Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Opossum]

Hm...it's always the long, negative comments that get to me and make me think. This is the one I got so far. What do you think? I'm asking because I want a second opinion.

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I'll give my own input on each of the person's points.

- Lucina getting integrated into Robin's Final Smash makes no sense. Chrom is already there and Lucina is popular enough and easy enough to make to warrant being a character.

- Snake is a can of worms that can go either way.

- Waluigi and Daisy can go either way, but oversaturation is a non issue. Mario is Nintendo's flagship franchise.

- Heavily disagree that Celica can't provide anything new. That shows some ignorance on the commenter's part IMO. Also, on it feeling weird without Alm, not only did Warriors do that, but the same happened with Chrom and Robin in Smash 4, so it's a non-issue.

- Impa I think has shaky odds since her appearance is so inconsistent, but then again the same can be said for Ganondorf. Definitely disagree with them dismissing one offs at this point though.

- I don't get his issue with Excitebiker. There's plenty of attacks usable on a bike.

- ARMS did well enough where it not having a future isn't a concern. If not base game, DLC.

- Not sure where he's getting that Rhythm Heaven statement from. Nintendo doesn't release sales data for digital titles.



Basically I disagree with the commenter on a lot of things lol. Nice video though! The victory theme segment at the end was a neat throwback to your roster videos of yesteryear.

 

[Nekoo]

Wait, I'm pretty sure Roy was confirmed before the Ballot was even a thing. Did you just vote for him anyway for the sake of 3 Roys? Lol

Nope the Fighter Ballot opened when Lucas was announced and we had the true trailer for Mewtwo, so basically we didn't knew Yet about Roy

 

[Smasherfan88]

Hm...it's always the long, negative comments that get to me and make me think. This is the one I got so far. What do you think? I'm asking because I want a second opinion.

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Personally it feels like this person's reasoning is because he either dislikes the characers or doesn't know much about them. So they don't think they would have much unique moveset potential or any at all.

Also I watched your video as well and I agree with your reasoning and choices for the most part, the only changes I would make though would be adding Kamek to the roster as with your inclusion of Toad, Waluigi, and Daisy he's the last main stay character from the Mario series, at least in the realms of the 2-D and RPG games, he's been around since the SNES too, then also adding Sylux, and your reasons for not putting him on there are sound st first, it's just the fact Greninja got in Smash before X and Y were finished since Sakurai stated he saw Greninja's design when X and Y were in development and he added him in, though I think X and Y released first, Sylux, if he is a major part of prime 4, can simply pass around that fact as he isn't an entirley new character like Greninja was and had appearances in Prime hunters, Prime three, then federation force (though the last two were more like MCU after credit scenes). So besides those two characters I would add, your roster is pretty nice.

 

[Metal Shop X]

You know what I really miss?

The "Reggie's Bizarre Adventure" trailers we had for E3 2014 and E3 2015.

Man, I just LOVED those trailers, they were so funny and good at building excitation, even when E3 2015 ended up dissapointing, I still remember the trailer for it fondly.

Too bad they decided to drop those trailers. :/

 

[Fenriraga]

Yea, let's freshen it up a bit.

What new items does everyone want to see?

Third party items, period. Having the S-flag and Galaga ships was nice, but I need more. I wanna chug down E Tanks, slow down time with Chaos Emeralds, beat up SF cars for goodies inside, and use Summons in more than just Midgar.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Third party items, period. Having the S-flag and Galaga ships was nice, but I need more. I wanna chug down E Tanks, slow down time with Chaos Emeralds, beat up SF cars for goodies inside, and use Summons in more than just Midgar.

To be fair, we did get a few 3rd party Assist Trophies. >.>

I'd rather Chaos Emeralds were saved for a Shadow moveset, but maybe the item boxes could show up. There's a lot they could do. Not sure how to make them feel balanced, though. Rings are kind of useless outside of "restore 10 health" type deal. Invincibility is borked by default, of course. Warp is useless. Though the special shields could be fun?

 

[?????????????]

Basically I disagree with the commenter on a lot of things lol. Nice video though! The victory the,e segment at the end was a neat throwback to your roster videos of yesteryear.

Aw, thanks!

Also I watched your video as well and I agree with your reasoning and choices for the most part, the only changes I would make though would be adding Kamek to the roster as with your inclusion of Toad, Waluigi, and Daisy he's the last main stay character from the Mario series, at least in the realms of the 2-D and RPG games, he's been around since the SNES too, then also adding Sylux, and your reasons for not putting him on there are sound st first, it's just the fact Greninja got in Smash before X and Y were finished since Sakurai stated he saw Greninja's design when X and Y we're in development and he added him in, though I think X and Y released first, Sylux, if he is a major part of prime 4, can simply pass tharound that fact as he isn't an entirley new character like Greninja was and had appearances in Prime hunters, Prime three, then federation force (though the last two were more like MCU after credit scenes). So besides those two characters I would add, your roster is pretty nice.

Oh yes, I saw your comment! I think Kamek would be a great addition, just lower priority (?) than the ones I already added. And I thought you made a very good point about Sylux.

 

[Zerp]

Yea, let's freshen it up a bit.

What new items does everyone want to see?

The one item that on contact turns off all items, turns all characters into Bayonetta and transforms the stage to Smashville because Final Destination is for casuals./s

Really though, I'd like to see the parasol return, it was always fun to see characters like Captain Falcon casually floating by with it.

Also the various elemental shields from Sonic, I think those would be fun.

 

[Fenriraga]

Nope the Fighter Ballot opened when Lucas was announced and we had the true trailer for Mewtwo, so basically we didn't knew Yet about Roy

Derp, just went and checked the direct where Lucas was announced, you right. Lordy, I forgot how long that ballot went for.

To be fair, we did get a few 3rd party Assist Trophies. >.>

I'd rather Chaos Emeralds were saved for a Shadow moveset, but maybe the item boxes could show up. There's a lot they could do. Not sure how to make them feel balanced, though. Rings are kind of useless outside of "restore 10 health" type deal. Invincibility is borked by default, of course. Warp is useless. Though the special shields could be fun?

I mean, we could just replace the timer with an Emerald. For the most part I was just saying the first items that came to mind though.

I think a Shield Monitor could work. Maybe just prevent knockback for a single Smash attack, protect a single hit of damage over a certain percentage, or just prevent damage in general for a short time (but not knockback) ala Melee's cloaking device.

 

[Opossum]

Yea, let's freshen it up a bit.

What new items does everyone want to see?

Breidablik as a Poké Ball or Assist Trophy type of item would be great.

That and the Headgear from Punch-Out!! That decreases damage taken on the character's upper body.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Yea, let's freshen it up a bit.

What new items does everyone want to see?

I did bring up an All-Star mode concept at one point. On the subject of items, seeing the Red Shell come back would be a good start.

As for new items, perhaps the Piranha Plant would be one to consider. The player picks up a flower pot that has a sleeping Piranha Plant inside. The Piranha Plant would them wake up, and attack anyone (excluding the player who's carrying it) within its attack range. After 20 seconds, the item would disappear.

 

[Garteam]

Hm...it's always the long, negative comments that get to me and make me think. This is the one I got so far. What do you think? I'm asking because I want a second opinion.

Spoiler

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A lot of the logic in that comment is pretty faulty.

It's really hard to use "this character has no moveset potential" as an argument in a world where Wii Fit Trainer is a fighter. Celica, Springman, and Excitebiker all have a lot of moveset potential and would be unique amongst the current cast. Plus, ARMS did very well judging by how much post-launch support its gotten. It may not have made Splatoon numbers, but 1 million+ is still really respectable for a new IP released 2 months into a console's lifespan, so we'll probably see at least one more ARMS game. Celica without Alm isn't really a concern when we have Robin and Lucina without Chrom, who's a bigger character in Awakening than Alm is in Shadows of Valentia.

Also, I would say Rhythm Heaven is doing fairly well. It has games released on a semi-regular basis, even if the latest game was e-shop only in North America. I'd say Rhythm Heaven is about the size of Warioware, kinda niche but still big enough to justify having a playable character in Smash.

Dragon Quest does have certain characters that stand out above the crowd in terms of importance and popularity, such as the Hero from Dragon Quest I, Erdrick, and Eight. Even if Sakurai doesn't want to use a mainline protagonist, he could opt for slime or a support character such as Bianca or Jessica. Just because there isn't a clear series mascot like Pikachu or Cloud doesn't mean none of the Dragon Quest characters stand out. After all, Sakurai chose Marth to represent Fire Emblem, and that series didn;t have a stand out protagonist until Marth made it into Smash Bros.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

I don't expect to see Waluigi or Daisy in this next Smash personally. Moveset potential is a major aspect Sakurai thinks about, and I don't think they offer anything that interesting/nothing other characters can't do. I think other Mario characters like Captain Toad, Paper Mario and maybe even Geno would get in before them, because they just have a lot more to offer.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

For items, I want the bitter spray from Pikmin 2 as a rare item. Mind you, they knew it was super OP in Pikmin itself so only the spicy spray returned in Pikmin 3.

 

[Fenriraga]

For items, I want the bitter spray from Pikmin 2 as a rare item. Mind you, they knew it was super OP in Pikmin itself so only the spicy spray returned in Pikmin 3.

Ohhh I forgot all about that, that would be EVIL in a game like Smash, it'd be getting frozen but even worse.

Doooo it.

 

[Idon]

A lot of the logic in that comment is pretty faulty.
Just because there isn't a clear series mascot like Pikachu or Cloud doesn't mean none of the Dragon Quest characters stand out.

Dragon Quest's "Pikachu" is definitely Slime. It's probably the most iconic version of that enemy archetype and so hugely popular in Japan, almost every console has a Japan-exclusive "slime" version of it.

The only issue is, outside of that Rocket Slime game on the DS, he doesn't do... well, anything really.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Dragon Quest's "Pikachu" is definitely Slime. It's probably the most iconic version of that enemy archetype and so hugely popular in Japan, almost every console has a Japan-exclusive "slime" version of it.

The only issue is, outside of that Rocket Slime game on the DS, he doesn't do... well, anything really.

Dragon Quest Monsters has him do a lot(as he's your main partner in the first game, and I believe the two sequels, but it's been a while), but beyond that, yeah. He's the de facto mascot, but that doesn't inherently mean much alone. Moveset potential isn't necessarily hard. It's just making it flow right that could cause issues.

 

[Blargg888]

DKC Returns trumps every recent FE game in terms of sales with +6 million copies sold. Tropical Freeze, unlike #FE, sold +1 million copies on the unsuccessful Wii U.

Regardless of which one is more popular, saying something like that is just dumb.

Even if what you said is true, it has nothing to do with what my comment said.
Also, #FE is a spinoff, not a main FE game, just so you know.

Yea, let's freshen it up a bit.

What new items does everyone want to see?

I'd personally like to see a Splatoon item, like maybe a gun type item, or a throwable trap, kinda like the Kid Icarus Eye-Thing.

 

[Autumn ♫]

Dragon Quest's "Pikachu" is definitely Slime. It's probably the most iconic version of that enemy archetype and so hugely popular in Japan, almost every console has a Japan-exclusive "slime" version of it.

The only issue is, outside of that Rocket Slime game on the DS, he doesn't do... well, anything really.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lp3OSVNk6RQ&t=2s

I think this helps show a lot of what Slime could do. It definitely got me interested in him.

 

[Smasherfan88]

Oh yes, I saw your comment! I think Kamek would be a great addition, just lower priority (?) than the ones I already added. And I thought you made a very good point about Sylux.

Thanks! It's good get the feedback of what people think about your feedback, at least that's the case for me. But yeah, Kamek is lower priority than Toad, Daisy, and Waluigi, especially in the popularity department. Though I think he's the next in line after they officially add Toad, Daisy, and Waluigi to smash since he's been the main antagonist of almost all the Yoshi games since the OG Yoshi island on the SNES, he's appeared multiple times throughout the Mario & Luigi series, he's recently been added to the Paper Mario series with Sticker Star, he made his first playable appearance in Mario Party Nine and he's about to make his second in Mario Tennis Aces if those datamine leaks are true, and there's a big possibility he's also the main bad guy of that Yoshi switch game they revealed last year.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Pizza dude man guys brought up a good point

If there's cuts why did it take a shorter time to make?

 

[MopedOfJustice]

Pizza dude man guys brought up a good point

If there's cuts why did it take a shorter time to make?

Because it was built off the old game and so most of the cast was ported rather than reconstructed.

 

[Nekoo]

If there's cuts why did it take a shorter time to make?

I believe there no cut but that's not a reason at all. Causality vs correlation.
Each cut had a personal reason to be cut, whenever it's priority, time constrain, money, budget, licencing and such.
We could get Cut on Smash Switch for all we know

 

[Nielicus]

I'd like to see some Pokemon items that aren't pokeballs, and maybe some items from franchises that don't have any/many like Xenoblade.

And also I'll be surprised if Daisy isn't finally a swap for Peach. Then again, no I won't lol

 

[Nebunera]

I think there will be cuts and I guess that is alright...as long as it isn't my mains that aren't from the original 12.

 

[DYED]

My face when they rework Ganondorf:

Spoiler

 

[T-Hell]

So, I just found out something interesting. Apparently Smash 4 was meant to have a story mode, just one without any cutscenes. Of course, Sakurai eventually went back on this decision and just didn't include a story mode at all, but since it was planned at one point for Smash 4, maybe we'll finally get it in this game?

YES PLEASE! lol

 

[Nebunera]

My face when they rework Ganondorf:

Spoiler

They might give him a sword...

So, I just found out something interesting. Apparently Smash 4 was meant to have a story mode, just one without any cutscenes. Of course, Sakurai eventually went back on this decision and just didn't include a story mode at all, but since it was planned at one point for Smash 4, maybe we'll finally get it in this game?

One can hope.

I'd like to see it return, it was just amazing to see an Infinity War in Smash, you would never see Captain Falcon with Olimar anywhere else.

The "cutscenes would be on YouTube" was not a good reason because it was our choice to be spoiled to it...

 

[Stratos]

Aisya from the ASH: Archaic Sealed Heat she has a bodyguard called Bullnequ and although burned by the Flame Snake, he is reborn from the ashes to help her. He could perhaps serve as her Final Smash.

 

[IronWarrior94]

So what's one song from a game you know is going to be in Smash, and you can't wait to listen to it as you main your vet or any of your wanted newcomers?

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

I'd like to see some Pokemon items that aren't pokeballs, and maybe some items from franchises that don't have any/many like Xenoblade.

And also I'll be surprised if Daisy isn't finally a swap for Peach. Then again, no I won't lol

Daisy is too different to be a alternate but too similar to be unique, kind of a sad really lol

 

[ThoughtfulWanderer]

So what's one song from a game you know is going to be in Smash, and you can't wait to listen to it as you main your vet or any of your wanted newcomers?

One of the best parts of Odyssey, of course!

 

[Pokechu]

Daisy is too different to be a alternate but too similar to be unique, kind of a sad really lol

If Daisy is too similar to Peach to be unique then Dixie is too similar to Diddy to be unique.

Daisy would be quicker and stronger than Peach and use more brutal attacks like her fists (shown by how she literally KNOCKED Bowser out in Mario Party 3). Alongside her own body she could use sports equipment and an overall flower aesthetic to help her in battle.

There's no way she's too similar to Peach to have her own unique moveset.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

If Daisy is too similar to Peach to be unique then Dixie is too similar to Diddy to be unique.

Daisy would be quicker and stronger than Peach and use more brutal attacks like her fists (shown by how she literally KNOCKED Bowser out in Mario Party 3). Alongside her own body she could use sports equipment and an overall flower aesthetic to help her in battle.

There's no way she's too similar to Peach to have her own unique moveset.

She could have her own moveset but she's doesn't have anything moveset wise that would stand out that makes me think sakurai would ever consider making her a unique newcomer.

Dixie really isn't a good comparison cause she's so different from diddy in everything but body type and does have actual things in her games that could offer a unique playstyle in smash.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Yea, let's freshen it up a bit.

What new items does everyone want to see?

Toads...eveyone can abuse a useless Toad now...even the Captain(s) will do so

 

[Pokechu]

She could have her own moveset but she's doesn't have anything moveset wise that would stand out that makes me think sakurai would ever consider making her a unique newcomer.

Dixie really isn't a good comparison cause she's so different from diddy in everything but body type and does have actual things in her games that could offer a unique playstyle in smash.

Just from the spinoffs alone though if you wanted to make Daisy a unique character you could, while she'd still use the generic sports equipment which could be applied to other characters, she's the only character with the flower motif or massive strength. Just like Dixie the only thing Peach and Daisy share are their body type.

The chances of Daisy getting in are really small but she definitely isn't too similar to Peach as many of her moves would be out of character for Daisy. Daisy's never been seen picking turnips or having Peach's float ability and she wouldn't fight as elegant either. Peach's high kick? nah Daisy would just kick them in the face. Daisy couldn't use Toad, she wouldn't create the rainbow Peach creates in her aerial, etc.

Honestly though a Peach semi clone wouldn't be bad for her, it'd work for the most part. I wouldn't be surprised if Daisy actually gets in as a semiclone this go around.

 

[Gameboi834]

Sigh, still waiting on the e-mail to play Smash at E3...

 

[Troykv]

Yea, let's freshen it up a bit.

What new items does everyone want to see?

I want the Breidablik! It would be fun to summon Fire Emblem Characters :D

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Just from the spinoffs alone though if you wanted to make Daisy a unique character you could, while she'd still use the generic sports equipment which could be applied to other characters, she's the only character with the flower motif or massive strength. Just like Dixie the only thing Peach and Daisy share are their body type.

The chances of Daisy getting in are really small but she definitely isn't too similar to Peach as many of her moves would be out of character for Daisy. Daisy's never been seen picking turnips or having Peach's float ability and she wouldn't fight as elegant either. Peach's high kick? nah Daisy would just kick them in the face. Daisy couldn't use Toad, she wouldn't create the rainbow Peach creates in her aerial, etc.

Honestly though a Peach semi clone wouldn't be bad for her, it'd work for the most part. I wouldn't be surprised if Daisy actually gets in as a semiclone this go around.

The problem is the "sports idea" works just as well for Waluigi. Daisy doesn't really have any particular signature abilities to show off that are applicable to Smash. She still doesn't act like Peach, so wouldn't make a great alternate costume. On the other hand, she doesn't have enough to really make her indefinitely unique. I wish she got some more unique abilities, something Waluigi currently has over her(like air swimming).

 

[Fenriraga]

Sigh, still waiting on the e-mail to play Smash at E3...

I'd imagine they would probably want to send it in the evening PT since people need to get off work and such.