Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Mutsukki]

Some guys on 4chan have found the actual renders and not just the silhouette: they screenshotted them and posted them on 4chan. Those came from a different trailer.

I don't know the source and I didn't even search to be honest, though that trailer alone is not enough to prove or debunk anything, we need to do more research first.
And by the way, there's no back of the grinch, it's still a front picture, just it's the one without the dog.

That's what I always thought, that it was the front. But people were so adamant on it being the back that I had to go and find one of it.

And luckily there it was

 

[Fenzer]

The worst part of it is..... we only have those leak to help us cope with the wait. We can't take anything for granted, it's merely speculations and god only know what's going to be revealed and when.
God damn Smash, why are you Smash?

 

[Mutsukki]

May I posit a crazy, absolutely insane theory, about this supposed leak, based on what we know for a fact is coming up.

We have two Live events going on in Tokyo (Nov. 3rd-4th), and Kyoto (Nov. 23rd-24th), and it's quite possible that one of the items shown in the leak pertained to a wrap-around banner of some kind for a cylindrical display... Then, maybe this could be what we're seeing:

What if the banner contradicts with various 'Insiders' because the banner shown here is incomplete? And if incomplete, what if this means this banner is specifically for a display at the upcoming Nov. 3rd-4th Nintendo Live 2018 event? And what if that means that there is another banner that is being worked on that differs here, and is perhaps the actual banner the insiders know about, and will be put up for display at the next event on Nov. 23rd-24th? ERGO...

If the leak banner is inaccurate because it's missing key characters previously leaked from insiders, that means we haven't seen all of the fighters yet.

Maybe.

Or, maybe this is not at all what's going on, and it's only as simple as one side or the other being fed false information, be it by insider or by the leak. I think the former's more fun, even if absolutely impossible, though.

insert the conspiracy guy jpeg here

I would not even want to go through the logistics of having a French company printing your stuff for your Japanese event

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Virtual Boy stage would be kinda neat. Can't think of a lot of a lot of Nintendo properties that don't already have character representation. Unless you go back to like B-list NES games. Lolo's castle?

Okay, now I really want a Virtual Boy stage thanks to you...

But do you know who they have permission to make fake promotional material of?

First party characters.

Like, say, Incineroar.

Incineroar is still not fully owned by Nintendo
Pokemon is Co-owend by Nintendo, Gamefreak, and Creatures inc.

 

[ErenJager]

Both ResetERA and NeoGAF have always been super toxic echo chambers, please. Stop putting those cesspools on a pedestal as if they have any validity due to their reputations. Everything is fallable, the words of "insiders" mean **** all on their own. Do your own research, and use your head.

Also, your first claim would still imply the leak is real. Unless you wanna suggest a 50yo Frenchman made a fake smash leak to troll us all. Because that's who took the Snapchat, it came from Eric Brigard's phone.

Or did someone buy a cheap phone or change their name on their phone to his name?

 

[Chrono.]

I'm at a line at the bank browsing smashboards for rumor mill discussion.

This is my life now.

 

[beans]

TBH I want insiders to be wrong cause they act too smug for my taste.
You cant be that smug to me, only fictional female characters of japanese origin can be that smug to me

 

[Mango The Magician]

Guys the Grinch render wouldn't be hard to fake at all.

Both these existed before the leak.

Combine them and you get this

 

[Graizen]

YO imagine that!

The "fake leaker" took his time to put a Grinch poster just to make the leak more real!

WOW! And people discussed this and said it was fake the same way?

 

[Deleted member]

Some guys on 4chan have found the actual renders and not just the silhouette: they screenshotted them and posted them on 4chan. Those came from a different trailer.

I don't know the source and I didn't even search to be honest, though that trailer alone is not enough to prove or debunk anything, we need to do more research first.
And by the way, there's no back of the grinch, it's still a front picture, just it's the one without the dog.

What about this one?

Compare it with the one of the leak in your image.

Also, people are saying these have been publically available for a long time. I'd like to see proof of that, not meaningless words. Also remember that the Snapchat leak is about a month old now. So this material was on Eric's desk about a month ago.

 

[Mutsukki]

Honestly, you have to do very heavy mental gimnastics to think that this is fake. In a court all of this evidence would have been a complete sentence because it circumstacially is too heavy to ignore all of it.

The man was old and mostly wont care about smash that much. Was ******** about his job and didn't know that that armband had so heavy spoiler info. In fact these things are usually without value: for example we got leaked grinch renders and we DONT ****ING CARE, and for him I'm sure that the smash thing would be the same ****ing thing because these thing of promotional **** is normally done public, to help people make connection between promotion and product. It, is, real.

As I said, the only possibility is that Nintendo somehow backed up with the roster and did a change after sending these to print. These couldn't have been from a long time ago, simply because there was no events being held. Is almost sure that those are being prepared for an upcoming event in november or in store sales.

Face it, it's done. This IS real, the only thing left is confirmation from Nintendo.

Incineroar will be day one dlc i suppose, like mewtwo.

Jesus Christ please do not ever think of becoming a judge. If you think ANY of this evidence (which you even admitted is circumstancial) is enough to pass a veredict I wouldn't even want to think about what kind of incompetent legal system would allow that.

 

[BluePikmin11]

So Vergeben is now claiming Incineroar will be DLC. What strikes me as interesting is his wording, in that he wasn't actively denying the Grinch leak. His previous posts were just this leak not being what his sources told him, which is a much more fair approach than "Trust me guys, it's fake."

Two questions:

1. Is there a Gamefaqs source that has Vergeben saying this?
2. Have multiple sources confirmed to Vergeben about this information?

If Segment's article is to be trusted, what Verge has said is mostly speculation then. It might actually be speculation from the SegmentNext author really.

 

[GunBlaze]

And here. we. GO.

https://twitter.com/Meshima_/status/1055799886585585664

 

[mbvswb]

Nothing of value has happened since the new item, huh?

 

[Deleted member]

Or did someone buy a cheap phone or change their name on their phone to his name?

Would this be after making the fake Smash leak with perfect precision to fool us all? They would also probably have to know Eric, and since the Grinch leak is real, they'd have to either be Graphic designers themselves as well, or be in Eric's office to frame him.

 

[MrGame&Rock]

I just wrote up a big post and I guess the forums software ****in ate it?

heres the bullet points
hope its not breaking a rule to post this link

https://www.resetera.com/threads/ru...er-updates-in-op.76702/page-145#post-14199041

this real background comparison completely shattered the leak for me. I dont know how anyone can look at it as real anymore.

Theres absolutely no reason to believe that the name in the leak needed to be involved in the leak. Someone who wants to make a fake leak can find a semi legitimate linkedin to throw under the bus. The name is super visibile in the leak with some minor photomanipulation and that feels deliberate. In addition to blacking out their name they could have just cropped it out of the photo frame.

Theres also absolutely no reason that one of tens of thousands of posts on 4channel with every single variant of any smash roster acts as corroborating evidence for any leak

This is a solid point. I don't know if it's completely 100% damning because 1) it could have been a distortion created by the poor image quality, 2) the banner could have just changed, that's completely possible, and 3) there's a lot of evidence in favor of this being real, like the dielines, the fact that this banner has some parts of certain characters that we've never seen, that it doesn't use anything pre-made, etc.

So I was #teamreal but I'm now #teamunsure. Because I don't know what to make of that inconsistency. But hey, we'll probably get new official info soon that will put this debate to rest.

edit: also, the blank banner isn't even the focus of the snapchat video. It's in a corner, decently far away. (credit to my friend Fortunate Sun on discord for this point) So that makes a debunking based solely on the blank banner more questionable.

 

[Pyra]

And here. we GO.

https://twitter.com/Meshima_/status/1055799886585585664

Excellent news!

 

[Pazzo.]

"Some say that the souls of those banned on ResetERA can still be heard on moonless nights."

 

[Opossum]

Hoping it's real. Gimme Mach Rider and the Chorus Kids.

Anything before gen 4 just doesn't work good.

There is nothing overtly wrong with the third generation mechanically, though. The physical-special split in the fourth generation was an update, not a bug fix. The only huge issue in gen three was with the IVs of roaming legendaries, but it didn't make the game borderline unplayable.

 

[JacobLeBeauOFFICIAL]

And here. we GO.

https://twitter.com/Meshima_/status/1055799886585585664

I don't understand...?

 

[Mutsukki]

What about this one?

View attachment 172307


Compare it with the one of the leak in your image.

Also, people are saying these have been publically available for a long time. I'd like to see proof of that, not meaningless words. Also remember that the Snapchat leak is about a month old now. So this material was on Eric's desk about a month ago.

My dude I just hit up you with a link that you conveniently ignored, but here it is again, with the blog post date in it:

https://screenrant.com/grinch-2018-movie-trailer-poster-final/

Funny that you ask people to use their head when you're the most delusional one in these discussions.

 

[KMDP]

Okay, now I really want a Virtual Boy stage thanks to you...

Incineroar is still not fully owned by Nintendo
Pokemon is Co-owend by Nintendo, Gamefreak, and Creatures inc.

But Game Freak and Creatures Inc are pretty much First Party Companies for Nintendo nowadays (seriously, when was the last time they made anything not for Nintendo?)

Something else, "fake" promotional artwork doesn't have to go to waste if they make the characters after the fact.

Putting an idea out there, Sakurai could have an agreement with Game Freak to use Incineroar as the "fake leak", as long as he eventually gets into the game as DLC or something.

 

[Fenriraga]

watch me break a rule with my first post in years here.

I do not comprehend how anyone can look at this background comparison and still seriously discuss the grinch leak:

https://www.resetera.com/threads/ru...er-updates-in-op.76702/page-145#post-14199041

That aside the character list feels like a GameFAQs Melee fanfiction list where everyone’s elusive fav got in. Its only missing Ashley and a bunch of others that actually did get added this time / last (like mac and krool and castlevania)

As someone who loves Geno and hates Banjo and Isaac I would put all three of them on the same level of undeservedness to make a smash roster.

I’m sticking with not even the insiders on this one, but what I feel is the obvious gut feeling which is that there’s maybe another one or two characters and a handful of echoes to announce.

(which covers boring pokemon like incineroar instead of good ones like raichu or decidueye. and all your ken shadow etc echoes)

Spoiler: Spoiler because naughty words

Hi, welcome back, have a counterpoint

 

[Pyra]

I don't understand...?

New demo.

EDIT: obviously potentially

 

[Ring-a-Sheep]

Feel free to take my personal opinion with a grain of salt but i feel like calling day 1 DLC ain't right, and i personally don't think sm4sh is a good argument for day 1 DLC, it had two releases and by the time mewtwo was announced the 3DS version was already released so honestly i don't see day 1 DLC for ultimate, that's just me though ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ .

 

[Amiibo Doctor]

Can we all just stop arguing for a second and pop a 100 yeet

Still think its real

 

[Deleted member]

I don't understand...?

Whatever build they're using at that event is probably not the E3 one.

Given how close we are to release, I wouldn't be shocked if it's version 1.0.

 

[Iridium]

And here. we GO.

https://twitter.com/Meshima_/status/1055799886585585664

Well, if I get some good footage to scrutinize, then good! I wouldn't expect a significant amount of changes anyway though.

 

[Garteam]

An actual wolf is boring.

An orange wolf with a mohawk, geokinesis, a counter-based playstyle, and a red-eyed powered up form isn't quite what I'd call "an actual wolf".

 

[Paperchampion23]

And here. we GO.

https://twitter.com/Meshima_/status/1055799886585585664

When is this? Because I have the feeling that the direct may happen before this

 

[Pyra]

When is this? Because I have the feeling that the direct may happen before this

First Nintendo Live event is in about
A week.
A week.
A week.
A week.

Dammit, King Zora, **** off!

 

[GunBlaze]

When is this? Because I have the feeling that the direct may happen before this

November 2nd, 11:45 PM EST

 

[Fenzer]

And here. we GO.

https://twitter.com/Meshima_/status/1055799886585585664

Damn! That's interesting! At least, something new!

 

[AustinMooMoo]

Honestly, you have to do very heavy mental gimnastics to think that this is fake. In a court all of this evidence would have been a complete sentence because it circumstacially is too heavy to ignore all of it.

The man was old and mostly wont care about smash that much. Was ******** about his job and didn't know that that armband had so heavy spoiler info. In fact these things are usually without value: for example we got leaked grinch renders and we DONT ****ING CARE, and for him I'm sure that the smash thing would be the same ****ing thing because these thing of promotional **** is normally done public, to help people make connection between promotion and product. It, is, real.

As I said, the only possibility is that Nintendo somehow backed up with the roster and did a change after sending these to print. These couldn't have been from a long time ago, simply because there was no events being held. Is almost sure that those are being prepared for an upcoming event in november or in store sales.

Face it, it's done. This IS real, the only thing left is confirmation from Nintendo.

Incineroar will be day one dlc i suppose, like mewtwo.

I think the real mental gymnastics is not realizing that both sides have valid points with evidence supporting their claims. I am on one side of this debate but I still understand why people have the views that oppose mine. Additionally, I am exhausted hearing about the 50 year old being too old for snapchat nonsense, I believe it was stated by one individual and spread like wildfire as a retort to team fake. We all need to be a little more open-minded instead of dismissive of someone who doesn't share our viewpoint.

 

[Graizen]

Guys the Grinch render wouldn't be hard to fake at all.

Both these existed before the leak.
View attachment 172308View attachment 172309
Combine them and you get this
View attachment 172310

MY GOD

He faked the Grinch part as well!?

This leaker must be the smartest person in the universe!

 

[Deleted member 269706]

Followers of leaks are becoming dogmatic. Your biases, your hopes are blinding you o heratics! There is but one true leader-- the great Sakurai! Follow him and only him. Thou shall not appease the cries of the false prophets. They only seek you present you as foolish. Patience o child, our revelation is near

 

[drag0nscythe]

Guys the Grinch render wouldn't be hard to fake at all.

Both these existed before the leak.
View attachment 172308View attachment 172309
Combine them and you get this
View attachment 172310

Yeah. But why though?

 

[Pazzo.]

If the leak is real (which I'm leaning on fake for now), which bets will you have to fulfill?

If Shadow is legit, I'll have to upload myself eating Wheaties in salt water with an extra serving of salt. I'll upload it here even.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Using the Grinch render is not a argument against it did the person claim never seen before

Here's the real smoking gun if you guys absolutely insist on it

Is the present the Grinch connect to know or not?

If its no go find a hanger of it and see if the present is the same or not

 

[osby]

New demo.

EDIT: obviously potentially

"BUT WHEN!?" I ask, in a perfectly calm manner.