Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[TheMilkmann]

I love how this thread went from 0 to 150, and then all the way back to 0 all within the span of a few hours.

 

[TeamFlareZakk]

To be honest, I would sooner expect the main character from FE 3 Houses before Crash.


I found Ridley the most hype out of Smash Ultimate's newcomer reveals so far, but K. Rool's reveal was great too.

Yes Ridley was hype too indeed.

 

[LetterO]

If Crash gets in, then Snake vs Cloud vs Crash would be possible in a Nintendo game.

 

[CosmicQuark]

Keep in mind most people here are looking for those off the wall Sakurai WTF picks, it's why obscurer characters are brought up and talked about more often than your Rayman or your Banjo Kazooie

Banjo Kazooie is more expected I'd say by the general public, not those keeping up with leaks and the such. Meanwhile the hardcore smash community hear that there's minecraft in the new game, so we're all anticipating that perhaps Steve is in.

True, but they still "expect" those off-the-wall picks, and I was taking issue with using the word expected when it came to Banjo & Kazooie. I wish they were expected. Those not keeping up with leaks still think Banjo & Kazooie are impossible (since they wouldn't know Microsoft's involved with the game). Banjo & Kazooie would be the epitome of "making the impossible possible" to many people who gave up on him after Melee.

Steve's only expected because of the Vergeben leak where he says that Minecraft content is in the game somewhere, but never says anything about Steve being a completely playable character. I consider it highly unlikely, given that Steve has absolutely zero personality. You can't make a full-fledged character out of that. All the characters in Smash have some form of personality, but Steve literally has no facial expressions.

A lot of people thought Octolings were a shoe-in as well, but that's been pretty dead in the water since the August Direct.

That was my point--people are expecting Steve because of "Minecraft content" and Hitagi's leak. I've shared my personal viewpoint why I don't think Steve fits in with Smash for the same reasons you point out, but I also recognize my bias. But from the general feel of this forum, Banjo's popular but not expected, whereas Steve is, at the very least, controversial, but expected.

I think re-reading your post as "Banjo makes sense for Smash" whereas the other ones don't reads more accurately to what you're trying to say here. But if everybody has Steve on their prediction lists, I can't really see how that's not "expected". Maybe it's just a semantics, rather than a difference in opinion though.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Especially after Minecraft got such a big push right after the Switch came out. Nintendo knows how big Minecraft is, so they made sure to get it on the system ASAP. And it was the first game that allowed playing between Xbox and Nintendo, so if there's any Microsoft game that has a chance of being represented somehow, it would make sense.

There's a Minecraft-themed 3DS itself. That says a lot to me.

It being on the Switch helps too.

But yeah, it's clearly the gateway between the two companies. Sakurai might not have known that, but its gaming status alone is enough to add content. Though I think playable Steve? has a pretty strong chance. But not enough to consider it guaranteed, just likely.

 

[Zinith]

If Crash gets in, then Snake vs Cloud vs Crash would be possible in a Nintendo game.

They couldn't get that into a PLAYSTATION game lol

 

[doomedtacox]

Alrighty all, I'm signing off for the night, so I'd like to get my last couple thoughts out just in case they make me look like a genius in a couple days (or maybe just slightly clever). I'm a new user and I'm glad I found this board, it seems like a very fun and genuine place, thank you to the people I was able to converse with tonight. Anyways, I'd say the following has about a 3% chance of coming true:

-IF we get a direct reveal (or just a smash news reveal, like a solo character trailer) tomorrow morning, I think the actual direct/announcement will be on Thursday at 6 PM Montreal time.

-This means that the first portion of the mysterious Montreal Nintendo event will be a viewing party for the direct. Now, the event at the bar starts at 5 PM, so that means everyone would have an hour to get settled in before the direct airs, which makes sense. The direct would air at 6 PM Montreal time because that is 7 AM Japan time, which I believe is when most of the directs happen. The occurrence of this direct is why Nintendo has to be so secretive about the Montreal event and not tell the bar what game it's for until tomorrow. There's no way they'd risk the bar manager/owner or whoever leaking the date of a direct before it's announced.

-Now, the bar has said that the event will not be streamed, or that "no streaming is allowed", or something along those lines. This wouldn't make sense if the entire event was a viewing party. In this case, I'm guessing there will be a playable demo at the bar at around 6:30 PM Montreal time, or whenever the direct is over. This is what will not allowed to be streamed, as Nintendo has not allowed any of the demos to be streamed thus far to my knowledge.

So to summarize, I think that IF a direct is revealed tomorrow, it will air at 6 PM Montreal time on Thursday, and the Montreal Nintendo event will be a viewing party for the direct followed by the demo being playable at around 6:30 PM. This will probably be disproven when Nintendo doesn't announce anything tomorrow, and the Nintendo Montreal event will probably be Mario Kart VR or something random, but what the heck I figured I'd post this just in case some of you want some crazy late night theories to digest.

 

[Deleted member]

What would be the most crazy and trollish inclusion in Smash you could think of?

Mine would be a GTA character in Smash due to the fact that one of the games in the series was on the DS. That would be freaking crazy lol.

 

[staindgrey]

Especially after Minecraft got such a big push right after the Switch came out. Nintendo knows how big Minecraft is, so they made sure to get it on the system ASAP. And it was the first game that allowed playing between Xbox and Nintendo, so if there's any Microsoft game that has a chance of being represented somehow, it would make sense.

There's something to be noted about Phil Spencer's "make Xbox cool again" campaign he's been on the past couple years, though. The new Xbox division is clearly trying to play nice, with the Play Anywhere push, the free backwards compatibility, the cross-platform play and the very customer friendly Xbox Games pass. If Spencer wanted to use Smash as an avenue to win back some Switch fans, Banjo-Kazooie could have a higher upside than Minecraft.

I say this because Minecraft isn't commonly seen as a "Microsoft title". You don't need an Xbox to play it, and the majority of Minecraft players don't. If-- and this is a very hypothetical "if"-- if they have something in the works involving Banjo-Kazooie or Rare's other Nintendo-spawned properties, getting the gears turning with Smash Bros. promotion would benefit them much more than Minecraft content.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Steve's just a completely blank character that most people replace with their own skins. He can't even make facial expressions. The humor and soul of Minecraft comes from the world and the creatures, not the player characters. That's why a stage or Assist Trophy make more sense than a playable character.

Listen, G&W is an equally if not more so blank character, and if I remember correctly not Villager nor Wii Fitt can make facial expressions either.

And like wise, you seem to be doubting what can actually be done with Steve as a character. In a series where Sakurai has had no problem with giving character move sets which represent more than themselves ala Pac-Man and Duck-Hunt. The soul of Minecraft can certainly be transmitted through the moveset.

I mean I get that he's a box, but to say he's impossible is the same classic mistake people have done so many times. Sakurai can make it happen. He can make literally anything happen if he wants to, despite whatever fantasy limitations people put on him. Hell, even if he DOESN'T want to and he applies ACTUAL limitations to himself, he can still make it happen.

If I can think of some 4 3 tilts, some specials and a recovery for Steve I'm pretty sure Sakurai can.

 

[Zinith]

What would be the most crazy and trollish inclusion in Smash you could think of?

Mine would be a GTA character in Smash due to the fact that one of the games in the series was on the DS. That would be freaking crazy lol.

Jak 3 Leaper Lizards...

 

[osby]

What would be the most crazy and trollish inclusion in Smash you could think of?

Mine would be a GTA character in Smash due to the fact that one of the games in the series was on the DS. That would be freaking crazy lol.

Reimu Hakurei, she's the obvious indie rep.

 

[staindgrey]

You can hate something and still like certain aspects of it. I hate Fate's story, but I love Conquest's gameplay. I dislike Corrin's writing within the context of Fate's story, but I love how freaky and weird their Dragon form is. There's nothing wrong with that. No need to feel dirty.

You're absolutely right. I'm just indirectly airing my grievances at Daisy being a Peach clone. I've never liked Peach. I've always wanted Daisy. At this rate, I feel like I won't end up maining her at all; meanwhile, the protagonist of my least favorite Fire Emblem is actually really fun and feels natural to use with significantly less effort.

I'm really rusty with Smash 4, and it shows, but I'm picking up Corrin with surprising ease. And I don't like it.

 

[CosmicQuark]

Listen, G&W is an equally if not more so blank character, and if I remember correctly not Villager nor Wii Fitt can make facial expressions either.

And like wise, you seem to be doubting what can actually be done with Steve as a character. In a series where Sakurai has had no problem with giving character move sets which represent more than themselves ala Pac-Man and Duck-Hunt. The soul of Minecraft can certainly be transmitted through the moveset.

I mean I get that he's a box, but to say he's impossible is the same classic mistake people have done so many times. Sakurai can make it happen. He can make literally anything happen if he wants to, despite whatever fantasy limitations people put on him. Hell, even if he DOESN'T want to and he applies ACTUAL limitations to himself, he can still make it happen.

If I can think of some 4 tilts, some specials and a recovery for Steve I'm pretty sure Sakurai can.

I've noted this before, but I'll say it again--what do those three characters have in common? They're important to Nintendo's history. If they weren't, they would likely not have been included because of those issues. I don't see the same courtesy being extended for purely third party (and indeed multiplatform) characters.

 

[staindgrey]

What would be the most crazy and trollish inclusion in Smash you could think of?

Mine would be a GTA character in Smash due to the fact that one of the games in the series was on the DS. That would be freaking crazy lol.

The Pong ball.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

I've noted this before, but I'll say it again--what do those three characters have in common? They're important to Nintendo's history. If they weren't, they would likely not have been included because of those issues. I don't see the same courtesy being extended for purely third party (and indeed multiplatform) characters.

This is again, an invented limitation. There's no place Sakurai makes such assertions. He explains that he likes to include hardware reps yes, but that isn't to say he's limiting himself to it.

Like wise, thinking he's not going to give a courtesy to third party is exactly what they thought prior to Snake Pac-Man Cloud Bayo Richter getting in, as people just assumed third parties wouldn't receive echos of the same series for some reason.

The way I see it, what Sakurai has proven is that as long as the character is iconic, as long as they are heavy requested, he doesn't seem to consider some of the finer points like the character being kind of blank as limitations.

Steve is CERTAINLY iconic enough to be given a consideration, and whatever Sakurai lands on is beyond pretty much everybody that tries to figure him out via speculation, exemplified by all the shock and salt that has come from literally every season of reveals

 

[KingofKoopas]

What would be the most crazy and trollish inclusion in Smash you could think of?

Mine would be a GTA character in Smash due to the fact that one of the games in the series was on the DS. That would be freaking crazy lol.

Shrek
I dont even gotta post a meme pic or a video
and were you expecting anything else?

 

[Radical Bones]

What would be the most crazy and trollish inclusion in Smash you could think of?

Mallow.

Trailer starts with it clearly being a Super Mario RPG character too.

 

[staindgrey]

Mallow.

Trailer starts with it clearly being a Super Mario RPG character too.

HA! Geno gets Chrom'd.

 

[LetterO]

I can see absolute madman Sakurai adding Geno AND Mallow

 

[Zinith]

I can see absolute madman Sakurai adding Geno AND Mallow

Geno, Mallow and.....

Well, you know

 

[Ring-a-Sheep]

Mallow.

Trailer starts with it clearly being a Super Mario RPG character too.

I wouldn't be mad tbh

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Geno, Mallow and.....

Well, you know

Princess Toadstool?

 

[Deleted member]

Mallow.

Trailer starts with it clearly being a Super Mario RPG character too.

Mallow as in the Pokemon Mallow? Sorry, I'm not super familiar with Super Mario RPG lol.

 

[PLATINUM7]

Mallow as in the Pokemon Mallow? Sorry, I'm not super familiar with Super Mario RPG lol.

Mallow is the other original party member created for SMRPG.
https://www.mariowiki.com/Mallow

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Mallow as in the Pokemon Mallow? Sorry, I'm not super familiar with Super Mario RPG lol.

Don't worry not many people actually are

 

[Noipoi]

Mallow as in the Pokemon Mallow? Sorry, I'm not super familiar with Super Mario RPG lol.

Mallow as in this boi.

As you can see, he's clearly a frog.

 

[Will]

Mallow as in this boi.
View attachment 170304
As you can see, he's clearly a frog.

Yeah, and this is clearly a toad.

 

[Fenriraga]

Geno, Mallow and.....

Well, you know

Yeah, of course we know. Everyone's favorite purple Mario RPG Reptile!

Spoiler

Real talk, what if Yoshi got a Croco costume instead of a Boshi one?

 

[Deleted member]

Mallow as in this boi.
View attachment 170304
As you can see, he's clearly a frog.

As my 1,000th post, I will use it to promote all of you to play Super Mario RPG. Look at Mallow. He maybe a bit of a weak sauce, but he's a great character.

 

[SuperSceptile15]

What would be the most crazy and trollish inclusion in Smash you could think of?

Lightning as the Square Enix rep.

 

[Shroob]

Honestly though, getting to hear the main menu music...


I don't wanna say I'm getting excited, because we probably still have a looooooong wait for the next Direct, but goddamn that's an amazing menu theme.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Lightning as the Square Enix rep.

You shut your dirty mouth

 

[Diem]

That was my point--people are expecting Steve because of "Minecraft content" and Hitagi's leak. I've shared my personal viewpoint why I don't think Steve fits in with Smash for the same reasons you point out, but I also recognize my bias. But from the general feel of this forum, Banjo's popular but not expected, whereas Steve is, at the very least, controversial, but expected.

I think re-reading your post as "Banjo makes sense for Smash" whereas the other ones don't reads more accurately to what you're trying to say here. But if everybody has Steve on their prediction lists, I can't really see how that's not "expected". Maybe it's just a semantics, rather than a difference in opinion though.

I guess I don't know what the broader public considers likely. Banjo and Geno seem to be the only two remaining requests from the Melee days, and Phil Spencer's publicly remarked on how he'd be on board with adding Banjo to Smash. The original source for the Steve speculation comes from a statement that goes out of its way to not say "playable character."

But yeah, Banjo makes the most sense for Smash out of any Microsoft character.

Listen, G&W is an equally if not more so blank character, and if I remember correctly not Villager nor Wii Fitt can make facial expressions either.

And like wise, you seem to be doubting what can actually be done with Steve as a character. In a series where Sakurai has had no problem with giving character move sets which represent more than themselves ala Pac-Man and Duck-Hunt. The soul of Minecraft can certainly be transmitted through the moveset.

I mean I get that he's a box, but to say he's impossible is the same classic mistake people have done so many times. Sakurai can make it happen. He can make literally anything happen if he wants to, despite whatever fantasy limitations people put on him. Hell, even if he DOESN'T want to and he applies ACTUAL limitations to himself, he can still make it happen.

If I can think of some 4 3 tilts, some specials and a recovery for Steve I'm pretty sure Sakurai can.

Game and Watch comes from a bunch of wacky games where he's juggling balls, putting out oil fires, cooking, etc., and Sakurai's finally showing that fully through his aesthetic changes in Ultimate. He also has sounds unique amongst the cast, as no other character shares the kinds of beeps and other noises he does. And even before that, the animations and moves were so unique that they stood out even without being animated as fancily as they are now.

Villager has all kinds of facial expressions and animations, both in Smash and in the AC games. Starting with the second game, the player could learn specific emotions and trigger them at will through Dr. Shrunk.

Wii Fit Trainer's facial expressions are static, but the animations and voice clips are where the personality are at. No character sounds or moves like Wii Fit Trainer, just like G&W, so even without actual expressions, the character has a clearly defined personality/identity.

What does Steve do that conveys any personality whatsoever? His face is just an 8x8 pixel grid with no animations at all. He has no unique sound clips to give any kind of audio identity like G&W and WFT. His outfit and design are completely basic. And though I haven't played Minecraft a whole lot in recent times to fully remember, I'm pretty sure you can count all the Minecraft animations with your fingers. What kind of trailer could you possibly create for the character based on all those limitations? The player character in Stardew Valley has more substance and personality than Steve.

That's why Minecraft: Story Mode and all those awful YouTube videos go for that weird style where the characters' bodies are like Gumby and their faces have these ugly eyes and mouths. It's the only way to convey any amount of personality at all, and it requires a great deal of creative license, and that's not what Smash is about, especially for third party characters.

I'm not saying he's impossible, and if there's anyone who can think of a way to implement the character, it's Sakurai. My doubt is that Sakurai would even consider the character, based on the fact that there's little to no potential for any personality to be conveyed.

 

[Zinith]

Yes play SMRPG, and gaze your eyes upon Boshi, who's lucky to be a part of the PERFECT animal

 

[Noipoi]

Yeah, of course we know. Everyone's favorite purple Mario RPG Reptile!

Spoiler

View attachment 170305

Real talk, what if Yoshi got a Croco costume instead of a Boshi one?

I'd take Croco over Boshi any day. I like his 20s gangster attitude as opposed to Boshi's...I barely remember his personality. He's a bully I guess?

As my 1,000th post, I will use it to promote all of you to play Super Mario RPG. Look at Mallow. He maybe a bit of a weak sauce, but he's a great character.

I SUPPORT THIS POST

If you can, go play Mario rpg! It's a great game and it even gives you an appreciation for the more recent Mario rpgs. You see where it all began!
The characters are funny, the story is good, it's a great game!

Go play it!

 

[Fenriraga]

Yes play SMRPG, and gaze your eyes upon Boshi, who's lucky to be a part of the PERFECT animal

Is that a Teenage Croco? Man, his youth must have been full of rebellion.

 

[Shroob]

Did we ever figure out what was making Pikachu golden in that one image with a scared looking Squirtle?

 

[Noipoi]

Is that a Teenage Croco? Man, his youth must have been full of rebellion.

As an adult, Croco steals treasures.
As a teen, Croco stole hearts.
What a bad boy...

 

[hazza5557]

Has anything happened in the last 8 hours?