company. The print papers shown in the french video also means nothing because most of the printed work looks the same. Our French friend could work as designer or quality inspector checking early versions like the ones shown in the leak. There could be confidential work between the company and Nintendo, so don't wait for a conection, (not even about past works, those documents can be very restrictive) VG companies are really serious about this. It's difficult for some people make a fake banner, not for everyone. Etc, etc...
Don't follow this way, you can't prove anything according at what we got.
Just wait to the reveals or bigger leaks.
 
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D

Deleted member

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Because Visual proof seems to be in the game. Not just words. VISUAL proof, as we're now at 2 insiders saying that it doesn't match not what they HEARD but what they SAW
>Seems to be.

You're making assumptions here. None of them are making any claims that they saw a build of the game where different characters were made as playable.
 

Iko MattOrr

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I can believe some of the clouds were smudged a bit by the camera + lighting and such, but there are 100% some actual changes to the background, the missing castle and right crystal formation being the most notable ones. Whether that's a significant hit to the leak is up to each individual, I don't personally think it's enough to put the leak down as there are possible explanations for the changes, but it's for certain not just all camera stuff.
I agree with this, and especially, those changes to the background are consistent between the multiple pictures of it in the leak, so the possibility that's an artifact of the camera is completely out of question.
An artifact of the printer would make slighty more sense, but it's still impossible IMO because it's not just some colors blending, it's some shapes being completely different.
 

Michael the Spikester

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This is the main thing I’m intrested in, so yall’s opinion would be nice.
I’m definetly TeamFake and if it’s Fake, then I’m Pretty sure Inci is in.
How Big do yall think are Incineroar’s chances of being in if it’s Real? As DLC, a character missing from the poster or something. The worst timeline for me would be if Inci was leak bait all along, that would feel cruel to the fans lol.
I personally think Incineroar is the missing character in the banner.

If a retro newcomer (Mach Rider) alone is in it then a new Pokemon too is considering the trend since Melee.
 
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Trisepta

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A lot of you keep posting this to try and debunk the leak as fake:

https://i.imgur.com/n3xve9P.jpg

From Reddit:
View attachment 172353


I mean, I know it's been stated here before. But there you go, from a photography expert. I think you can all drop the background nonsense now. It's your own opinions about how cameras work and such, vs the words of someone who makes a living off of photography and understands this very well.
No, a camera wouldn't completely change areas like that. And the same problem areas are also visible on the image with the characters on it. So it's not distortion from a camera.
Also, we don't know who this expert is or if they even looked at the image.
 
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Noipoi

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This is the main thing I’m intrested in, so yall’s opinion would be nice.
I’m definetly TeamFake and if it’s Fake, then I’m Pretty sure Inci is in.
How Big do yall think are Incineroar’s chances of being in if it’s Real? As DLC, a character missing from the poster or something. The worst timeline for me would be if Inci was leak bait all along, that would feel cruel to the fans lol.
I think if he's not base, he may one of the first dlc characters.
 

Cosmic77

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See the Gematsu leak. I totally think this is plausible.
Heck, Vergeben didn't predict Richter and King K. Rool. His information wasn't fully accurate either. There is no denying that.
A lack of information does not mean something is inaccurate.

Verge may have not given us a full picture, but his predictions haven't been wrong yet. Not saying Incineroar and Ken are all we're getting, but I don't think it's fair to throw Verge under the bus just because one character doesn't match.
 

Nekoo

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>Seems to be.

You're making assumptions here. None of them are making any claims that they saw a build of the game where different characters were made as playable.
How am I making assumption when two Insider clearly use "Doesn't match what I saw" compared to the usual "Heard" they use?
 

meowth_thats_wrong

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We don't need to waste time coming up to a counterargument to an argument which is fundamentally unsound. Him being 50 literally changes nothing. Your pre-existing biases that the older generation never uses Snapchat or uses emojis are simply the result of your own flawed stereotyping of an age-group. And "doesn't speak english"? Have you even seen the original leak you're arguing so adamantly about? It was in French.
That doesn't mean the stereotypes aren't accurate to that age group. Why do you think they exist in the first place? From Google: 15% of Snapchat's users are 35+ years old. Then think of how many generations that "35+ years old" stat spans, and how that percentage is probably skewed to users closer to 35 than to 50. It's not 15% of 50 year olds, it's 15% of 35-99 year olds, and I really doubt 50 year olds make up most of that 15%. Him being 50 is very relevant to the validity of the leak because he is of the demographic that hardly touches Snapchat. Not to mention he's a 50 year old who seems to make decisions that a 20 year old would make, like breaking an NDA (concerning 2 large corporations) on social media that can easily be traced back to his name. It just doesn't make sense why someone would be so careless about their career at an age where you'd be focused on keeping a steady job until retirement.
 

Cutie Gwen

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Well that depends. If the leak is real, they could be lying to make sure the surprise isn't ruined, and if it's fake they could be toying with up by saying they aren't sure when they know it's fake.
Alright. Fair enough, but one TIIIIIIINY question. What do they gain from this? Insiders aren't the people who leaked Smash and claimed something that contradicts Grinch here. "Oh, it's to not ruin the surprise!" can't work as they're still giving it attention, meaning people would STILL be thinking about Grinch. There's no damage TO control for these credible insiders
 
D

Deleted member

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This is the main thing I’m intrested in, so yall’s opinion would be nice.
I’m definetly TeamFake and if it’s Fake, then I’m Pretty sure Inci is in.
How Big do yall think are Incineroar’s chances of being in if it’s Real? As DLC, a character missing from the poster or something. The worst timeline for me would be if Inci was leak bait all along, that would feel cruel to the fans lol.
If it's real? Zero.

He certainly wouldn't be in the base game, as that'd debunk the Grinch leak, thus his only shot would be DLC.


... if that even happens.

... and the DLC hasn't even planned yet.

... and by then Gen 8 would have more relevance.
 

kylexv

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I know the perfect way for all of us as a Smash community to celebrate Halloween together.

By watching the "Halloween is Grinch Night" TV special.
 

KMDP

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Because Visual proof seems to be in the game. Not just words. VISUAL proof, as we're now at 2 insiders saying that it doesn't match not what they HEARD but what they SAW
"Visual proof" can include a complete reveal schedule which was 100% accurate all the way up to Isabelle's reveal, you know.
 

Nekoo

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"Visual proof" can include a complete reveal schedule which was 100% accurate all the way up to Isabelle's reveal, you know.
That would work, however there is one character that break this, it's Incineroar. They all seems DEAD SET on Incineroar and not others characters.
Like, out of the question.

I think they saw stuff for Incineroar, whatever that is
 

beans

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This is the main thing I’m intrested in, so yall’s opinion would be nice.
I’m definetly TeamFake and if it’s Fake, then I’m Pretty sure Inci is in.
How Big do yall think are Incineroar’s chances of being in if it’s Real? As DLC, a character missing from the poster or something. The worst timeline for me would be if Inci was leak bait all along, that would feel cruel to the fans lol.
Before anything, I doubt it was meaning ill will for the fans that fire starter was leak bait, I doubt it was meant for everybody to see and parade about it, just to try and weed out the sources is the possibility i go with,
Now, no
If Inci is not base, then his not in. His best chance would be with the Gen 8 pokemon dlc as a pack
If he is not in base, then as solo DLC it would feel as if Alola is already a thing from the past
 

Gothitelle

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And before you go "you're making assumptions about what had to have happened", consider that the alternative requires the assumption that a literal psychopath sought out a person working at a print shop to associate with incriminating material. I don't think that's any less of an assumption.
And herein lies the problem that's been causing hundreds of pages worth of arguments. This is all presumptive. I've made it clear that I'm sitting on the fence for that exact reason, because there is literally no definitive proof one way or the other that you could give. Just to make it clear, for a hundredth time - I'm only arguing because I want to test every single hole in this leak.

And there, now when it turns out to be real I've saved face!
 
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