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Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

Almost one month has passed since release. In retrospect....

  • This is by far the best Smash ever. Like, I don't even know how they will top this.

  • Pretty freakin' good; I have a few qualms over things like internet play, balancing issues, etc.

  • It's ok, but [insert Smash game here] is better.

  • I'd rather play Parcheesi.


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Idon

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Corrin is a pretty trite example given that he came out in Smash before his game released, but other than Corrin I've been familiar with every last Smash newcomer before their reveal since Brawl. Certainly Richter isn't obscure at all; SotN was one of the biggest games of its generation, and it's not even the only game Richter has been in! Obviously 'if Amazing Ampharos has no clue who a character is, they're not in" is an imperfect metric, but if I don't know who a character is so thoroughly that even after I see a picture I'm still drawing a blank (meaning I've literally never seen this anime woman before), color me very skeptical.
Well, get into the Japanese mobile game bubble and you'll have a pretty good idea of all these characters. Saber, Jeanne, Shirou, and Lancer mean nothing to everyone else, but even be tangentially aware of the game genre they're a part of and they're iconic no-brainers.
 

Polan

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Personally I'm going with "Eldritch abomination opposed to Darken (yes that's not his name, but might as well call the obvious pun)" I mean either way, everyone dies, the choice is just darkness or light. On a side note, I wonder how you get the true ending?
are multiple endings confirmed? cuz it would be tight if for the final battle you had the choice to side with either one (who tf would side with discount sauron tho) or to destroy them both.
 

A.G.L.

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im still holding out hope for geno, buuut lets take the idea "spirits deconfirm characters" anyway and see what we get.
Theres a few missing spirits like adeleine, cross, and tibby who could possibly be dlc character but two stand out to me the most, porky and sylux.

porky is the only boss to have no spirit, and he has a long history with smash yet appears to be nowhere (heh) this time.
mother 3 is highly requested to get localized and has been for a long time.
mothers 30th anniversary is next year, perfect time for a collection or something.

sylux is the hunter that has the biggest role in metroid games yet does not get a spirit while other hunters do.
sylux is supposedly getting a bigger role as part of metroid prime 4.
metroid prime 4 will likely be one of nintendos "big" games in the near future, pushing sales etc...

nintendo is choosing the dlc choices, not sakurai.
nintendo seems to have pushed corrin to promote the newest FE back during smash 4 dlc, sakurai even said he thought there were too many fe characters.
nintendo is not above pushing short sighted money grabs and cross promotional characters (not saying these characters are that but anything beyond helping sell both smash dlc and some current "in the moment" game might not factor much into a nintendo pick).
box theory proves that yes we can indeed easily assume characters sometimes, nintendo might not "hide their hand" as much as we think they do, we literally over think this stuff everytime, it might be as simple as figuring out the few big characters who dont have spirits that also might promote games next year.

there are other missing spirit characters but those 2 have a lot going for them now imo, i cant ignore that theyd make sense given all we know.
again im not totally on board with spirits characters being deconfirmed as dlc choices but there is a logic to it so its worth speculating over just in case that is how this goes down, i'll ALSO be rooting for geno and hopeful anyone is still possible of course but its still worth fully investigating this possibility.

other characters that stand out to me are:

1.heihachi - missing mii costume like all the third party mii costumes but also no spirit when namco is working so closely on smash, already felt likely and seems like an easy spirit choice yet hes not here.

2.banjo - some Rare games are represented in smash ultimate, blast corps and jet force gemini, very interesting we'd get ANYTHING Rare so this is definitely something to pay attention to suddenly.

3.style savvy - seems a missing song exists that might have been attached to a style savvy stage and no spirit is found in the code despite people seeing one in the final smash direct, potentially held off for dlc? we also seem to have a character that was "cut" between isabelle and incineroar, and with missing style savvy song that could potentially be whats happening here.
Its possible, that all of this is true. However I just do not see Nintendo not wanting to promote FE Three Houses. Its very likely we will get a Three Houses rep. Especially because Nintendo is choosing this time around, its very likely they will push for one of their new characters. And given the fact the DLC character and FE Three Houses might come out around the same time. It makes sense Nintendo will want to capitalize on this and push a character from one of their most anticipated 2019 games. Metroid Prime 4 as far as we know isn't nearly as far in development as FE Three Houses. So pushing a Metroid character might not make the most sense. At least in the first fighters pass, if there is a second fighters pass then I can see Sylux being pushed here.
 
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NabiscoFelt

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RandomAce

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Very doubtful for both Sora & Geno to be DLC. It would not ft Square's past business patterns. They are incredibly stingy when it comes to their things. So the fact they would be giving two of their characters over to Nintendo to use as playable characters. Is really doubtful, as nice as it would be. Its just not how Square does business.
I know, I also noticed how SE has been doing lately as well, the FGC has been in for quite a ride when Noctis and 2B were announced.

However, isn’t Geno more low hanging fruit compared to Sora, Cloud, and the other more high profile characters? I would assume that it would be easier to get Geno since he isn’t on the same level as them along with him being a lot more correlated with Nintendo. And Nintendo seemed to have been able to get the rights to Geno before, as seen with the Mii Costume in Smash 4 along with spirits in Ultimate.
 

NintenZ

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Also hot take:

Katalina is on-par with Gothitelle in terms of speculative Smash newcomers imo.
 

MSmariosonic

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Plenty of pages back there was a claim Reddit said Snake's codecs returned for all the brawl vets

Any solid proof if this is still legit?
 

GoeGoe

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Just gotta say again the odd friendship you and AGL have formed makes me laugh. A glimpse of light in this insane thread.
Thanks, nothing to it really. Open mindedness, acceptance of each's opinion regardless. Dashed with politness and respect. You're welcome aboard if you're willing to bind with these.
 
D

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Also hot take:

Katalina is on-par with Gothitelle in terms of speculative Smash newcomers imo.
We're slowly building up the greatest roster of all time. First, we got Gothitelle as an echo of Gardevoir and Mario2. Now we've got Katalina.
 

ThatOneAnon

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I think the thing a lot of people are forgetting about DLC is that... well it’s DLC.

Nintendo has to be able to SELL these to the general audience, NOT just the Smash fandom.

A character that has mass appeal or has an important role in an upcoming game is plausible.

A character who’s only speculated because they don’t have a spirit, doesn’t bode well for DLC at all.

Just keep that in mind.
This argument means nothing after we got characters like Corrin and (as much as it pains me to say it) Bayonetta. Hell, you could even argue the DLC veterans for Sm4sh (excluding Mewtwo for obvious reasons) were generally unknown to anyone who hadn't played Smash before.
The only DLC character you could maybe make the argument people would know is Ryu, but here's the thing: The general audience KNOWS what Street Fighter and Ryu are. The question is, is the general audience INTERESTED in Street Fighter? And I'd argue that, no, they aren't.
So literally every DLC character in Smash history, the general audience either doesn't know or is uninterested in.
Of course, back then Nintendo was basically only selling to Nintendo fans, and they knew this, because by that point we were way into the late stages of the Wii U's life cycle. So perhaps things could be different since the Switch was way more successful, but until further notice, I honestly don't think popularity is going to matter one way or the other.
 

Idon

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Also hot take:

Katalina is on-par with Gothitelle in terms of speculative Smash newcomers imo.
She's on par with the producer from idolm@ster or the general from kancolle.

As in ****ing impossible and the more people bring it up the more my brain cells start to explode.
 

NabiscoFelt

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are multiple endings confirmed? cuz it would be tight if for the final battle you had the choice to side with either one (who tf would side with discount sauron tho) or to destroy them both.
I believe one of the challenges is called "Get the true ending" and the cutscenes certainly seem to imply parallel scenarios (There's one with light enveloping everything and one with dark) so I'd say it's fairly likely we get multiple endings
 

Zeox

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Guys, I don't want to scare anyone, but it seems that "Blue", the velociraptor from Jurassic World, is not a spirit... so DLC confirmed!?!?!??!?!'1'1?!'1?!'1'!'!º1
 

A.G.L.

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I know, I also noticed how SE has been doing lately as well, the FGC has been in for quite a ride when Noctis and 2B were announced.

However, isn’t Geno more low hanging fruit compared to Sora, Cloud, and the other more high profile characters? I would assume that it would be easier to get Geno since he isn’t on the same level as them along with him being a lot more correlated with Nintendo. And Nintendo seemed to have been able to get the rights to Geno before, as seen with the Mii Costume in Smash 4 along with spirits in Ultimate.
The problem with Geno is he also does not fit Square's business patterns. He is not relevant anymore and does not represent the company. If he was added as we've seen from the datamining. He would be another Mario character and not seen as a Square representative. I agree Geno would be easier to get, but he would not help Square cross promote anything. In terms of money he would only help Square make short term income instead of long term income. Square prefers to put characters that are long term income. Im not saying Geno is impossible, but if we look at Square's past business patterns. He does not for the model of characters they use in other games.
 

Izayoi

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Right now, do you think Monster Hunter is the most likely DLC Newcomer?
To be honest, Monster Hunter would be an amazingly big Japanese pick. Everyone in Japan knows about the Monster Hunter series and a fighter would probably be a very welcome addition for them.
 

blackghost

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Are you saying that Crash and Banjo are underwhelming!?
for me personally yes to banjo. crash is a great addition imo. banjo i honestly couldn't care less. crash had a kart game, a main line series and a party game i think. I dont find the two on similar levels at all. banjo has like 2 great games and nothing of note since 2000 and he's microsoft. unless Microsoft wants to reboot the series (which doesnt fit at all into their plans in my estimation) they dont gain enough to do a deal for the characters use. very similar to SE and geno honestly. what fans want and companies want do not often overlap.

"Underwhelming" is subjective. Some people want more Nintendo characters. Some people want third-parties. Some people want both.

To use an example, if Travis Touchdown was revealed as the first DLC character, I would lose my mind and it would be one of the most hype Smash reveals of all time for me. However, for a large portion of the audience, he'd be "oh another swordsman from that new Switch game, that's cool I guess".

And to risk sounding like a broken record, a Style Savvy rep would be an absolute hoot for me since I loved Fashion Forward and think she'd come with fantastic music and lots of humorous moves. But to a lot of the audience people would see her as "that clothes stylist who stole [popular character]'s spot".

Of course I'm sure the GENERAL public would enjoy any character, but in terms of core Smash fandoms we are all different and want different things and have different ideas on what constitutes hype.
the DLC is for everyone that plays smash not the spoiled group that believes everything centers on them their desire for little known characters travis would be cool and he'd be a surprise for most. my main point is there will be at least two characters that will rock twitter and generate interest form nonsmash focused groups like ryu, cloud, and bayo did. looking at nintendo dlc record on main series games for things like mario kart, zelda, and smash 4 it is honestly impressive. i dont think that nintendo will swing low with dlc for the most preordered switch game ever. they will go for it all. i dont think there are many Nintendo characters left that embody that direction for the company. im not looking at what fans wantor which is considred "hype." Sakurai already appeased older and vocal fans about characters with addtional villains and the inclusion of requested characters. For DLC im looking at what nintendo has done in the past and how it will want to project into the future. the dlc characters in 4 brought mechanics, inputs, and had clear design goals (ryu and bayo were made fo hardcore players featuring combos and input commands) and cloud was made to be easy but still featured new mechanics.
 

Ramen Tengoku

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Guys, I don't want to scare anyone, but it seems that "Blue", the velociraptor from Jurassic World, is not a spirit... so DLC confirmed!?!?!??!?!'1'1?!'1?!'1'!'!º1
A Universal rep made so much sense in hindsight, with them collaborating with Nintendo on both theme park attractions and that animated Mario movie :4pacman:
 

Abha

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Guys, I don't want to scare anyone, but it seems that "Blue", the velociraptor from Jurassic World, is not a spirit... so DLC confirmed!?!?!??!?!'1'1?!'1?!'1'!'!º1
You sure it isn't Riptor from Killer Instinct?
 

Cosmic77

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Its possible, that all of this is true. However I just do not see Nintendo not wanting to promote FE Three Houses. Its very likely we will get a Three Houses rep. Especially because Nintendo is choosing this time around, its very likely they will push for one of their new characters. And given the fact the DLC character and FE Three Houses rep might come out around the same time. It makes sense Nintendo will want to capitalize on this and push a character from one of their most anticipated 2019 games. Metroid Prime 4 as far as we know isn't nearly as far in development as FE Three Houses. So pushing a Metroid character might not make the most sense. At least in the first fighters pass, if there is a second fighters pass then I can see Sylux being pushed here.
I mean, if Nintendo skipped out on Xenoblade 2, I don't think a Three Houses rep is guaranteed. I'd actually argue a MP4 rep is more likely. All signs are pointing to the game coming out next year, and given it's seemingly high budget and the franchise's poor track record in Japan, it definitely needs the promotion far more than FE.

I think people are quick to overestimate a Three Houses character's odds of getting in because of Corrin in Smash 4, but they keep forgetting that Nintendo wasn't the ones responsible for adding him. Sakurai's team was who chose him.
 
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