Data "Smash Ain't no Joke" - Little Mac Matchup Discussion Thread

[MintyBreeze]

Oh, jeez, a tournament?

If you want an example of some threads like this, the R.O.B boards have individual discussions, just no archive or summaries about them. It works fairly well, and it lets people respond to threads even if they're months old. Here's a good example of one.
http://smashboards.com/threads/r-o-b-matchup-analysis-11-yoshi.399344/
Just let me know if you need help writing stuff up, every board needs a good match-up thread.

Neat how you can just find people from your state on here and talk to them on the fly, isn't it?

 

[LCC Son-in-Law]

Alrighty yall, the thread is up. Sorry it's a bit late.
Shiek Matchup Discussion

 

[MintyBreeze]

Now, though, we can't forget about the summaries and their format! People might just be visiting for a short, condensed summary of a match-up.

What do you think would be a good summary? Like... How the other character plays, if they counteract Mac or not, how both of you can approach, moves to watch out for and use... Ect. ... And I know that stages would be especially important for Mac.
Just let me know if you need help making this stuff.

 

[LCC Son-in-Law]

Now, though, we can't forget about the summaries and their format! People might just be visiting for a short, condensed summary of a match-up.

What do you think would be a good summary? Like... How the other character plays, if they counteract Mac or not, how both of you can approach, moves to watch out for and use... Ect. ... And I know that stages would be especially important for Mac.
Just let me know if you need help making this stuff.

Would a summary of the matchup not be something we would make after or during the time people have really begun discussing it? I realize summary and format is important, but we need to combine info on it first, correct? I fully plan to make a summary on the OP of each matchup thread.

 

[MintyBreeze]

Sorry, sorry... It's just that I had trouble myself making a summary before on one of these. Didn't mean to question you at all.

 

[LCC Son-in-Law]

Sorry, sorry... It's just that I had trouble myself making a summary before on one of these. Didn't mean to question you at all.

No, it's no problem at all. Honestly, I thought I was missing something. I appreciate the offer, and I'll be sure to let you know if I need any help Thank you.

 

[TM_icecream]

I'm trying to shuffle through this thread to find yoshi mu stuff.

It would be very beneficial to make a summary after a character has been discussed every time

 

[MintyBreeze]

Also, this thread could be used to generally discuss match-ups, instead of only a specific one. I encourage both to be active!

 

[LCC Son-in-Law]

I'm trying to shuffle through this thread to find yoshi mu stuff.

It would be very beneficial to make a summary after a character has been discussed every time

We haven't gone through many character matchups yet. We are currently starting our matchup discussion, and following each matchup I will make a summary on it's thread, and list links to those threads on the Opening Post here. I'm afraid we haven't discussed yoshi in length yet.

Also, this thread could be used to generally discuss match-ups, instead of only a specific one. I encourage both to be active!

I believe that is the best idea, use the other threads for specific matchups and this thread for general matchup discussions whenever someone feels the need.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

To all Little Macs out there, the Rosalina sub-forum has a match-up discussion thread all set up to analyze Rosalina's match-up against Little Mac. Got anything to share for the Rosalina vs. Little Mac match-up? Then head to the following thread link...

http://smashboards.com/threads/409123/

In terms of the rules, be sure to go to the directory thread.

http://smashboards.com/threads/404194/

 

[daxterattano]

How do I deal with Cpt. Falcon? This is the one match-up and just can't get the hang of no matter how many times I play it. It's like I can't touch him most times.

 

[LCC Son-in-Law]

This is the one match-up and just can't get the hang of no matter how many times I play it. It's like I can't touch him most times.

Moved your thread to the Matchup Discussion Thread.

 

[Dooms]

This is the one match-up and just can't get the hang of no matter how many times I play it. It's like I can't touch him most times.

get gud

edit: Seriously though, Falcon is a difficult character to fight against because he makes it really difficult to space moves thanks to his ground speed. If you see him dashing up, forcing him into shield with ftilt (if you can get used to only having the second ftilt hit his shield for proper spacing), dtilt, or jab would be ideal. If he goes for uair chains, throw in counters every now and again to add a fear factor into the matchup (but don't do it if you don't think he'll double jump, as he can save his jump and knee you for it). Don't let him dtilt you near the ledge. That will be a stock pretty much. Recovering against him is very difficult tbh, but if you can save your jump and counter you can generally mix it up enough to save yourself. Punish his landings, because he has a really tough time landing (Especially if he's facing towards you).

 

[LCC Son-in-Law]

Hey everyone, as of today the Shiek Matchup Discussion is currently closed. It's a matchup we will most likely discuss again in the future, but for now we need to move on.
On that note, I'm far overdue on moving us to the next discussion, and for that I apologize. I'll be working on a summary of the info collected on the matchup and add it to the opening post of the Shiek Discussion, as well as adding the link on the opening post of this thread. If you are interested in that info before I get the summary done, please go on and visit the thread.

If you have a suggestion for the next matchup we should discuss, please mention it here. I'll start up the next matchup discussion on either the evening of July 26th or the morning of July 27th.

 

[Venks]

Hey everyone, as of today the Shiek Matchup Discussion is currently closed. It's a matchup we will most likely discuss again in the future, but for now we need to move on.
On that note, I'm far overdue on moving us to the next discussion, and for that I apologize. I'll be working on a summary of the info collected on the matchup and add it to the opening post of the Shiek Discussion, as well as adding the link on the opening post of this thread. If you are interested in that info before I get the summary done, please go on and visit the thread.

If you have a suggestion for the next matchup we should discuss, please mention it here. I'll start up the next matchup discussion on either the evening of July 26th or the morning of July 27th.

I feel we didn't really get anywhere with the Sheik matchup, but to be fair nothing has really changed or been discovered since the 3DS days. We have no real option against short hop fAirs. A good Sheik will alternate between empty baits, max spacing fAirs, and shield cross up fAirs. The fact that Sheik can land off of any of those options and instantly fTilt or dash-grab means we play a neutral game we can only win with the hardest of reads while Sheik just does her thing with little risk.

To be fair a lot of our matchups require a lot more commitment than our opponent, but Sheik has the easiest time getting us into the air and covering our options as we try to transition from air back to the ground. I personally switch characters against Sheik. I feel the MU is at least 8-2 in Sheik's favor.

 

[LCC Son-in-Law]

I also want to note that I had like 5 little mac mains on skype say they wanted to discuss the Little Mac Ditto next. Anyone have any preference?

 

[Venks]

I also want to note that I had like 5 little mac mains on skype say they wanted to discuss the Little Mac Ditto next. Anyone have any preference?

I don't really think the Little Mac ditto is important to discuss. It's really silly and the more patient player wins all trades due to super armor. I think more important matchups would be the ones we'll see in tournament. Like Rosalina, Zero Suit Samus, Fox, Mario, and C. Falcon.

 

[TakeYourHeart]

I can deliver solid input on the Capt. Falcon, ZSS, Fox and Mario match ups.

That said, I think there is a bit more to the mirror then @ Venks is describing. Sure the more patient player often wins, but given that playstyles of Mac's vary, there might be ripe discussion for countering certain playstyles of enemy Mac's in the .

Regardless, I look forward to it.

 

[jet56]

i agree there should be a discussion on the mac ditto. its not so much the ditto, but the clash of play styles between two different little macs. ive found i can beat some really easily, and others i just get rekted by, even if they don't know the character. i find the biggest issue for both players is the super armor clashes involved, especially if both throw out smash attacks. not to mention that its all based on which input the game reads first, as if you throw out your d-tilt, but it reads your opp. ftilt first, youll take the ftilt. not to mention little mac recovering against another little mac is TERRIFYING and gives me ptsd.

 

[LCC Son-in-Law]

Ok, Irl stuff is getting in the way of things. I'll have the next matchup discussion up today, but the shiek summary will be a day or two. I just started a new job and the hours are taking some time to adjust to. My apologies again guys.

Edit: Alright guys, thread is up! This time we are discussing Captain Falcon. I plan to end discussion on August 4th.
http://smashboards.com/threads/matchup-analysis-2-captain-falcon.411815/

 

[Champ Gold]

Has anyone given input on the ,& matchups. Friend has been playing them and is learning pretty quickly about them

 

[jet56]

i can give a little. pac man and megaman are projectile characters in short. so if used right, side-b is your best friend if you time it right. regarding pac man, if he uses his hydrant, smash it back at him, then approach when hes avoiding it. for megaman, just get in his face, and patiently approach and shield till you are close enough. lucario isnt a hard matchup, as mac dominates him in the neutral game, just read his moves and attacks and predict his patterns and punish them. oh, and don't let him stay alive over 100% if you can avoid. cause aura.

 

[shinhed-echi]

I've never seen these two being discussed
They are very annoying, and I get constantly bodied by them (especially Shulk).
Heck, I even lose to more than I do against combined.

 

[Champ Gold]

I've never seen these two being discussed
They are very annoying, and I get constantly bodied by them (especially Shulk).
Heck, I even lose to more than I do against combined.

It's because with just like Sheik, Shulk can combo into Fair but his has significant knockback even on Buster so it's an easy KO on Mac but the matchup does lean in Shulk's favor but Mac's framedata is better than his (70% of Shulk's attacks have lag) and super Armor is very dangerous.

Wario is really just a bad matchup in general due to his insanity of his moves like Bike and being a normal a Heavyweight character

 

[SteadyDisciple]

So, I really need some help with the matchup against . It seems like no matter what character I use, no matter how much I practice, I cannot beat this character. I know it's suggested to steal his Gyro to take away his projectile spam, but I can't pick the darn thing up without it hitting me, so advice other than that would be welcome. I can't seem to punish him with Jolt Haymaker at all, or time the super armor against his arials, and shielding them leaves him out of range to punish.

I swear I'm not terrible at this, Rob is just the one character I can't touch no matter who I play. Other characters I use with any level of competence are , , and if people think any of them will do better.

 

[Champ Gold]

So, I really need some help with the matchup against . It seems like no matter what character I use, no matter how much I practice, I cannot beat this character. I know it's suggested to steal his Gyro to take away his projectile spam, but I can't pick the darn thing up without it hitting me, so advice other than that would be welcome. I can't seem to punish him with Jolt Haymaker at all, or time the super armor against his arials, and shielding them leaves him out of range to punish.

I swear I'm not terrible at this, Rob is just the one character I can't touch no matter who I play. Other characters I use with any level of competence are , , and if people think any of them will do better.

ROB isn't too hard but you should always shield at the start of the math because most ROB players will do that if they don't start off the with Gyroid. Also whenever he attacks on the ground, Counter because most of his attacks especially his side-b is incredibly telegraphed. And last, if you feel like you're gonna get grabbed just use Jolt Haymaker to stop it (unless you're by the end he which would be really stupid to do so as Mac) and just get out he away from his counterattack

Also it's great to see a fellow Mac and Wii Fit combo

 

[jet56]

So, I really need some help with the matchup against . It seems like no matter what character I use, no matter how much I practice, I cannot beat this character. I know it's suggested to steal his Gyro to take away his projectile spam, but I can't pick the darn thing up without it hitting me, so advice other than that would be welcome. I can't seem to punish him with Jolt Haymaker at all, or time the super armor against his arials, and shielding them leaves him out of range to punish.

I swear I'm not terrible at this, Rob is just the one character I can't touch no matter who I play. Other characters I use with any level of competence are , , and if people think any of them will do better.

ill be honest, rob was a problem for me as well, but actually, you more or less just have to walk up and powershield his stuff till you get close enough. its not quite that easy, but that's really the gist of it. once you get into range, he gets very uncomfortable and tries to back up and space you. keep slowly approaching and shielding till you start wailing on him.

 

[Champ Gold]

There are no steadily changes right now. There's that doubt in me that D-Smah might be nerfed but it's probably just placebo.

I wish it is.

 

[jet56]

d smash wasn't touched thank god, actually he got a slight buff.
im thinking we should discuss the luigi matchup next, hes been changed, and i feel like we are going to be seeing more of him.

p.s. not trying to take over the board or anything, but damn, my name is all over the place. i shall keep the little mac board alive!

 

[Venks]

So, I really need some help with the matchup against .

Something that helps me is blocking the initial gyroid and letting Rob pick it back up. When Rob picks up the gyroid and throws it you can actually dash under it. That's a free dash attack every time he tries to use it.

 

[LCC Son-in-Law]

d smash wasn't touched thank god, actually he got a slight buff.
im thinking we should discuss the luigi matchup next, hes been changed, and i feel like we are going to be seeing more of him.

p.s. not trying to take over the board or anything, but damn, my name is all over the place. i shall keep the little mac board alive!

I was actually planning for luigi to be the next one on the list, and it couldn't be at a better time!
I'm glad to see people who are very active on here

 

[Zarxrax]

Today I was playing a good DeDeDe, and I couldn't figure out how to do anything against him. I was able to beat him every time when he played as other characters, but I would just get bodied when I went up against his dedede.
His spacing was really good, and he would basically fly around near me trying to bait out attacks. If I tried anything, I would always miss, and then he would hit me with a quick aerial as he landed, and he would follow up from there. On the ground, his hammer outspaces my f-tilt, which kept me from approaching. When I got knocked offstage, he would throw the vertically bouncing gordos to cover the edge while standing back a bit and charging up a smash attack, basically covering any recovery and getup options. Any ideas how to handle this matchup?

 

[Champ Gold]

Today I was playing a good DeDeDe, and I couldn't figure out how to do anything against him. I was able to beat him every time when he played as other characters, but I would just get bodied when I went up against his dedede.
His spacing was really good, and he would basically fly around near me trying to bait out attacks. If I tried anything, I would always miss, and then he would hit me with a quick aerial as he landed, and he would follow up from there. On the ground, his hammer outspaces my f-tilt, which kept me from approaching. When I got knocked offstage, he would throw the vertically bouncing gordos to cover the edge while standing back a bit and charging up a smash attack, basically covering any recovery and getup options. Any ideas how to handle this matchup?

Treat him like every other heavyweight. Spacing and grabs can work as well. If they are throwing a Gordo, throw out a F-Smash or jab (jabs work better) to give him better options. Also his most dangerous moves have a telltale sign almost everytime. Also spot dodge because they are always gonna use throws to set up UP-Airs, F-Airs and probably a N-Air.

The matchup is bad due to his great spacing and recovery but it isn't the worst.

 

[LCC Son-in-Law]

Alright guys, the Luigi Matchup Discussion is now underway. It will end on August 20th, unless it seems we haven't covered it very well by that time. Looking at how well the C. Falcon discussion went though, I think this time limit will be fine.
Also, updated the opening post of this thread. Just a heads up.

 

[pokeanand]

Hiya! (Imagine me saying that in Melee Fox's voice)

This is my first time as a user on Smash Boards and I'm absolutely loving it here!

I main Little Mac and have yet to get good at him.

I would like to know, who doesn't have a good matchup against Mac?

I think it'd be something without a good projectile/air game as those are Mac's greatest enemies.

Ganondorf maybe? Although I have seen Ganondorf murder him in the past.

DFTBA! ^-^

 

[SteadyDisciple]

Even though the board is currently being revamped, a lot of the matchups have already been discussed here:

http://smashboards.com/threads/smash-aint-no-joke-little-mac-matchup-discussion-thread.348176/

With that said, digging through them is a bit of a pain, so I understand if you'd rather wait for further responses. Honestly, Sm4sh is a relatively well balanced game from what has been seen so far, so I wouldn't say Mac wrecks anyone outright. There are definitely advantages and disadvantages in a matchup, but nothing insurmountable.

 

[WispBae]

Hey there, someone at our own eye level!

The Doggy boards are discussing this MU and would love your input on it!

Click this picture of Arcade Mac to go straight to the thread!

 

[LCC Son-in-Law]

Hey guys! The 4th matchup discussion, Link, is now in session! Please drop by the thread and give your input if you have any!

 

[LCC Son-in-Law]

Welp, double posting :X. The link matchup discussion is now closed. I gave it much more time than I meant to.

If anyone has any suggestions for the next matchup discussion, please go ahead and let me know! I'll try to get one together soon.

 

[jet56]

DAMNIT I MISSED THE LINK DISCUSSION! UGH!!!!!......breathe.....ok....im over it.

*ahem* in all honesty it doesn't bug me, just wish i had found time to give an input on it. and for the next one...uh...fox.

yeah fox. (im so tired right now )