Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Mc.Rad]

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Here is another tier list based on the alignment (evil or not) for characters I found. What do you all think?
Why isn't Yoshi chaotic evil for his tax fraud?

Falcon is obviously Chaotic Good (though acts more lawful good in the GX story mode)
Dr Mario is more neutral Good as seen in the Dr Mario 64 story mode
Dark Pit is chaotic neutral
Technically Olimar is lawful good, I would put lowie at Chaotic neutral
Ryu, Simon, and Rictor seem more Lawful good as well. They have strict morals that they follow
I do completely agree with Duck Hunt’s placement however

 

[Meritocracy]

I'll just throw this up here, I do belive Steve has a book.

 

[Opossum]

Here is another tier list based on the alignment (evil or not) for characters I found. What do you all think?
Why isn't Yoshi chaotic evil for his tax fraud?

I'd argue Chrom is closer to Neutral Good. He doesn't let laws stop him from doing what's right, as shown when he commits an act of war by killing a Plegian brigand on Plegian soil. Yes, the brigand threatened Emmeryn, and Gangrel had taken Maribelle hostage, but it was still technically an act of war, or at least a major escalation in the rising tension between Ylisse and Plegia.

 

[I Never Felt It Before]

(replying to a post I couldn't find the original source to.)
Konami
Iconic Franchise: Bomberman

SEGA
Iconic Franchise: NiGHTs (Nights into Dreams)
Iconic franchise(2): Alis and Myau (Phantasy Star 1)

Capcom
Iconic Franchise:"Palli the Calico" (Monster Hunter)


SQUARE ENIX
Iconic Franchise/assoicated with Nintendo: Terra (Final Fantasy)

Bandai Namco
Iconic Franchise: Heihachi (Tekken)

Franchise associated with Nintendo: Don Chan ( Taiko No Tatsujin)

UBISOFT

Iconic franchise: Rayman

Level-5

Franchise assoicated with Nintendo : Professor Layton
Iconic franchise: Jibanyan (Ykw)

Bethesda:

Iconic Franchise Vault Boy (Fallout)

Tecmo:

Ryu (Ninja Gaiden)

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I'll just throw this up here, I do belive Steve has a book.

A...book?

What do you mean?

 

[I Never Felt It Before]

I'd argue Chrom is closer to Neutral Good. He doesn't let laws stop him from doing what's right, as shown when he commits an act of war by killing a Plegian brigand on Plegian soil. Yes, the brigand threatened Emmeryn, and Gangrel had taken Maribelle hostage, but it was still technically an act of war, or at least a major escalation in the rising tension between Ylisse and Plegia.

You forgot to mention that Cloud is chaotic good, not neutral. While he is stopping a militaristic army, it's for the greater good of the planet. Those reactors are polluting the earth.

 

[Will]

How do you know Sakurai's priorities?

How do you know them, Mr. "K. Rool is 2nd place there's no way anyone could top him"?

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

How do you know Sakurai's priorities?

It's called Sakurai Bias. it's why we have 7 Million Fire Emblem Characters And Dark Pit. Sakurai has gone on record to say that he loves Minecraft... Minecraft is also big in Japan, Ya know? If anything, Steve is getting in before Banjo... Not saying Banjo isn't happening, Just that Steve is such a gaming icon, he seems higher priority...

 

[Deleted member]

You forgot to mention that Cloud is chaotic good, not neutral. While he is stopping a militaristic army, it's for the greater good of the planet. Those reactors are polluting the earth.

I always have to remind myself that Cloud is an eco-terrorist.

 

[Mc.Rad]

(replying to a post I couldn't find the original source to.)
Konami
Iconic Franchise: Bomberman

SEGA
Iconic Franchise: NiGHTs (Nights into Dreams)
Iconic franchise(2): Alis and Myau (Phantasy Star 1)

Capcom
Iconic Franchise:"Palli the Calico" (Monster Hunter)


SQUARE ENIX
Iconic Franchise/assoicated with Nintendo: Terra (Final Fantasy)

Bandai Namco
Iconic Franchise: Heihachi (Tekken)

Franchise associated with Nintendo: Don Chan ( Taiko No Tatsujin)

UBISOFT

Iconic franchise: Rayman

Level-5

Franchise assoicated with Nintendo : Professor Layton
Iconic franchise: Jibanyan (Ykw)

Bethesda:

Iconic Franchise Vault Boy (Fallout)

Tecmo:

Ryu (Ninja Gaiden)

To be honest I wouldn’t say that NiGHTS is THAT iconic. The fanbase for it is super small to begin with.

I’d say that Yakuza is an iconic franchise, but that’s more talking in recent terms. Shenmue can be another one

 

[I Never Felt It Before]

I always have to remind myself that Cloud is an eco-terrorist.

Yeah. Hard to say but he's not neutral to me. He is doing a good deed in the end

 

[Opossum]

I think Banjo will be in and Minecraft will just be a stage. I doubt the only ballot character in the roster will be K. Rool.

Sakurai outright said Dark Samus and Chrom were added due to being popular requests. K. Rool isn't alone in that regard.

The Inklings had strong support too, but obviously they didn't need it lol.

 

[Mc.Rad]

I'll just throw this up here, I do belive Steve has a book.

Steve Minecraft confirmed for having literature

 

[osby]

I think Banjo will be in and Minecraft will just be a stage. I doubt the only ballot character in the roster will be K. Rool.

Define "ballot character". All newcomers we got were probably voted somehow highly in the ballot.

 

[I Never Felt It Before]

To be honest I wouldn’t say that NiGHTS is THAT iconic. The fanbase for it is super small to begin with.

I’d say that Yakuza is an iconic franchise, but that’s more talking in recent terms. Shenmue can be another one

I don't like realistic stuff in my Smash but I guess? I never of heard of it before I googled it up for my Smash bros Sega roster idea which is just recently.

 

[Mc.Rad]

Define "ballot character". All newcomers we got were probably voted somehow highly in the ballot.

I’d give Simon a slight pass, I dunno about Richard though...

 

[Will]

I'll just throw this up here, I do belive Steve has a book.

An official Minecraft book, or one of the million licensed fanfictions that are out there?
Because there are a lot out there.

 

[Cosmic77]

I'm not that good at wording my own thoughts so bear with me, but I just want to talk about something that's been bothering me for a while regarsing the reactions to the Minecraft character(Steve) rumours in Smash.
It just proves how much this ****ing fanbase moves goalposts, how it tries to act like every Smash inclusion has some higher justification and how it hates anything that's new and popular.
The first thing is "Minecraft doesn't have any history with Nintendo" which is ****ing bull**** because neither did Metal Gear or Final Fantasy VII(the site uses the FFVII logo so that's all Cloud represents, not FF as a whole). But if you mention this? People will try to find whatever justification for these even though none of these would defend their inclusion before they were revealed. Metal Gear has barely touched Nintendo consoles and the Solid series jad on GC game when Snake was included. Snake wasn't added for some complicated and "rich" history with Nintendo, it was because Kojima asked Sakurai to do it. And Cloud? It wasn't because "FF leaving Nintendo is part of its history". No, it's literally just because Cloud is the most recognizable and popular FF character, his ties to Nintendo be damned.
But then some people have the nerve of saying Minecraft getting a character makes no sense. One of the biggest games of all time, bigger then 90% of the current Smash roster, a game that has showed up on every recent Nintendo console that even has exclusive content.

So why do people try to downplay Minecraft so much? Because it's new and popular and isn't their favorite childhood game. If it's not the game they played when they were kids, it's not good and kids liking it are cringy and gross. Heads up, your experiences are not universal. More kids have experienced Minecraft than they ever will an old forgotten N64 game. Stop acting like they're wrong for liking this game just because you din't want whatever you grew uo with to be outstaged.
Putting Banjo at the same level, or even higher, than Steve's is ridiculous. Banjo had moderate success in the past and has fallen into irrelevancy these days. Nintendo would never ask for the IP to be in Smash unless they were going to straight up buy it back, because it benefits no one. You give money to your rival company and advertise a game that'll never be in your console(or doesn't even exist). Minecraft, however, is a game currently on Nintendo consoles, a game Microsoft is much more lenient with and much more worth the effort to go through the legal hoops.

/Rant

While I agree that no one should dismiss Minecraft simply because they don't like the idea of Steve getting in before a character who we deem as more deserving, it's not necessarily wrong to not like Mincecraft/Steve period.

Minecraft has a huge legacy, and I think Steve would be an understandable addition to the roster. Does that mean I want him in Smash? Not at all. Even though he makes a lot of sense to me, I really don't want to see Minecraft bridge over into something like Smash. Just not my cup of tea.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Actually, there was a thread in the Smash Subreddit with a similar idea based around Gruntilda's rhymes. Worth a look.

... this is singlehandedly the best Smash thread I've read through in 3 months. This totally needs to be a thing if Banjo makes it.

 

[osby]

I’d give Simon a slight pass, I dunno about Richard though...

He's one of the most popular Belmonts. Definitely the most popular in Japan.

 

[Deleted member]

While I agree that no one should dismiss Minecraft simply because they don't like the idea of Steve getting in before a character who we deem as more deserving, it's not necessarily wrong to not like Mincecraft/Steve period.

Minecraft has a huge legacy, and I think Steve would be an understandable addition to the roster. Does that mean I want him in Smash? Not at all. Even though he makes a lot of sense to me, I really don't want to see Minecraft bridge over into something like Smash. Just not my cup of tea.

I can understand not liking it, people can have their opinions, but there's a difference with outright "distaste" and "hatred" I see being thrown around that are just a reaction to its popularity.

Personally, I don't care much for Minecraft content, loved it back in the day and would still play it on my PC if I was up for it but it doesn't interest me in a "holy **** I ****ing love this" kind of way. Still, I can appreciate the unique moveset Steve would defi itely bring with him.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

A bit late but i'm sorry bro, didn't mean to offend you

Spoiler

i was trying to mock people who don't want older characters in Smash

My favirte series in Smash are 50% Third Party and the other 50% are Nintendo
Pacc-Man World
Bayonetta 1 on PC and 2 on Switch, waiting for 3
Street Fighter Alpha, Capcom VS SNK, Marvel VS Capcom
I've enjoyed pretty much every game except Sonic 06
Mario, Pokemon, DKC and Luigi's Mansion

Don’t worry I’m not offended, so no need to apologize (I was just confused and caught off guard by someone using “boomers”)

As for that Sonic 06 part...how dare you not enjoy the greatest Sonic game of all time (alongside the recent Boom games)?

 

[I Never Felt It Before]

He's one of the most popular Belmonts. Definitely the most popular in Japan.

Simon was my most wanted, ngl. I'm just ashamed people are obsessing over the 3rd dog in smash (with no cats) and not the character that is defining 3rd parties right now.

 

[Iridium]

I have a question for you all. If any newcomer so far were to get a crazy amount of hate when the game comes out, who do you all think it would be? I would consider this later as well.

The Smash community isn't always the best when it comes to not letting this get out of hand fast...

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I’d give Simon a slight pass, I dunno about Richard though...

Stop misspelling Ricardo's name

Also, quick warning, the Smash UK might be the E3 demo again with people from the audience being picked ot like last time Nintendo UK did this

 

[I Never Felt It Before]

Stop misspelling Ricardo's name

Also, quick warning, the Smash UK might be the E3 demo again with people from the audience being picked ot like last time Nintendo UK did this

His name is actually Rick

 

[osby]

Simon was my most wanted, ngl. I'm just ashamed people are obsessing over the 3rd dog in smash (with no cats) and not the character that is defining 3rd parties right now.

I liked both Isabelle and Richter, though.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

His name is actually Rick

Now you're deliberately misspelling Rachel's name

 

[Deleted member]

I have a question for you all. If any newcomer so far were to get a crazy amount of hate when the game comes out, who do you all think it would be? I would consider this later as well.

The Smash community isn't always the best when it comes to not letting this get out of hand fast...

Incineroar, because he's a heel. Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaybe Ridley. I can see some weaker players falling victim to repeated down specials and some hate coming from that. Kind of like a Little Mac 2 if you will. He won't be a strong character, but he ruins weaker players.

His name is actually Rick

To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to understand Castlevania.

 

[Cosmic77]

Simon was my most wanted, ngl. I'm just ashamed people are obsessing over the 3rd dog in smash (with no cats) and not the character that is defining 3rd parties right now.

Hey now! Isabelle was a great addition! Might not seem as important as Simon to you, but she's essentially the new mascot for one of Nintendo's biggest franchises.

(And people keep forgetting that Mewtwo is technically a cat.)

 

[Freduardo]

I have a question for you all. If any newcomer so far were to get a crazy amount of hate when the game comes out, who do you all think it would be? I would consider this later as well.

The Smash community isn't always the best when it comes to not letting this get out of hand fast...

Isabelle. Her hate will be “should have just been an echo” and “she’s a villager clone”. She isn’t. At all. She would have been if she was an echo.

But that’s where the “Dark Pit/ROB hate” is going to go.

 

[Will]

If any newcomer so far were to get a crazy amount of hate when the game comes out, who do you all think it would be? I would consider this later as well.

It'd be 3DS Little Mac all over again.

I'm just ashamed people are obsessing over the 3rd dog in smash (with no cats) and not the character that is defining 3rd parties right now.

Well we certainly don't have any other hedgehogs right now, you make a point.

 

[SmashingXan2]

Everyone's talking about K.Rool being the ballot character, but what about Ridley? Sakurai said he wont be in Smash because he was too big, and one game later hes in smash. There has to be a reason for this, and it's likely the ballot

 

[Murlough]

It's called Sakurai Bias. it's why we have 7 Million Fire Emblem Characters And Dark Pit. Sakurai has gone on record to say that he loves Minecraft... Minecraft is also big in Japan, Ya know? If anything, Steve is getting in before Banjo... Not saying Banjo isn't happening, Just that Steve is such a gaming icon, he seems higher priority...

Steve isn’t a gaming icon. Minecraft is. Steve is just the default skin that everyone eventually changes if they have played for more than a week.

 

[Freduardo]

Simon was my most wanted, ngl. I'm just ashamed people are obsessing over the 3rd dog in smash (with no cats) and not the character that is defining 3rd parties right now.

How’d you get three dogs?

Duck Hunt. Isabelle.

Wolf? If he counts, so does Fox, as those are canines as well. So that’s four.

Maybe not wolf... maybe an assist... Nintendogs?

Rush as part of mega man’s moveset?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Everyone's talking about K.Rool being the ballot character, but what about Ridley? Sakurai said he wont be in Smash because he was too big, and one game later hes in smash. There has to be a reason for this, and it's likely the ballot

Reason is because Sakurai only mentioned the ballot for K.Rool. For Ridley, he said Ridley simply had an overwhelming amount of western fan demand so he caved and decided to try and make Ridley work. Funny enough when he was talking about K.Rool he said size might have been a problem as Sakurai believes K.Rool's supposed to be huge and physically look down on others

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Steve isn’t a gaming icon. Minecraft is. Steve is just the default skin that everyone eventually changes if they have played for more than a week.

He still represents the gameplay... Also If I asked a random person on the street what Banjo Kazooie is, they probably wouldn't know... Minecraft on the other hand...

 

[I Never Felt It Before]

How’d you get three dogs?

Duck Hunt. Isabelle.

Wolf? If he counts, so does Fox, as those are canines as well. So that’s four.

Maybe not wolf... maybe an assist... Nintendogs?

Rush as part of mega man’s moveset?

Rush, I haven't thought about, and the third was Lucario.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Here is another tier list based on the alignment (evil or not) for characters I found. What do you all think?
Why isn't Yoshi chaotic evil for his tax fraud?

Dark Pit is more of a chaotic good or true neutral (whatever Vegeta is now is what Pittoo would be)

Simon was my most wanted, ngl. I'm just ashamed people are obsessing over the 3rd dog in smash (with no cats) and not the character that is defining 3rd parties right now.

Well you see...lots of people don’t have much of a connection to Castlevania like you do, and know more about Isabelle

Everyone's talking about K.Rool being the ballot character, but what about Ridley? Sakurai said he wont be in Smash because he was too big, and one game later hes in smash. There has to be a reason for this, and it's likely the ballot

Or maybe it was because Sakurai found Ridley ready to end it all only for him to decide Ridley should join Smash...but had to kill Mario in order to make sure Pit and Kirby had no problems in looking Roman Reigns strong (wrestling term right there)

How’d you get three dogs?

Duck Hunt. Isabelle.

Wolf? If he counts, so does Fox, as those are canines as well. So that’s four.

Maybe not wolf... maybe an assist... Nintendogs?

Rush as part of mega man’s moveset?

Lucario

 

[Deleted member]

Funny enough when he was talking about K.Rool he said size might have been a problem as Sakurai believes K.Rool's supposed to be huge and physically look down on others

And then he gives K. Rool an actual crocodile run so he's lower to the ground.

Disclaimer: I love K. Rool's croc run.