Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Idon]

Mipha/ruto = pig ganon > darunia/daruk > urbosa = revalli > midna > tingle = vaati = skull kid = deku princess


How I'd rank importance if Zelda newcomers

Okay, but consider this:

Fierce Deity Link > Everyone

I mean if you can't cut the friggin moon in half, why are you even here?

 

[Opossum]

Unstacked Echoes all the way.

And all of you Echo Stackers better make Chrom the forefront of Slot 25.

>:^(

 

[Freduardo]

How would ya'll rank these in terms of likelihood and personal want? Just for kicks.

Geno, Sora, Lara Croft, Neku, Slime, Terra, Agnes, any other major SE rep I forgot

In terms of want:
12) Marina Lightyears
11) Tonberry
10) Agnes
9) Neku
8) Lara Croft
7) Sora
6) Terra
5) Kefka
4) Crono
3) Slime
2) Geno
1) Bub and Bob (technically Square owns Taito these days)

In terms of expected:
2) Sora
1) Geno

 

[Vasculio]

Rumor has it that there might be a Smash or Nintendo Direct sometime next week. And the're hinting at a new character/characters reveal.

 

[Impa4Smash]

To shamelessly answer my own SE rep question.

Expect:
1. Geno
2. DQ Rep/Slime
3. Terra/FF Rep
4. Sora
5. Lara Croft
6. Agnes
7. Neku

Want:
1. Lara Croft
2. Sora
3. Agnes
4. Terra/FF Rep
5. Slime/DQ Rep
6. Geno
7. Neku

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Rumor has it that there might be a Smash or Nintendo Direct sometime next week. Was and the're hinting at a new character/characters reveal.

It's either a single reveal or duo reveal.

 

[Chrono.]

I'll keep saying this but Slime as the initial DQ character would be kinda... lame.

I'll put it like this, when I think "oh man I want a Dragon Quest character in Smash" I'm gonna go towards one of the characters I actually play as in the games. Someone like a Hero, or Terry, or Yangus. Not the mook you fight in the early game area and be on your way.

And this isn't just for DQ I mean towards pretty much most franchises. Just because Chocobos and Moogles are iconic mascots it doesn't mean they would've been good choices for FF to get it's foot in Smash before Cloud or someone like Cecil.

There's obviously some exceptions to this, like Pikachu. He's the mascot, not the main character, but in Pokemon games you actually do control the mons in battle so, yes, Pikachu is a perfect choice over someone like Red. And even then we still got a Pokemon Trainer down the line.

I think Jack Frost is another I can see as an exception too, since in SMT you also control the demons and send them to battle. But the main characters in those games also do fight on their own, so I still think characters like Kazuya or Flynn would make more sense.

 

[Idon]

Unstacked Echoes all the way.

And all of you Echo Stackers better make Chrom the forefront of Slot 25.

>:^(

Oh man, if Chrom's bringing the flattened damage of Lucina's Parallel Falchion to Roy's moveset, you bet I'm gonna be replacing that Smash OC.

Though one minor gripe with Chrom is that I wish he got an Exalted Falchion appearance whenever he charges something up to replace Roy's flames other than just... I think that's wind?

 

[JustCallMeJon]

While Mario got a clone and that Link has 2 clones, I am baffled that Marth has 3 clones/semiclones. Even more baffling is that Marth's clone, Roy, got a echo for him which is Chrom. 4/7 of all FE are Marth Clones!

With so many Marth echoes/semiclones, why not add them all into one Marth slot instead?

Now these anime swordmen copycats will now have a reason to be here! Maybe we can call this slot, the "Fire Emblem" slot!

 

[PK-remling Fire]

If something is getting revealed next week, it's probably going to make or break a lot of the popular leaks floating around. Also it'll also probably open the floodgates for even more fake leaks, so that should be fun.

 

[Robertman2]

Jack Frost shouldn't be used as a fighter over Joker or Demi Fiend or Raidou. That's stupid, hee-ho.

I wanna know why the option tonstack echoes was even added tbh

 

[Michael the Spikester]

If something is getting revealed next week, it's probably going to make or break a lot of the popular leaks floating around. Also it'll also probably open the floodgates for even more fake leaks, so that should be fun.

And should it not be Incineroar, Ken or both its gonna definitely open a new can of worms in terms of predictions.

 

[CosmicQuark]

If something is getting revealed next week, it's probably going to make or break a lot of the popular leaks floating around. Also it'll also probably open the floodgates for even more fake leaks, so that should be fun.

While I expect Verge being right and it'll probably be Incineroar... I just want a surprise that no one expects so that we're not talking about the same characters ad nauseum.

EDIT:

Jack Frost shouldn't be used as a fighter over Joker or Demi Fiend or Raidou. That's stupid, hee-ho.

I wanna know why the option tonstack echoes was even added tbh

To Persona fans, could Jack Frost be incorporated into Joker in a way we could kinda have both? I know a bit from playing Person 3, and watching Persona 4, but don't know anything about Persona 5.

Also, I'm glad they added the option to stack echos. Don't need the same exact characters duplicated a dozen times. That being said, it depends on how unlocking characters go. I'm fine with Peach and Daisy being separate slots. Samus and Dark Samus--less so.

 

[Captain Fun]

I'll keep saying this but Slime as the initial DQ character would be kinda... lame.

I'll put it like this, when I think "oh man I want a Dragon Quest character in Smash" I'm gonna go towards one of the characters I actually play as in the games. Someone like a Hero, or Terry, or Yangus. Not the mook you fight in the early game area and be on your way.

I agree. Not that I wouldn't be happy with Slime (because how could you hate that face) but the stories and worlds of Dragon Quest are experienced through the heroes.

 

[Idon]

While Mario got a clone and that Link has 2 clones, I am baffled that Marth has 3 clones/semiclones. Even more baffling is that Marth's clone, Roy, got a echo for him which is Chrom.

With so many Marth echoes/semiclones, why not add them all into one Marth slot instead?
View attachment 168039
Now these anime swordmen copycats will now have a reason to be here!

Might as well just make the slot called "Fire Emblem" then.

Actually though, I've been thinking of a way to include all FE characters and that's through a weapon class style system.
Long-sword users: Users who wield their blades elegantly keeping their foes at bay.
Broad-sword users: Users who place their entire body into attacks and go on the offensive.
Katana users: Users who wield an alterative style of swordsmanship focused on speed.
Heavy users: Users who wield massive weapons with power to be feared
Magic users: Users who rely on mid-long range attacks to do damage

That should get most FE characters squared away excluding Ephraim and Anna.

I'll keep saying this but Slime as the initial DQ character would be kinda... lame.

I'll put it like this, when I think "oh man I want a Dragon Quest character in Smash" I'm gonna go towards one of the characters I actually play as in the games. Someone like a Hero, or Terry, or Yangus. Not the mook you fight in the early game area and be on your way.

And this isn't just for DQ I mean towards pretty much most franchises. Just because Chocobos and Moogles are iconic mascots it doesn't mean they would've been good choices for FF to get it's foot in Smash before Cloud or someone like Cecil.

There's obviously some exceptions to this, like Pikachu. He's the mascot, not the main character, but in Pokemon games you actually do control the mons in battle so, yes, Pikachu is a perfect choice over someone like Red. And even then we still got a Pokemon Trainer down the line.

I think Jack Frost is another I can see as an exception too, since in SMT you also control the demons and send them to battle. But the main characters in those games also do fight on their own, so I still think characters like Kazuya or Flynn would make more sense.

Someone other than me mentioning Kazuya?
The hell kind of reality have I stumbled upon?
And yeah, I totally agree, mascots =/= representative of gameplay and essence of a character.

Jack Frost shouldn't be used as a fighter over Joker or Demi Fiend or Raidou. That's stupid, hee-ho.

I wanna know why the option tonstack echoes was even added tbh

Someone mentioning goddamn RAIDOU as well? Marvelous.

As for giving the option to stack echoes, I got 2 theories:
Cynical reason: To stop backlash from fans who think echoes steal slots.
Reasonable reason: To organize the roster better with the influx of veterans and newcomers on top of a disorganized "chronological" layout instead of a series one.

 

[Deleted member]

Absolutely NOBODY expected Cloud to be added in smash 4 and nobody asked for it

....yeah, nobody.
Certainly not a full 1/3 of the people asking for a Final Fantasy character for the Ballot....

 

[Robertman2]

Might as well just make a slot called "Fire Emblem" then.



Someone other than me mentioning Kazuya?
The hell kind of reality have I stumbled upon?
And yeah, I totally agree, mascots =/= representative of gameplay and essence of a character.


Someone mentioning goddamn RAIDOU as well? Marvelous.

As for giving the option to stack echoes:
Cynical reason: To stop backlash from fans who think echoes steal slots.
Reasonable reason: To organize the roster better with the influx of veterans and newcomers on top of a disorganized "chronological" layout instead of a series one.

Raidou 2 (too lazy to put the full title) is my favorite SMT game not counting anything Persona)

And tbh I feel like it's the Cynical reason

 

[Vasculio]

I actually need to see that Simon amiibo. Sure would be one of my desired.

Unfortunately veterans with Smash 4 amiibos will not get new models, but reprints of their 4 versions.

And should it not be Incineroar, Ken or both its gonna definitely open a new can of worms in terms of predictions.

At this point even the smalliest news is welcomed. *fingers crossed* I am hopeing for at least three characters. Maybe one newcomer and two echos.

 

[Aurane]

I wanted a few Final Fantasy characters, and Cloud was one of them.

Black Mage was my number 1 pick.

 

[Zinith]

Don't ask me about SE characters cause you'd know I'd break the spirit of the question...

 

[Opossum]

Oh man, if Chrom's bringing the flattened damage of Lucina's Parallel Falchion to Roy's moveset, you bet I'm gonna be replacing that Smash OC.

Though one minor gripe with Chrom is that I wish he got an Exalted Falchion appearance whenever he charges something up to replace Roy's flames other than just... I think that's wind?

He's confirmed to have Lucina's Balanced Blade effect for Roy's moveset, actually.

And yeah, after Sakurai said he likes giving Fire Emblem characters their endgame weapons (when talking about Omega Yato), I was kinda surprised Chrom didn't have the Exalted Falchion.
I'm just fruitlessly hoping he has a Great Lord alternate costume that has the Exalted version.

 

[cothero]

....yeah, nobody.
Certainly not a full 1/3 of the people asking for a Final Fantasy character for the Ballot....

His inclusion wasn't based on the ballot, he was certainly planned way before it (the same goes for bayonetta).

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Who even asked for Cloud and Bayonetta anyways?

The fact Cloud got in before Banjo is just so unjustified.

If Banjo does get into this game. I'm gonna have so much fun playing as Banjo beating up Cloud as my punching bag

 

[Zippo]

My guess is that that there's going to be a Mini Smash Direct next Wednesday/Thursday. No more than 10 or so minutes. It'll share some details/info on a few more modes, tease Spirits, and they'll end with not only a new character, but the date for last big Smash Direct next month.

 

[Idon]

He's confirmed to have Lucina's Balanced Blade effect for Roy's moveset, actually.

And yeah, after Sakurai said he likes giving Fire Emblem characters their endgame weapons (when talking about Omega Yato), I was kinda surprised Chrom didn't have the Exalted Falchion.
I'm just fruitlessly hoping he has a Great Lord alternate costume that has the Exalted version.

Yeah, kinda wish all lords got their final classes as alternate costumes. I think Roy's Smash original design is an interpretation of that, but that's just speculation on my part.

Chrom's great lord design is my favorite out of the Awakening master class designs. Love me a man in a full-suit of armor.

Who even asked for Cloud and Bayonetta anyways?

The fact Cloud got in before Banjo is just so unjustified.

A lot of people wanted Cloud. It's just those people weren't Smash speculators on social media who were jaded and thought a tangentially related Nintendo character could get in without a main appearance.
As for Bayonetta, I know a small clique that wanted her in. Of course, as we found out, that clique wasn't the thing that ultimately got her into Smash.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

His inclusion wasn't based on the ballot, he was certainly planned way before it (the same goes for bayonetta).

Which doesn't mean he wasn't a popular request in general. Because he definitely was. It just had nothing to do with the ballot for why he got in(which he didn't lack requests either anyway. Being a gaming icon and people really wanting him in in general because of how awesome he is matters).

As for me, when it came to a FF character, I definitely expected Cloud after I learned that Source Gaming's translation about "Nintendo appearances" was incorrect. When it was clear that it was just a factor, and not a requirement, that completely changed my view on speculation entirely. He wasn't an expected choice in general, of course. I just happen to have odd expectations, and once in a blue moon, I'm right. XD

Okay, that isn't clear. If we got a FF character, I expected it would be Cloud. Not that I outright expected a FF character. That part took me by surprise. The specific choice did not.

 

[Deleted member]

His inclusion wasn't based on the ballot, he was certainly planned way before it (the same goes for bayonetta).

Your argument was that "nobody asked for it".

The Ballot shows that you're lying through your teeth. Regardless of how he got in, people did ask for it.
Even back in the BRAWL days!

 

[Robertman2]

Who even asked for Cloud and Bayonetta anyways?

The fact Cloud got in before Banjo is just so unjustified.

If Banjo does get into this game. I'm gonna have so much fun playing as Banjo beating up Cloud as my punching bag

I asked for Bayonetta. I started asking for her in 2012 when Nintendo announced they were publishing Bayonetta 2

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Speaking of punching bags. Who are going to be yours?

Mine will be

 

[Vasculio]

I really don't care for 3rd party characters like Banjo, Crash Bandicoot or Steve from Mindcraft. As for the Cloud and Bayonetta debate. I actually got hyped up after seeing Cloud. But for Bayonetta... meh... wasn't too thrilled. But i did like her stage. For Corrin.. He/She got my stamp of approval

 

[Will]

Who even asked for Cloud and Bayonetta anyways?

The fact Cloud got in before Banjo is just so unjustified.

If Banjo does get into this game. I'm gonna have so much fun playing as Banjo beating up Cloud as my punching bag

It's been 3 years, and you still choose to be salty.

 

[Zinith]

Speaking of punching bags. Who are going to be yours?

Mine will be

As a Yoshi main, and are the two I need to know how to beat, so those are MY punching bags...

 

[PK-remling Fire]

Who even asked for Cloud and Bayonetta anyways?

The fact Cloud got in before Banjo is just so unjustified.

If Banjo does get into this game. I'm gonna have so much fun playing as Banjo beating up Cloud as my punching bag

I'm a huge Banjo supporter but I voted for Bayo in the polls

 

[Deleted member]

Who even asked for Cloud and Bayonetta anyways?

The fact Cloud got in before Banjo is just so unjustified.

If Banjo does get into this game. I'm gonna have so much fun playing as Banjo beating up Cloud as my punching bag

I mean, Cloud getting in before Banjo makes sense, IMO. Banjo is definitely helped refined platformers ushering into the jump to 3D, but Cloud Strife pretty much is the face of the entire role-playing game genre, even to this day. That whole time period where Nintendo ****ed up with their relationship with Sony is also pretty historic too, we'd be living in a drastically different world had that not happened.

 

[Chrono.]

Speaking of punching bags. Who are going to be yours?

The random button.

 

[Impa4Smash]

Jack Frost shouldn't be used as a fighter over Joker or Demi Fiend or Raidou. That's stupid, hee-ho.

I wanna know why the option tonstack echoes was even added tbh

Whoa now. As a Jack Frost supporter, friend you are crazy. The little dude's in like every Persona & SMT game. The perfect rep. He even has his own game!

 

[osby]

Speaking of punching bags. Who are going to be yours?

Mine will be

While Mario got a clone and that Link has 2 clones, I am baffled that Marth has 3 clones/semiclones. Even more baffling is that Marth's clone, Roy, got a echo for him which is Chrom. 4/7 of all FE are Marth Clones!

With so many Marth echoes/semiclones, why not add them all into one Marth slot instead?
View attachment 168039
Now these anime swordmen copycats will now have a reason to be here! Maybe we can call this slot, the "Fire Emblem" slot!

Incorrect, Marth is not a Marth clone.

 

[Will]

I mean, Cloud getting in before Banjo makes sense, IMO. Banjo is definitely helped refined platformers ushering into the jump to 3D, but Cloud Strife pretty much is the face of the entire role-playing game genre, even to this day. That whole time period where Nintendo ****ed up with their relationship with Sony is also pretty historic too, we'd be living in a drastically different world had that not happened.

Could you imagine Ocarina of Time having those weird CGI cutscenes on the level of FFVII?

 

[CosmicQuark]

Don't ask me about SE characters cause you'd know I'd break the spirit of the question...

If Dark Samus can be an echo for Samus, and if Geno gets in, Boshi not being a Yoshi echo would be a total missed opportunity.

Your argument was that "nobody asked for it".

The Ballot shows that you're lying through your teeth. Regardless of how he got in, people did ask for it.
Even back in the BRAWL days!

Cloud was certainly a popular and iconic enough character to be in Smash, and I think he fits well. That being said, you can't know who won the ballot from the DLC characters chosen. We don't know anything, other than King K Rool, Chrom and Dark Samus were supposedly high on it, as claimed by Sakurai, as well as inferring from Mii costumes. And there's evidence to suggest Bayonetta was chosen before the ballot finished--since she was the final DLC character, the same could be said of Cloud. As for the evidence we do have, the fan polls, Cloud was popular-ish, depending on how you analyze the polls (for me, I'd say he was popular).

EDIT:

I mean, Cloud getting in before Banjo makes sense, IMO. Banjo is definitely helped refined platformers ushering into the jump to 3D, but Cloud Strife pretty much is the face of the entire role-playing game genre, even to this day. That whole time period where Nintendo ****ed up with their relationship with Sony is also pretty historic too, we'd be living in a drastically different world had that not happened.

Depends on how you view it. Personally, I have preferential treatment towards Nintendo icons to gaming icons in general. So I agree, though I'm also not surprised Cloud came before Banjo. I do believe given Nintendo also ****ed up their relationship with Rare, that Banjo's a huge missed opportunity (which will hopefully soon be rectified).

 

[Idon]

Whoa now. As a Jack Frost supporter, friend you are crazy. The little dude's in like every Persona & SMT game. The perfect rep. He even has his own game!

yeah, but so does Chocobo, and I don't see many people clamoring for that feathery fiend.