Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[PixelPasta]

Not sure if it's just an issue on my end or not, but the charts don't have labels from what I'm seeing, so I can't see what the options were.

Yeah, I have no idea why Google formats it like that. But you can view the option by hovering your cursor over each bar on the graph - its still rather annoying though.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I finally finished the concept for the Hanafuda character, it was fun to draw and color:

 

[kiteinthesky]

I'd argue Geno isn't really hype either. Outside of a dedicated group of Smash fans, no one really remembers/cares about him that much.

I don't buy it. If that were true, Geno wouldn't have been voted high enough to get a Mii costume, with its own intro no less, and wouldn't have had nearly the pull as he had over the years. Nor would the only Square content we received have been Geno and Cloud. It wasn't just people on Smash Brothers forums pushing for him; people from all over the world including Japan have requested him for a loooooong time. I think everyone's views on him and some of the other retros are biased because what we mostly see in terms of Smash is content from the forums and our minds just assume that's all there is.

That being said, I do agree with you on Banjo. He's one of the few popular options I could think of that would be as well-received if not more so, that was at least realizable. If only Konami would cooperate enough to let us have Simon Belmont, then I'd have listed him too.

 

[Fenriraga]

also i dont

There was a problem fetching the tweet

This tweet came out.
So the engine of the game is going to be like Smash 4. I knew it.
This is most likely true.

Namco still being involved doesn't mean it's using a similar engine to 4, but it certainly does add fuel to the game being a heavily-modified 4. Which I think was to be expected by this point.

...Also that guy is a software engineer for Nintendo. He may want to be a bit more careful with what information he shares.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I don't buy it. If that were true, Geno wouldn't have been voted high enough to get a Mii costume, with its own intro no less, and wouldn't have had nearly the pull as he had over the years. Nor would the only Square content we received have been Geno and Cloud. It wasn't just people on Smash Brothers forums pushing for him; people from all over the world including Japan have requested him for a loooooong time. I think everyone's views on him and some of the other retros are biased because what we mostly see in terms of Smash is content from the forums and our minds just assume that's all there is.

You forget that Sakurai already was interested in Geno before the ballot. That plays a role as well in getting the costume. If anything, the ballot simply confirmed that he was wanted enough to be worth trying to get the costume.

He wouldn't be all that hype, honestly. He has a small but sometimes vocal fanbase. He'd still be cool, but mostly for a minority.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Considering all the debates surrounding who is and isn't a "E3 megaton", I'd laugh if the only third-party character revealed at E3 was someone like Shantae. Seriously, arguments based off fan assumptions like "Oh, only big name characters will be announced at X major event!" is how we'll get caught off-guard. Seriously, these arguments reminds me of what people expected in the December 2015 broadcast and what we ultimately got.

If Bayonetta and Corrin were leaked to be the sole Final Broadcast reveals two months earlier than when it aired, a lot of people wouldn't believe the leak because "they wouldn't be hype enough".

 

[Bladeviper]

There was a problem fetching the tweet

This tweet came out.
So the engine of the game is going to be like Smash 4. I knew it.
This is most likely true.

this doesnt mean its the gameplay engine, this is just the graphics/text and they could have modified it since

 

[Fenriraga]

Yeah even as someone who's number 1 pick for Smash is Geno, I can't really say he'd be "E3" worthy, at least as the token third party reveal.

I still believe his chances are better than ever, and much better than people think, but E3 is not a stage that is set for him as the focal point.

...Also, is this now the closest thing to official confirmation we have that Namco is indeed involved again?

 

[kiteinthesky]

You forget that Sakurai already was interested in Geno before the ballot. That plays a role as well in getting the costume. If anything, the ballot simply confirmed that he was wanted enough to be worth trying to get the costume.

He wouldn't be all that hype, honestly. He has a small but sometimes vocal fanbase. He'd still be cool, but mostly for a minority.

But that was largely because of the huge campaigns from the Brawl days and before. The one here was not the only one going on; Geno was hugely requested in Japan at that time too and Super Mario RPG was hotly demanded for a virtual console release, especially in Europe whose gamers didn't even get a chance to play the game yet and wanted to.

I don't think you guys give the character's popularity enough credit. A campaign on one forum alone could never have had the impact Geno's support from outside has had, and that goes for a lot of the other retros too (Rayman comes to mind).

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Side note: I'm worried we'll have Crashboards (and not of the Bandicoot variety) before the main event, things are so tense around here.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

But that was largely because of the huge campaigns from the Brawl days and before. The one here was not the only one going on; Geno was hugely requested in Japan at that time too and Super Mario RPG was hotly demanded for a virtual console release, especially in Europe whose gamers didn't even get a chance to play the game yet and wanted to.

I don't think you guys give the character's popularity enough credit. A campaign on one forum alone could never have had the impact Geno's support from outside has had, and that goes for a lot of the other retros too (Rayman comes to mind).

If nothing else, Sakurai himself has confirmed that Geno was a popular character among the "silent majority" of the Smash fan base. If it was just forum-specific popularity, Sakurai would have been specific about his statement.

 

[Icedragonadam]

Another thing that hasn't been pointed out is that tweet might have confirmation of when development started, August 2016. Not sure if that means anything since it's speculation to have started development in June or July 2016. But I think it does tip some newer characters to being slightly more likely *coughRexandPyracough*.

 

[Opossum]

I finally finished the concept for the Hanafuda character, it was fun to draw and color:

I can't believe Sakurai added Reinhardt to Smash without his horse OR his Dire Thunder tome.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

You could make Geno a hype reveal for a lot of people, but you would have to pair him with a hype veteran like Cloud or a hype Nintendo all-star like Toad/Captain Toad.

Throwing him in a reveal trailer with either of those guys would get EVERYONE talking about him. Not just the guys that played Super Mario RPG.

 

[dada5714]

Side note: I'm worried we'll have Crashboards (and not of the Bandicoot variety) before the main event, things are so tense around here.

It's been a long time since I've been here regularly (Brawl days), does the site still go down pretty easily?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

It's been a long time since I've been here regularly (Brawl days), does the site still go down pretty easily?

With tons of traffic, it can. It gets pretty bad sometimes, heh.

 

[RandomAce]

Regardless of whether or not some characters are "E3 Worthy", there are still options for who to show for E3, and those are characters that are from the ballot.

Think about it. Most of the iconic nintendo characters are all ready in Smash at this point, so any new additions added to Smash 5, your average E3 viewer is most likley going to be unfamiliar with regardless. This means that Nintendo would be better off trying to appeal to the Smash community instead, and with the ballot reaching upward to ~1.8 million votes, a highly requested character from the Smash ballot would still be hype for the Smash community, who are more than likely going to be watching the E3 Livestream.

 

[Arcanir]

Honestly I wouldn’t mind if they held onto Pokémon for a little longer and gave it a 2019 release. The last time they tried to pump out a new game ASAP on a fresh console, It was X/Y, which was a game so barebones and average I would almost dare to call it unfinished. With Pokémon Switch, I want them to take the time to craft something truly special, not just crank out a new gen to make quick sales.

But yeah, if all Nintendo had to show was Smash and Metroid, I would be underwhelmed. Sure, Smash is probably one of the most exciting releases on any console for me, but only having those two things to show would make me feel kind of lukewarm about Nintendo’s upcoming year.

I wouldn't say XY is the best example of that as it didn't get into the 3DS until three years into its lifecycle. Rather, its problems were more just growing pains with GF needing to make and adapt to 3D along with GF's change in mindset from Gen 4/5.

I think the Switch game would be in a better position considering GF has their 3D assets in place now unlike XY, but we'll see on that.

 

[monadoboy]

You're Not Alone(FFIX): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tog9GjczJVE&t=417s

Yes, please. One of the best songs in a game soundtrack. Made an already amazing scene so much better. Uematsu is a legend.

I still can't believe Midgar had only two songs, that should be a crime. Not even One Winged Angel. I've only played 7, 8, 9 and OG Crystal Chronicles, and there's so much amazing music from those to choose.
My favorite from the CC series: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umz2fUSYYRo

Crystal Chronicles itself should get something in Smash, at least a stage or trophies. The GC one was amazing, memorable and still holds up today.

 

[Dragoncharystary]

So with all of this E3 hype quickly building up, I decided to make a list of what we should be expecting at E3 and what we should not be expecting at E3. Keep in mind that if something is not mentioned that either means I didn't think of it or I could see it going either way.

First, what we should expect at E3 in order of likeliness:
1. Super Smash Bros Switch - This one is 100% confirmed. All we can speculate on is what exactly will be revealed about the game that we no next to nothing about. For sure going to be playable on the show floor as well as being heavily featured on treehouse.
2. Yoshi Switch - This one is almost a given as well considering we haven't seen this one since last year's E3 unless of course it ends up in development hell like it's predecessor on the Wii U did. That seems unlikely though, since we got a gameplay demo of it on treehouse last year and a fair amount of footage in the trailer. Expect us to get a title, a lot of gameplay, and an appearance on the show floor as well. Probably also on the treehouse a fair amount.
3. Fire Emblem Switch - This one is another obvious one. We will likely see a fair amount of gameplay, some dedicated treehouse segments, and possibly being playable on the show floor though I'm 50/50 on this one. I also think it's possible this one could get pushed back to 2019 but I find that unlikely, I do think they will stay true to the release year here.
4. Metroid Prime 4 - Very likely that we're seeing this one as well. The only question is how much of it will we actually see. I was expecting only a slight tease of it in a short trailer not showing any gameplay footage until today's walmart leak convinced me that we will get to see a little more than I thought. Probably only a gameplay trailer but it will be refreshing none the less.
5. Pokemon Switch - I'm sure will get something on this one as well, though I'm unsure of really how much. I could see us getting a gameplay trailer or just a slight tease of an official announcement and trailer for the game coming in the next few weeks from the Pokemon company. The Pokemon company's tendency to do things on their own sometimes is the onyl rease why I rank this below Metroid, though I still think this is coming before it. I am 50/50 on this releasing in 2018.
6. Retro's Project - It's been several years since Tropical Freeze released, and whatever Retro is working on is unlikely to be a new Donkey Kong or Metroid Prime game. Whatever it is is anyone's guess but it seems about the right time to finally see what they're working on.

That covers it for the likely stuff, anything not mentioned there that's not down below is still possible but isn't as easy to predict. There surely are some things that will be revealed that I didn't mention though. Now for the stuff we should not expect in no particular order:
1. Any new Splatoon information(aside from Inklings in Smash) - Splatoon 2 came out a year ago, and while I'm sure a sequel is happening and might already be in the works, don't expect to hear about it anytime soon. As for new content to Splatoon 2, I don't think any free updates to the game will make the E3 presentation, and I doubt any info on the Octo Update will show up either since I don't think there's anything huge in it that we don't know about and we've been receiving information on it over time since it's reveal at the direct. Although I can see them playing it on the treehouse to generate hype for it's arrival one month from then and it might make the show floor as well so people have a chance to play it early but I don't expect any new Splatoon info during the presentation.
2. Anything on the New Legend of Zelda game - This one's obvious, it just started production, not gonna be here even if it is farther along than we thought.
3. More Wii U ports - While I do think it's possible there are more Wii U ports coming that we don't know about, don't expect any to be revealed here. I'm sure Nintendo has many other things to show off here. Wii U ports just aren't E3 level announcements.

That's all I have for now. I'd like to hear all of your thoughts on this and what you think we might see and not see at E3.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Something to note regarding Tiago:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Do you think roster finalization came around the time Tiago left after making the rendering engine?

 

[RandomAce]

Something to note regarding Tiago:

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Do you think roster finalization came around the time Tiago left after making the rendering engine?

Most likley, since once Sakurai and the team are finished with the project plan they usually begin working on the game and create the characters. Seeing how he stated that he left in August 1st most likley means that the roster finalization and beginning of development began somewhere around early to late July.

 

[Gumzilla]

if square could get any one character in smash they'd push sephiroth. thats the only character 3rd party i can think of that would draw the same response cloud did in an audience like e3. thats not even a debate

Geno

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Geno

Geno is a very niche character, he's unknown outside of the relatively small smash community

 

[monadoboy]

Most likley, since once Sakurai and the team are finished with the project plan they usually begin working on the game and create the characters. Seeing how he stated that he left in August 1st most likley means that the roster finalization and beginning of development began somewhere around early to late July.

Does this help or work against Rex and Springman? I'm starting to think neither of them will make it more and more.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Sephiroth is far from the only Square character that'd bring a Cloud like response.

FARRRRR FROM.

Square has other Final Fantasy protags (Noctis, Lightning, Squall, Yuna, Terra are all decently popular in the gaming world/FF World), Sora, Dragon Quest characters, and Lara Croft.

Sephiroth would personally just make me groan. I'd rather Tifa or Aerith if we're forced to get another iconic Final Fantasy 7 character.

 

[Murlough]

Like, I'm not a Geno hater, but comparing him to Sephiroth is pushing it. I have never touched either Super Mario RPG nor Final Fantasy, outside of Crystal Chronicles which wasn't even really an FF game but w/e. I know who Sephiroth is though. Geno feels like a character that was only really known by SM RPG players until he was made a case for in Smash. Most people who have touched a controller know who Sephiroth is.

Once again, I'm not hating on Geno at all but if I were Square Enix I would absolutely push Sephiroth over him. The crazy edgelord is a gaming icon and one of the most recognizable villains of all time. Geno is an obscure character from one Mario side-game. (correct me if I'm wrong please, really not trying to be rude here)

 

[Tree Gelbman]

On the contrary. I didn't know who Geno was until my roommate who is NOT a part of the Smash speculation community told me to play Super Mario RPG and how he wanted him for Smash Brothers.

Sooooo...

We can't really judge what a general and casual Smasher thinks of Geno. There could be limited cases like my roomie or there could be a whole lot more of them out there like he is.

 

[Icedragonadam]

Oh snap, he took down the tweet and Twitter account.

 

[Ura]

I've just seen that massive E3 leak from the Walmart Canada site. I hope's there more, because it seems like E3 is going to be bleh again with Smash Switch and Metroid Prime 4 being the only saving graces.

Spoiler: Walmart E3 Games leak

Lol Smash and Metroid aren't even going to be the only games shown off at E3. Hell Prime 4 won't even release until 2019 most likely. No one should look in to this because it's just placeholder titles.

Yeah even as someone who's number 1 pick for Smash is Geno, I can't really say he'd be "E3" worthy, at least as the token third party reveal.

I still believe his chances are better than ever, and much better than people think, but E3 is not a stage that is set for him as the focal point.

...Also, is this now the closest thing to official confirmation we have that Namco is indeed involved again?

Palutena and WFT were revealed at E3. I wouldn't worry to much about that.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

On the contrary. I didn't know who Geno was until my roommate who is NOT a part of the Smash speculation community told me to play Super Mario RPG and how he wanted him for Smash Brothers.

Sooooo...

We can't really judge what a general and casual Smasher thinks of Geno. There could be limited cases like my roomie or there could be a whole lot more of them out there like he is.

A better way to put it is... he's obscure. That's all there is.

Every Smash is different, casual or competitive. While they both have somewhat of a similar mindset at times, that doesn't mean they can easily be grouped together. Many tend to forget that.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I honestly don't think Sakurai gives two ****s about how he reveals things anyways. The man is a weird creature. Palutena was revealed in the E3 presentation. Meanwhile a hype third party icon like Pac Man was behind closed doors.

The man is impossible to understand.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

You gotta remember that super mario rpg is over 20 years old, hell the majority of the people who are gonna buy the game probably don't even know that the game exists at all, let alone geno.

 

[Ura]

I honestly don't think Sakurai gives two ****s about how he reveals things anyways. The man is a weird creature. Palutena was revealed in the E3 presentation. Meanwhile a hype third party icon like Pac Man was behind closed doors.

The man is impossible to understand.

Except in this case the milk represents Sakurai's game getting leaked.

 

[Koopaul]

Everyone seems so certain the Decidueye will be the new Pokemon but we can't always be so sure. Just in case, let's make a Top 5 Most Likely Pokémon list. A list where you think one of these might be in the game.

1. Decidueye
2. Mimikyu
3. Incineroar
4. Necrozma
5. Marshadow

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Rowlet is gonna get in.

Everyone expects owl archer.

Sakurai just gives you owl and you will like it.

 

[Super Flygon]

Looks like Tiago shouldn't have made that tweet! Hoping he doesn't get fired for revealing that information (even though it is realistically minor).

 

[kylexv]

All these deleted Tweets.
Can someone fill me in?

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Oh snap, he took down the tweet and Twitter account.

The Bamco and Nintendo ninjas assassinated him.

Or he was lying, who knows ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Zerp]

What was/were the tweet/s about? Sounds like it was the game engine out of context?

Everyone seems so certain the Decidueye will be the new Pokemon but we can't always be so sure. Just in case, let's make a Top 5 Most Likely Pokémon list. A list where you think one of these might be in the game.

1. Decidueye
2. Mimikyu
3. Incineroar
4. Necrozma
5. Marshadow

Here's a weird one:
1. Meowth
2. Decidueye
3. Mew
4. Clefairy
5. Lycanroc

If you're wondering why on earth I put more Gen 1 on that list than Gen 7, it's because I think the next Pokemon game is going to be based in Kanto yet again, and we all know how much the Pokemon Company loves pandering to Gen 1, I can totally see them pushing Sakurai/newdirector(wo)man to add something that's going to be relevant soon in advance. If a Kanto remakes/re-visit is the case (which I'm assuming it is) then I think most Kanto mons will have a massive advantage over even the Alola mons because the Kanto mons were around when Pokemon became a cultural phenomenon (and again were there when GO launched and exploded, unlike everyone else ) and that made quite a few of them insanely iconic as a result.