Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[PsychoJosh]

Master Chief would complete the set. Smash Bros. would then officially have characters from ALL their competitors.

They already have Sonic and Bayonetta, who belong to their once fiercest rival, Sega. They had Snake and Cloud who made their mark on the PlayStation. If Master Chief got in, they'd then have an Xbox character, completing the circle and allowing them to take over the universe.

 

[N3ON]

Since Snake and especially Cloud got in, people have acted like it was some great coup against Sony. You'd hear cries of like "omg Nintendo got a playstation character!". Granted, it's a little funny Sony couldn't acquire them for their own crossover, but it's all so overblown. Sure those characters are Playstation-associated, but again, they're not characters from Nintendo's competitors. It's akin to if PSASBR got like... Sonic or Bomberman or something. Those characters, these days, are Nintendo-associated... and it might be a little weird to see them in a Playstation crossover, but it's not like they actually got a Nintendo character...

And that's also why there's a biiiiig difference between getting the likes of Snake or Cloud and getting the likes of Master Chief or Banjo.

 

[Ura]

Since Snake and especially Cloud got in, people have acted like it was some great coup against Sony. You'd hear cries of like "omg Nintendo got a playstation character!". Granted, it's a little funny Sony couldn't acquire them for their own crossover, but it's all so overblown. Sure those characters are Playstation-associated, but again, they're not characters from Nintendo's competitors. It's akin to if PSASBR got like... Sonic or Bomberman or something. Those characters, these days, are Nintendo-associated... and it might be a little weird to see them in a Playstation crossover, but it's not like they actually got a Nintendo character...

And that's also why there's a biiiiig difference between getting the likes of Snake or Cloud and getting the likes of Master Chief or Banjo.

Cloud being a "Playstation" character is laughable considering his series isn't even owned by Sony. The certain game he had is associated with Sony consoles but he's not even remotely a "Sony" character.

Master Chief being in Smash would be a much MUCH bigger deal. He's a character who's actually owned by Microsoft so seeing a character owned by another company would be surreal.

Master Chief would complete the set. Smash Bros. would then officially have characters from ALL their competitors.

They already have Sonic and Bayonetta, who belong to their once fiercest rival, Sega. They had Snake and Cloud who made their mark on the PlayStation. If Master Chief got in, they'd then have an Xbox character, completing the circle and allowing them to take over the universe.

Cloud and Snake are not Playstation characters. No matter how you look at it.

Same goes for Crash.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

...Is there even any major Sony characters? As in not just exclusives(like Kratos), but ones they outright own? Unlike with Nintendo, Microsoft, or Sega, that's kind of hard to say.

 

[PsychoJosh]

...Is there even any major Sony characters? As in not just exclusives(like Kratos), but ones they outright own? Unlike with Nintendo, Microsoft, or Sega, that's kind of hard to say.

They don't really have a mascot. Since they let Crash and Spyro go, the closest thing they have to a "Mario" is Ratchet & Clank. There are also the Sony cats Toro and Kuro, but they're more marketing characters than actual game characters.

I guess there's also Parappa the Rapper. Miyamoto did once say that he's jealous he didn't think of Parappa first.

Cloud and Snake are not Playstation characters. No matter how you look at it.

Same goes for Crash.

They're not officially owned by Sony, no, but they are recognized as characters that made their hugest splash on the PlayStation, so in that sense, they're PlayStation characters.

MGS and FF7 were the killer apps for the system back in the day. Nintendo didn't have anything that could compete with them and they helped the PSX be the best-selling console of that generation.

 

[N3ON]

...Is there even any major Sony characters? As in not just exclusives(like Kratos), but ones they outright own? Unlike with Nintendo, Microsoft, or Sega, that's kind of hard to say.

Sony does outright own God of War. It's made by Sony Santa Monica, a first-party dev.

And Sony does have a stable of major characters like Kratos, Nathan Drake and Sackboy to name a few, but no, none are mascot status.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Sony does outright own God of War. It's made by Sony Santa Monica, a first-party dev.

And Sony does have a stable of major characters like Kratos, Nathan Drake and Sackboy to name a few, but no, none are mascot status.

Well, I wasn't talking about mascots so much as "owned by" and "major" only. Anyway, I guess I was more of a Microsoft and Nintendo gamer, so I don't remember which ones are which. Likewise, I only own Little Big Planet, despite not playing it just yet. Still, any of those 3 would add a proper Sony character. Sackboy sounds the most interesting, but I'm not sure which one is being pushed the most of the 3, though.

 

[N3ON]

Well, I wasn't talking about mascots so much as "owned by" and "major" only. Anyway, I guess I was more of a Microsoft and Nintendo gamer, so I don't remember which ones are which. Likewise, I only own Little Big Planet, despite not playing it just yet. Still, any of those 3 would add a proper Sony character. Sackboy sounds the most interesting, but I'm not sure which one is being pushed the most of the 3, though.

It would be Kratos considering Drake's story is apparently over now and lately LittleBigPlanet hasn't been performing up to snuff.

Of course there's also characters like Ratchet & Clank who just got a movie and Ellie from The Last of Us.

So they've got enough to work with. More than Microsoft.

But none I'm really dying to see near Smash. Even Kat from Gravity Rush, who is probably my favourite.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Banjo is in Diddy Kong Racing, so the worlds were possibly intended to be connected at one point. Things change, though.

Yeah I do remember that Banjo and Conker were in Diddy Kong Racing. They were also the only characters from Diddy Kong Racing to not return in the DS remake. Strangely, Tiptup did come back, despite being a Banjo-Kazooie series character, but that may be because his role in that series was very minor.

 

[Ura]

They're not officially owned by Sony, no, but they are recognized as characters that made their hugest splash on the PlayStation, so in that sense, they're PlayStation characters.

MGS and FF7 were the killer apps for the system back in the day. Nintendo didn't have anything that could compete with them and they helped the PSX be the best-selling console of that generation.

Yes but they're not Sony-owned characters. That's the sticking point.

is owned by Nintendo.

is owned by SEGA.

Master Chief is owned by Microsoft.

and are not owned by Sony.

There's really no getting around it.

...Is there even any major Sony characters? As in not just exclusives(like Kratos), but ones they outright own? Unlike with Nintendo, Microsoft, or Sega, that's kind of hard to say.

Nathan Drake and Kratos come to mind.

They would be very hype in a Smash Bros game.

 

[Deleted member]

The next smash will definitely go on the Nintendo Switch or other Nintendo consoles. I am fine with them going on a Nintendo console, but it would be nice to see Smash games on Steam, using an emulator is really hard for me when trying to play Melee and Project M on my PC. I just hope they release a major balance patch and some new interesting characters.

 

[PsychoJosh]

Nathan Drake and Kratos come to mind.

They would be very hype in a Smash Bros game.

I beg to differ.

Nathan Drake is too boring and generic for Smash (look at his moves in PSAS and you'll see exactly what I mean), and Kratos is just the violent, edgy machismo fantasy of a manchild. If a Sony character got in I'm pretty sure Nintendo would make a push for one of their more iconic mascots.

But that's a fantasy that's neither here nor there.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

It would be Kratos considering Drake's story is apparently over now and lately LittleBigPlanet hasn't been performing up to snuff.

Of course there's also characters like Ratchet & Clank who just got a movie and Ellie from The Last of Us.

So they've got enough to work with. More than Microsoft.

But none I'm really dying to see near Smash. Even Kat from Gravity Rush, who is probably my favourite.

Microsoft has some pretty feasible choices too, especially considering they own Rare's properties as well. I'm not too worried about finding a strong choice.

But yeah, both companies have some nice 1st/2nd party options.

Nathan Drake and Kratos come to mind.

They would be very hype in a Smash Bros game.

Very true. They both are pretty well known and have lots of potential. I never saw much gameplay for Nathan Drake, though. So I know little about him and can't say much. I saw more of Kratos, but it also helps when you're a Mortal Kombat player, and have seen lots of God of War commercials. Plus, I'm a fan of the Greek mythology too.

 

[Deleted member]

For you Banjo Kazooie people who want him in Smash Brothers,

@PedroDarkinson I think it would be cool if Banjo was in the next SSB DLC. We've worked with Nintendo on Rare IP before, no issues.

— Phil Spencer (@XboxP3) April 3, 2015

 

[N3ON]

Microsoft has some pretty feasible choices too, especially considering they own Rare's properties as well. I'm not too worried about finding a strong choice.

But yeah, both companies have some nice 1st/2nd party options.

I think it's telling that it's much easier to create a Sony All-Stars scenario, even excluding third-parties, than it would be for Microsoft. After like a half dozen decent choices, it pretty much falls off a cliff.

For you Banjo Kazooie people who want him in Smash Brothers,

@PedroDarkinson I think it would be cool if Banjo was in the next SSB DLC. We've worked with Nintendo on Rare IP before, no issues.

— Phil Spencer (@XboxP3) April 3, 2015

But yeah that's the reason Banjo had the demand he did during the ballot.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I think it's telling that it's much easier to create a Sony All-Stars scenario, even excluding third-parties, than it would be for Microsoft. After like a half dozen decent choices, it pretty much falls off a cliff.

I wouldn't call the difference that big at this point, though. All of Rare is 1st party now for Microsoft, after all.

Well, it is true that Sony has more 1st party series. Either way, neither holds a candle to Nintendo's options, heh.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Is it bold for me to make the prediction that a Bethesda character will be in the next Smash?

I'm hearing that Bethesda is rather pleased with how their games are selling on the system. In particular Skyrim... *cough* and are planning on supporting it into the foreseeable future with multiplatform and maybe even exclusive titles.

I really really hope it's not the Dragonborn but hell, if he's interesting then I'm down. But B.J Blazcowicz or The Doom Slayer are better choices in my opinion. I think one of those 3 is rather likely.

And maybe even a Ubisoft character as well... Please no Rabbids. Please Rayman.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

If a Sony character got in I'm pretty sure Nintendo would make a push for one of their more iconic mascots.

I mean.

I'm not gung ho for Kratos either (Nathan would be great though), but I'm pretty sure Kratos is the most iconic character they have at this point.

He was the Mario of PSABR after all.

 

[PsychoJosh]

I mean.

I'm not gung ho for Kratos either (Nathan would be great though), but I'm pretty sure Kratos is the most iconic character they have at this point.

He was the Mario of PSABR after all.

Kratos, the Mario of Sony?

That is EXTREMELY debatable. I definitely did not see him that way in PSASBR. Being in the top left corner of the character select screen does not rank you in order of importance.

I'd argue that the most mascot-like characters they have are Ratchet, Jak, Sly Cooper, Sackboy and Parappa. If Sony indeed does have a mascot at all I believe it'd definitely be one of those five.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Kratos, the Mario of Sony?

That is EXTREMELY debatable. I definitely did not see him that way in PSASBR. Being in the top left corner of the character select screen does not rank you in order of importance.

I'd argue that the most mascot-like characters they have are Ratchet, Jak, Sly Cooper, Sackboy and Parappa. If Sony indeed does have a mascot at all I believe it'd definitely be one of those five.

I'm mainly seeing him as the Mario due to the marketing.

He was the first character shown, one of the huge players on the box, given big time in the finale of the opening, etc.

He's clearly the character being pushed more then others.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I honestly don't think they'll just pick Sony or Microsoft characters just for the sake of it.

Every third party that was brought in Smash had a justified reason for being there;

• Snake may have gotten in because Kojima asked for him, but Sakurai could've said no if Snake wasn't as iconic as he is to the stealth genre.
• Sonic's iconic rivalry with Mario is a major part of the 90s in gaming history. That and he's one of the most iconic gaming characters, period.
• Mega Man is a huge platforming icon... or rather was before Capcom started treating him like nothing.
• Pac-Man probably got in because Bandai Namco worked on Smash 4, but he's still a huge arcade legend and is as iconic as Sonic and Mario.
• Ryu is the most iconic fighting game character.
• Cloud is one of, if not the most iconic JRPG character.
• Bayonetta is the only odd one since she got in because of the ballot, though said ballot makes her a justified exception. With that said, she's still decently popular, just not quite the same level as the other third parties.

Saying they should bring a character owned by Sony or Microsoft just because doesn't make sense to me. If they do that, they'll need to find someone iconic to gaming as a whole to justify it.

 

[Ghirahilda]

Does Fire Emblem have a iconic villain that could be added to the roster? I know that Robin is somewhat a villain.

Also, I think the heroes are really more preferable

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Does Fire Emblem have a iconic villain that could be added to the roster? I know that Robin is somewhat a villain.

Also, I think the heroes are really more preferable

Not really.

I mean, the villains like the heroes are mostly one offs.

And usually they aren't anywhere near as popular as the heroes.

Black Knight is the only one who bucked that trend and even then, he isn't THAT popular.

 

[Opossum]

Does Fire Emblem have a iconic villain that could be added to the roster? I know that Robin is somewhat a villain.

Also, I think the heroes are really more preferable

Honestly the only way I could see it happen is if the new Smash comes out around the same time as a remake of Genealogy of the Holy War. Seliph would have issues standing out and Sigurd has the issue of being horse-locked (and if he dismounts he has Seliph's issue), in which case I could see Arvis getting in. It helps that he's one of the more popular villains within the fanbase (which is saying something for a Jugdral character).

Beyond that though I don't see them going for a villain.

 

[Ghirahilda]

Also, we can't forget that there is a Fire Emblem being produced for Switch. So maybe we will get a new hero/heroine, maybe a new avatar and maybe a new villain for sure

 

[Deleted member]

I saw earlier some people guessing we might have Smash news for E3 2018.

But I personally would like an announcement like for the 2 previous installments, as to know only verbally.

'Cause I don't want Smash to steal Prime 4's spotlight.

 

[Megadoomer]

Also, we can't forget that there is a Fire Emblem being produced for Switch. So maybe we will get a new hero/heroine, maybe a new avatar and maybe a new villain for sure

Hopefully not all three, though; that would be absurd.

 

[Freduardo]

Does Fire Emblem have a iconic villain that could be added to the roster? I know that Robin is somewhat a villain.

Also, I think the heroes are really more preferable

Arvis/Alvis is probably their most identifiable villain

 

[Deleted member]

Arvis/Alvis is probably their most identifiable villain

>Appeared only in a Japan exclusive game

Yeah I doubt it.

 

[Opossum]

>Appeared only in a Japan exclusive game

Yeah I doubt it.

Within the fanbase itself he's incredibly popular.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Villians are heavily overrated, they don't automatically make a better character. Except in some cases where the villian gets far more personality as the main characters, Bowser and Ganondorf are good examples. K.Rool too because of his extremely chaotic nature. Wolf, Wario and Mewtwo are more anti-heroes if anything, who I do think are the most interessting of the bunch in terms of personality. Black Knight could also fit in there, but he's unfortunately not really in a favorable position.

Also Banjo is easily best choice for third party. Because I say so.

 

[Deleted member]

Within the fanbase itself he's incredibly popular.

ftfy

But yeah, I think I forgot that Fire Emblem isn't exactly iconic... Hell, the most iconic character from that series is mostly known through Smash.

And frankly I'm not an expert when it comes to Fire Emblem since I only played two games and a half (Unless you count all versions of Fates as one game, in which case I played one and a half game).

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

And frankly I'm not an expert when it comes to Fire Emblem since I only played two games and a half (Unless you count all versions of Fates as one game, in which case I played one and a half game).

There are three versions of Fates

 

[Deleted member]

There are three versions of Fates

>implying I said there weren't

 

[IronTed]

I saw earlier some people guessing we might have Smash news for E3 2018.

But I personally would like an announcement like for the 2 previous installments, as to know only verbally.

'Cause I don't want Smash to steal Prime 4's spotlight.

I doubt there'd be much cannibalization of hype between the 2. I mean Pokemon's announcement didn't seem to soften Prime 4's anticipation at last E3. Granted the internet is often not representative of the masses, so I guess it's a moot point.

 

[Deleted member]

Pokemon's announcement didn't seem to soften Prime 4's anticipation at last E3

USUM were revealed before E3 iirc, plus not many people were hyped about them to begin with because they were "just Sun and Moon 2.0".

 

[Schnee117]

USUM were revealed before E3 iirc, plus not many people were hyped about them to begin with because they were "just Sun and Moon 2.0".

They mean the "Yeah we're working on a mainline Pokemon for the Switch" announcement.

 

[IronTed]

USUM were revealed before E3 iirc, plus not many people were hyped about them to begin with because they were "just Sun and Moon 2.0".

I was referring to Pokemon for Switch.

 

[Deleted member]

They mean the "Yeah we're working on a mainline Pokemon for the Switch" announcement.

I was referring to Pokemon for Switch.

Oh that, I almost forgot that was announced then because it was so brief.
I was just busy screaming with joy because they confirmed that Metroid isn't dead.

Though tbh Smash is usually a much bigger deal to people then yet another Pokemon game (Myself not included), so I can see where FSG is coming from.

 

[IronTed]

Oh that, I almost forgot that was announced then because it was so brief.
I was just busy screaming with joy because they confirmed that Metroid isn't dead.

Though tbh Smash is usually a much bigger deal to people then yet another Pokemon game (Myself not included), so I can see where FSG is coming from.

It depends on the Pokemon game. If we're talking 3rd versions than yeah, few get hyped. But new mainline games often get much anticipation.

I see the concern, but I think it is misplaced. The two games are simply too different.

Edit: To the other point, I think a Smash announcement in Half 1 of 2018 is plausible, although I wouldn't expect it to be "center stage" so to speak until release would be close. Stuff like Pokemon or AC seem more center stage material right now (for 2018).