Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Momotsuki]

Is there anywhere I can read up on Loz18's prolonged trolling? I know the big stuff but I'm curious about the specifics.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I disagree that Ken having Ryu's command normals/unique moves is fitting. I think that whether he ends up classified as an echo fighter or not, most of those moves I mentioned would be changed. Sakurai is a fighting game buff and has taken a lot of care with the 3rd party characters.

They don't need to be changed.

And if we go that far, he'd likely not be an Echo, but more of a Dr. Mario situation where he'd be just unique enough to be his own character.

Even after sleeping on the whole thing, I just can't bring myself to like that trailer so my view from last night on the matter is still consistent. I'm fine with Isabelle but I won't defend that trailer lol

Yeah, I feel the same.

I agree with you. It wasn't a very good reveal, and wasn't action-packed like all the others. But then again, it's Isabelle. She's not made for action. The trailer wasn't good, but it was fitting for her character

Wait, people hated Isabelle's trailer?

I can see why people would dislike it for not using the normal 3D animation, but I thought it was pretty clever. It's not the typical action and fighting scenes that we're used to, but that's because AC doesn't encompass any of that. It's a laid back slice-of-life franchise that focuses on simple things. Introducing Isabelle by having her beat the crap out of other fighters is completely out of character for her and ignores that innocent, friendly tone the franchise is known for.

Seeing Isabelle shuffle around the office and communicate to the viewers through those traditional AC text boxes made me smile. It's not my favorite reveal trailer, but I love how they still had us questioning what we were watching even though we saw Isabelle as soon as the trailer started.

I'm a pretty big Animal Crossing fan and I didn't find any enjoyment in that trailer until they dropped that we'd finally get a legit new game at the end.

Was it fitting for Isabelle's character? Yes.

But would you really say it's "fun" and "exciting" to see someone tidy up a desk, monologue for a minute and then get a letter? I sure wouldn't.

They could've done more to sell the idea of Isabelle in Smash in order to make us happy about her being in without putting any action in it. Trailers like Duck Hunt's come to mind for that aspect. But instead, she was presented in the most boring way possible.

 

[Over9000BPM]

I don't think anything has happened to say otherwise.


EDIT: I swear, if anyone cites a "leak" against this lmao

Ummmm...

...I’ll get my coat.

 

[Over9000BPM]

Well..

The roster consists of 60+ characters so it's not that weird to see some make more of an appearance than others.

That would be the rational explanation. Lemme dream, it’s no less ridiculous than Skull Kid chair formations

 

[Pyra]

Ummmm...
View attachment 164137

...I’ll get my coat.

The more you sin like this the worse Samus is going to look.

 

[P.Kat]

I’m seriously considering maining Isabelle solely because of how much it will be piss people off to have their **** kicked out of them by her.

She was on my wish list so beating people up online with her is just icing on the cake.

Not gonna lie, if Ken gets in as a unique character, I'll be annoyed that they didn't opt for Chun-Li instead..

Either Chun-Li, or throw a curveball, and do what they did for Isabelle, and have Sakura join the fight as a Semi-echo, it would make sense that Ryu's number one fan would join him, their fighting style is similar, and according to the official Capcom poll she is the #1 voted fighter.

With this amazing direct, I can confidently believe that Final Fantasy IS getting more music into Smash.
This direct proved that Square Enix is not as stingy as we thought.

This is great news, I'm especially excited for another World of Final Fantasy game, I loved the first one and collecting Mirages. Other that and a little FF 10-2, I haven't played the other FF games, so maybe its time to change that especially with playing FF7. Though it's strange they didn't put FF6 out too, I'm not complaining with all they're revealing, and the potential for more Smash content.

The Isabelle hate is simple.

(1) Ridley gets revealed.
(2) K. Rool gets revealed.
(3) "OMG literally all of the unique newcomers will be ballot winners! Who's next!? Geno or Isaac!?"
(4) Isabelle gets revealed.
(5) "You serious Sakurai!? That's not the character I expected! No one talked about her online wanted her!! Bad decision!"

I guess some people are worry cause it ultimately means some of their characters aren't gonna make the base roster (even though they could be DLC). People just have to stay positive and hope for the best if they feel discouraged about their characters making it in. I know I'm not losing hope anytime soon.

 

[SkywardStriker16]

*coughSmashFor3DSunconvincingcough*

Yup, the Smash 3DS DEMO came out on 10 September in Japan, and 19 September in the U.S. and Europe.
Smash 3DS, the full game, released 13 September in Japan and 03 October elsewhere. The demo released not even a week before the full game in Japan and barely two weeks before the full game in the West. Your point?

 

[Over9000BPM]

The more you sin like this the worse Samus is going to look.

Well that’s another double post infraction I just earned myself so hopefully that’s punishment enough xD

 

[Moon Monkey]

Can I get a link to this dante leak?

 

[BlueMagician]

By the way, it doesn't seem like Digby is an alt, so could he replace Isabelle's Assist Trophy?

 

[Over9000BPM]

Yup, the Smash 3DS DEMO came out on 10 September in Japan, and 19 September in the U.S. and Europe.
Smash 3DS, the full game, released 13 September in Japan and 03 October elsewhere. The demo released not even a week before the full game in Japan and barely two weeks before the full game in the West. Your point?

I was calling the 3DS version a demo. Another bad joke, sorry

 

[Untouch]

By the way, it doesn't seem like Digby is an alt, so could he replace Isabelle's Assist Trophy?

I think that was the point of Kapp'n.

 

[Pyra]

They don't need to be changed.

And if we go that far, he'd likely not be an Echo, but more of a Dr. Mario situation where he'd be just unique enough to be his own character.


Yeah, I feel the same.



I'm a pretty big Animal Crossing fan and I didn't find any enjoyment in that trailer until they dropped that we'd finally get a legit new game at the end.

Was it fitting for Isabelle's character? Yes.

But would you really say it's "fun" and "exciting" to see someone tidy up a desk, monologue for a minute and then get a letter? I sure wouldn't.

They could've done more to sell the idea of Isabelle in Smash in order to make us happy about her being in without putting any action in it. Trailers like Duck Hunt's come to mind for that aspect. But instead, she was presented in the most boring way possible.

I really liked the trailer honestly. I thought it was fun and that it fit, but I think that your reasoning for not liking it is totally fine and it's just something we fundamentally disagree on. And that's okay. Keep being cool my dude.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Noticed a comment on this point before but I want to stress it. Leakers are typically not the ones seeing the game in action. Leakers are typically told about the game from another source.

Vergeben missed K.Rool and the fact that all characters were returning because he wasn’t told it was happening. A leaker is proven wrong if something they predicted is clearly and obviously incorrect.

Playtesters of the game probably don’t see the whole roster in an effort to stop full roster leaks at any one point. This is specifically what happened with Brawl, as two users had two different rosters, and both ended up being right in the end.

It’s up to you if you don’t believe someone, but I think most of the time when these people gain credibility, it turns from not believing it to not WANTING to believe it.

Thus far, Vergeben has been mostly right. The only thing he wasn’t 100% on was Isabelle, and the fact that she is similar to Villager in a number of ways at least implies she’s a semi-clone of sorts.

Really, I just think people misunderstand leakers. They think every leaker is claiming to have the game or something, when that’s not typically how it works. They don’t get all the information at once, and different sources might have different REAL information.

Above all, believing we’re going to get a crap ton of characters because one thing was slightly off is absolutely setting yourself up for disappointment. Without a doubt.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I was calling the 3DS version a demo. Another bad joke, sorry

Feels more like a beta to me since there's some fun stuff that ended up being "scrapped" for the "full game", such as Smash Run

 

[SkywardStriker16]

I was calling the 3DS version a demo. Another bad joke, sorry

If anything, the Wii U version was a demo considering Smash Tour's inclusion

 

[Corbin]

If there is going to be a downloadable demo for Ultimate, I would imagine it would come out between Nov 2nd (at earliest) and launch.

 

[Over9000BPM]

Feels more like a beta to me since there's some fun stuff that ended up being "scrapped" for the "full game", such as Smash Run

Good point. I swear neither version felt like a full game. Oh damn you Sm4sh for having the hottest Zamus of all time but otherwise being complete garbage!

 

[Untouch]

I'd be VERY surprised if we don't get a Testsmash for Ultimate shortly before the game launches.

 

[Over9000BPM]

If anything, the Wii U version was a demo considering Smash Tour's inclusion

Most good jokes fall apart under scrutiny

 

[DraginHikari]

Wait, people hated Isabelle's trailer?

I can see why people would dislike it for not using the normal 3D animation, but I thought it was pretty clever. It's not the typical action and fighting scenes that we're used to, but that's because AC doesn't encompass any of that. It's a laid back slice-of-life franchise that focuses on simple things. Introducing Isabelle by having her beat the crap out of other fighters is completely out of character for her and ignores that innocent, friendly tone the franchise is known for.

Seeing Isabelle shuffle around the office and communicate to the viewers through those traditional AC text boxes made me smile. It's not my favorite reveal trailer, but I love how they still had us questioning what we were watching even though we saw Isabelle as soon as the trailer started.

Frankly, I was kind of left dazed by it in a bad way. So much so when the actual tagline and gameplay I was left more confused and baffled then anything. Once again not in a good way. It's one thing to play with the exceptions we have for Smash Trailers, I just think it was doing rather poorly in this case. The nature AC environment is not suited to this kind of trailer and playing too close just confused people more then creating any actual build up.

I just think the Isabelle trailer hate stems from people not controlling their hype and thinking every direct and every trailer is about them[Smashers].

Isabelle was a small reveal in a Direct that, had we not been getting a new AC, probably wouldn’t have even had anything Smash related at all.

I get why people are complaining but we literally just got K.Rool and the Echos not long ago... it just looks like people are getting hella spoiled to me.

No one is assuming every trailer is directed at them, but when a certain expectation has been created for Smash reveals that was simply not achieved by Isabelle trailer. Not everyone who has a issue with the trailer has a problem with Isabelle specifically.

i think the trailer disappointment stems from people wanting another epic cg trailer and they forget even in smash 4 they did plenty of more chill trailers (rosa and wii fit trainer come to mind)
besides if Isabelle was in epic combat in a cg trailer... thats just not her..

Rosalina and Wii Fit Trainer trailers did a better job at what they were trying to do. Rosalina's trailer played a better job at the 'what is this?' aspect by continuing to throw curve balls between Kirby and the Mario Kart segments which did a better job of keeping people attention though the trailer was slower. Wii Fit's trailer was shorter and played up the confusion to it's advantage rather then giving a feeling of 'When is this going to end?'

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

I think it's worth noting that before the direct aired, Some guy went through the files of the Smash website and Found Proof that some franchises with currently one character, will get another one. The ones he noted were obviously placeholders, including Wii Fit, F-Zero, PAC-MAN, Ice Climbers, and Rob.

So now that Animal crossing has two characters, what do you think the other Four franchises are?
Here are my predictions:

Xenoblade with Elma
Street Fighter with Ken
Sonic with Shadow
Punch-Out with another boxer (Likely Glass Joe)

 

[osby]

I really liked the trailer honestly. I thought it was fun and that it fit, but I think that your reasoning for not liking it is totally fine and it's just something we fundamentally disagree on. And that's okay. Keep being cool my dude.

I liked it. The reveal was really obvious but I was just grinning like a fool, waiting for title to drop.


Also, guys, if 3DS version is a demo, it's first in the video game history that a game is outselled by its demo.

 

[Kuon]

Sakurai betrayed us, what a hack!

Lol he didn't betray us, we just expected something different

 

[drag0nscythe]

Noticed a comment on this point before but I want to stress it. Leakers are typically not the ones seeing the game in action. Leakers are typically told about the game from another source.

Vergeben missed K.Rool and the fact that all characters were returning because he wasn’t told it was happening. A leaker is proven wrong if something they predicted is clearly and obviously incorrect.

Playtesters of the game probably don’t see the whole roster in an effort to stop full roster leaks at any one point. This is specifically what happened with Brawl, as two users had two different rosters, and both ended up being right in the end.

It’s up to you if you don’t believe someone, but I think most of the time when these people gain credibility, it turns from not believing it to not WANTING to believe it.

Thus far, Vergeben has been mostly right. The only thing he wasn’t 100% on was Isabelle, and the fact that she is similar to Villager in a number of ways at least implies she’s a semi-clone of sorts.

Really, I just think people misunderstand leakers. They think every leaker is claiming to have the game or something, when that’s not typically how it works. They don’t get all the information at once, and different sources might have different REAL information.

Above all, believing we’re going to get a crap ton of characters because one thing was slightly off is absolutely setting yourself up for disappointment. Without a doubt.

you need to update your sig.
And he is right. They are also spreading a lot of false information this time around, to find leaks as they can.

 

[Over9000BPM]

I liked it. The reveal was really obvious but I was just grinning like a fool, waiting for title to drop.


Also, guys, if 3DS version is a demo, it's first in the video game history that a game is outselled by its demo.

I was just joking

 

[Moon Monkey]

They don't need to be changed.

And if we go that far, he'd likely not be an Echo, but more of a Dr. Mario situation where he'd be just unique enough to be his own character.


Yeah, I feel the same.



I'm a pretty big Animal Crossing fan and I didn't find any enjoyment in that trailer until they dropped that we'd finally get a legit new game at the end.

Was it fitting for Isabelle's character? Yes.

But would you really say it's "fun" and "exciting" to see someone tidy up a desk, monologue for a minute and then get a letter? I sure wouldn't.

They could've done more to sell the idea of Isabelle in Smash in order to make us happy about her being in without putting any action in it. Trailers like Duck Hunt's come to mind for that aspect. But instead, she was presented in the most boring way possible.

I honestly think if they had other Smash characters show up in animal crossing style the trailer would of been more exciting for me (a person not interested in AC)

Like seeing Wario enter in instead of Pete to annoy Isabella or something.

 

[Frostwraith]

I think we'll still have another Smash Direct or presentation sometime in the next two months.

Isabelle was a clever tie-up with the upcoming Animal Crossing game but it's obvious that Smash wasn't the biggest focus of this Direct.

Speaking of Isabelle, I can't say I'm particularly excited about her although she's a solid choice due to popularity. Her moveset isn't entirely unique either as the general concept and various of her moves are clearly derivative of the Villager. She might not be an echo but she's not a groundbreaking new fighter either. It's an okay addition for me.

 

[Sleeps with Butterflies]

Noticed a comment on this point before but I want to stress it. Leakers are typically not the ones seeing the game in action. Leakers are typically told about the game from another source.

Vergeben missed K.Rool and the fact that all characters were returning because he wasn’t told it was happening. A leaker is proven wrong if something they predicted is clearly and obviously incorrect.

Playtesters of the game probably don’t see the whole roster in an effort to stop full roster leaks at any one point. This is specifically what happened with Brawl, as two users had two different rosters, and both ended up being right in the end.

It’s up to you if you don’t believe someone, but I think most of the time when these people gain credibility, it turns from not believing it to not WANTING to believe it.

Thus far, Vergeben has been mostly right. The only thing he wasn’t 100% on was Isabelle, and the fact that she is similar to Villager in a number of ways at least implies she’s a semi-clone of sorts.

Really, I just think people misunderstand leakers. They think every leaker is claiming to have the game or something, when that’s not typically how it works. They don’t get all the information at once, and different sources might have different REAL information.

Above all, believing we’re going to get a crap ton of characters because one thing was slightly off is absolutely setting yourself up for disappointment. Without a doubt.

Yeah, I don't think I really had all the information I needed to comment on this subject. And I apologise for being a brat and cursing every other word in my posts. The belligerence wasn't directed at any specific user, but that doesn't make it any less vulgar and rude.

That being said, I'm still not convinced about Incineroar, and I really hope it isn't him. Lol

 

[Over9000BPM]

Lol he didn't betray us, we just expected something different

BETRAYAL

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Has anybody else brought up Isabelle's absence from the Everyone is Here artwork?

Yep. I think Ken and another Square Enix rep are pretty much confirmed now that Isabelle is in. About the the gen 8 Pokémon rep, even Verge is not very convinced about his source, so we'll have to wait.

Oh boy, if that other Square rep turns out to be Noctis, then things could harken back to when Vergeben also claimed that Phoenix Wright would be playable. I don't often like leaks, but what I'd give for that to be true!

 

[Pyra]

I think we'll still have another Smash Direct or presentation sometime in the next two months.

Isabelle was a clever tie-up with the upcoming Animal Crossing game but it's obvious that Smash wasn't the biggest focus of this Direct.

Speaking of Isabelle, I can't say I'm particularly excited about her although she's a solid choice due to popularity. Her moveset isn't entirely unique either as the general concept and various of her moves are clearly derivative of the Villager. She might not be an echo but she's not a groundbreaking new fighter either. It's an okay addition for me.

There's definitely going to be a new direct, I think, because they said they'll be showing off every available fighter before release and they also want to talk about the new mode.
Wouldn't be able to do either of those things in a general direct.

General direct was pretty much the best place to announce Isabelle haha. And to be fair, I already prefer her to the Villager.

 

[Sleeps with Butterflies]

Oh boy, if that other Sqaure rep truns out to be Noctis, then things could harken back to when Vergeben also claimed that Phoenix Wright would be playable. I don't often like leaks, but what I'd give for that to be true!

When did he leak Phoenix Wright? This is news to me.

 

[Moon Monkey]

I'm happy Smash Speculation is fun again before yesterday everyone reached a general agreement who was getting in.

Now it looks like its been thrown out the window.

 

[drag0nscythe]

Looking at the website, I am assuming shizue is Isabelle's japanese name.
I am conflicted on her. On one hand, I have no interest in her character and feel slightly resentful that she made it as a unique fighter. On the other, she is so cute. ugg. Stupid conflictions. We need more smash info. Make this feeling go away.

 

[Deleted member]

King K.Rool is just a semi clone, sorry I don't make the rules:
He has DDD's Dash Attack, NAir and Neutral B
Ganon's FAir and DAir
Mii Brawler's FSmash
Bowser's BAir
Simon's Side B
Duck Hunt's Up B(it works the same, only the animation is different)
And most importantly, Ike's Down B

 

[ColietheGoalie]

I thought it was pretty obvious it was a Smash announcement from the start. The host says "we have a couple more things to show you", then the presentation cuts to a highly popular character no in the game yet talking about how the mayor is "busy with Smash"... who didn't know where that was going?

I enjoyed the slow buildup of the trailer, just waiting for the tagline to appear.

---

As for Smash 3DS, I do feel it hobbled Smash4 unfortunately. I'm glad they're not doing that this time, and in a strange way Ultimate feels like the game 4 SHOULD HAVE been if it wasn't held back.

 

[Deleted member]

There's definitely going to be a new direct, I think, because they said they'll be showing off every available fighter before release and they also want to talk about the new mode.
Wouldn't be able to do either of those things in a general direct.

General direct was pretty much the best place to announce Isabelle haha. And to be fair, I already prefer her to the Villager.

That's why i think we'll have another non-Smash direct that has a rep in it (likely a Pokemon Direct) and then a final Direct that just dumps a whole ocean-load of information on us.

 

[Pyra]

Boy oh boy
Adding Isabelle to my list of secondaries is going to be fun

 

[osby]

King K.Rool is just a semi clone, sorry I don't make the rules:
He has DDD's Dash Attack, NAir and Neutral B
Ganon's FAir and DAir
Mii Brawler's FSmash
Bowser's BAir
Simon's Side B
Duck Hunt's Up B(it works the same, only the animation is different)
And most importantly, Ike's Down B

His Neutral B also takes from Bowser Jr. and his side B is taken from Link.

But yeah, you're right about being a semi clone. I'm sure he started development as an echo.