Smash 64 ELO Rating

[Sensei]

Do it Clubbadubba

 

[Kabutox]

Don't do it Clubbadubba.

Seriously.

 

[clubbadubba]

OH So the ratings are supposed to be about who's the best at pika dittos, or pika-kirby-fox-falcon matchups. You should have noted that somewhere

Edit: You allow for international tournament data, you know they don't use the apex or the chain-ace rulesets right? And in japan they don't even use the same version. Maybe you should redefine the scope, and then set in stone right now the exact rulesets which you accept. When a rulset changes, are you going to go back and remove the data from tournaments with old rulesets?

You live to make my life miserable, don't you?

Its not who's the best at pika dittos, its supposed to be for events in which players go all out to win. All out means they are picking characters that give them the best chance to win. Han Solo not going Fox? Kero not going Pika, Sensei/Boom going samus? (Continue for pretty much everyone in the tourney). There clearly was not high enough stakes or enough pride on the line for players to make the best decisions for themselves, so what makes this a serious tourney?

You are right I should redefine the scope and make that more clear in the OP. There was a little discussion about what this was for later on the 1st/2nd page itt, but I never transferred that to the first post, which is my mistake. If there is actually a lot of support for adding this to the ratings (and some of that comes from people NOT in the tournament), then I'll give the people what they want, but I think everyone understands that adding tournies like this will make the ratings pretty meaningless.

I suggest if people really want this rated that I make another ratings list that is for "non-mains" or something. Or maybe a low tier list? Idk but something different, because mixing results of people going mains and results of people going not mains is pretty meaningless.

With international data, those are SEPARATE lists, as was requested by pretty much everyone. The lists are not completely separate because whenever banze wins in brazil it affects his NA rating too, but that is a bug and I'm going to fix that when I get a chance. I'm 100% fine with making a separate list, but it doesn't make sense to mix serious and casual tournaments.

 

[Cobrevolution]

i dunno about the rest of you guys but i was attempting to win

i think boom and sensei were, as well

but the idea about mains - i mean, when's the last time isai went pika? didn't kero play some ness at zenith? nintendude threw falcon out there, as well. and boom played samus in pools (at least against me and jerry). i myself went all falcon at the june red bank tournament.

 

[Nintendude]

I'm not a good example. Whenever I use Falcon in tournament, it's because I think I legitimately have the best chance of winning with him.

 

[clubbadubba]

in every tournament a few individuals will not go mains for one reason or another (they don't need to in order to win, they want to see how well they can do, etc.), but if most people in the tournament are going mains, then its still a competitive event.

Plus it has come to my attention people were wasted during the tournament lol. Why am I even responding...

 

[Sensei]

No johns Clubbadubba

 

[Battlecow]

I mean obviously it's a ****ty idea to include that

but you did include Isai's apex stuff

I don't really see a difference

 

[Karajan]

look at the last post of pg 4 clubba

 

[prisonchild]

when I get drunk and play with my friends can you count that too clubba? I can make a bracket to make it official.

 

[Cobrevolution]

Plus it has come to my attention people were wasted during the tournament lol

what if folks were high at apex? or at zenith? or on ritalin or something to help them focus?

would that make their wins/losses illegitimate?

i'm just playing devil's advocate tbh. some people play better when they're blasted. so who's to say people can't show up to a tournament and play under the influence of something? after all, this isn't a sport or anything, and our only "performance enhancer" argument is controller based.

 

[Sensei]

I recall clubbadubba saying that as long as players agree the matches will count towards ELO rating, then it will count, and we all agreed beforehand that this tournament would. I am sort of regretting it now, but rules are rules Clubbadubba lol.

 

[clubbadubba]

When a small group of people decide to get drunk/high, or not go their best character option at a tournament where almost all the players are playing to win, then they are hurting their performance in a competitive environment. Either they don't care if they reach their full potential or they made a dumb decision, but either way a small minority is not going to eliminate a competition from getting rated.

When almost all of the entrants in a "tournament" get drunk and do samus dittos, then its hardly a competitive tournament. Calling something a tournament playing through the matches doesn't make something worth rating. I'll admit its extremely difficult to define what is rateable, and that's why there is and will be no definitive statement made describing it, but I think we all understand what a competitive tournament is.

I shall not today attempt further to define the kinds of material I understand to be embraced within that shorthand description ["hard-core pornography"]; and perhaps I could never succeed in intelligibly doing so. But I know it when I see it, and the motion picture involved in this case is not that.
—Justice Potter Stewart

edit: Sensei that was only 1 stipulation. Competitive ruleset was another (which was followed technically here, but certainly not the spirit of it). And of course the kicker requirement: MY DISCRETION. pwned

 

[Karajan]

When almost all of the entrants in a "tournament" get drunk and do samus dittos, then its hardly a competitive tournament.

You have no idea what you are talking about. Only the grand finals were held after mario party drinking game, and both players agreed to have it count.

 

[Sensei]

All hail Clubbadubba, the YOLO ranking king.

 

[clubbadubba]

Both drunk players agreed to have it count? Well in that case...

Don't do it Clubbadubba

You send me mixed messages.

Look guys, on top of the tourney sounding unrateable at first (and second, and third, and...) glance, I've had multiple people contact me and tell me there is no way this should count. I appreciate the entertaining day and I hope it was as fun for you as it was for me

Thanks for reminding me that its about time to remove genesis 2 from the ratings though. When I do that tonight pretty sure kikoushi is gonna be the GOAT, isai might even be second. We'll see.

 

[Karajan]

Ugh I was looking forward to
1) Kikoshi
2) Boomfan
3) Sensei
4) Isai

 

[clubbadubba]

I can run better than impulse to satisfy your curiosity, just won't go on the main ratings. Sometime tonight I'll try and get everything done.

 

[Han Solo]

I've had multiple people contact me and tell me there is no way this should count.

Yo Clubba, I got 17th at Apex. I don't want that to count.

 

[prisonchild]

why are you guys being so difficult? clubba wants to do the best for the community and you guys are giving him grief over such a silly issue (some would say TROLLING :O ).

clubba should ban some of you from ELO.


or make a rule like 'there must be more than x amount of participants or otherwise approved at the discretion of clubba to be counted towards the ELO rankings'. that might cut some of the bull****

 

[clubbadubba]

I would make rules, but Karajan likes to find loopholes and bend rules like its his job so there's no point. Its usually obvious enough what belongs and what doesn't thankfully.

Impulse 2013 has been added
Week 2 of SSBL has been added
Updated the online ladder

Too tired for better than impulse hypothetical ratings tonight.

 

[Battlecow]

Yo Clubba, I got 17th at Apex. I don't want that to count.

lol yeah dude it' s the same thing

 

[Cobrevolution]

clubba you didn't address what i said about possible mind/performance altering drugs being used

but say i take adderall before a tournament and get hyper focused and do extremely well, better than i would have had i not taken it. i play much better when i take the pill. is that illegitimate? the same can be asked of someone consuming alcohol before a tournament. i know some people can have two or three drinks and calm their nerves and build up their confidence - others can have two or three drinks and be wasted (cough fireblaster :D). in either case, if the players perform better, is that against the rules? same with weed. what if my practice seshes consisted of me lighting up a pipe and learning techs and mus, and when i go to tourneys i take a few hits in the car in between sets?

but here's another scenario that is actually included in the rating system: the bcow vs kero 50 dollar mm. (it was 50 bucks right?) in which kero won and refused bcow's money (i recall jimmyjoe saying this at a redbank tourney...if i am wrong about this, let me know, and i'll recant). one could argue that because there was no payout, this should not be included, as it was not actually a mm. both players were playing their best, however - and in the case of boom and sensei from this past weekend, the same could be said for them, even though there was no payout there either.

 

[Fireblaster]

others can have two or three drinks and be wasted (cough fireblaster :D).

Lol I already said I was barely drunk, I physically couldn't drink more. It's like trying to pump gas into a full tank. I need to drink stronger stuff than beer to get drunk because I can't ingest liquids that fast.

 

[Sangoku]

Taking substance to increase performance is against the backroom ruleset. While we can't know for sure none were used at apex (for example), we know they were used here (according to the participants), so it wasn't played following a proper ruleset.

My opinion shouldn't weigh since I'm not even in the ranking, but I don't think having it to count is a good thing for the accuracy of the list.

 

[Olikus]

Yeah cobr, it isnt allowed to do drugs in The br ruleset, so clubba can use that as a point and we can all move allong.

 

[Cobrevolution]

Taking substance to increase performance is against the backroom ruleset. While we can't know for sure none were used at apex (for example),

It is recommended that drugs*, including alcohol, are prohibited at tournaments for the sake of both the venue and the participants. Legal issues are possible, and use of drugs in the vicinity of the venue by participants should be heavily discouraged or prohibited completely. Relevant Federal and State regulations on drugs obviously apply., from the index.

that's all it says, but the reason given is more of a legal thing than a performance thing. which is understandable - a collection of inebriated people can very easily and very quickly degrade to something violent or destructive, thus causing damage to the venue or hurting others.

but the ruleset isn't saying you can't do coke because it's gonna make you hyper aware and play better than your opponent and thus give you an edge, it's saying you can't do coke...because it's illegal. which holds true for weed.

however, for things like ritalin/adderall/vyvanse etc, there's nothing there at all. and as for alcohol, it says it's prohibited at the tournaments, which means you cannot bring liquor into the venue. what you do beforehand is your business, really, and if you show up with a couple in you and you aren't causing a disturbance and you play exceptionally well, well...

but if you were aware of things that happened at other tournaments, then would those results be made illegitimate or not?

 

[Olikus]

Jesus. Clubba i suggest ignore button.

 

[clubbadubba]

Forgot to mention that Genesis 2 is no longer part of the ratings

 

[Olikus]

why is Genesis 2 not in the ratings? Didnt they use the recommended BR ruleset?

 

[Sensei]

People probably used substances at Genesis 2 too.

 

[clubbadubba]

Because its ~2 years old so its a bit outdated. I said before that soon after Zenith, Genesis 2 would go away. The same thing will happen to Apex 2012 after Apex 2014, etc.

Gotta keep the ratings current or they don't mean much.

 

[Olikus]

Because its ~2 years old so its a bit outdated. I said before that soon after Zenith, Genesis 2 would go away. The same thing will happen to Apex 2012 after Apex 2014, etc.

Gotta keep the ratings current or they don't mean much.

ah okay.

 

[Fireblaster]

Somebody at Genesis 2 used samus so it doesn't count

 

[Battlecow]

Yeah Kero's match with me would still count because we count even non-MM seriouslies

but if we were counting only real MM's (something I still kinda support) it would not

Why are you guys so upset you can't have really thought that he would include that ****

 

[Karajan]

These forums are trash bro, Opinionboards is just that, Opinions. However someone like me who states FACTS, is not welcome to an opinion based community.

 

[B Link]

^The opinion argument is the dumbest argument ever made. There ARE better opinions than others. A better opinion is one that is justified/is reasoned well throughout. The only blurry areas are beauty, taste in music, and other weird stuff like that.

The opinion argument is similar the "it's just a theory!" reply to scientific theories. But theories are all we have in science, cuz that's how discoveries work. it is clear that some are more convincing than others. If you think Einstein's Theory of Relativity is flawed because it's "just a theory" you're an idiot.

Sorry just had to take that off my chest because so many people use that dumb argument.

 

[KnitePhox]

Somebody at Genesis 2 used samus so it doesn't count

yup, darth rancorous used samus

S-PAWNED, the entire list is fake, boom is #1, gimpyfish is above so many ppl LMFAO what a real RATING SYSTEM

nice effort clubba

 

[Cobrevolution]

i do think the minimum number of games helps, but i don't think those players should be placed into the list until they meet the minimum game reqs. although i don't know how that'd work out. having people with "unstable" ratings on the board is kinda iffy. half tipsy, will edit if necessary to make sense.

 

[clubbadubba]

It is definitely a lot better now in terms of the number of players that meet the stable rating req, as opposed to when pretty much no one met it. It would still leave out all of the japanese and pretty much anyone who has only been to one tournament. Might be better to just raise the req # wins to like 4 or 5 instead of the 1 it is currently at, but that would make the list a lot shorter. There are a few options to fix that, I'll look into it some time (hopefully soon, but irl man, irl...)