Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Slavic]

And put me in the boat of people who think most of the original 12 not really needing big reworks. like you could do some but doesn't feel necessary.
But starting by Mario, and I might do more of these if you guys want me to.

I feel being simple is part of Mario's style, and that the moveset is pretty true to character. Up and neutral special are some of his most iconic abilities. A lot of his normals are taken directly from his games (mostly from 64).
Update/Overhaul potential: His source material doesn't give much that fit his simple style. A lot of his potential is random power-ups which would often feel weird as part of a bigger moveset. there is a few things you could do to make a more "true to game" Mario.
- The most unique thing potential isn't actually attacks, but movement abilities, Like triple Jump, crawling, etc.
- Maybe having him use Hammer for Up-smash.
- Cappy is cool, it's Mario using his iconic hat for attacking. My idea for implementation would be it replacing the cape as side special and would be a projectile with similar Attributes as the cape.
Dr. Mario would still have the sheet of course.

- two ideas if you want to add cap jump, either smashing/doubletapping side-B or adding Mario's Dive as a Z-air that can be used while holding B.​

- FLUDD is slightly outdated, but I don't really have any good ideas for replacement. On the other hand I would like Luigi to Poltergust on down-B so the brothers could have "matching" down-Bs.

Personally, I'd love FLUDD as Mario's Up Special (again, Doc keeping the Jump Punch as a legacy). My idea would allow either Mario to hover with said nozzle in the air or charge it on the ground to blast off with the Rocket Nozzle. Of course, that brings the Down Spec in my eyes to the Luma Spin... which would very roundabout bring Mario back to his Smash roots a little bit in a funny way.

 

[Zinith]

Yoshi is just not appealing for competitive play due to how unorthodox he is. it is the exception because in that game he is a much more appealing pick than a lot of characters because of his nasty combos. had a dead meta until AmSa came along.is trash. had a meta that was so dead he had no breakthrought performance in FOUR years while seemingly worse characters likehad better runs. Having awful MUs against as well as bad MUs against didn't help at all. That is why everyone forgets about Yoshi in Smash. He is never on the radar, besides lol Smash 64.

You're missing my point. I'm not saying you should give Yoshi a chance in the current Smash games. You probably already did, but things change between games and I have a feeling it will for Yoshi. I'm saying give him a chance THIS time...

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

So... enhanced port?

I seriously thought this debate was over.

Say it with me:

SMASH. BROS. ULTIMATE. IS. A. NEW. GAME.

 

[Starbound]

With echoes, do you think they'll be right beside the OG character, or will we have the 'clone corner' we got last game?

I like 'clone corner' as grouping all the echoes together shows the distinction that they're the band of misfits.

 

[StormC]

I don't think it is. Lol

Also, Meowth? Has he been disconfirmed already? Cause if not, we might be sleeping on him. One of the more iconic Ninty characters next to Toad that aren't in.

He's a Pokeball mon.

 

[Ivander]

Hypothetical scenerio, how would you feel if, somehow, they made a "Helper-to-Hero" Event Match(ala Kirby Superstars' Helper-to-Hero mode or Star Allies Guest Star mode) for the more "active" Assist Trophies? Like say, Takamaru, Waluigi, Magnus, Ghirahim, etc. For those Assist Trophies, they can jump, they can get damaged, etc. So how would you feel about playing a Event match where you can play the more "active" Assist Trophies, like Takamaru or Dark Samus, with their only moves being their Assist Trophy moves and those moves are tied to the attack buttons?
Like say, Knuckle Joe, tapping A quickly makes him do Vulcan Jab, pushing and holding A makes him do the more stronger Force punch(or whatever it was called) and pressing B makes him do Rising Break. Or Takamaru, pressing A makes him do the Sword Slashing while B makes him use his Windmill Swords/Shurikens.

Anyway, how would you feel if they made an Event Match that allowed you to pick one of the more "active" Assist Trophies and play as them for that Event match?

 

[Shyy_Guy595]

We've already seen them in promotional material right next to their counterpart.

I doubt that'll change.

 

[Murlough]

I'll take any form of Bowser's Castle so long as we get one. Its so overdue for a Smash Stage its almost criminal.

As for the Pokeball Pokemon:
1. Rimbombee
2. Vikavolt
3. Palosand
4. Drampa
5. Marshadow
6. Zereora
7. Lycanroc
8. Decidueye
9. Incineroar
10. Buzzswole

I would really LOVE to see all of these as pokeball summons....

Spoiler

 

[DarkFalcon]

I just don't care for Yoshi as a character. Charming? Sure. Interested in playing as? Personally to me? Not at all. Just never really stood out to me, plus feels weird to play.

 

[Shyy_Guy595]

I'll take any form of Bowser's Castle so long as we get one. Its so overdue for a Smash Stage its almost criminal.

As for the Pokeball Pokemon:
1. Rimbombee
2. Vikavolt
3. Palosand
4. Drampa
5. Marshadow
6. Zereora
7. Lycanroc
8. Decidueye
9. Incineroar
10. Buzzswole

I would really LOVE to see all of these as pokeball summons....

Spoiler

Where's Mimikyu?

 

[Murlough]

Where's Mimikyu?

On the character select screen.

 

[MaestroDavros]

So... enhanced port?

No, at least in my point of view. In fact, as Sakurai said in his recent Famitsu collumn, in the case of stages (and items) ALL of them have been redone from scratch. Doesn't matter if they came from Smash 64, Melee, Brawl, 3DS or WiiU, they've been built from the ground up. That's already a huge amount of work, and based on how stunning the Melee stages look now, was a very worthwhile one.

Assets get reused all the time, whether they are visual or audio (case in point, Jigglypuff has used the same English & Japanese voice clips that were recorded all the way back for the original Smash Bros. with any additional clips added to the character utilizing leftovers from those sessions) as it is not always necessary to redo things. Sometimes there are reasons to. I can understand why Marth was redone; the original voice clips heard in isolation have always sounded poor to me. They sound like they weren't recorded with most of the other Melee recordings, and there is a distinct poorer quality to them. Redoing them was a great idea, although I understand why after having 3 games of Marth speaking Japanese suddenly moving over to English is a bit of a shock, especially after the Roy treatment for Smash 4 (now if only they would redo Mario/Luigi/Dr. Mario's voice clips, they fit fine for what Brawl was trying to do, and Luigi does sound more like Luigi, but I've just never liked them for some reason and feel out of place in Smash 4 and now SSBU).

 

[Shyy_Guy595]

Oh shoot. I kinda hope he does tbh

 

[Zinith]

See, all I'm asking is that since Yoshi is likely one of the 12 starters don't prejudge him and write him off.

 

[Slavic]

Alright, here's a new game: Name 3 songs that you want to have in SSBU, regardless of how likely or unlikely they are to get in. 3 songs that you want to Smash to so badly, you'd let Link near your prized pottery collection for at least 30 seconds, just to ensure that they get into the game. They all must be from different franchises. Songs from all franchises owned by Nintendo and their 2nd parties, Sega, Konami, Capcom, Bandai Namco, and Square Enix are all fair game, but no music from games not developed/published by any of these companies.

My List:

Spoiler

1. Wave Ocean ~ The Inlet (Sonic the Hedgehog (2006))

I hate just about everything in this game... except for the music. The vast majority (looking at you and your Midis, Chronicles) of Sonic games have amazing soundtracks, and 2006 is no exception. This is hands down my favorite track from 2006, it is the very definition of speed to me, and I'd love to fight with it playing in the background.

2. That Person's Name Is (Bravely Default)

I'd love to get music from other SE series aside from FF, and this is my number one choice. I loved BD as well as its music, and this track is a perfect fit for Smash, imho.

3. Battle! Aqua/Magma Leader (Pokémon Omega Ruby/Alpha Sapphire)

Easily my favorite track from any and all Pokémon games, hands down. Being a Hoenn fanboy, I really want to see music from ORAS in SSBU, and this one is a must.

Uncontrollable may be my single favorite song in the entirety of the Xenoblade saga. There's so much drama in this music and the nonsense lyrics, unlike Black Tar it gives anxiety-inducing gravity to the Tyrant battles. I would kill to take down Ridley to this song. Not to mention the Kill la Kill bleeds heavily through this song.

...or any song from the first Ecco. I didn't grow up with Sonic at all but I did play a ton of Ecco as a child, and the soundtrack is still one of the most memorable and nostalgic across all games for me.

This very quickly became my favorite Pokemon villain battle theme playing through Sun and the Battle Tree. Not only does it just hit pretty hard, it has tones of Coliseum / XD at parts, which is absolutely killer.

 

[Arthur97]

With echoes, do you think they'll be right beside the OG character, or will we have the 'clone corner' we got last game?

I like 'clone corner' as grouping all the echoes together shows the distinction that they're the band of misfits.

I don't like the segregation, though I don't like the general treatment they get.

 

[Murlough]

See, all I'm asking is that since Yoshi is likely one of the 12 starters don't prejudge him and write him off.

Write him off as what? I'm kinda with DarkFalcon in that I'm pretty neutral on Yoshi.

EDIT: I don't know why it kept my second sentence but OK....I ended up deleting that and after I hit send it apparently is still there....anyway I meant to say I'm not against Yoshi at all. I don't have strong feelings either way.

This very quickly became my favorite Pokemon villain battle theme playing through Sun and the Battle Tree. Not only does it just hit pretty hard, it has tones of Coliseum / XD at parts, which is absolutely killer.

Lusamine's theme is the only one I would seriously miss. Guzma's is pretty great but Lusamine's is on another level.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Thanks for everyone who replied to my post about about 12 newcomers.

Here’s a challenge for you all,
Since the OG12 seems to hold such an importance this time around. Let’s do a 12 Newcomers list. They can be predicted, wanted, or both. Rules are 8 original/unique characters (2 of which have already been revealed in Inkling and Ridley, so you only need 6 more.) 2 semi-clones, and 2 Echoes (1 of which is Daisy, so you really only need 1 more.)

And....GO!

I'm going for wanted with this

Unique characters:
1) Dixie Kong
2) Elma
3) Bandana Dee
4) Krystal
5) Lara Croft
6) Tetra
7)
8)

Semi-clone:
9) Impa (of sheik, possibly with elements of Zelda and even Lucario too)
10) Fiora (of Elma)

Echoes:
11) Octoling
12)

 

[Zinith]

Write him off as what? I'm kinda with DarkFalcon in that I'm pretty neutral on Yoshi.

Write him off as someone you won't play as. He'll be different from Smash 4 Yoshi. If you play him and find that he's still not for, I'll understand. But don't make early judgments on him

 

[DarkFalcon]

See, all I'm asking is that since Yoshi is likely one of the 12 starters don't prejudge him and write him off.

I don't play characters I don't want to play. I don't have anything against Yoshi I just prefer several other characters over him, and have no reason to play him. It's not a personal attack on the character or anything. I just simply have no feelings at all towards Yoshi. Of a cast of over 60 fighters Yoshi doesn't bring anything to the table that interests me.

 

[Sharkarat]

Personally, I'd love FLUDD as Mario's Up Special (again, Doc keeping the Jump Punch as a legacy). My idea would allow either Mario to hover with said nozzle in the air or charge it on the ground to blast off with the Rocket Nozzle. Of course, that brings the Down Spec in my eyes to the Luma Spin... which would very roundabout bring Mario back to his Smash roots a little bit in a funny way.

Nah, I kinda like the jump Punch, also:
- I think the Current Fludd is its most iconic form and that the other forms really doesn't add much to his playstyle, his recovery already being pretty good (and my ideas makimg it better). Also they're much more gimmicky which I kinda don't want on Mario's U-Special.
- Would rather have Luma spin on Rosalina

 

[Knight Dude]

So what are some of the remixes in this game so far?

I know Vega's theme for Street Fighter, Wood Man's theme for Mega Man(you hear it in Mega Man's trailer) and Ridley's got a new remix since he's gonna be playable now, but I think I'm forgetting one.

Something from Zelda right?

 

[CJ Falcon]

Write him off as someone you won't play as. He'll be different from Smash 4 Yoshi. If you play him and find that he's still not for, I'll understand. But don't make early judgments on him

Different how? Different because his eggs bounce now? Different because he has some slight changes to his animations? Don't see anything about new Yoshi that would change anyone's mind about him.

EDIT: Actually, the bouncing eggs might be a big deal.

 

[TonyMyOnly]

Yoshi's up B has always bothered me when I try to play as him

 

[Murlough]

Different how? Different because his eggs bounce now? Different because he has some slight changes to his animations? Don't see anything about new Yoshi that would change anyone's mind about him.

EDIT: Actually, the bouncing eggs might be a big deal.

Just depends on how far they can bounce tbh. I actually really want Yoshi to be able to jump out of egg roll now. That would be a fun buff.

1. *Hits shield with Egg Roll*
2. *jumps and downairs the shield until it breaks*
3. *laughs in Yoshi*

On second thought don't do that Sakurai.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

So what are some of the remixes in this game so far?

I know Vega's theme for Street Fighter, WoodMan's theme for Mega Man(you hear it in Mega Man's trailer) and Ridley's got a new remix since he's gonna be playable now, but I think I'm forgetting one.

Something from Zelda right?

Remix of BotW's main theme.
https://www.smashbros.com/en_US/sound/index.html

Also the Splatoon one they put up recently

 

[Jedisupersonic]

With echoes, do you think they'll be right beside the OG character, or will we have the 'clone corner' we got last game?

I like 'clone corner' as grouping all the echoes together shows the distinction that they're the band of misfits.

I think they'll be next to who they are the Echo of, if they do # order for the CSS this time.

 

[Knight Dude]

Remix of BotW's main theme.
https://www.smashbros.com/en_US/sound/index.html

Also the Splatoon one they put up recently

Alright, thanks man.

I'm wondering if any Mega Man music outside of 1-6 will be in. I hope so since 7-10 have some of the best tracks in the series, maybe even some MMX and Battle Network stuff if we're lucky.

With Street Fighter, I'm betting it'll mostly be the other SF2 characters, given Vega's theme is in. Maybe 3 and Alpha stuff if they want to expand beyond that.

 

[DarkFalcon]

I'm surprised they haven't brought the Lower Norfair/Magmoor Caverns track in from Metroid.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

Alright, thanks man.

I'm wondering if any Mega Man music outside of 1-6 will be in. I hope so since 7-10 have some of the best tracks in the series, maybe even some MMX and Battle Network stuff if we're lucky.

With Street Fighter, I'm betting it'll mostly be the other SF2 characters, given Vega's theme is in. Maybe 3 and Alpha stuff if they want to expand beyond that.

I honestly hope we get Megaman X stuff but I doubt we will get anything outside of Classic.

Is the X Collection out yet? I wanna show my support so we can get an X9 like how MM11 is happening x.x

 

[Radical Bones]

Any time I hear enhanced port I want to go on a long rant. I won't tho

Let's ask the mods to get 'enhanced port' and 'Smash 4.5' put onto the list of censored words.

Hey, Verde Coeden Scalesworth ... be a doll, would ya

 

[MaestroDavros]

Thanks for everyone who replied to my post about about 12 newcomers.

Here’s a challenge for you all,
Since the OG12 seems to hold such an importance this time around. Let’s do a 12 Newcomers list. They can be predicted, wanted, or both. Rules are 8 original/unique characters (2 of which have already been revealed in Inkling and Ridley, so you only need 6 more.) 2 semi-clones, and 2 Echoes (1 of which is Daisy, so you really only need 1 more.)

And....GO!

Here's my picks

Newcomers:

1. Ridley (confirmed)
2. Inklings (confirmed)
3. King K. Rool (new DK character, villain, at least popular with the Smash fanbase, while he hasn't really appeared in a game in years, he nevertheless has a strong loyal fanbase which offsets this)
4. Shantae (represents a much needed indie rep, female fighter, continually popular series, lots of moveset potential as a result)
5. Simon Belmont (not exactly my biggest wish although I respect the Castlevania series and understand the character's popularity, very popular on the NES, really interesting moveset potential with the whip)
6. Ashley (super popular in Japan, female fighter, probably some interesting potential movesets)
7. Sakurai's pick (got to let the man put something interesting in, he has a real knack at finding potential in even the most obscure of places)
8. Sakurai's pick (same reasoning as 7)

Semi-Clones:

9. Dixie Kong (obvious reasons, Diddy being in the game since Brawl has made Dixie's eventual positioning on the roster feel inevitable. While I guess an echo fighter would be fine, her moveset even with Diddy's confirmed changes make her an ideal candidate for semi-clone status with hair styled attacks)
10. Medusa (not kidding, while again an echo fighter for Palutena could work, come on, wouldn't you like to see a semi-cloned Palutena with snake themed attacks? Also if custom moves are indeed gone, some of Palutena's could probably be moved over to Medusa.)

Echo Fighters

11. Daisy (confirmed)
12. Dark Samus (can't decide if Chrom or Dark Samus are more likely, but IDK Dark Samus for Samus makes too much sense if we assume Echo Fighters have a greater importance in this game than previous Smash games)

Those are my picks. I've stayed pretty close to what has already been speculated as I feel that the general fan wish list is a sound one. Whether it comes to fruition or not I don't know, but I guess we'll see what happens.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

With echoes, do you think they'll be right beside the OG character, or will we have the 'clone corner' we got last game?

I like 'clone corner' as grouping all the echoes together shows the distinction that they're the band of misfits.

The separation was weird to look at

 

[DarkFalcon]

The biggest issue with Dark Samus as an Echo is she (lore has called DS a she before, so I'm sticking with it) fights completely differently than Samus. Not only movement wise but moveset wise. It's not a Shadow situation where it COULD work even though Shadow has shown unique moves. It'd be downright strange.

 

[Blargg888]

Since BoTW story is sooo bad (I don't even mind to finish), I also hope that Smash try to represent things not from the main quest. Yoga Clan and Linels were cool. I hope that if any champion needs to appear at some way, Urbosa make in as a Assist Trophy.
Best case scenario.

Now, a lot of stages and items could work from BOtW. I want a travelling stage, passin through some popular areas, like that valley that rains so much and the dragon crosses in the sky.

Yoga Clan sounds like a good name for a WFT only 8 Player Smash.

 

[Jexulus]

I personally gravitate to Yoshi in most of the Mario spin off games. He just checks off all the boxes for me.
Is green? Yes.
Is dinosaur? Mmhmm.
Is giant nose? Absolutely.

Thing is, for the strangest reason, Smash has always been the exception for me. I've given him the honest college try since 64, and something about him never clicked for me. Was it that his recovery centered around his double jump? Was it his Up B? Is it just that I'm actually a dinosaur in real life and he feels way too much like myself and that throws me off subconsciously? Who knows.

I fully intend to try Yoshi again when Ultimate comes out, because I'm a Yoshi loyalist in almost every other game he's in and I want that to be true in Smash as well, but I can't imagine he'll click with me in such a way that he'll be a part of my rotation of characters. Not after so many attempts.

 

[DarkFalcon]

I personally gravitate to Yoshi in most of the Mario spin off games. He just checks off all the boxes for me.
Is green? Yes.
Is dinosaur? Mmhmm.
Is giant nose? Absolutely.

Thing is, for the strangest reason, Smash has always been the exception for me. I've given him the honest college try since 64, and something about him never clicked for me. Was it that his recovery centered around his double jump? Was it his Up B? Is it just that I'm actually a dinosaur in real life and he feels way too much like myself and that throws me off subconsciously? Who knows.

I fully intend to try Yoshi again when Ultimate comes out, because I'm a Yoshi loyalist in almost every other game he's in and I want that to be true in Smash as well, but I can't imagine he'll click with me in such a way that he'll be a part of my rotation of characters. Not after so many attempts.

It's the complete opposite for me. I don't understand Yoshi's design. It's really off putting and weird to me. I get what he's supposed to be, but it's just really awkward and kinda ugly to me personally. That's probably why I avoid him, because I look at him and don't "get" him like I do with other characters. His design does not resonate with me at all.

 

[MaestroDavros]

The biggest issue with Dark Samus as an Echo is she (lore has called DS a she before, so I'm sticking with it) fights completely differently than Samus. Not only movement wise but moveset wise. It's not a Shadow situation where it COULD work even though Shadow has shown unique moves. It'd be downright strange.

That's why I was wavering between Chrom and Dark Samus for that slot (actually, I'd already written a bit for Chrom before changing my mind). I'd actually prefer Chrom over Dark Samus, but the issue with Chrom is that he'd make more sense to me as a Marth echo than an Ike echo except that Lucina exists, which is precisely why it would make more sense. Not saying no to him being an Ike echo though.

Thus while the differences in abilities in game universe is a potential concern, I feel that Dark Samus as a Samus echo is a realistic possibility.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

The biggest issue with Dark Samus as an Echo is she (lore has called DS a she before, so I'm sticking with it) fights completely differently than Samus. Not only movement wise but moveset wise. It's not a Shadow situation where it COULD work even though Shadow has shown unique moves. It'd be downright strange.

Personally i'd be ok with Shadow being an Echo with Mewtwo styled teleport dodges, because at his and Sonic's core gameplay they play very much alike, I know he has his unique powers, and they'd be cool but I don't think he has a chance besides being an Echo as much as it hurts to say that.

I want him in regardless.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

The biggest issue with Dark Samus as an Echo is she (lore has called DS a she before, so I'm sticking with it) fights completely differently than Samus. Not only movement wise but moveset wise. It's not a Shadow situation where it COULD work even though Shadow has shown unique moves. It'd be downright strange.

Strongly agree, dark samus is meant to be flying around, shooting scatters of phazon and lazers, creating phazon barriers, creating phazon tentacle things, turning invisible, duplicating herself. Her fighting anything like Samus is never shown in canon at any point.