Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[PsySmasher]

Here's the problem.
I can say it is a fake as well!
But i can't say why!

You understand now genius?

As someone who would benefit from the leak being fake, but is neutral on whether or not it's real, let me just say this:

Calm Down
(This extends to everyone else who's deep into speculation)

Whether it's because you're most wanted character won't get in because of the leak
Or because you don't believe this, Vergeben or any other source of leaks...

Don't let your emotions override your reasoning. You'll come off more as a jerk than someone trying to make a point.

 

[Chrono.]

Jokes aside, I don't think this place has been that bad in regards to discussing this rumor.

I feel it was worse when the box theory first popped up, now that was a ****storm.

 

[SuperSmashLover]

Only 1 Echo was revealed during E3

No, I didn't mean new echos (Daisy) only. I'm counting Dark Pit and Lucina as well.

 

[Pazzo.]

I've gotta ask a quick question.

Why would Simon and Richter get revealed together, yet Ryu and Ken not be revealed together?

Quite a few echos (I believe it was 3 out of the currently officially confirmed 6) were revealed in the original wave of information that came with the "Everyone is Here" trailer.

Here's a hot take, which i hope is horribly wrong; What if Ken was actually the false leak the whole time?

I know, it sounds ridiculous, but compared to Dark Samus and Chrome, does Ken come across as a "surprise" character to anyone that would warrant his own independent announcement?

Interesting point. Sakurai certainly doesn't seem to keep consistency on Echo fighters...

On another note, welcome.
It makes me to see a new user with an avatar I created.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Man this leak is a doozy. The ride never stops.

Better then having a drought though.

 

[Untouch]

Jokes aside, I don't think this place has been that bad in regards to discussing this rumor.

I feel it was worse when the box theory first popped up, now that was a ****storm.

I wish I had the self control required to stop looking at this thread because it's going to be 100x worse during the direct.

 

[owjies]

just gonna make a comment on this one.The rough part isnt moving characters and pasting them somewhere. Everybody with decent graphical skills can do such a thing. But the really rough part is to keep the background accurate. Especially considering the fact that on one of the pictures, the entire background without characters on it was presented. This is a huge deal because somebody would have to take the time to produce himself the missing parts of the stage, the clouds, the lightings and so on. This is not something you just cut and paste from one point to another. And making renders of the newcomers in an artstyle that fits the already existing characters' look is also something that you won't just do that easily. Just consider the time someone has to put into this entire leak to produce it himself. Hard to say how many hours/days you will need to be able to produce a fake leak like this.

Also besides arguing about the editing that has to be done, there are a lot of other questions you should also ask yourself:
1. Why would someone even try to move many characters? If you are capable of drawing any character in the artstyle of the Ultimate banner, you probably would try to make renders that fit pretty easy into already existing gaps.
2. Why bother to show a picture with only the background without any characters? Completely unnecessary work you do. Unless you don't need to do the work because you already have access to the background without characters, then it's easy to just add it in case anyone is doubting the leak.
3. Why hide a name in the corner of the image? Also not really something, a fake leaker would put any effort into.
4.Why hide the name so poorly that people can still figure out what's written there? Furthermore why put a name of a person into the leak who has a connection to a company working with Bandai Namco?
5. Why even bother making a Grinch movie render?
These are already 5 things I highly doubt any fake leaker would put any effort into. There exists too much information alongside the actual character reveals on the banner and trying to debunk this will be much harder than some people think. If I try to put myself into the position of a fake leaker, I would definitely only try to make one good, kinda possible/realistic picture without any context. And of course I would go with something likely and avoid anything that seems unlikely. At this point I want to throw in some names: Would you let Incineroar out after people are almost convinced he is in the game? On the other side: Would you put Chorus Kid into your fake leak alongside safe guesses like Ken and Shadow?

I do understand that people are being sceptical about any leak but one point some people already brought up: Do not forget people who wanted to debunk the ESRB leak by arguing about Shulk having the face of Little Mac.

Regarding #2, I think it's likely that the person (or people) that put this together recreated the background after removing the characters and placing them on individual layers. You would need that blank background in order to freely rearrange existing characters and insert the original characters. They would've accomplished this partially using the clonestamp tool in photoshop and maybe some original painting if they're skilled. The blurry, low-res quality of the shot diminishes most mistakes or imperfections that they may have made. These would be pretty straightforward (albeit time consuming) tasks for people with graphic design or vfx skills.

The main reason I'm skeptical, as awesome as this lineup would be, is that we're basing this all off of one low-res image. If the leakers showed us the full-res source image for the print, we may have debunked this right away based on the quality of the original artwork. It still may be real, and I'd be happy to be wrong, but I'd rather be surprised than disappointed.

 

[CosmicQuark]

I mean, I told everyone to stop acting like he was already confirmed. I ****ing love the Cat but seeing people shove Inceneroar down other people's throats as a sure thing was getting old. The tables have turned now it seems and it looks like people are hating on Incenaroar, sadly.

I don't fully believe this leak but if it's real and I lose Inceneroar I'm fine with that. It just means I'll have to support him for DLC pretty hard.

Friendly reminder to everyone that ****ting on a character or their fanbase is not ok. Don't be a **** about it. You can speculate without being a ****.

I wish people could. As much as I love Banjo, I've been avoiding my own fan thread due to the toxicity some people have (and this is coming from someone who doesn't like [character who shall remain nameless]).

My hope is the leak is real and Incineroar is still in, either revealed last or as the first DLC character.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Oh one reason why a direct could handle 5-7 characters your all forgetting they could do a hour long direct that shows the rest of the stuff of smash

 

[Nekoo]

https://smashboards.com/threads/sma...spoilers-leaks.434391/page-6074#post-22587891


Thoughts on Papagenos source?

Can be truth, especially since it seems to be one of HIS close friends, however said source also heard about Incineroar and seems confused on where it went, but it also raise hope for Banjo, since it seems close to Microsoft too.
I'm in 50/50 but on the positive side- Hopefully, he don't get scammed, especially since he seems genuine.


Also AHEM
For the people who keep believing that the Chad-leak was what ruffled feather...

It was Square-Enix who seemingly internally panicked, not Nintendo, as Tansut seems to have SE link. so...
Either they panicked because that Text leak is truth and did leak Geno, because I'm not sure SE knows who's in or not in beside their characters.
But that also doesn't make sense because Sassy Geno also happened at the same time, and everyone though.

Just a food for though.

 

[Noipoi]

Jokes aside, I don't think this place has been that bad in regards to discussing this rumor.

I feel it was worse when the box theory first popped up, now that was a ****storm.

I barely even remember what it was like when the box first appeared. I remember the first post regarding the theory and some reactions, but besides that it feels like the box has been part of my life forever.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

https://smashboards.com/threads/sma...spoilers-leaks.434391/page-6074#post-22587891

I mean when you put it that way. Then yes.

Just yes.

Still Team Hmm, Indeed. (Selling those sweatshirts still!)

But yeah.

 

[Luigi The President]

No, I didn't mean new echos (Daisy) only. I'm counting Dark Pit and Lucina as well.

Which you really shouldn't, since they're veterans

 

[kirbsmash]

ANYBODY ON TEAM MAYBE?

 

[7982Brick]

Has this been mentioned?

 

[ZephyrZ]

I've gotta ask a quick question.

Why would Simon and Richter get revealed together, yet Ryu and Ken not be revealed together?

Quite a few echos (I believe it was 3 out of the currently officially confirmed 6) were revealed in the original wave of information that came with the "Everyone is Here" trailer.

Here's a hot take, which i hope is horribly wrong; What if Ken was actually the false leak the whole time?

I know, it sounds ridiculous, but compared to Dark Samus and Chrome, does Ken come across as a "surprise" character to anyone that would warrant his own independent announcement?

Because Simon and Richter were both newcomers. The Everyone is Here trailer focused on veterans, plus Inkling because they had already been confirmed. Lucina and Dark Pit were in the Everyone is Here trailer because they were veterans. Dark Samus and Chrom, however, were not despite echoing veterans. It'll presumably be the same for Ken.

 

[ChocolatGelgato]

if this is fake some of yall teamfakers are gonna be real mean too, i wouldn't call yourself the kind ones just yet until you actually prove it after keninceneroar happens or whatever the ****.

Yeah i'm *still* tentatively grinch gang atm im just waiting for something that doesn't bring us back to square one, which most arguments for or against basically amount to for the last day.

Still mildly interested in what papagenos has to say tho. I still fear he might just be gullible here (sorry if ur reading this lly really) but what he says may be food for thought, but like most other insiders, it doesn't really mean much (especically as papagenos is a middle man with no record of insider info until now)

 

[Chrollo.]

Jokes aside, I don't think this place has been that bad in regards to discussing this rumor.

I feel it was worse when the box theory first popped up, now that was a ****storm.

I don’t really mind Box Theory, but if its true and its Ken & Incineroar left, I really would’ve wish they switched Incineroar and K Rool’s announcements. Ending on someone so controversial just feels lackluster to me.

 

[Luigi The President]

Can be truth, especially since it seems to be one of HIS close friends, however said source also heard about Incineroar and seems confused on where it went, but it also raise hope for Banjo, since it seems close to Microsoft too.
I'm in 50/50 but on the positive side- Hopefully, he don't get scammed, especially since he seems genuine.


Also AHEM
For the people who keep believing that the Chad-leak was what ruffled feather...

It was Square-Enix who seemingly internally panicked, not Nintendo, as Tansut seems to have SE link. so...
Either they panicked because that Text leak is truth and did leak Geno, because I'm not sure SE knows who's in or not in beside their characters.
But that also doesn't make sense because Sassy Geno also happened at the same time, and everyone though.

Just a food for though.

Does it not stand to reason that SE has...well for lack of a better word "spies" who would know about the games roster, with how big the company is

 

[Michael the Spikester]

ANYBODY ON TEAM MAYBE?

Since I'm 50/50 yes.

 

[Cosmic77]

"LOL No way Incineroar is getting in over Decidueye or Mimikyu. He's not popular and we already have like a dozen fighters with moves like his." - May 2018

"WHAT!?!? IT'S NOT DECIDUEYE!?!? FREAKING INCINEROAR IS GETTING IN!?!?" - July 2018

"I've come to accept it. We're probably getting stupid fire cat as the last newcomer." - September 2018

"I swear, if this leak is fake and we're getting Incineroar, I'm giving up on Ultimate!" - October 2018


Poor Incineroar can't catch a break.

 

[Buzzwole]

I just wish Nintendo would reveal something. Its been quite a while now since Isabelle was confirmed and there isn't much time left to reveal stuff.
Reviewers are going to have the game soon. I don't know why they've decided to stay silent for this long, but leaks are inevitable at this point.

Whether this whole thing is fake or not, Nintendo has gotta get moving soon.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Can be truth, especially since it seems to be one of HIS close friends, however said source also heard about Incineroar and seems confused on where it went, but it also raise hope for Banjo, since it seems close to Microsoft too.
I'm in 50/50 but on the positive side- Hopefully, he don't get scammed, especially since he seems genuine.


Also AHEM
For the people who keep believing that the Chad-leak was what ruffled feather...

It was Square-Enix who seemingly internally panicked, not Nintendo, as Tansut seems to have SE link. so...
Either they panicked because that Text leak is truth and did leak Geno, because I'm not sure SE knows who's in or not in beside their characters.
But that also doesn't make sense because Sassy Geno also happened at the same time, and everyone though.

Just a food for though.

That profanity text leak is a last month thing just like the cloud leaker said and geno is involved

 

[Deleted member]

I mean, I told everyone to stop acting like he was already confirmed. I ****ing love the Cat but seeing people shove Inceneroar down other people's throats as a sure thing was getting old. The tables have turned now it seems and it looks like people are hating on Incenaroar, sadly.

There have been far more people ****ting on Incineroar and trying to discredit Verge solely because of Incineroar even before this than there were people "shoving him down other people's throats".

The hate was always there. Nothing changed except now people are more obnoxious about it because it seems like they won in the end.

 

[doomedtacox]

https://smashboards.com/threads/sma...spoilers-leaks.434391/page-6074#post-22587891


Thoughts on Papagenos source?

I think that Papagenos is a rational, decent person, so I don't think he'd make a video unless he feels the "source" has a somewhat high level or credibility.

 

[War Anvil]

Let's think of the struggles between leakers as something like...

Yes, kirbsmash , I'm on team maybe.

Monkeys? You know who calls people Monkeys?

Frieza.

And you know what franchise he’s from?

Dragon Ball.

And you know who the protagonist is? Yeah, that’s right...

GOKU CONFIRMED

Ya can't assume we're monkeys fighting each other if we're not Saiyans.

 

[Untouch]

Has this been mentioned?

Yes, several times.
AutoCAD is beyond industry standard.
The bottom part would be interesting if it wasn't just pictures being contained in boxes which is obvious.

 

[Chrono.]

I don’t really mind Box Theory, but if its true and its Ken & Incineroar left, I really would’ve wish they switched Incineroar and K Rool’s announcements. Ending on someone so controversial just feels lackluster to me.

I'm pretty confident in thinking that even if Incineroar is final base roster character, he's not the final reveal.

They're gonna end things with a DLC announcement, much like Mewtwo ended things off in 4 before Wii U came out.

 

[Blargg888]

I've gotta ask a quick question.

Why would Simon and Richter get revealed together, yet Ryu and Ken not be revealed together?

Quite a few echos (I believe it was 3 out of the currently officially confirmed 6) were revealed in the original wave of information that came with the "Everyone is Here" trailer.

Here's a hot take, which i hope is horribly wrong; What if Ken was actually the false leak the whole time?

I know, it sounds ridiculous, but compared to Dark Samus and Chrome, does Ken come across as a "surprise" character to anyone that would warrant his own independent announcement?

First of all, only one of the currently revealed Echoes was revealed alongside the "Everyone is Here" trailer: Daisy.

Both Chrom and DS were revealed in the August Direct, two months after the Everyone is Here trailer.

Richter was revealed alongside Simon, yes, but in this case, they're both newcomers.

And DP and Lucina are returning characters.

Ryu was a Smash 4 character, so he was revealed in the Everyone is Here trailer.

As it stands, Richter is the only Echo Fighter to have been revealed alongside his respective base character.

Daisy, Dark Samus, Chrom, Lucina, and Dark Pit were all either revealed separately, or alongside another newcomer.

 

[Luigi The President]

I just wish Nintendo would reveal something. Its been quite a while now since Isabelle was confirmed and there isn't much time left to reveal stuff.
Reviewers are going to have the game soon. I don't know why they've decided to stay silent for this long, but leaks are inevitable at this point.

Whether this whole thing is fake or not, Nintendo has gotta get moving soon.

You didn't get the memo? You're selfish for being disgruntled with how we've gotten one newcomer and about nothing else in 2 months
/s. I see this line of thinking far too much.

 

[SneakyLink]

I'm just gonna share my 2 cents:
1. Right now, I feel this summarizes everything that has been going on:

2. Personally I'm gonna take a neutral stance towards this 'leak'. Mostly because every time something comes up, counter evidence also emerges.

 

[lightdrago]

How long did it take for gameplay to pop up after the ESRB leak? This one came out around the same time frame ESRB leak popped up, so I’m just wondering.

 

[SevenGameSet]

ANYBODY ON TEAM MAYBE?

I used to be, I'm now on Team God Help Us All

 

[SuperSmashLover]

Interesting point. Sakurai certainly doesn't seem to keep consistency on Echo fighters...

On another note, welcome.
It makes me to see a new user with an avatar I created.

One way or another we will find out soon :D

And you're welcome it's awesome!

 

[Z25]

I've gotta ask a quick question.

Why would Simon and Richter get revealed together, yet Ryu and Ken not be revealed together?

Quite a few echos (I believe it was 3 out of the currently officially confirmed 6) were revealed in the original wave of information that came with the "Everyone is Here" trailer.

Here's a hot take, which i hope is horribly wrong; What if Ken was actually the false leak the whole time?

I know, it sounds ridiculous, but compared to Dark Samus and Chrome, does Ken come across as a "surprise" character to anyone that would warrant his own independent announcement?

It’s not hard to grasp why.
Castlevania was a brand new ip this game. Thus Simon needed his own trailer. And they already had richter as an echo so they threw him in there.

Ryu didn’t need a trailer since he was a vet, therefore there would be no need for ken to just show up.

Plus a third party echo is special. So if we have shadow to it makes sense to reveal the third party echos together as opposed to just dropping them when they revealed their counterpart in everyone is here.

They had to space out reveals rather then give us them all at once.

 

[doomedtacox]

Can be truth, especially since it seems to be one of HIS close friends, however said source also heard about Incineroar and seems confused on where it went, but it also raise hope for Banjo, since it seems close to Microsoft too.
I'm in 50/50 but on the positive side- Hopefully, he don't get scammed, especially since he seems genuine.


Also AHEM
For the people who keep believing that the Chad-leak was what ruffled feather...

It was Square-Enix who seemingly internally panicked, not Nintendo, as Tansut seems to have SE link. so...
Either they panicked because that Text leak is truth and did leak Geno, because I'm not sure SE knows who's in or not in beside their characters.
But that also doesn't make sense because Sassy Geno also happened at the same time, and everyone though.

Just a food for though.

The source isn't one of his friends, they reached out to him and this is his first time interacting with the "source". For him to trust them, they must be somewhat legit.

 

[Confirmation]

Yeah but before that claim people were saying "UH NO ONE COULD MOVE SO MANY FIGHTERS AROUND!"
A guy in ResetEra do this in 24h showing that it's possible and now it becomes "UH! NINTENDO THEMSELVES CAN MOVE FIGHTERS AROUND! SO EVERYONE CAN"

Like, cm'on, it was just a way to show that IT IS possible, not that IT WAS what happened.

Omni said he could make this in less than a day already. The idea isn't new.

It's the ridiculous circumstances and everything else about the leak that makes it still survive.

 

[Luigi The President]

The source isn't one of his friends, they reached out to him and this is his first time interacting with the "source". For him to trust them, they must be somewhat legit.

Lol if poor papa is being played

 

[Pazzo.]

One way or another we will find out soon :D

And you're welcome it's awesome!

Thank you, wear it proudly.

Just curious, did you find it here or somewhere else?

 

[Bowserlick]

Team "Release the game today"