Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Scoliosis Jones]

You’d think this would be obvious by now. It’s not just what a character can do. It’s how they can use it that contributes to them being unique.

Link, Toon Link, Shulk, Marth, Cloud, Ike, Corrin, Roy, and Lucina all have swords. You cannot effectively play any of them the same way as another because of how they use the weapon.

I’m frankly just sick of the tired old arguments that literally nobody learns from. Just because Robin uses magic doesn’t mean another magic user can’t be added. That’s literally the most ridiculous thing you could say when literally the rest of the Fire Emblem characters all use the same type of weapon in a different way.

In other news, I really don’t think Rex and Pyra are as outlandish as some are making it out to be. Development for Smash Switch started in 2016. Xenoblade 2 started development in 2015. Sakurai could easily say, “Well, if Xenoblade 2 is out in 2017, that would be closer in proximity...not to mention Rex has some cool stuff to pull from!”

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Only new playable character I'd be willing to bet cash money on is Isabelle and even then not a great deal of dosh.

Rex/Pyra and Spring Man are big new characters but dev times clash with them

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Only new playable character I'd be willing to bet cash money on is Isabelle and even then not a great deal of dosh.

Rex/Pyra and Spring Man are big new characters but dev times clash with them

Frankly, I can't think of any newcomer character I'm confident on. E3 will be unpredictable.

 

[Deathcarter]

Only new playable character I'd be willing to bet cash money on is Isabelle and even then not a great deal of dosh.

Rex/Pyra and Spring Man are big new characters but dev times clash with them

Isabelle and Excite Biker for me. Only those two have absolutely everything going for them.

 

[SlickWylde]

Honestly, I can't think of a single "Guaranteed" newcomer. I feel like we already have the really big ones, and I got all the ones I would've wanted. So now I assume they're going to cater to the younger generation with characters I've never heard of haha. Oh, I guess King K Rool would be sweet, but I'd be willing to bet he will never get in.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Isabelle and Excite Biker for me. Only those two have absolutely everything going for them.

I'd say Excitebike is the most likely first party universe we'll get along with Rhythm Heaven.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Retro IMO is a choice of Excitebike, Balloon Fighter (with Villager getting a new Up-B), Mach Rider (less likely than Excite Bike) and the community favorite Takamaru.

The problem with Retro reps is the 80's only lasted for so long so you'll run out of characters eventually.

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

As much as I want to believe Isabelle will be playable, and as obvious of a newcomer as she seems to be, I can see her being that character that everyone thought would be playable but wound up being passed.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

As much as I want to believe Isabelle will be playable, and as obvious of a newcomer as she seems to be, I can see her being that character that everyone thought would be playable but wound up being passed.

You can make a move set for anyone, but a character needs to have something more than just a list of original moves.

They need to really have traits beyond that which make them unique. That's why Sakurai comes up with slogan's for characters, like how Meta Knight is the Pointed Sword Dancer, Snake is the Heavy Weapons Specialist, Rosalina is the Puppeteer.

People use to think Little Mac was a bad choice because he only had punches. But, it's not just special moves that make a character original. Little Mac is original because of his characteristics. He was a seemingly unstoppable wrecking machine with bad air performance.

I'm skeptical of what Isabelle can bring, but I'm not as creative as Sakurai, so...

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

As much as I want to believe Isabelle will be playable, and as obvious of a newcomer as she seems to be, I can see her being that character that everyone thought would be playable but wound up being passed.

Isabelle's problem is just down to moveset tbh, she's got the relevance and the popularity but she falls short in that area. It's just a question if sakurai sees potential and can come up with something, if he doesn't think she's distinct enough from villager than it won't happen. She can definitely be made unique imo but she's not the most obviously and clearly unique character.

The terraforming idea people have thrown around is interesting, it's just a case if sakurai sees it and can/wants to make it work

 

[True Blue Warrior]

So this is an old move set and gameplay idea I had for Isaac back during pre-Smash 4. What do you guys think?

Spoiler: Moveset

-Downward slash, the double forward-moving slash
+- Casts a weak , small rock projectile with no knockback that lasts for a short while
+-Uses Punji, casting a bamboo that sprouts from the ground.
+-Uses Growth to cast grass which sprouts from below Isaac
+-Gaia. A shower of Venus energy and boulders rain closely upon the enemy.
+-Thorn. A field of spiked vines sprout out from the ground in front of Isaac. Does not deal much knockback and lasts for a few moments. It does not hurt Isaac, meaning he can use Thorn as a temporary over.
+-Spire.A stalagmite is cast twice. Where the direction held is down-right or down left during these two castings determines where the Spires is casts from, whether it is directly in front of Isaac or behind for for the two castinsg. Thing something sorta like Lucas's Down-Smash.
Aerial- Cast a rock wall in front of him.
Aerial++- Halt. Temporarily stops an opponent mid-movement, stunning them and letting them fall down for a brief movement in an helpless state
Aerial++-Pound. Casts a magical giant hand that pounds the opponent below Isaac. Can be used to spike enemies.
Aerial++-Force. Has good knockback. It involves casting a giant magical fists that leaves after-images behind it
Aerial++-Upwards kick followed by Isaac casting thorny vines above him
+-Sends out a Magical Giant hand after opponent to grab them. Has great range. The pummel would be the Hand crushing the opponent multiple times
+-Front-Slap. Slaps off the opponent, knocking them off forwards.
+-Catch-The Hand throws the opponent upwards
+-Pound. The Hand just crushes the opponent on the stage with a flat hand. Causes the opponent to bounce.
+-Back-Slap-Same as Front-Slap except of course, done backwards.

Special Moves
-Move- works similar to how it did in Brawl, except much smaller, dealing damage and with far less knockback. However, it does have several expanded abilities such as the ability to grab and throw opponents in mid-air.Press once to activate Move. Whilst it is still active, press before it disappears in order to grab the opponent. If successful, one has a short period of time to control the Hand whilst still holding before being forced to throw them. One can throw them in any different direction.

+-Great Wall-Chargeable move. The level of charge that is held determines the distance in which Isaac creates the wall from him as well as its power in terms of damage dealt and knockback given. Great for immediately stopping all momentum of the opponent if they end up in contact with it, as they end up stunned and any damage would be absorbed by the wall. A key move in limiting offensive approach

+-Wild Growth- A great, thick tangle of vines ends up sprouting from a yellow portal made out of Venus energy. Very useful anti-air attack and the primary recovery method that Isaac would use. After Wild Growth stops, Isaac can the climb the vine in order to gain ground. Does not cause helpless state. Can still attack whilst climbing, however, Isaac can only attack with his sword with the button. Another key anti-air move due to its great reach. Useful for attacking opponents directly above you.

+-Quake- The floor that Isaac is on ends up shaking. Opponents that are on the floor or in close proximity are send upwards, bouncing three times before being knocked up upwards

Final Smash

Judgement


As for his gameplay, I expect Isaac's gameplay to be based around anti-air zoning and ground dominance by limiting offensive approaches, heavily relying on his magical hand and his other techniques to bring the opponent down to earth. Whilst he'll be more of a grounded character, I don't expect that he will be heavily relying on mobility as it would be below-average. Rather, he stands his ground and uses techniques such as Quake, Rockfall, Spires and Growth to control and dominate on his own terms.

 

[Tetra_________________]

True Blue Warrior Super detailed Nice

 

[Hinata]

Honestly, I can't think of a single "Guaranteed" newcomer. I feel like we already have the really big ones, and I got all the ones I would've wanted.

I agree. Pre-Smash Switch announcement, the only newcomer I would've predicted with 100% certainty was the Inklings, and now they're in. I dunno if anyone else reaches their level.

 

[Freduardo]

Okay, new game:

Dillon’s Rolling Western, Pushmo, Ever Oasis, ARMs, 1080, Waverace, BoxBoy, Chibi Robo, Custom Robo, Golden Sun, Legendary Starfy, Nintendo Wars, Rhythm Heaven, Sin and Punishment, Star Tropics, Paper Mario, Mario & Luigi, Balloon Fight/Kid, Clu Clu Land, Mysterious Murasame Castle, Daigasso Band Brothers, Elite Beat Agents, Devil World.

Of these 23 Nintendo franchises... in this game... seven will get new characters.


Aaaaand name em

(Did you think of a Nintendo franchise I didn’t? Oh fine, take it from that)

 

[Wyoming]

Paper Mario, Clu Clu Land, Murasame Castle, Rhythm Heaven, Golden Sun, ARMS, and uh Chibi Robo why not

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Okay, new game:

Dillon’s Rolling Western, Pushmo, Ever Oasis, ARMs, 1080, Waverace, BoxBoy, Chibi Robo, Custom Robo, Golden Sun, Legendary Starfy, Nintendo Wars, Rhythm Heaven, Sin and Punishment, Star Tropics, Paper Mario, Mario & Luigi, Balloon Fight/Kid, Clu Clu Land, Mysterious Murasame Castle, Daigasso Band Brothers, Elite Beat Agents, Devil World.

Of these 23 Nintendo franchises... in this game... seven will get new characters.


Aaaaand name em

(Did you think of a Nintendo franchise I didn’t? Oh fine, take it from that)

Isaac, chibi, Paper Mario, Saki, Takamaru, Springman (With a ribbongirl clone), and he's not on the list but Wonder Red (I have yet to play his game but he's really growing on me, I should really play it lol)

 

[FlareHabanero]

I actually love the fact that things are more unpredictable, because that only means reveals are going to be far more interesting. I want the development team to just go full on ham with the game in general. Playing it safe is for the birds!

 

[Pazzo.]

Okay, new game:

Dillon’s Rolling Western, Pushmo, Ever Oasis, ARMs, 1080, Waverace, BoxBoy, Chibi Robo, Custom Robo, Golden Sun, Legendary Starfy, Nintendo Wars, Rhythm Heaven, Sin and Punishment, Star Tropics, Paper Mario, Mario & Luigi, Balloon Fight/Kid, Clu Clu Land, Mysterious Murasame Castle, Daigasso Band Brothers, Elite Beat Agents, Devil World.

Of these 23 Nintendo franchises... in this game... seven will get new characters.


Aaaaand name em

(Did you think of a Nintendo franchise I didn’t? Oh fine, take it from that)

Rolling Western, Sin and Punishment, MM Castle, Rhythm Heaven, ARMS, Golden Sun, Nintendo Wars

 

[Chandeelure]

I hope they revisit the idea of Chorus Kids (if the Gematsu Leak was true).

They sound interesting and... are cute.

That's important.

 

[blackghost]

i'd say Isabelle and lyn are the only other new characters i'd expect to get in. she has received noticeable pushes from nintendo as has animal crossing overall.
lyn based o heroes fan polls that nintendo can use to measure how popular she is. (also warriors). also there are 5 lyns in heroes. i'd call that a push.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I like Lyn but...

I actually really don't want her in Smash Bros.

 

[Icedragonadam]

I'd rather have a FE character from the Jugdral games instead, and then we would have a FE from every major region.

 

[Hinata]

Here's a (hopefully) fun question for you all.

Sometimes, when NIntendo announces Smash Bros. characters, said announcement coincides with something else happening regarding the character and/or their series (for example, Cloud was announced in the same Direct that announced he would appear in Final Fantasy Explorers, and Shulk was announced in the same Direct that announced the 3DS port of XBC1).

So, just for fun, take your most wanted newcomer (or maybe a newcomer you just expect to be in the game, not necessarily your most wanted), and come up with an announcement regarding their series that Nintendo would pair their Smash Bros. reveal with.

For example, they could announce Phoenix Wright for Smash Bros at the same time Capcom officially announces Ace Attorney 7.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

I like Lyn but...

I actually really don't want her in Smash Bros.

How come?

 

[Deathcarter]

(Did you think of a Nintendo franchise I didn’t? Oh fine, take it from that)

You forgot about Nintendoland. Seriously, I think Monita is one of the more likely newcomer candidates and she never gets brought up on this forum.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Okay, new game:

Dillon’s Rolling Western, Pushmo, Ever Oasis, ARMs, 1080, Waverace, BoxBoy, Chibi Robo, Custom Robo, Golden Sun, Legendary Starfy, Nintendo Wars, Rhythm Heaven, Sin and Punishment, Star Tropics, Paper Mario, Mario & Luigi, Balloon Fight/Kid, Clu Clu Land, Mysterious Murasame Castle, Daigasso Band Brothers, Elite Beat Agents, Devil World.

Of these 23 Nintendo franchises... in this game... seven will get new characters.


Aaaaand name em

(Did you think of a Nintendo franchise I didn’t? Oh fine, take it from that)

Dillon, Tethu, Spring Man, Chibi-Robo, Isaac, Paper Mario and because it wasn't mentioned, the Stylist/Model from Style Savvy.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

How come?

I mostly just want the FE cast to the same.

I mean if Lyn gets in neat but...

I don't want 7 Fire Emblem character (unless the roster is gigantic).

And I don't want cuts.



Plus I've had some experiences with Lyn fans....

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Lyn is cool and all...but please god no more FE sword fighters

 

[Koopaul]

Okay, new game:

Dillon’s Rolling Western, Pushmo, Ever Oasis, ARMs, 1080, Waverace, BoxBoy, Chibi Robo, Custom Robo, Golden Sun, Legendary Starfy, Nintendo Wars, Rhythm Heaven, Sin and Punishment, Star Tropics, Paper Mario, Mario & Luigi, Balloon Fight/Kid, Clu Clu Land, Mysterious Murasame Castle, Daigasso Band Brothers, Elite Beat Agents, Devil World.

Of these 23 Nintendo franchises... in this game... seven will get new characters.

Aaaaand name em

(Did you think of a Nintendo franchise I didn’t? Oh fine, take it from that)

Believe it or not, Nintendo has more series than you can count. It gets quite overwhelming. Here's an incomplete list of a huge chunk of them.
https://nindb.net/series/index.html

As for seven series I'd like to get a character?

Barbara from Daigasso Band Brothers/Jam with the Band (duh)
Andy from Advance Wars
Chibi-Robo from Chibi-Robo!
Dillon from Dillon's Rolling Western
Spring Man from ARMS
Starfy from the Legendary Starfy
Donbe & Hikari from Shin Onigashima

I have no faith any of these characters will get in the game. But I root for them and most underdogs.

 

[Bowserlick]

You should never give up your character or politician or beliefs because of fans.

 

[Koopaul]

Fans have no impact on my decisions. I'm just realistic. We've been playing the speculation game for years now and we should all learn something from it.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

Okay, new game:

Dillon’s Rolling Western, Pushmo, Ever Oasis, ARMs, 1080, Waverace, BoxBoy, Chibi Robo, Custom Robo, Golden Sun, Legendary Starfy, Nintendo Wars, Rhythm Heaven, Sin and Punishment, Star Tropics, Paper Mario, Mario & Luigi, Balloon Fight/Kid, Clu Clu Land, Mysterious Murasame Castle, Daigasso Band Brothers, Elite Beat Agents, Devil World.

Of these 23 Nintendo franchises... in this game... seven will get new characters.


Aaaaand name em

(Did you think of a Nintendo franchise I didn’t? Oh fine, take it from that)

Dillon’s Rolling Western - Dillon
ARMS - Spring Man
Paper Mario - Paper Mario
Golden Sun - Isaac
Rhythm Heaven - Chorus Kids
Star Tropics - Mike
ExciteBiker - Excitebiker

The only ones I’d be genuinely surprised with are Isaac and Mike.

 

[Megadoomer]

Okay, new game:

Dillon’s Rolling Western, Pushmo, Ever Oasis, ARMs, 1080, Waverace, BoxBoy, Chibi Robo, Custom Robo, Golden Sun, Legendary Starfy, Nintendo Wars, Rhythm Heaven, Sin and Punishment, Star Tropics, Paper Mario, Mario & Luigi, Balloon Fight/Kid, Clu Clu Land, Mysterious Murasame Castle, Daigasso Band Brothers, Elite Beat Agents, Devil World.

Of these 23 Nintendo franchises... in this game... seven will get new characters.


Aaaaand name em

(Did you think of a Nintendo franchise I didn’t? Oh fine, take it from that)

Sin & Punishment, Custom Robo, StarTropics, ARMs, Nintendo Wars (Advance Wars falls under this umbrella, right?), Paper Mario, and (not on the list, but whatever) the Wonderful 101.

 

[mario123007]

If that is the case then I guess there is little chance of us getting Rex as a playable character in the base roster of Smash Switch especially since Xenoblade was still a very niche franchise back in 2016 and if 6 months later would have made Robin less likely, you have to wonder whether or not Sakurai would even be interested in a character from a game that wouldn't be released (assuming development started somewhere around February-March 2016) for another year and 9-10 months.

Don't quote me on this but I don't think a series being niche or not matters that much in my opinion.
Iwata was heavily involved in the making of Xenoblade Chronicles. Remember, it was Iwata that changed the game's title to Xenoblade. And as we all know, Iwata and Sakurai were buds as well. So Sakurai somewhat is fond with Xenoblade series.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

I know that including content from the phone games has been discussed already but would it count as Nintendo or Third Party? Or would the mobile games not count in any form since they're, in my personal opinion, meant to get customers attracted to the Switch/3DS?

I ask because a new Nintendo IP for mobile was announced today (developed by Cygames but published by Nintendo).

Source:
http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2018/05/nintendos_next_mobile_game_is_a_jrpg_called_dragalia_lost

I know the game won't receive representation in this game, but it's something to discuss for post Smash Switch all the same.

Honestly, this is the only Nintendo character that can work as a mobile rep.

Better than a Pokemon Go trainer and Kiran from Fire Emblem Heroes.

 

[Freduardo]

Honestly, this is the only Nintendo character that can work as a mobile rep.

Better than a Pokemon Go trainer and Kiran from Fire Emblem Heroes.

I don’t dislike the Nintendo mobile games. Heroes is a lot of fun.

But the crossover they need is the Mystic vs Valor Splatfest.

 

[-crump-]

Okay, new game:

Dillon’s Rolling Western, Pushmo, Ever Oasis, ARMs, 1080, Waverace, BoxBoy, Chibi Robo, Custom Robo, Golden Sun, Legendary Starfy, Nintendo Wars, Rhythm Heaven, Sin and Punishment, Star Tropics, Paper Mario, Mario & Luigi, Balloon Fight/Kid, Clu Clu Land, Mysterious Murasame Castle, Daigasso Band Brothers, Elite Beat Agents, Devil World.

Of these 23 Nintendo franchises... in this game... seven will get new characters.


Aaaaand name em

(Did you think of a Nintendo franchise I didn’t? Oh fine, take it from that)

Haha great list, but have you ever heard of a neat little game called Codename S.T.E.A.M?

Other than that I’ll take BoxBoy, Paper Mario, Chibi Robo, Balloon Fight, Starfy, and Chibi Robo.

 

[FlareHabanero]

People are so fixated on the whole niche thing, as if straying away from the norm will somehow negatively impact the commercial and critical reception of Super Smash Bros. because Nintendo isn't just sticking with the million sellers. You know, despite the fact that a lot of characters in Super Smash Bros. are already from niche titles that only people interested in video games will even recognize. Almost like it's supposed to be a crossover meant to cover as much of Nintendo's legacy as humanly possible, and even beyond that too.

 

[ThatShadowLink]

Okay, new game:

Dillon’s Rolling Western, Pushmo, Ever Oasis, ARMs, 1080, Waverace, BoxBoy, Chibi Robo, Custom Robo, Golden Sun, Legendary Starfy, Nintendo Wars, Rhythm Heaven, Sin and Punishment, Star Tropics, Paper Mario, Mario & Luigi, Balloon Fight/Kid, Clu Clu Land, Mysterious Murasame Castle, Daigasso Band Brothers, Elite Beat Agents, Devil World.

Of these 23 Nintendo franchises... in this game... seven will get new characters.

How fun. Most of my favorites are on the list so, I'll just run down-

Mysterious Murasame Castle: Takamaru
Dillon's Rolling Western: Dillon
Golden Sun: Isaac
Nintendo Wars: Sami
Sin and Punishment: Saki

As for any IPs missing, I'd leverage Lip from Panel De Pon and Mach Rider from... Mach Rider.

One of those gets in? Especially Takamaru and Dillon? I'll be so excited.

 

[DGAMER]

This new game is fun.

ARMS gets Springman
Chibi-Robo gets... Chibi Robo
Mysterious Murasame Castle gets Takamaru
Rhythm Heaven gets... A character
Golden Sun gets Isaac
The Legendary Starfy get Starfy (Preety sure this one will get overlooked)
and Ever Oasis gets a character