Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[osby]

Sadly, Lucina is the laziest clone. Poor girl can't even get an unique Final Smash or an unique stance :/

I don't want to call or lazy because they were literally added after development, but they kinda pale in comparison with Ultimate echoes. Eh, still beats being an alt. (Also if it's any consolation, her stance is unique to her now that Marth have a different one)

 

[Cutie Gwen]

i'm going to start using that as an insult

Well **** you too you winged snagret! Your mother was a wollywag!

 

[Deleted member]

Did you get-a the buff?

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Yes.
And-a what did it cost?
*flashback to all nerfs* Everything.

That would have been a god-tier buff if it could still make him rise in the air.

I mean, it's still good, but the damage has been done, and us Luigi mains are gonna have a bad time.

 

[Will]

Can't we go one damn day without bull****

This **** is standard, you can't avoid it and hoping to would be a lost cause.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

That would have been a god-tier buff if it could still make him rise in the air.

I mean, it's still good, but the damage has been done, and us Luigi mains are gonna have a bad time.

Can Manic Depressed Luigi become Canon then?

 

[GoeGoe]

Ishikawa Goemon for Smash
His final smash is Kirby's old Smash and he just kinda boils people alive

You mean gets boiled in (self destruct )

 

[Deleted member]

No..... I'm claiming this site has neonazis because there are users here I've seen their posts on certain matters. Like holy **** dude I even said ERA was equally toxic . Are you deliberately ignoring what you don't like? And I already said why I didn't directly name them. Read what I replied to Osby about

See if the claims that Ridley's down B ignore shields are right

Alright. Then if they are that bad, then **** them. But here the thing, I call out ResetEra because I think they’re full of scumy people, not because I’m a neonazi. Not even ****ing close. So if you’re gonna have issues with never calling out ResetEra, then do be it. I say what I want to.

This has already gone on far enough, so unless we want to incursvthe earth if the mods, I suggest, for both of our sakes, we drop this. Capers?

 

[Idon]

Honestly, wished they used some time to make DPit and Lucina more unique. The only reason they were their own characters was because they were last minute, so now with more time, they could be given some more differences.

 

[osby]

Honestly, wished they used some time to make them unique. The only reason they were their own characters was because they were last minute, so now with more time, they could be given some more differences.

More time? They were juggling 70+ characters.

 

[Bee Card]

Don't quote me on this, but I think my local Best Buy has the demo. What do you all wanna see?

I need to know if a day they will put an option to don't do smash with the A button (and put the smash option on the X button) so I can do tilt.
But I don't think that demo version has options

 

[Pyra]

I'm still watching a playthrough of Tingle's Rosy Rupeeland because @Tougon mentioned the final boss fight and it got me intrigued and

oh my god this is glorious

 

[Aerospherology]

PM me when we see Geno's Mii Costume or Spirit (not the icon).

 

[Will]

Honestly, wished they used some time to make DPit and Lucina more unique. The only reason they were their own characters was because they were last minute, so now with more time, they could be given some more differences.

What exactly would they change?

 

[Androobie]

But here the thing, I call out ResetEra because I think they’re full of scumy people, not because I’m a neonazi.

At this point, I’m not sure if you actually didn’t read her post, or you’re choosing to ignore what she’s saying.

 

[osby]

Highlights from the full interview with Sakurai from Game Informer:


A lot of stupid arguments I heard from people saying that SSE 2 or "X" character is confirmed, or complaints about X thing being missing, boiled down to "But this is Ultimate, so it should be there!" Can't fully blame them, since the marketing, even up to the recent video with Xander Mobus, used the subtitle to hype up the game. But the subtitle is "Special" in Japan, and way back in June, Sakurai said "Smash is special," referring to the whole franchise, so the subtitle has no bearing on how Sakurai or the team view the game. Ultimate isn't any more special than any other Smash game in their eyes.


So there are no mid-development cuts or additions, like many people seemed to believe. That's part of why I didn't believe the Grinch hoax; the only corroborating "leak" was the "Chadindorf" leak, which claimed that there were cuts to the game, which didn't align with the smoothness of Smash 4 or Ultimate's development. Some people say that Chrom must have been a late addition, but this seems to be untrue as well.

The Smash ballot does matter, and is probably still being taken into account for DLC. Perhaps even moreso, since Ultimate's roster seems to be mostly ballot characters with some others added in, like Incineroar, Ken, and Piranha Plant.

And apparently Pokemon is the only series that gets a special reservation, because it's Pokemon, the most profitable franchise in the world. That at least makes sense.


Interesting... So it sounds like Sakurai might be looking for a protege. The dude's almost 50, and works like the madman we all know he is, so he can't go on forever. It'll be interesting to see if that happens, who it will be, and how much of Sakurai's philosophy they'll carry forward.


So Sakurai is very aware of the positive reactions to the game, which is great. No doubt the huge letter from the K. Rool fans made it his way, so I'm sure he must feel very happy and relieved that, in spite of some negative reactions, this game has also had unprecedented positive reactions.


This is the best part of the interview, to me.

We've all classified characters like Piranha Plant, Wii Fit, etc. as the "Wacky surprise" that Sakurai loves, but here he says that surprise isn't an element at all. It's more about creating an interesting and diverse cast of characters who are all fun and unique, rather than just having the same stereotypical characters fill up the roster, even if it's at the cost of some popular picks. This is why I've been excited about some of the characters in Smash that I'm not going to play, but I think it's at least cool they've been announced. Isabelle and Incineroar add new personalities to the game that didn't exist before, so even if they weren't hugely popular picks, they bring some more variety to a game that's all about variety.

As opposed to the "anime swordsmen" who are all variations of the same archetype, even if their personalities in their respective games are different. All the Fire Emblem characters in the game have unique stories and personalities in their games, but due to how Smash operates, they're not able to show very much of that personality in the game, where they're generally all stoic-faced and can only say some small lines that aren't always even in English.


This is the mark of an excellent project lead. Someone who is able to recognize the limitations at hand, yet work with them in order to still make something that's unique and interesting. Not everyone is able to do this, and that's how some games or other projects enter development hell, go over-schedule and over-budget, etc. But Sakurai's been doing this since he was younger than I am now, so he understands how to manage a game's development and recognize what's possible and what isn't, even when what's possible for him is far more than most other directors.

Also, it seems that he and the team definitely learned from Smash 4's lack of a solid single-player experience, and are aiming to make up for it, despite those limitations. Very good to hear.


This is really interesting. So it sounds like getting even all the Nintendo characters together is sometimes a hassle. Maybe he's just referring to the third parties, like Capcom and Konami, but those are only 3 or so characters each. It sounds like he's referring to the cast across the board, which is odd. Obviously Pokemon isn't difficult to deal with, given that they get a special reservation, but where is the difficulty?

Also interesting how Smash 3 and beyond could've been developed exclusively by HAL without Sakurai, but it was Iwata who chose to make Sakurai the head even if it meant using a new team/studio. Shows how strong their friendship was and how much faith Iwata had in Sakurai. Of course, they were coworkers at HAL, so that only makes sense.

Sakurai has his flaws--he's not some kind of demigod whose work is divine, and he has made mistakes--but his strengths are what makes him and Smash so special. Compared to if the game were developed more horizontally without his singular direction, where characters would be chosen and made more by committee, the different modes, features, and options would be basic and unimaginative, and the overall quality and polish would be lesser. E.g., the many derivatives of Smash, like PlayStation All-Stars or those Cartoon Network games.

Hey, nice to see more positivity around here. aside from obligatory 'anime swordsman' rant

 

[Paperchampion23]

Honestly, wished they used some time to make DPit and Lucina more unique. The only reason they were their own characters was because they were last minute, so now with more time, they could be given some more differences.

At least they have their gameplay differences, it almost looks like Daisy, D. Samus and possibly Richter have almost zero notable differences except obvious appearance and D. Samus's animations. Hoping Richter's whip is actually longer but weaker like people keep saying, but I'm nervous for the other 2.

Gotta wait for hard numbers and framedata.

 

[TeenGirlSquad]

Is it actually confirmed that the "wavedashing" in this game is basically useless? I still think it's possible that characters like Luigi could actually get some traction out of the new wavedashing/wavelanding, in which case he might be better than we're thinking. But I'm not sure.

 

[Deleted member]

I like discussing Smash in this thread so I'll say for those who aren't doing that to shut up instead of actually discussing Smash.

I'm convinced Zephiel is just a dragon weeb.

Zephiel: "Dragons are so cool, they're btter than us humans. Rawwr, that's dragon for I 'love you'."
Zephiel's Father: "I've gotta kill this child before it's too late"

Hmmm.
"These people are different and don't deserve to live"
"Hey, you guys say that place is toxic but this place is just as toxic too, and I'm not going to directly mention my biggest examples to prevent harassment or whatever"
wow these are literally the same kind of people

Reminds me of this

 

[Diem]

Sakurai give me bunny suit Chrom alt.

I wouldn't mind additional alt costumes as DLC. Samus needs her Prime or Samus Returns design desperately. Mewtwo should get his armor, and the Zelda cast could get their previous designs back as well.

The concern would be hitboxes, rigging, etc., but Project M seemed to do it without much difficulty. I'd love more alt costumes instead of more Mii costumes.

 

[Will]

I call out ResetEra because I think they’re full of scumy people, not because I’m a neonazi.

If she's gonna call anyone a neonazi it would probably be me.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Now that we've all let loose some steam, how about some music choices in Smash? I highly doubt those can be political. I'll start by suggesting the Metal Gear Rising track Collective Consciousness

 

[Idon]

What exactly would they change?

Small stuff
Give Lucina Chrom's up B
Change 1 animation on DPit to use the claws or have a neutral B staff.

 

[osby]

At least they have their gameplay differences, it almost looks like Daisy, D. Samus and possibly Richter have almost zero notable differences except obvious appearance and D. Samus's animations. Hoping Richter's whip is actually longer but weaker like people keep saying, but I'm nervous for the other 2.

Gotta wait for hard numbers and framedata.

Dark Samus's bombs make her go to a different direction and her attacks have electric effect.

 

[praline]

I’m glad Break Free from Super Mario Odyssey is in Ultimate. That’s the only good vocal track from Odyssey.

 

[osby]

I wouldn't mind additional alt costumes as DLC. Samus needs her Prime or Samus Returns design desperately. Mewtwo should get his armor, and the Zelda cast could get their previous designs back as well.

The concern would be hitboxes, rigging, etc., but Project M seemed to do it without much difficulty. I'd love more alt costumes instead of more Mii costumes.

Tbh, most of the Project M alts look like butt.

 

[Will]

Give Lucina Chrom's up B

Okay but why though, that just makes Lucina more a Chrom clone than a Marth clone if you ask me.

Change 1 animation on DPit to use the claws or have a neutral B staff.

Claws are cool but the Staff was made into an item so it loses its purpose there. also something something his final smash

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Small stuff
Give Lucina Chrom's up B
Change 1 animation on DPit to use the claws or have a neutral B staff.

You know, that kind of means Lucina is a better fighter than Chrom. Then again Chrom got ****ing annihilated by Captain Falcon whereas Lucina held her own for a bit

 

[Pyra]

Now that we've all let loose some steam, how about some music choices in Smash? I highly doubt those can be political. I'll start by suggesting the Metal Gear Rising track Collective Consciousness

The national anthem of the Soviet Union
Malo Mart from Twilight Princess

 

[Idon]

Okay but why though, that just makes Lucina more a Chrom clone than a Marth clone if you ask me.


Claws are cool but the Staff was made into an item so it loses its purpose there. also something something his final smash

Yeah but
1. It's more canon
2. It's a neat reference
3. It further differentiates her from Marth.

And like there's nothing stopping DPit from just... doing both attacks but the final smash being super flashy.

 

[osby]

Now that we've all let loose some steam, how about some music choices in Smash? I highly doubt those can be political. I'll start by suggesting the Metal Gear Rising track Collective Consciousness

Are you guys interested in me begging for more Sonic Unleashed tracks umpteenth time?

 

[Deleted member]

Small stuff
Give Lucina Chrom's up B
Change 1 animation on DPit to use the claws or have a neutral B staff.

Why give Lucina Chrom’s Up B?

 

[RyuhoFox]

I hope we still have the Geno Mii costume in the game since I never got it for 4. Noticed both Springman and what looks like a ZSS one recently as well so it looks like there are a bunch more than I expected.

 

[Opossum]

Now that we've all let loose some steam, how about some music choices in Smash? I highly doubt those can be political. I'll start by suggesting the Metal Gear Rising track Collective Consciousness

AND LINKS PLEASE, NOT EMBEDS.

There. Now I'll be able to read the thread.

 

[Kotor]

Y'all shunning other sites for being toxic when this site had someone use a literal altright conspiracy theorist as an avatar. Not as in "SJW GOT TRIGGERED COMPILATION 29769271 BECAUSE BEING OFFENSIVE IS COOL" but as in "WHITE PEOPLE ARE UNDER ATTACK AND GETTING OPPRESSED BY THE FILTHY NONWHITES! HOLLYWOOD IS CONSPIRING TO TELL CHILDREN THAT MEN ARE OBSOLETE! FROZEN IN LEFTIST PROPAGANDA! BLACK PANTHER ACTUALLY PROMOTES ANTI IMMIGRATION! FEMINISTS ARE RUINING CHILDREN PASTA CANS BECAUSE I GOT ICKY FFFFFEEEEEMAAAAAALES ON MY KIDDY PASTA CANS INSTEAD OF THE ONE WITH BATMAN" The guy had that as an avatar for well over a month, hasn't seen any consequences as far as I could tell and one of the mods here KNOWS the guy in question is a neonazi and knew who the guy in his avatar was

Uhh.... I think Phoenix Wright is a lock for DLC?

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Now that we've all let loose some steam, how about some music choices in Smash? I highly doubt those can be political. I'll start by suggesting the Metal Gear Rising track Collective Consciousness

The Divine Trial from BOTW, maybe?

 

[Roberk]

Yeah but at least it comes out before Christmas wont you be visiting or having family visit then?

I barely have anybody over for Christmas and it’s usually just for dinner, Thanksgiving is multiple days of many people from the ages of kids to millennials for me, so it’s much more varied and entertaining.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Uhh.... I think Phoenix Wright is a lock for DLC?

thats a funny way of saying Professor Layton

 

[Deleted member]

Changes I would make to Echoes(Chrom and Ken are fine as they are):
Down B is now like Shulk's; Final Smash is Tempest Trial, where she summons a vortex in the middle of the stage
Neutral B is a weaker version of the Staff item
Missile is replaced with a rapid fire shot, can be angled up or down slightly; Down B produces a copy of herself, pressing it again will have the clone perform an A move.
Holy Water now works like it does in SotN's Richter Mode, lingering less but moving slightly forward; FS is now Hydro Storm
forcibly removed her from the game

 

[RyuhoFox]

Why give Lucina Chrom’s Up B?

Tmk Lucina and Chrom are supposed to be very similar fighters in canon and in game share that skill so it would makes sense for them to share the attack in Smash

 

[Will]

Yeah but
1. It's more canon
2. It's a neat reference
3. It further differentiates her from Marth.

And like there's nothing stopping DPit from just... doing both attacks but the final smash being super flashy.

1.
2. ok
3. You could just give her an entirely new move or give her Roy's type of recovery.

DPit's Staff is defeated by the Staff item in purpose.