Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[blackghost]

If anything, Bayonetta doesn't fit in because she's not even the poster girl for action adventure/whatever genre her game is.

I imagine adding her was also a personal favor, though.

she pretty much is the poster child for her genre though. when your game i reviewed as the near perfection of the genre (which is action hack n' slash) you are the face. when your game announcements healine events you are a face. bayonetta isnt niche at this point. after 2 especially.

adding her as a personal favor? what? where and how does that make sense? the only person this claim appears to be valid is snake's inclusion because of the respect and friendship kojima and sakurai have and that relationship is pretty well documented. unless you are just gonna come out and say you are a ballot conspiracy theorist, her inclusion is the easiest to figure out.

top 5 id want: midna and wolf link, shadow, impa, rabbid peach, and baldr.

 

[MrReyes96]

Mario + Rabbids kingdom battle is a good game
It’s the only other series that has had a big crossover with Mario other than Sonic. And my big I mean the other franchise is in the title and plays a big role in the game.
I’m not rooting for rabbids but to deny their possibility or even how much they deserve it is silly.
They make more sense than your niche jrpg protagonists third party picks

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Bayonetta's brother in action Dante probably still holds the title of the face of the hack and slash genre.

I prefer her because she's got more of an interesting personality IMO that we don't see often, but Dante is most assuredly even with his recent rough go of it still the hack and slash face.

Though honestly I feel as if Bayonetta does a damn good job repping it in his place considering they were both created by the same dude and both are the premiere faces of a dying breed of a genre.

 

[Danpal65]

How is everyone talking about amiibo becoming Smash characters and not talking about Squishy Metroid for Smash?!

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

she pretty much is the poster child for her genre though. when your game i reviewed as the near perfection of the genre (which is action hack n' slash) you are the face. when your game announcements healine events you are a face. bayonetta isnt niche at this point. after 2 especially.

adding her as a personal favor? what? where and how does that make sense? the only person this claim appears to be valid is snake's inclusion because of the respect and friendship kojima and sakurai have and that relationship is pretty well documented. unless you are just gonna come out and say you are a ballot conspiracy theorist, her inclusion is the easiest to figure out.

top 5 id want: midna and wolf link, shadow, impa, rabbid peach, and baldr.

DmC is dead anyway and God of War changed genres. Bayonetta is pretty much the only major hack and slash franchise left lmao

 

[MrReyes96]

Bayonetta's brother in action Dante probably still holds the title of the face of the hack and slash genre.

I prefer her because she's got more of an interesting personality IMO that we don't see often, but Dante is most assuredly even with his recent rough go of it still the hack and slash face.

Though honestly I feel as if Bayonetta does a damn good job repping it in his place considering they were both created by the same dude and both are the premiere faces of a dying breed of a genre.

Bayonetta is also Nintendo exclusive at this point, she’s more than deserves to be in.
With her and Wonder Red I think the character action genre would be well represented.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Bayonetta is also Nintendo exclusive at this point, she’s more than deserves to be in.
With her and wonder Red I think the character action genre would be well represented.

tbh I always forget about wonder red, although his game sold like hot garbage he could honestly make it. Nintendo doesn't have very many new ips to add anyway and he seems like he could be a unique character. Here's hoping for a switch port at the least, Never played it but it seems like it deserves a second shot at success.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I do wonder if Bayonetta would benefit from a genre change. It'd be sad to see the entire genre go bye bye, but it seems as if modern games aren't really into the hack and slash genre anymore.

We still haven't seen Bayo 3 gameplay, so there's a chance. There's also rumors that Devil May Cry will return. But we'll see. You never know with Capcom series.

 

[MrReyes96]

tbh I always forget about wonder red, although his game sold like hot garbage he could honestly make it. Nintendo doesn't have very many new ips to add anyway and he seems like he could be a unique character. Here's hoping for a switch port at the least, Never played it but it seems like it deserves a second shot at success.

He also lines up nicely with the timing of when smash 5 was being planned, and represents a franchise from the Wii U era.
I really hope the game gets ported, it’s excellent and deserves a second chance

 

[Blargg888]

So here's a kinda fun hypothetical.

You get to pick five newcomers for the new Smash...but with one condition: the characters need to have preexisting amiibo.
What five characters do you pick?

Waluigi, Majora's Mask Link, Waddle Dee, Celica, Qbby.

 

[N3ON]

she pretty much is the poster child for her genre though. when your game i reviewed as the near perfection of the genre (which is action hack n' slash) you are the face. when your game announcements healine events you are a face. bayonetta isnt niche at this point. after 2 especially.

adding her as a personal favor? what? where and how does that make sense? the only person this claim appears to be valid is snake's inclusion because of the respect and friendship kojima and sakurai have and that relationship is pretty well documented. unless you are just gonna come out and say you are a ballot conspiracy theorist, her inclusion is the easiest to figure out.

top 5 id want: midna and wolf link, shadow, impa, rabbid peach, and baldr.

There's no way she's more of a face than Dante, who's received over double the games, has probably seven or eight times the series sales, and, fwiw, an overall higher rated game (not that critical reception inherently correlates to widespread ubiquity). Even Nier Automata, the one game, probably has sales roughly around the Bayonetta series total sales, and that correlates to a greater audience size, as there would be overlap between Bayo titles.

Also, her titles didn't headline the VGAs, if that's what you're talking about. BotW did. Not that that really matters, since ****ing Cranky Kong headlined that event before.

She wasn't a personal favour though, that much is true.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

I do wonder if Bayonetta would benefit from a genre change. It'd be sad to see the entire genre go bye bye, but it seems as if modern games aren't really into the hack and slash genre anymore.

We still haven't seen Bayo 3 gameplay, so there's a chance. There's also rumors that Devil May Cry will return. But we'll see. You never know with Capcom series.

I'm gonna be so sad if Bayonetta caves to the action/adventure walky talky ****y genre switch that's been so popular. How did the bayonetta port on switch sell anyway?

He also lines up nicely with the timing of when smash 5 was being planned, and represents a franchise from the Wii U era.
I really hope the game gets ported, it’s excellent and deserves a second chance

Wasn't a port teased sometime last year? Or am I imagining things? Honestly I think the best thing going for him besides timing is potential, he seems like he'd make a unique character and I could see Sakurai wanting to include him cause of it.

 

[MrReyes96]

I'm gonna be so sad if Bayonetta caves to the action/adventure walky talky ****y genre switch that's been so popular. How did the bayonetta port on switch sell anyway?


Wasn't a port teased sometime last year? Or am I imagining things? Honestly I think the best thing going for him besides timing is potential, he seems like he'd make a unique character and I could see Sakurai wanting to include him cause of it.

The one image that’s been giving me hope...

 

[Tree Gelbman]

My impression was the Switch ports only sold so so, not bad, but not good, but to be fair. There was no new content in the Bayo ports to entice anyone who had already bought them for Wii U.

Because by the time Bayo had been added to Smash Brothers, you could get both Bayonetta 1 and 2 for Wii U for pretty cheap.

Bayo 3 will be the real judge of just how much Bayo being in Smash Brothers has affected her series.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

My impression was the Switch ports only sold so so, not bad, but not good, but to be fair. There was no new content in the Bayo ports to entice anyone who had already bought them for Wii U. Because by the time Bayo had been added to Smash Brothers, you could get both Bayonetta 1 and 2 for Wii U for pretty cheap.

Bayo 3 will be the real judge of just how much Bayo being in Smash Brothers has affected her series.

Still a shame tho, but it doesn't seem like the games were really promoted at all, I already own the wii u version so I wasn't about to buy it again but I barely remember hearing about it, tbh I forgot they came out at all.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Still a shame tho, but it doesn't seem like the games were really promoted at all, I already own the wii u version so I wasn't about to buy it again but I barely remember hearing about it, tbh I forgot they came out at all.

They were kinda tacked on just before the Bayonetta 3 announcement and got overshadowed really. And they didn't even try anything like ''NOW WITH NEW COSTUMES AND ITEMS!" or anything of that nature.

So I think even her die hard fans were like ''Yeah I'll pass."

 

[MrReyes96]

I’m planning to buy it again but it’s a lower priority since I already played it.
I still want to support the series and play the games again though

 

[N3ON]

I do wonder if Bayonetta would benefit from a genre change. It'd be sad to see the entire genre go bye bye, but it seems as if modern games aren't really into the hack and slash genre anymore.

We still haven't seen Bayo 3 gameplay, so there's a chance. There's also rumors that Devil May Cry will return. But we'll see. You never know with Capcom series.

Nier Automata performed above expectations, and afaik, there's strong reason to believe DMC5 is on the way. Plus Bayo 3 in the pipeline, Nintendo must have some faith.

Seems there's still room for the genre.

Still a shame tho, but it doesn't seem like the games were really promoted at all, I already own the wii u version so I wasn't about to buy it again but I barely remember hearing about it, tbh I forgot they came out at all.

Why Nintendo didn't even mention them in the Mini Direct I'm sure I've no idea~

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I think if Kamiya gets his wish that Bayonetta and Dante crossover he wants to do could really help both characters. Granted. I suppose it's more difficult now than ever, considering you'd have so many cooks in the kitchen. Sega, Nintendo, Capcom.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Nier Automata performed above expectations, and afaik, there's strong reason to believe DMC5 is on the way. Plus Bayo 3 in the pipeline, Nintendo must have some faith.

Seems there's still room for the genre.


Why Nintendo didn't even mention them in the Mini Direct I'm sure I've no idea~

How did I forget nier? I ****ing love that game. So is DMC5 FINALLY coming then? I haven't kept up with the series tbh I've still yet to finish 4 lol.

 

[MrReyes96]

I think if Kamiya gets his wish that Bayonetta and Dante crossover he wants to do could really help both characters. Granted. I suppose it's more difficult now than ever, considering you'd have so many cooks in the kitchen. Sega, Nintendo, Capcom.

Bayonetta is already in wonderful 101 let’s just make that a full crossover.

 

[N3ON]

How did I forget nier? I ****ing love that game. So is DMC5 FINALLY coming then? I haven't kept up with the series tbh I've still yet to finish 4 lol.

Well, no announcement yet, but there have been some fairly convincing murmurs...

 

[StormC]

Here's a question I haven't seen people ask. Do you think that, to tie in with E3, Nintendo will have a demo of Smash 5 running in Best Buy and stuff like what they did for Smash 4 back in 2014?

Probably, and the sad truth is if they announce someone like K. Rool, I'll be one of those suckers waiting 5 hours in line to play it.

 

[MysticKnives]

So, hypothetical scenario for you guys. Take your 2 most desired characters. One you can get in Smash forever while the other is banned from Smash forever. Would you take that offer? My 2 would be Ridley and Banjo-Kazooie. I fear neither have good odds so....I might ban Banjo-Kazooie to get my space dragon. It hurts.

Pretty late to this but I’d ban Min Min if it got me Wang Tang from Power Stone. Hard as hell choice as I really got into ARMS and think she’d be a great choice for it. People have no idea how much I crave a new Power Stone. Games like that and Smash 64. Those old school late 90s games that have a very arcade and comic book vibe to them. Doesn’t hurt that I love Goku as well and my boy Wang Tang (my favorite in Power Stone) pretty much takes inspiration from the character too.

 

[Gumzilla]

Ok. Highly unlikely but how about Doomguy? I can see him utilizing the many guns from his first appearance and even his newest game! The play style would definitely be reminiscent of Snake.

 

[Danpal65]

Ok. Highly unlikely but how about Doomguy? I can see him utilizing the many guns from his first appearance and even his newest game! The play style would definitely be reminiscent of Snake.

If Doom Guy were to get in I would imagine him being very different to Snake. Snake is a character built around steal, slow and deliberate movements. Doom Guy is insane; he rushes in guns blazing and tears through everything in his path.

If Doom Guy were in Smash I imagine he would be a heavy, but fast character who would rush in to smack a foe in the face with melee attacks and then blast theme with plasma rifles, shotguns and rocket launchers from a further distances.

 

[Gumzilla]

If Doom Guy were to get in I would imagine him being very different to Snake. Snake is a character built around steal, slow and deliberate movements. Doom Guy is insane; he rushes in guns blazing and tears through everything in his path.

If Doom Guy were in Smash I imagine he would be a heavy, but fast character who would rush in to smack a foe in the face with melee attacks and then blast theme with plasma rifles, shotguns and rocket launchers from a further distances.

I guess you have a point. He IS a pretty fast dude. Especially in the reboot! I think his Final Smash would either be the BFG or Berserker mode.

 

[_Sheik]

Wait... the Spring Man leak was proven fake? Did its maker come out and say it like Omni did with his Rayman?

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Wait... the Spring Man leak was proven fake? Did its maker come out and say it like Omni did with his Rayman?

yup.

 

[Deleted member]

Wait... the Spring Man leak was proven fake? Did its maker come out and say it like Omni did with his Rayman?

Yes, yes he did.

EDIT:

FECK

 

[Hinata]

Wait... the Spring Man leak was proven fake? Did its maker come out and say it like Omni did with his Rayman?

Indeed he did.

 

[YoshiandToad]

So here's a kinda fun hypothetical.

You get to pick five newcomers for the new Smash...but with one condition: the characters need to have preexisting amiibo.
What five characters do you pick?

Toad, Isabelle, Chibi-Robo, Waddle Dee and Waluigi

 

[Danpal65]

I guess you have a point. He IS a pretty fast dude. Especially in the reboot! I think his Final Smash would either be the BFG or Berserker mode.

Berserker mode would certainly make him seem super crazy and powerful, but there would be no way the BFG is passed over. It would be AWESOME for him to pull it out, launch the giant green energy blast and then have it destroy whoever it comes into contact with.

 

[Gumzilla]

Berserker mode would certainly make him seem super crazy and powerful, but there would be no way the BFG is passed over. It would be AWESOME for him to pull it out, launch the giant green energy blast and then have it destroy whoever it comes into contact with.

As long as we get a DOOM stage with demon enemies to beat the crap out of I'll be happy! :D

 

[_Sheik]

Ah, thanks I noticed that video but couldn't watch it on mobile so I came here to ask.

Also it seems really hopeless to think Directs are happening before E3 by basing yourself on the assumption that Nintendo will once again have a 30-minute showing. It was a one-time thing, with literally five games crammed into the first two minutes (and Rocket League coming back later as a reminder), speaking of reminders M+R Kingdom Battle was there as well when it didn't need to, AND two of the announcements, the biggest ones actually, had literally little to no footage and focus given to them for obvious reasons.

Meanwhile Nintendo has much more to show this year than mere words and reminders; they have (silently) kept teasing us with the presence of Fire Emblem on the Switch's lineup for more than a year now, saying jack about it but WE ALL KNOW it's coming; at least six titles have pretty much nothing to offer but World Premiere-type trailers (Shin Megami Tensei, FE, Bayo 3, MP4, Pokémon and Smash) and everybody's clamoring for Nintendo to finally show them off (although the possibility that all 6 of them will be in the show is highly unlikely, especially SMT); Mario Odyssey was so successful a game it would be too good of an opportunity to pass up not to announce some sweet, earth-shattering DLC for it; Yoshi has been MIA since E3 2017, and they've obviously got some secret announcements in the pipeline, etc. etc.

And when Nintendo has so many big-ass guns to unveil all at once, I think it would be a mistake to let any of them loose before E3. Now I'm not saying everything has to be in their main presentation as they'll probably save some of it for the Treehouse, but I highly doubt Nintendo could fit all (let alone most) of the above into a mere 27 minutes. 45 would be my jam, like in 2014

 

[Ridel]

Dunno about DOOM. Seems a bit out of theme to me. I guess with Bayonetta and Snake though it isn't too strange, and it has a legacy behind it.

 

[Gumzilla]

Say what if we got custom Final Smashes? For example we can switch Kirby's FS for his old one!

 

[Llort A. Ton]

I took my idealistic roster from the Roster Thread, and put the characters in chronological order, like an all star mode. And here's what I got.

Spoiler

Yeah... good luck on all star mode...

And I counted how many newcomers I chose for each "era".
Arcade/NES era (80-89)- 5 newcomers
SNES era (90-95)- 6 newcomers
N64 era (96-00)- 8 newcomers
GC era (01-05)- 3 newcomers
Wii era (06-11)- 5 newcomers
Wii U era (12-16)- 3 newcomers
Switch era (17-present)- 1 newcomer
The biggest group of newbies is from N64 era, which was my first era of gaming (started with PS1 and GBC). Surprised myself by how many SNES characters I put here, especially since I didnt play Snes until much later when my older brother bought us one. Though, many of these SNES characters had games on N64, so that may play a factor. I kinda expected myself to put more GC characters, since I got GC shortly after N64 era ended, and its still my favorite era. Its not really news to anyone that they prefer characters from the era they grew up with, but I still found it interesting

So how about you guys? Try taking a pool of characters you'd like to see in the game and see if they match up with your introduction years of games. You dont need a pic like I made, but bonus points if ya do.

Ok. Highly unlikely but how about Doomguy? I can see him utilizing the many guns from his first appearance and even his newest game! The play style would definitely be reminiscent of Snake.

Nothing like Snake if you ask me. Doomguy would have no traps. I'd see him as a quick zoner with strong projectiles, but is quite weak when hit. To counter this, he has the chainsaw for melee attacks. Weapons include Super Shot Gun, Rocket Launcher, Plasma Rifle, chaingun and maybe the pistol. Only new weapon in DOOM 2016 were grenades and assault rifle (unless they were in 3, havent played it yet), I dont really see either playing a major part in the moveset. Of course, the BFG for his final smash! Have his home stage just be Hell. Having Wario summon a Cyberdemon during story mode would be hilarious. Id love to see him, but I think he just has a small shot for DLC.

 

[Danpal65]

Say what if we got custom Final Smashes? For example we can switch Kirby's FS for his old one!

Eh, I kinda hope they don't. I feel like Custom Moves as they are act as a slippery slope of having characters having less defined movesets for competitive play and instead having a pool to pull from. Look what that did to Palutena, totally ruined her. Plus, I feel that expanding that to Final Smashes would add an unnecessary amount of work for something that is not used as much competitively and would require a whole bunch of fine tuning for them to be fair in casual matches.

 

[RADSheikah]

AND two of the announcements, the biggest ones actually, had literally little to no footage and focus given to them for obvious reasons.

Well in fairness, one of those announcements was so that people would stop complaining about a 3DS game and the other was that so people wouldn't complain about a 3DS game.