Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Deleted member]

I hope no characters from Xenoblade 2 get in. Lol

Why so? Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is a great game and it would make Smash in Switch outdated not to include any. Include Rex, Pyra and Mythra and I would be happy. If they pushed for a T-rating however, they would not have to censor Pyra and Mythra. Pyra and Mythra are in a T rated game, so I am sure they would not need any changes in a T-rated Smash Brothers game. If it is E10+ on the other hand, than Pyra and Mythra are getting censored. I really like Pyra and Mythra's designs, so seeing them get censored would be a little saddening. Either way, we need Xenoblade Chronicles 2 representatives.

Edit: Am I the only one that likes Pyra's design?

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Why so? Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is a great dame and it would make Smash in Switch outdated not to include any. Include Rex, Pyra and Mythra and I would be happy. If they pushed for a T-rating however, they would not have to censor Pyra and Mythra. Pyra and Mythra are in a T rated game, so I am sure they would not need any changes in a T-rated Smash Brothers game. If it is E10+ on the other hand, than Pyra and Mythra are getting censored. I really like Pyra and Mythra's designs, so seeing them get censored would be a little saddening. Either way, we need Xenoblade Chronicles 2 representatives.

If anything, any censorship from Pyra would literally just be her shorts being slightly longer. Most of Xenoblade being T, looking at the box, is language, tobacco, alcohol, and violence, and while suggestive themes are also there on Xenoblade 2's box, Smash 4 was E10+ with Bayonetta in the roster.

 

[MopedOfJustice]

Can I just say that Star Allies is probably the worst Kirby game out there (not counting spin offs). It's so bare bones, it brings nothing new to the table, and is by far the easiest Kirby game yet. The final boss was was the only interesting part of the game.

I wouldn't mind it if we didn't get any content from it in Smash.

I really don't understand how you could say that, given that Robobot is recycled garbage other than the mech part.

Nightmare in Dreamland is obviously the best game in the series.

The only thing that it's the best in is music. It has easily my favorite soundtrack, but it gets beaten in every respect by other games. It honestly isn't even better than Kirby's Adventure despite being a remake of it.

you could do "more interesting stuff" in subspace.

Dare I ask?

 

[DraginHikari]

If anything, any censorship from Pyra would literally just be her shorts being slightly longer. Most of Xenoblade being T, looking at the box, is language, tobacco, alcohol, and violence, and while suggestive themes are also there on Xenoblade 2's box, Smash 4 was E10+ with Bayonetta in the roster.

Frankly, the censoring of material in Smash Bros has always been so minor that I hardly ever notice it until someone points it out.

 

[Deleted member]

If Sakurai cannot fix the double grab issue, I don't even want the Ice Climbers back.

Chain Grabs were already fixed in Smash 4.

I'll never understand why people care so much about some loli.

You just answered your own question

 

[asia_catdog_blue]

You just answered your own question

That's pretty sad, imo.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Does this count as spam? I'm legitly asking here....
ㄓ ㄉㄠˋ ㄌㄜ˙。

Yes. It doesn't add anything to the discussion and is hard to read for others. Might be fine in a social thread if you're conversing with someone, but in a thread dedicated to Smash talk, it's off-topic instead.

 

[Mr. Mumbles]

A lot of Kirby villains have the same issues Zelda villains have - they're one or two-shot characters outside of cameos and spin offs.

Skull Kid, Zant, Ghirahim, Yuga etc.

Marx, Magolor, Dark Matter, Nightmare etc.

I fail to see how that's a problem. I don't see any of them as particularly likely, but at the same time none of them would surprise me.

Aren’t Vaati and Dark Matter three-shot characters?

Depends on if you count the original Four Swords as a full-fledged game or not. As much as I like vaati I tend to think of him as having two games.

 

[mario123007]

I'm gonna make a prediction.

Ice Climbers will be back, but, I think they won't be seperate-able. I think they will still walk and attack side by side, but they will always be together. I could see this as something Sakurai would do to more easily balance stuff with them, and I forsee a lot of anger towards that decision if it happens.

Not really, as an Ice Climber main myself, despite I love the fact that they can be separate sometiimes but I prefer them sticking together, especially when flying off stage...

Yes. It doesn't add anything to the discussion and is hard to read for others. Might be fine in a social thread if you're conversing with someone, but in a thread dedicated to Smash talk, it's off-topic instead.

Yeah, I aware I should stick to the topic here.

 

[Roberto zampari]

Why Sakurai doesn't do a fighter ballot again while Smash is in development?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Why Sakurai doesn't do a fighter ballot again while Smash is in development?

Maybe. Though the point of the Smash Ballot was to gather ideas for Smash 4 and future games. He doesn't really need to do so now that he has tons of data.

But it could go either way.

 

[Akenero]

I'm gonna be upset if Xenoblade and Arms have no representation. Anyone else here share the same feelings?

 

[ErenJager]

Added characters that are potentially likely and to which it applies to. It also doesn’t count unknown games in the works. I think it can most definitely work except for retro characters. Unless a retro anthology for Switch is in the works.

Hmm, would Ashley be too far of a stretch to suggest for Wario Ware?
I feel Sakurai is some what aware of her moderate popularity; giving her an assist trophy and mii costume.
In the least maybe she'll be shown as an AT again.

Side note, wouldn't it be fun to see Ashley in Luigi's mansion... since she lives in a haunted mansion next door...
I feel like there could be a solid DLC campaign based on that.

 

[pupNapoleon]

"DK doesn't need more representation either."

I know this is far back... but I absolutely disagree.
Even without characters in the equation, the worlds of DK have a lot from which to draw. It is a shame we have no in game appearance of the bananas, of the animal crates, of any enemies short of the Kremlings....and how many versions of the DK rap have we had, instead of other music?

No... Donkey Kong as a series definitely does need more representation.

 

[Roberto zampari]

I'm gonna be upset if Xenoblade and Arms have no representation. Anyone else here share the same feelings?

Xenoblade have Shulk.
Do you want Rex or Pyra?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I'm gonna be upset if Xenoblade and Arms have no representation. Anyone else here share the same feelings?

Even if somehow they don't get more characters, they're going to get representation in trophies, music, and/or stages/items. There's no way they'll be ignored.

 

[ErenJager]

Did anyone else found it weird that in Smash 4 the three clones, Dark Pit, Dr. Mario and Lucina, had separate character slots yet Alph and the Koopalings didn't? I can understand the Koopalings didn't but it's odd Alph didn't. I think clones should either be different character slots or costumes, no inbetweens.

On the topic of clones/semi-clones I wouldn't mind:
Daisy
Dry Bowser
If Captain Toad is a newcomer hopefully Toadette gets added too
Funky Kong
Toon Zelda
Medusa
Dark Samus
Black Shadow
Shadow The Hedgehog

I think Sakurai addressed this, pretty much Alph and Koopalings are purely cosmetic changes and don't change their mechanics. Once even the slightest character mechanic changes, could be something as small as speed or hit box, it gets it's own character slot. I'm embellishing a bit more then what he actually said, but I still think i'm accurate.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Infernape's my choice for a Fire starter. I even made a moveset for him once, that I'll edit the post with.

Here it is:

Spoiler

It has a style similar to . It focuses on throwing extremely fast Mach Punches.

• Neutral Attack: Does a Mach Punch. 5%. To follow, Infernape releases a fury of Mach Punches like 's jab, except each of these punches sends out a wave that extends a small range in front of Infernape's fist.
• Dash Attack: Jumps and kicks. 3%.
• Forward Tilt: Does a spinning tail whip. 2%.
• Up Tilt: Flips and kicks while standing on a hand. 4%.
• Down Tilt: Sweeps with its tail. 2%.
• Forward Smash: Throws a Mach Punch while sliding forward a little. 5-15%. Has little starting or cooling time.
• Up Smash: The fire on its head shoots up. 7-11%.
• Down Smash: Throws a series of Mach Punches downwards. 9-15%. Has little starting or cooling time.
• Neutral Aerial: Spins while hitting with its tail. 3% in the front, 4% in the back.
• Forward Aerial: Throws a Mach Punch while traveling a small distance. 4%.
• Up Aerial: Flip kicks. 3%.
• Back Aerial: Throws a strong Mach Punch with short range. 8%.
• Down Aerial: Does two forward punches, doing a full downwards flip after each one. The first one does 3%. The second one is a Mach Punch that meteor smashes and does 5%.
• Grab: Does a Mach Punch, but grabs instead of punching. It's the fastest grab, but has some of the shortest range.
• Forward Throw: Jumps and throws. 4%.
• Up Throw: Does a Mach Punch as an uppercut. 5%.
• Back Throw: Kicks them back. 3%.
• Down Throw: Burns them three times, with the first burn doing 3%, the second doing 4%, and the third doing 5%.

• Neutral Special: Fire Punch. Charges some fire into its fist, then releases it in a Falcon Punch-like attack, with a large fireball covering its fist. 10%, with a sweetspot of 15% in the fist. Pressing A while the fire is charging turns the attack into a Mach Punch of 7% damage, that sends Infernape sliding forwards.
• Side Special: Taunt. Makes a mocking face (akanbe). Opponents in a short range facing Infernape can only use damaging moves for the next three seconds.
• Up Special: Flame Wheel. If in the air, curls into a wheel while shooting up and causing 2% burn damage to opponents who touch it. If on the ground, curls into a wheel and charges up, able to roll around and attack. The speed is charged, while the damage with each hit is always 4%. Infernape can jump and cancel while rolling just like 's Spin Dash.
• Down Special: Thunder Punch. Charges some electricity into its fist, then releases it in a punch for 5%. It is much faster than Fire Punch in both charge and punch, and it also stuns the opponent. Pressing A while the electricity is charging turns the attack into a Mach Punch of 5% damage, that sends Infernape sliding forwards with more range than Fire Punch's Mach Punch.
• Final Smash: Fire Spin. A vortex of fire appears around it, trapping anybody who touches it and dealing them hits of 4%. The fire expands outwards.

I really like Mach Punch.

Any time a character is described as "being like this other character," unless it is a Lucas/Ness situation, I completely tune out. I don't want a new character that feels like a new one.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I think Sakurai addressed this, pretty much Alph and Koopalings are purely cosmetic changes and don't change their mechanics. Once even the slightest character mechanic changes, could be something as small as speed or hit box, it gets it's own character slot. I'm embellishing a bit more then what he actually said, but I still think i'm accurate.

Well if I remember right, Alph was considered for a clone using Rock Pikmin, but I could be wrong for all I know.

Looked it up just in case to see if I was crazy and found this SourceGaming article. https://sourcegaming.info/2015/07/29/plucky-little-guys-olimar-and-alph-in-smash-4/

 

[Akenero]

Xenoblade have Shulk.
Do you want Rex or Pyra?

Rex, definitely, He's so fun haha

 

[Xenorange]

Indies? Shovel Knight, no questions asked.

But also Papyrus.

What about Sam and Wing DINGS

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

Strong predictions for Legend of Zelda representation in 5mash.

-Link and Zelda will be changed to their Breath of the Wild versions. Link has practically been confirmed already to have this but I easily see Zelda with him. Both of them will have slight moveset changes to accompany BOTW moves for themselves. Both will also have alt costumes from said game as well, like Zelda's white dress and Link in that Zora wedding armor.

-While Normal Link changes to BOTW in both look and moveset changes (which means he can finally get away from the Triforce Slash FS), Toon Link will keep the basic Link moveset (although I do think he should get rid of the Triforce Slash as well). So if you are used to how Link fought in previous Smash games Toon Link is the one for you.

-Ganondorf will be staying Twilight Princess but might get some adjustments to his moveset as well as have a smidge of BOTW representation in him. In my opinion his Final Smash should be turned from TP Pig Ganon to something Calamity Ganon based.

-Sheik will literally be the same or at least mostly the same. While Zelda needs the change to accompany her BOTW self Sheik doesn't really need it. However an off the wall choice I think should be thrown into the character is an alt character of Impa from Skyward Sword/Ocarina of Time. Make it works like Alph for Olimar. Or like the gender choices for Robin, Corrin, WFT, and Villager.

-We will finally get a new Zelda character since like Melee/Brawl. The strong choices now would be one of the champions from BOTW to accompany the changed Link and Zelda. My personal pick would be either Mipha or Urbosa but Revali would likely be the most unique.

 

[ErenJager]

Why Sakurai doesn't do a fighter ballot again while Smash is in development?

I have a feeling he may be using the results from the ballot to influence decisions for this Smash...
Any new characters from the Switch era, he would probably have his own assumptions and expectations on whether to include them or not..
it's almost irrelevant to do another ballot.. assuming the only differences would be newer generation characters... and probably a big Crash Bandicoot demand.

 

[mario123007]

I'm gonna be upset if Xenoblade and Arms have no representation. Anyone else here share the same feelings?

I wouldn't be upset with ARMS, but Xenoblade 2 characters to be in particular, I will. I mean we already know Sakurai has already played Xenoblade 2 and he seems to enjoy the game.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

Side note, wouldn't it be fun to see Ashley in Luigi's mansion... since she lives in a haunted mansion next door...
I feel like there could be a solid DLC campaign based on that.

No please. I feel like the Mario games and WarioWare games should never crossover. Their tones are completely different, and it would just clash.
There would also be a lot of people playing Luigi's Mansion who wouldn't know who Ashley is, and having this character in a different style just there would be especially jarring to them.

Plus, I don't think Ashley needs to be forced into a Luigi's Mansion game to boost her ik popularity. She can stand on her own just fine.

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

I hope no characters from Xenoblade 2 get in. Lol

The chances of that happening is so very low because it is very likely at this point with Rex or whoever they choose.

Why Sakurai doesn't do a fighter ballot again while Smash is in development?

Probably because it would cause more chaos than the ballot for DLC did in Sm4sh. Especially with more newcomer slots.

I also don't feel the main roster should be based too much off popularity and demand.

 

[ErenJager]

Well if I remember right, Alph was considered for a clone using Rock Pikmin, but I could be wrong for all I know.

Looked it up just in case to see if I was crazy and found this SourceGaming article. https://sourcegaming.info/2015/07/29/plucky-little-guys-olimar-and-alph-in-smash-4/

Yes, should he had enough time to develop the rock pikmin into Alph's moveset, he would have received his own character slot.

 

[Ivander]

Aren’t Vaati and Dark Matter three-shot characters?

Dark Matter is technically five if you count being a one-shot boss, six if he is in Star Allies as rumoured. You had his original appearances in Kirby's Dreamland 2 & 3 and Kirby 64, Squeak Squad(as Dark Nebula is Dark Matter, or at least related to Dark Matter, confirmed by the Kirby 20th Anniversary book in Japan) and his boss appearance in Planet Robobot.
He's rumoured to be in Star Allies, but so far, he hasn't been confirmed yet. That being said, you could still somewhat count him if you remember that Gooey, who is in Star Allies, is part of or related to Dark Matter.

Anyway, not exactly going to be hopeful and wishful when it comes to characters as, even if I want some more than others, I'm happy with any new characters regardless. That being said, I actually hope Smash Run returns. That or an Adventure Mode/Metrovania-like Mode.

 

[Cosmic77]

I'm gonna be upset if Xenoblade and Arms have no representation. Anyone else here share the same feelings?

Even though I think both franchises have a really good chance of getting a newcomer, I can't say I'd care that much if Spring Man or Rex/Pyra never got in the game.

I've played ARMS, and while it's a fun game, it wasn't even close to matching the same feeling I got when I first played Splatoon. Personally, I don't feel like a newcomer such as Spring Man is absolutely required, and I'd be satisfied just getting an ARMS Assist Trophy.

As for Xenoblade, I've never played a game from that series before. I have little to no connection with it's characters, and the thought of another JRPG character doesn't strike me as exciting.

 

[ErenJager]

No please. I feel like the Mario games and WarioWare games should never crossover. Their tones are completely different, and it would just clash.
There would also be a lot of people playing Luigi's Mansion who wouldn't know who Ashley is, and having this character in a different style just there would be especially jarring to them.

Plus, I don't think Ashley needs to be forced into a Luigi's Mansion game to boost her ik popularity. She can stand on her own just fine.

Fair enough.
I think there are ways to do crossovers that don't hinder the tone of either side.
However yes, the clash of those tones could be considerable.
It can be executed correctly. (I'm speaking in more-so generality rather then specifically for the Ashley x Luigi's Manson)

 

[pupNapoleon]

I have a feeling he may be using the results from the ballot to influence decisions for this Smash...
Any new characters from the Switch era, he would probably have his own assumptions and expectations on whether to include them or not..
it's almost irrelevant to do another ballot.. assuming the only differences would be newer generation characters... and probably a big Crash Bandicoot demand.

It isn't a feeling, it was a flat out statement in the poll- that the results would be used in future Nintendo games, Smash and otherwise.

 

[mario123007]

Xenoblade have Shulk.
Do you want Rex or Pyra?

If you have played the game, then you'll know it's very likely it has to be both.

Like I used to mention, technically Rex is going to be in as playable character but you'll also see Pyra on the back stage, or just beside him but not a character (I mean... technically you can't damage Blades in the game.) he will have other Blades as well for different movesets.

I hope no characters from Xenoblade 2 get in. Lol

Well, you may be just joking, but give me one good reason why lol.

Why so? Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is a great game and it would make Smash in Switch outdated not to include any. Include Rex, Pyra and Mythra and I would be happy. If they pushed for a T-rating however, they would not have to censor Pyra and Mythra. Pyra and Mythra are in a T rated game, so I am sure they would not need any changes in a T-rated Smash Brothers game. If it is E10+ on the other hand, than Pyra and Mythra are getting censored. I really like Pyra and Mythra's designs, so seeing them get censored would be a little saddening. Either way, we need Xenoblade Chronicles 2 representatives.

Edit: Am I the only one that likes Pyra's design?

Um, have you played the game yet? Once again you have to play it before saying "It's a great game". I personally think it's a great game, but maybe not to you.
The game's rating only sets stone after the game is almost went gold.... that's why you see the game having RP before release.

And no, you aren't, despite people (Especially Smashboards here for some reason) loves to pan Pyra and Mythra's design, while I disagree with their compalint but I don't mind people criticize their design. However, if they wish or "bet" censorship will happen on them if they are in Smash just because they don't like their design, then I think that's way out of credit.

If anything, any censorship from Pyra would literally just be her shorts being slightly longer. Most of Xenoblade being T, looking at the box, is language, tobacco, alcohol, and violence, and while suggestive themes are also there on Xenoblade 2's box, Smash 4 was E10+ with Bayonetta in the roster.

Well, despite I have no problem if they do do that minor tweak on Pyra I don't think the new Smash Bros Switch will be stay rated E10+, again, unless you think it's an enhanced port, don't be so sure that Smash Bros Switch will be E10+.

I have mention this before... Bayonetta (And probably Corrin) was planned and included AFTER the game's release (Since she's the ballot winner), so it's a guarantee that she gets some minor censorship.

and don't mention Tharja because if it wasn't ESRB leak we might even not know she was even once in as a trophy. That being said, I have to be frank here... I will be disappointed if they stick Smash Bros Switch E10+... this means censorship might happen... and no don't bring up "Attract more audience"... Brawl was rated T and it is still the best selling Smash Bros game to date.

 

[ErenJager]

Strong predictions for Legend of Zelda representation in 5mash.

-Link and Zelda will be changed to their Breath of the Wild versions. Link has practically been confirmed already to have this but I easily see Zelda with him. Both of them will have slight moveset changes to accompany BOTW moves for themselves. Both will also have alt costumes from said game as well, like Zelda's white dress and Link in that Zora wedding armor.

-While Normal Link changes to BOTW in both look and moveset changes (which means he can finally get away from the Triforce Slash FS), Toon Link will keep the basic Link moveset (although I do think he should get rid of the Triforce Slash as well). So if you are used to how Link fought in previous Smash games Toon Link is the one for you.

-Ganondorf will be staying Twilight Princess but might get some adjustments to his moveset as well as have a smidge of BOTW representation in him. In my opinion his Final Smash should be turned from TP Pig Ganon to something Calamity Ganon based.

-Sheik will literally be the same or at least mostly the same. While Zelda needs the change to accompany her BOTW self Sheik doesn't really need it. However an off the wall choice I think should be thrown into the character is an alt character of Impa from Skyward Sword/Ocarina of Time. Make it works like Alph for Olimar. Or like the gender choices for Robin, Corrin, WFT, and Villager.

-We will finally get a new Zelda character since like Melee/Brawl. The strong choices now would be one of the champions from BOTW to accompany the changed Link and Zelda. My personal pick would be either Mipha or Urbosa but Revali would likely be the most unique.

Very nice.

My predictions, or more rather, my desired changes for Zelda characters would be;

Ganondorf getting his a move set based off his own canon, including sword(s) and magic possibly.
I'd like to see Black Shadow included in the roster, and get a version of Ganondorf's old move set.

I'd also like to see the return of Young Link.
There's two possibilities i'd enjoy seeing.
1) If Link has received a new and updated move set based on BotW, and his old move set is gone, it would be fitting to bring back Young Link with the now retired move set.
2) If Link's BotW appearance is just a costume... then perhaps Young Link can get an original move set based on his Masks.

Regardless if it's possibility 1 or 2... I still want Young Link to get a Fierce Deity final smash.

Other changes I want... hmm... maybe playable Impa and give Sheik a harp?

 

[ErenJager]

It isn't a feeling, it was a flat out statement in the poll- that the results would be used in future Nintendo games, Smash and otherwise.

Well I guess that's where the feeling came from.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

I will say that if a Xenoblade 2 character isn't in (guessing Rex w/ Pyra as his blade) I can see them as 1st party DLC like Corrin was.

 

[Yonder]

33 votes for "Isaac", 4 votes for "Isaac (Golden Sun)", 3 votes for "Isaac from Golden Sun", and 2 votes for "Issac".

I love it.

Meanwhile, Walking ABSOLUTELY BLITZES abovr everyone else by over 4x the votes as #2. And these are all amongst the most popular characters. Idk if some guy with a lot of IP addresses manipulated the results, or people we're just meming. But that's crazy, despite the small subset. Is Waluigi actually that popular?

Personally, I really do want him in.

 

[*The Sensus Crustulum*]

Steering away from character discussion, would anyone like to see a story mode, akin to SSE in Brawl? That would be great.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

Out of the veteran non-clone characters, what special moves would you like to change?

I'm not including clones bc I'd guess that most of us would like a decloning overhaul.

The move that comes to mind for me (probably because I'm playing Star Allies) is Kirby's side+b. I think it was cool in Melee because Dedede wasn't there, but now that he is here, I don't think Kirby needs the Hammer ability. I would really like to see some of the other powers from Kirby get utilized. I would personally like to see Staff take it's place. Kirby could use the pole-vault move. It would give him a fast horizontal recovery move with decent range. I think it would have Kirby do a kick after vaulting, and end with him in free-fall so he can't use both side B and up B in the same recovery sequence.

 

[*The Sensus Crustulum*]

Out of the veteran non-clone characters, what special moves would you like to change?

I'm not including clones bc I'd guess that most of us would like a decloning overhaul.

The move that comes to mind for me (probably because I'm playing Star Allies) is Kirby's side+b. I think it was cool in Melee because Dedede wasn't there, but now that he is here, I don't think Kirby needs the Hammer ability. I would really like to see some of the other powers from Kirby get utilized. I would personally like to see Staff take it's place. Kirby could use the pole-vault move. It would give him a fast horizontal recovery move with decent range. I think it would have Kirby do a kick after vaulting, and end with him in free-fall so he can't use both side B and up B in the same recovery sequence.

Change Mario's grab to Cappy.
Dark Pit's main weapon will be his staff in Uprising.

 

[AlphaSSB]

Steering away from character discussion, would anyone like to see a story mode, akin to SSE in Brawl? That would be great.

Yes. Wouldn't mind either way if it were a direct SSE squeal, or if it was an entirely new story.

The SSE started out with villain characters vs hero characters, but eventually the villains and heroes teamed up against a greater threat. It's be interesting if they directly went with the Heroes vs Villains dynamic. Of course, there's bound to be more hero characters than villains, but that's where the minions and bosses come to fill in the gaps.