Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[UserKev]

Ghirahim's cool, but his chances aren't too high because he's ultimately not the main villain of his game(although he's the driving antagonist of the plot that said and very important, no questioning that)

This is why I stated, Smash's rules, are Complicated! Who gives a ish if Ghirahim wasn't the main villain in Skyward Sword? He still played a more significant role than the main villain as he slept on his ass. Give me a playable henchmen any day.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

This is why I stated, Smash's rules, are Complicated! Who gives a ish if Ghirahim wasn't the main villain in Skyward Sword? He still played a more significant role than the main villain as he slept on his ***. Give me a playable henchmen any day.

Unfortunately, that does play a role in determining characters. There's also various other Zelda characters as competition. I think a remake of SS would vastly improve his chances, though~

 

[Zerp]

So, some new information about that trademark came out that I think implies there's a little more to it than we originally thought.

Spoiler

https://twitter.com/vaporwavedash/status/931706374173716480

The logo matches up perfectly to Melee's but not to any of the other games. Isn't that odd? You'd think if this was just an generic logo they'd go with Smash 4's, but nope they went with Melee. Maybe it's an mistake of some sorts but I doubt it, and it'd be kind of weird if they started selling merchandise with Melee's logo on it instead of the most recent game unless if Melee HD/VC actually is happening so I'm going to make the personal assumption that they will do something with Melee soon, but we shouldn't take this as an 100% confirmation of anything (or deconfirmation of another Smash game on the Switch if Melee does come through).

Any thoughts on this?

 

[RealLuigisWearPink]

GC VC here we come!!

Wait we still need NES, SNES, Gameboy and N64......

 

[Luminario]

I'll only accept Melee HD if they fix character balance. A game that people masquerade as competitive where only 6 characters are viable is not a good competitive game. I'd also like to see them fix all the bugs as well simply out of my own pettiness, because it will be so funny seeing Melee stans actually have to explain the reason for still playing the GC version is because "Nintendo fixed the bugs I used to win"

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I'll only accept Melee HD if they fix character balance. A game that people masquerade as competitive where only 6 characters are viable is not a good competitive game. I'd also like to see them fix all the bugs as well simply out of my own pettiness, because it will be so funny seeing Melee stans actually have to explain the reason for still playing the GC version is because "Nintendo fixed the bugs I used to win"

It wouldn't exactly be Melee if it didn't maintain everything from the original GCN title. Sadly, this will mean that Bowser remains being arguably the worst fighter in the game.

 

[SmashChu]

If an ARMS character gets in it's most likely just going to be a template character with different variations, like Bowser Jr. and the Koopalings.

I'm thinking it'll be Spring Man/Ribbon Girl/Min Min/Ninjara/Kid Cobra, mainly because those five seem like they would share an animation rig easier. I don't think Twintelle or Master Mummy would be selectable in this template since they would require different animations due to their body types.

The ARMS characters all have different abilities and they each have arms that are associated with them (although they can use every arm). You can't really place one over the other because of that. If you have Ribbon Girl, she's got to have the 4 jumps, which Spring Man doesn't have.

More likely, you'll get Spring Man and Ribbon Girl. Both will be in since they are similar (model swaps) but have unique attributes and arms.

 

[Ura]

What would you guys think of Melee HD being a bridge of sorts in the gap between Smash 4 and Smash 5?

I remember something being stated about how Wind Waker HD was sort of meant to bridge the gap between Skyward Sword and Breath of the Wild (which we didn't know about at the time and we thought would be releasing in 2015/2016).

So I think Melee HD could serve a similar purpose Wind Waker HD had and then a brand new Smash Bros game comes out in 2020 or 2021. That would also line up well with whatever Sakurai is doing seeing as he's still working on his new project. 2020/2021 would be ample time to complete a new Smash Bros game.

 

[EdwardSponge]

Can't wait for Fox's down B the video game HD Portable Now needlessly convirted to 3D Delux Directors Cut Chain of Memories Final Mix 2

 

[PsychoJosh]

God damn it I don't want Melee HD. I'm not interested.

I honestly think the only people who are interested are competitive Melee players.

 

[SmashChu]

What would you guys think of Melee HD being a bridge of sorts in the gap between Smash 4 and Smash 5?

I remember something being stated about how Wind Waker HD was sort of meant to bridge the gap between Skyward Sword and Breath of the Wild (which we didn't know about at the time and we thought would be releasing in 2015/2016).

So I think Melee HD could serve a similar purpose Wind Waker HD had and then a brand new Smash Bros game comes out in 2020 or 2021. That would also line up well with whatever Sakurai is doing seeing as he's still working on his new project. 2020/2021 would be ample time to complete a new Smash Bros game.

Probably wont happen. First off, Nintendo is not going to do the same thing that was done for the Wii U. If they did mean to do a "bridge" with the WWHD, they wont repeat that for another title. Also, Nintendo would rather have a new Smash on the system to push units, so the focus will be there. My guess is still that a new Smash will happen in 2019.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

What would you guys think of Melee HD being a bridge of sorts in the gap between Smash 4 and Smash 5?

I remember something being stated about how Wind Waker HD was sort of meant to bridge the gap between Skyward Sword and Breath of the Wild (which we didn't know about at the time and we thought would be releasing in 2015/2016).

So I think Melee HD could serve a similar purpose Wind Waker HD had and then a brand new Smash Bros game comes out in 2020 or 2021. That would also line up well with whatever Sakurai is doing seeing as he's still working on his new project. 2020/2021 would be ample time to complete a new Smash Bros game.

Melee HD will never happen.

The only people who even care about it are competitive Melee players, which form only a small amount of the Smash fanbase, so it's already doomed to have low sales in comparison to other Smash titles, but on top of that, it would probably get fixes here and there, some of them potentially good, but others killing many of the technical aspects of the game, since Sakurai wants Smash to be accessible.

In other words, if Melee HD happens, stuff like wavedashes and wavelands might not come back, which would drive away the small minority of the fanbase who would actually care for it in the first place. And even if they do keep it, it's not worth it because, again, only a small part of the fanbase would care for it.

 

[RealLuigisWearPink]

**** it, let's make a full-blown Melee REMAKE! New graphics, new characters (all the ones considered but cut during Melee's development), same gameplay.

 

[PsychoJosh]

**** it, let's make a full-blown Melee REMAKE! New graphics, new characters (all the ones considered but cut during Melee's development), same gameplay.

Okay, you get right on that, we'll be right behind you shortly.

 

[Zerp]

I don't think Melee HD is plausible when VC is so much easier and can accomplish the exact same goal (getting the Melee community on board as part of the Switch's install base) if it has minimal lag. Anyway, I expect our questions to be answered very shortly, Melee's anniversary is the 21st after all.

**** it, let's make a full-blown Melee REMAKE! New graphics, new characters (all the ones considered but cut during Melee's development), same gameplay.

Nah, we need to step it up even higher than that, we need to kidnap the former Project M dev team and force them to make Project M 2 an official game for Nintendo.

 

[Ura]

God damn it I don't want Melee HD. I'm not interested.

I honestly think the only people who are interested are competitive Melee players.

I'm not all that interested either. I posted that as a scenario given the recent news of the trademark.

Probably wont happen. First off, Nintendo is not going to do the same thing that was done for the Wii U. If they did mean to do a "bridge" with the WWHD, they wont repeat that for another title. Also, Nintendo would rather have a new Smash on the system to push units, so the focus will be there. My guess is still that a new Smash will happen in 2019.

Yeah I know it's sketchy but it's still possible.

I'm also in favor of a new Smash Bros in 2019 but I don't know if that would fit with Sakurai's new project. 2020 seems more realistic.

Melee HD will never happen.

The only people who even care about it are competitive Melee players, which form only a small amount of the Smash fanbase, so it's already doomed to have low sales in comparison to other Smash titles, but on top of that, it would probably get fixes here and there, some of them potentially good, but others killing many of the technical aspects of the game, since Sakurai wants Smash to be accessible.

In other words, if Melee HD happens, stuff like wavedashes and wavelands might not come back, which would drive away the small minority of the fanbase who would actually care for it in the first place. And even if they do keep it, it's not worth it because, again, only a small part of the fanbase would care for it.

I know. There's a lot of problems with doing Melee HD and personally I would pass on that. I brought it up in light of the possibility it happens.

There's also the problem of casual Smash fans who look at the game and ponder why they would want to buy a game that's 16 years old and has significantly less content than Smash 4.

I don't think Melee HD is plausible when VC is so much easier and can accomplish the exact same goal (getting the Melee community on board as part of the Switch's install base) if it has minimal lag. Anyway, I expect our questions to be answered very shortly, Melee's anniversary is the 21st after all.

I would prefer Melee being on GC VC as well.

The thing is that we have no idea how VC will work on the Switch especially if the subscription thing rumored is true.

 

[SmashChu]

Yeah I know it's sketchy but it's still possible.

I'm also in favor of a new Smash Bros in 2019 but I don't know if that would fit with Sakurai's new project. 2020 seems more realistic.

Keep in mind we have no idea what Sakurai is doing or if he is even working on the next Smash. Sakurai was brought on because of Iwata and he was really the one who pushed him to keep making the games. He may step away from it or Nintendo may prefer to make it in-house and have more creative control over it (It is one big advertisement for their IPs after all). I think one mistake people are making is to assume that Smash follow the same beats as the last two, but Nintendo is a totally different company. You can tell that by how they manage the Switch (and by the fact they have a totally different president).

I would say 2019 because its the anniversary of Smash and, if we assume it started development in 2016, it would be about 3 years.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

There's also the problem of casual Smash fans who look at the game and ponder why they would want to buy a game that's 16 years old and has significantly less content than Smash 4.

Indeed.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Melee HD isn't that bad of an idea, as long as it has more character balance, and especially if the Wavedash(which should be a bit easier to do) is worthwhile for every character. The game isn't nearly that unbalanced, although there's a blatant tier gap.

If VC, they only need to modify the game enough(if it's even possible, the data may be too old) so the GC Controller uses the L and R buttons to their fullest potential. If it's not possible to modify the data, which means the Gamecube Controller won't work properly overall with the game, they're better off making an HD remake to rerelease the game.

Ultimately, the controller is kind of the issue here. Melee HD would still sell for being the Smash brand alone, and since this'll give them a chance to do a lot of balance changes, who knows how interesting it could be. Other than things is possibly making it more like FFVIIr, which means a lot of unique changes. Or if you will, how WWHD had the Tingle Bottle. Not sure what else they could add that would help the game. Some NPC's being playable? Including remapping Master Hand and Crazy Hand's controls to the regular movesets instead of the using the D-Pad(as with making it so you could only choose Final Destination. Smash 4 actually did that, by removing stages from the stage select during 8-Player Smash). Giga Bowser could work in single player, but most likely would be multiplayer. I can't think of a part of Adventure Mode that makes him impossible to work with, not even the F-Zero stage. At best, the final Bowser Boss could be buffed up against Giga, same with the other Giga. The Wire Frames would work fine(even if kind of weak) for all modes. There's also stages they intended that they could finally put in, including a proper Fire Emblem stage. There's also more music available to throw in as well, including a quick one to add to Temple since a new FE stage would exist.

There's a ton of potential for a remake, is all I'm saying. And may be their only option to re-release it, period, if they can't modify the data at all. Otherwise, yeah, VC sounds good~

 

[UserKev]

God damn it I don't want Melee HD. I'm not interested.

I honestly think the only people who are interested are competitive Melee players.

I don't want a Melee HD either. It wouldn't make sense for many reasons.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Melee HD isnt a bad idea in theory. An old game that many very passionate people want to be able to play on modern hardware (No CRTs!), with better graphics. Assuming they dont foolishly do anything to mess with the old balance to cause competitive players to shun it, it would be a great bit of fanservice. Of course, no harm done to anyone who doesnt want to buy it.

Now, would it be a good idea monetarily? ehhhhhhhh maybe. I imagine there is a large audience that wants a melee rerelease, and a few people that would love to practice on the go, but im not sure it would be worth remaking the game in HD>

A rerelease is on VC or something is probably the best we would get. Either would be nice.

 

[PsychoJosh]

I don't think there is a huge demand for Melee HD.

Most casual audiences would just see it as obsolete, because it doesn't have any of the cool guest characters they've come to love in later games, nor anywhere close to the graphics of SSB4. The only people who would seriously appreciate it are the competitive players, who would create an even greater divide between themselves and the casuals by quickly destroying the casuals online, making them hate it more. Meanwhile, the competitive audience isn't nearly large enough to sustain the game monetarily on its own, so it would flop in sales.

It's just a losing proposition all around. Unless Nintendo released it as a free-to-play game with online play I really don't see the point.

 

[Caryslan]

I don't think there is a huge demand for Melee HD.

Most casual audiences would just see it as obsolete, because it doesn't have any of the cool guest characters they've come to love in later games, nor anywhere close to the graphics of SSB4. The only people who would seriously appreciate it are the competitive players, who would create an even greater divide between themselves and the casuals by quickly destroying the casuals online, making them hate it more. Meanwhile, the competitive audience isn't nearly large enough to sustain the game monetarily on its own, so it would flop in sales.

It's just a losing proposition all around. Unless Nintendo released it as a free-to-play game with online play I really don't see the point.

I also think there would be a massive backlash if any attempt to rebalance the game is made. If you suddenly had Fox nerfed and say Bowser rise through the tiers by giving him traits from Smash 4(his armor, being more mobile, etc) the backlash would be bad.

I recall Street Fighter II HD tried to take the same route by trying to balance the roster by giving characters new abilities, command inputs from later Street Fighter games, and rebalancing the matchups. How often is Street Fighter II HD played in tournaments? Never, because Super Street Fighter II Turbo is still the standard.

So, you can't really rebalance the game or change the gameplay because you will risk turning off the hardcore Melee fans. The casual fans will take one look, and wonder where the newer characters are before they go back to playing Smash 4.

A Melee remake is not going to find the audience that people think.

 

[A Distant Demon]

I also think there would be a massive backlash if any attempt to rebalance the game is made..

so. . .don't? When you make a game for an audience (in this case hardcore players) you cater to them. Not changing balance would be exactly that

A Melee remake is not going to find the audience that people think.

A niche one, yes. Melee HD would never have been a huge seller. It is a remake/port after all and not a full new game. Thankfully, it would also be less work than a full game as well so it could potentially still be profitable. Not going to be a blockbuster though. It would also be some damn good PR, but that would probably negligible.

Not every game needs to be a megaton. Just because games like Fire Emblem Warriors aren't hitting a million sales doesn't mean they arent successful.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Keep in mind we have no idea what Sakurai is doing or if he is even working on the next Smash.

https://gonintendo.com/stories/2711...cent-mech-toy-purchase-he-made-teases-that-it
This is a cycle. You claim this, I bring this up, you ignore it and then claim it again. Whatever he's working on, it involves a toy mech's gun somehow

Not every game needs to be a megaton. Just because games like Fire Emblem Warriors aren't hitting a million sales doesn't mean they arent successful.

Well, I think it depends, Fire Emblem never exactly was a mega hit before Awakening, but Smash has consistently been a mega hit, so if a Melee HD comes out and doesn't do as well as other games, it doesn't really matter if it ends up making a profit because one of Nintendo's most popular franchises had a game that didn't meet up to the rest of the series, which investors certainly wouldn't like either

 

[N3ON]

Yeahhhh.... Melee HD is little more than a fan pipe dream. The competitive crowd is not Nintendo's targeted demographic (it's also smaller than people think), super iterative series like Smash, Kart, Mario Party, etc. have yet to ever see rereleases, as far as a stop-gap Smash the ROI would presumably be higher on a deluxe Smash 4 port, and it's entirely possible GC/VC will be a thing, on which it just appear on for the fraction of the cost.

What are the reasons it would happen, again? To mollify the diehard fanbase (Nintendo doesn't actually care too greatly about) which could also be appeased by a simple re-release? They're still playing the same game sixteen years later, it's not like graphics are a dealbreaker. And I don't know if people who suggest it realize that most consumers would rather get a Smash 4 port packing more than double the characters (and, ostensibly, newcomers) than a Melee HD.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Unfortunately, that does play a role in determining characters. There's also various other Zelda characters as competition. I think a remake of SS would vastly improve his chances, though~

The most important part or a SS remake is OBVIOUSLY the increased chance of Impa appearing.

We all know that's more likely to happen than Ghirahin anyway.

 

[Aurane]

The most important part or a SS remake is OBVIOUSLY the increased chance of Impa appearing.

We all know that's more likely to happen than Ghirahin anyway.

And that's not by much.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

https://gonintendo.com/stories/2711...cent-mech-toy-purchase-he-made-teases-that-it
This is a cycle. You claim this, I bring this up, you ignore it and then claim it again. Whatever he's working on, it involves a toy mech's gun somehow

Guns on mechs...

Is he bringing back Custom Robo?

 

[Diddy Kong]

And that's not by much.

She's appearing more consistently than Ganondorf currently. Tell me how she isn't the most prominent Zelda character not in Smash yet again please.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

She's appearing more consistently than Ganondorf currently. Tell me how she isn't the most prominent Zelda character not in Smash yet again please.

Because Tingle exists and had his own games, Impa has not. "Muh Hyrule Warriors" also applies to Tingle too

 

[Diddy Kong]

Because Tingle exists and had his own games, Impa has not. "Muh Hyrule Warriors" also applies to Tingle too

A game so bad it never got a US release about 10 years back on the DS. Sure you can count that! A character with such a hatebase that Tingle hasn't physically appeared in a new game since his own flopped DS game, and deliberately got removed from Twilight Princess for the same reasons. He wasn't priority in Hyrule Warriors either, otherwise he'd be in the main game, where Impa is the very first ally Link recruits. You sure you wanna do this comparison?

 

[Opossum]

A game so bad it never got a US release about 10 years back on the DS. Sure you can count that! A character with such a hatebase that Tingle hasn't physically appeared in a new game since his own flopped DS game, and deliberately got removed from Twilight Princess for the same reasons. He wasn't priority in Hyrule Warriors either, otherwise he'd be in the main game, where Impa is the very first ally Link recruits. You sure you wanna do this comparison?

I mean, to be fair, Tingle was notable enough pre-Brawl to get an Assist Trophy. Impa didn't even get that in Smash 4, despite Tingle returning and Zelda getting multiple new ones.

 

[Aurane]

She's appearing more consistently than Ganondorf currently. Tell me how she isn't the most prominent Zelda character not in Smash yet again please.

That's not the problem.

The problem is that Impa will never use her HW incarnation and thus makes her inclusion meaningless.

Such is not shared by Yink, as Yink is adorable and Impa is not.

Smash debates.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I mean, to be fair, Tingle was notable enough pre-Brawl to get an Assist Trophy. Impa didn't even get that in Smash 4, despite Tingle returning and Zelda getting multiple new ones.

As well as the fact he showed up in the Great Bay stage. And he was pretty minor in MM too(bar what, one moment where he's needed? If I remember right, you have to pop his balloon once. Any time else was just a convenient warp point option, but not absolutely needed for progression). Much more important in WW in comparison, where he was heavily needed for most stuff, even if it was mostly sidequests(with the Triforce Charts being important to the game's progression). Not counting his own games(which is more than anyone bar Link and Zelda can say. And while the CD-i games aren't canon, they're still official games, despite Nintendo refusing to admit it. The Tingle games are spin-offs that are dubious in canon too, so...), where he's obviously important, he has a minor role in MC as helping out with the Kinstone fusions(and his family appears from WW here), some minor roles in the Four Swords games as an obstacle during some minigames. Then there's the Oracle appearance, where he's part of the necessary trade sequence. So that's... only the FS games where he isn't necessary for progression? I can't entirely remember, but I think some Kinstone fusions with him were required. I think I covered all his roles in regular Zelda games. HW is a different one, but I don't know if he was part of the 3DS' story or not. Haven't gotten that far. Hand cramps and all.

If you don't count MM(imo, despite that one moment, he feels too minor), he has a multiple important roles(he's pretty central to completing WW, even if the role was annoying, it's hardly minor at that point), two of his own games(the Balloon Party one doesn't count as having a real plot, but count it if you want?)

 

[SmashChu]

https://gonintendo.com/stories/2711...cent-mech-toy-purchase-he-made-teases-that-it
This is a cycle. You claim this, I bring this up, you ignore it and then claim it again. Whatever he's working on, it involves a toy mech's gun somehow

I fail to see how that contradict anything I said. All it tells us it, as you put, involves the toy mech, but anything beyond that is pure speculation. This give you no information if he is working on Smash or not which is my entire point.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I fail to see how that contradict anything I said. All it tells us it, as you put, involves the toy mech, but anything beyond that is pure speculation. This give you no information if he is working on Smash or not which is my entire point.

Except it kinda does. What does Smash have in common with that? Nothing. Smash doesn't use guns like that, Sakurai specifically did NOT want guns like that in Smash and his new project involves a gun like that. Sure, it isn't outright saying it, but it's almost like there's this thing called subtlety. I recommend looking that word up if you are unaware of it's definition

 

[Diddy Kong]

I mean, to be fair, Tingle was notable enough pre-Brawl to get an Assist Trophy. Impa didn't even get that in Smash 4, despite Tingle returning and Zelda getting multiple new ones.

There's literally only ONE instance of a AT getting promoted to playable character status; . If anything that's a good thing for Impa.

Pre-Brawl, Impa also missed out on the major Zelda releases represented in Brawl: TP and WW.

And above the story related stuff regarding Tingle, Impa got her name because it means 'to impact' the story line. She set off Link on his quest in NES Zelda for example. Then she's a Sage in OOT, and ALBW, has a grand role as the most major NPC after Zelda in Skyward Sword and is the Sheikah's leader in BOTW.

Tingle would've probably been included in Brawl if he ever was seriously considered. Which I strongly doubt.

 

[Opossum]

There's literally only ONE instance of a AT getting promoted to playable character status; . If anything that's a good thing for Impa.

Pre-Brawl, Impa also missed out on the major Zelda releases represented in Brawl: TP and WW.

And above the story related stuff regarding Tingle, Impa got her name because it means 'to impact' the story line. She set off Link on his quest in NES Zelda for example. Then she's a Sage in OOT, and ALBW, has a grand role as the most major NPC after Zelda in Skyward Sword and is the Sheikah's leader in BOTW.

Tingle would've probably been included in Brawl if he ever was seriously considered. Which I strongly doubt.

I'd include Charizard in that as well. Yes, he was a Poké Ball, but it's still a summon. It's not a good thing for Impa: think about it. Skyward Sword was the thing that would have gotten her in. It hit the relevance sweet spot and got quite a bit of content. Several items, a stage, and an Assist Trophy...but still no sign of Impa anywhere.

Skyward Sword came and went, and if Impa were to get in, it'd have been in Smash 4. Then, she had a combat ready and major role. And yet...she didn't even get in as an Assist Trophy, and instead Ghirahim got in, as well as Midna and Skull Kid. If Sakurai didn't see her as important then, I don't think anything since then would change his mind. All she really had was a semi-major role in Hyrule Warriors...alongside a ton of other Zelda characters that don't constantly shift in appearance and build.

 

[Diddy Kong]

I'd include Charizard in that as well. Yes, he was a Poké Ball, but it's still a summon. It's not a good thing for Impa: think about it. Skyward Sword was the thing that would have gotten her in. It hit the relevance sweet spot and got quite a bit of content. Several items, a stage, and an Assist Trophy...but still no sign of Impa anywhere.

Skyward Sword came and went, and if Impa were to get in, it'd have been in Smash 4. Then, she had a combat ready and major role. And yet...she didn't even get in as an Assist Trophy, and instead Ghirahim got in, as well as Midna and Skull Kid. If Sakurai didn't see her as important then, I don't think anything since then would change his mind. All she really had was a semi-major role in Hyrule Warriors...alongside a ton of other Zelda characters that don't constantly shift in appearance and build.

Point well taken. Yet I still think that Impa was very well considered, and some of her new moves where transfered to Sheik instead. Like the Bouncing Fish and the grenade, but also her overall style of movement. It's just a gut feeling, but remember how Chrom was also skipped over because they couldn't make him all that unique. The same thing could've happened with Impa. Notice her Smash Wii U trophy stating she is equal in combat skill as Ghirahim? This does not often happen with regular trophies, last time I remember was Melee's Pit trophy; 'Will Pit ever fight again?'

Spoiler: Wii U Impa trophy description

When Zelda falls from Skyloft to the world below, this mysterious warrior protects and guides her. If you can tear your eyes away from her remarkable Sheikah garb, you'll see a powerful resolve in her eyes. Her combat skills are on a level with Ghirahim's swordsmanship and magic. It seems Impa actually hails from an age long past...

THEN, she also has a trophy as her old sage appearance, and she even has a specific 3DS trophy. Which other character has as many trophies as Impa does exactly!? That's right, no other character. Move along please.

Semi-clones where not really present either outside of Luigi and Toon Link untill Roy and Lucas came back. I blame Impa's exclusion because of that. They simply wanted to keep Sheik around, and Impa has a different build than Sheik so she couldn't become a late clone addition like Dark Pit or Lucina, neither an alt like Alm.

Then, she obviously didn't have the criteria of getting in as DLC, cause we all know what happened there.

I still think she's eglible as a late addition to the Zelda cast, just to give it a newcomer after 3 entries that's more than a graphic update and a noticable bigger head. She's had consistant appearances ever since, just not always in the most suitable ways. A Skyward Sword remake could fix that, or the upcoming DLC of BOTW which would suddenly, and miraculously would feature a Young Impa, which is still very well possible of course. As again, with BOTW, the only noticable main characters that return are; Link, Zelda, Ganon, and Impa. OH AND BEEDLE! Never forget Beedle.

She's not in the greatest position, but far better than any other potential Zelda newcomer. And Zelda desperately needs a newcomer.

About Charizard though, yes true. But that is even a far more logical choice to make playable than Little Mac, which shows because Zard was already there in Brawl. I also don't expect any characters who are ATs in Smash 4 to promote to playable status.