Social Smash 4 Social Topic 2.0

[Gunla]

It's even better. You could call it more broken than '06.
And it's the best.

I dunno, Ride to Hell: Retribution is pretty absolutely broken and undeniably offensive. As is Day One.
But Sonic 06 and Superman 64, in addition to Aquaman Battle for Atlantis are the nostalgia bad games.
I can stomach the classic disasters and Day One, but RtH is just too offensive to anyone. It's not safe for work, not for anywhere, not safe for the world.

 

[Substitution]

06 is my limit for brokenness. XD

Well, trust me when I say.
Sonic '06 is bad. But I know a lot worse.
...Especially in the music category.

Tis fine and onoted.

Ah.

Ocarina of Time 3D or do you mean Eletale Monsters(Japanese version of Quest 64)?

Eletale Monsters. I've never heard of this one.

Been there, done that.

Ah. Again.

The OVA was way worse about it anyway. At least Elise made sense as a character due to how she was brought up. She wasn't shallow or anything, even if she wasn't exactly a good one. I can get her backstory, but yeah, I don't ultimately like her overall, though. I don't mind her as much as others do, though. I kind of shrugged for the most part.

Honestly, my main problem with her is she feels tacked on.
The relationship felt forced. It felt too unrealistic.

Honestly, if anything, the entire story of '06 feels like a really bad self-insert fanfic.
There's really no other way to put it.

Somehow I doubt that's the reason. He sent Silver to do it after all, and Eggman was just there in the right time and place.

To be fair, Sonic was protecting Elise. So I'd assume he thought "Eggman + Elise in captivity = Sonic coming".

My thought is that Mephiles had no choice once his minion went against his ideals. That, and he found out Elise's past, so he couldn't have relied on him once that happened. He also could clearly time travel, so probably knew everything that happened, got fed up, did it himself.

Though that make you wonder.
He was put into the artifact thingy in the past. But yet somehow he's still present in the present (with a physical form) and the future.
...Is that a plot hole I've found?

Plain and simple. It made a lot of sense to me, the only real issues at best were some possible contradictions among all 3 stories when noting each other's points. But Sonic Adventure 1(which this game takes some notes from anyway) had the same issues of inconsistency. Adventure 2 actually properly fixed that problem since the cutscenes ended almost entirely the same way, and it made the Dark ending canon for the Final one to take place.

Well, that's what happens when your game only takes 6 months to develop.
You begin to ignore stuff like that...

That was a bit obvious, but nothing else was an issue. Regardless of who won, the same cutscene played out during the other parts. Adventure 1 somewhat did this, though, like Amy keeping Gamma from being killed makes it look like Sonic was the canon version of the story.

I think it's less lazy and more genius.
Think of it, they we're there at some point. So it would make sense for them to remember.
Though, admittedly, it could've been handled better...

I say this due to the fact they're the only two that match up with each other. Anyway, Adventure 2 just did a somewhat better job at it. I don't think Heroes even tried, and Shadow's game had multiple different endings purposely anyway. Same with cutscenes. Related, nobody knows the true "path" that made sense.

Yeah, that's one thing I didn't like about Shadow's game.
If anything, the alternate endings could've been tossed, they didn't matter.
We could've gone on without 'em. They did. Why? The "Final Story".
It's as if they didn't want Shadow to be bad. So they just said "NOTHING ELSE MATTERS!" and ditched what was once a unique idea (fresh on the other hand, not exactly).

I dunno, Ride to Hell: Retribution is pretty absolutely broken and offensive. As is Day One.
But Sonic 06 and Superman 64, in addition to Aquaman Battle for Atlantis are the nostalgia bad games.

Please. Let's not mention that game.
The farther away from it, the better.

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

I'm sorry, but people who love playing terrible games as a guilty pleasure are ****ing insane and idiotic masochistic morons who I will absolutely never understand. Especially if they like Sonic 06, for which I will gladly blatantly make fun of them for. XD

But one man's trash is another man's treasure. Some people just like **** because it's ****, I guess. ¦D *shrugs*

But then you have people who like things that are terrible while trying to convince everyone that it's good, like Sonic 06, which is just plain ridiculous. lol

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I'm super hyped for that Shaq Fu 2

 

[The Original Robot boy]

The feels... I can't hold back these tears anymore!!

brb going on a Pokemon music spree.

Come and get meeee!

 

[Gunla]

I'm sorry, but people who love playing terrible games as a guilty pleasure are ****ing insane and idiotic masochistic morons who I will absolutely never understand. Especially if they like Sonic 06, for which I will gladly blatantly make fun of them for. XD

But one man's trash is another man's treasure. Some people just like **** because it's ****, I guess. ¦D *shrugs*

There's a good difference between a guilty pleasure bad game and a masochistical one.
-Sonic 06 is inbetween. It's madness.
-I play Superman 64 for the glitches alone.
-I avoid games like RtH which are offensively bad because they are just horrible to look at.

It's how you play the game. Do you play through it just to see how much stupid stuff you can do? Or do you play it seriously?
I play these games primarily to just see how much &%$# I can do and not because they are good. Because they aren't.

 

[Substitution]

I'm sorry, but people who love playing terrible games as a guilty pleasure are ****ing insane and idiotic masochistic morons who I will absolutely never understand. Especially if they like Sonic 06, for which I will gladly blatantly make fun of them for. XD

...I somehow feel that this was meant for me...

But one man's trash is another man's treasure. Some people just like **** because it's ****, I guess. ¦D *shrugs*

To be fair, a bad game has a lot of hilarious qualities to it.
It's like watching a bad Movie. You completely understand it's horrible. But there's just a charm to it.

But then you have people who like things that are terrible while trying to convince everyone that it's good, like Sonic 06, which is just plain ridiculous. lol

I never got that either.
I just like it for how bad it is.

But, if you ever want to see a broken game. Try "Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing" on the PC.

There's a good difference between a guilty pleasure bad game and a masochistical one.
-Sonic 06 is inbetween. It's madness.
-I play Superman 64 for the glitches alone.
-I avoid games like RtH which are offensively bad because they are just horrible to look at.

It's how you play the game. Do you play through it just to see how much stupid stuff you can do? Or do you play it seriously?
I play these games primarily to just see how much &%$# I can do and not because they are good. Because they aren't.

And to be fair, I do find breaking a game fun in it's own way.
...Gave me a reason to keep playing Super Scribblenauts...

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

There's a good difference between a guilty pleasure bad game and a masochistical one.
-Sonic 06 is inbetween. It's madness.
-I play Superman 64 for the glitches alone.
-I avoid games like RtH which are offensively bad because they are just horrible to look at.

It's how you play the game. Do you play through it just to see how much stupid stuff you can do? Or do you play it seriously?
I play these games primarily to just see how much &%$# I can do and not because they are good. Because they aren't.

I play games so I can play a goddamn game. If the game is too terribly designed for me to do that, I don't care how silly it's errors can be, it's **** and deserves to be destroyed and forgotten. Different tastes and all that. ¦D

To be fair, a bad game has a lot of hilarious qualities to it.
It's like watching a bad Movie. You completely understand it's horrible. But there's just a charm to it.

I can't really relate to that. I already don't like watching movies much to begin with so bad movies aren't particularly enjoyable for me at all, either.

 

[Substitution]

I can't really relate to that. I already don't like watching movies much to begin with so bad movies aren't particularly enjoyable for me at all, either.

I dunno.
Honestly, it gets boring always playing a game by the book.
I like to think outside of the box. And games like '06 or S64 seem to fit the bill...

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Nothing is worse than your average CD-i game. And there's a reason why such games are joked about on YouTube.

 

[Substitution]

Nothing is worse than your average CD-i game. And there's a reason why such games are joked about on YouTube.

But they let you do the duck walk! "Cool huh?"

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

But they let you do the duck walk! "Cool huh?"

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

I dunno.
Honestly, it gets boring always playing a game by the book.
I like to think outside of the box. And games like '06 or S64 seem to fit the bill...

I think that mindset is honestly kinda silly and terribly flawed in a certain regard.

If a game is made to be played a certain way and advertised to play a certain way, stop screwing around and play it that certain way and don't get mad because you can't make the game do something it wasn't meant to do or capable of doing. I mean, if you can do some other stuff in it and it's fun, that's one thing, but if you can't and you weren't supposed to and you whine about it, that's not anyone's problem but yours.

This isn't describing you in any way, just gamers on a different topic entirely. It's basically a mild tangent without lasting 500 pages. XD

 

[Substitution]

I think that mindset is honestly kinda silly and terribly flawed in a certain regard.

...I think we're having different views here.
What I mean is there are times where I find it fun just to mess with the game.
See how I can break it, see if I can step the boundaries, see just how much I can do.
Naturally, I do play a game like intended. But it's always a neat change of pace.

It's like why some people skip the missions in GTA and just drive around.
But hey, opinions and the like.

If a game is made to be played a certain way and advertised to play a certain way, stop screwing around and play it that certain way and don't get mad because you can't make the game do something it wasn't meant to do or capable of doing. I mean, if you can do some other stuff in it and it's fun, that's one thing, but if you can't and you weren't supposed to and you whine about it, that's not anyone's problem but yours.

Look, I think this is where we disagree.
The main reason I like "screwing around" is that it makes thing more interesting.
I love games with a ton of relay value, like Scribblenauts which I mentioned earlier.
It's fun to explore IMO. See what exactly I can do.

Now, I don't whine when I can't do something (like try to make a racing game out of a fighting game).

This isn't describing you in any way, just gamers on a different topic entirely. It's basically a mild tangent without lasting 500 pages. XD

Well, I like responding though.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Well, trust me when I say.
Sonic '06 is bad. But I know a lot worse.
...Especially in the music category.

IMO, that's where Unleashed falls. Ugh, the game is just meh at best.

Eletale Monsters. I've never heard of this one.

Requires a Japanese n64 or a Gameshark to properly play. You can guess the other ways.

Honestly, my main problem with her is she feels tacked on.
The relationship felt forced. It felt too unrealistic.

It's a one-sided relationship, so it makes sense. Elise fell in love with her rescuer, and after rescuing her a huge amount of times, it's not that odd. Also, Princess + Knight in Shining Armor is a pretty regular storytelling things.

Honestly, if anything, the entire story of '06 feels like a really bad self-insert fanfic.
There's really no other way to put it.

To be honest, I feel like almost every Sonic game is like that. -_- The stories are just wretched at times. Sonic Battle is another lovely one.

To be fair, Sonic was protecting Elise. So I'd assume he thought "Eggman + Elise in captivity = Sonic coming".

Or he knew what would all happen. That, and we don't know if killing Elise truly would've released the Trigger, so he had to let it happen to set up the right moment. It's not so much a plot hole in this case as a "one way works". Does need better writing, though.

Though that make you wonder.
He was put into the artifact thingy in the past. But yet somehow he's still present in the present (with a physical form) and the future.
...Is that a plot hole I've found?

It got destroyed/broken, actually. Not a plot hole.

Well, that's what happens when your game only takes 6 months to develop.
You begin to ignore stuff like that...

Not exactly that. The staff wouldn't let them fix the bugs and fired the testers. Honestly, it was a dumb decision to do so. I mean, the game is still fun as hell, especially with multiplayer, but yeah.

I think it's less lazy and more genius.
Think of it, they we're there at some point. So it would make sense for them to remember.
Though, admittedly, it could've been handled better...

But of course.

Yeah, that's one thing I didn't like about Shadow's game.
If anything, the alternate endings could've been tossed, they didn't matter.
We could've gone on without 'em. They did. Why? The "Final Story".
It's as if they didn't want Shadow to be bad. So they just said "NOTHING ELSE MATTERS!" and ditched what was once a unique idea (fresh on the other hand, not exactly).

To be honest, that's why I love the game. Replay value. The problem was some missions were just dumb instead. The gameplay was fine, though, overall. Just had a few issues.

But yeah. Once Unleashed came around, well... I started to ignore the Console games, only owning them just because. Black Knight was fine. Colors are just... not impressive on the console. Generations was terrible as a handheld. Lost World was not bad as a handheld so far, finally feeling like a game I could enjoy. None of this "go hyper fast with almost no control" crap that plagues Unleashed/Colors/Generations quite often. Black Knight had solid enough controls. Secret Rings had almost no real control. It had good music, and good voice acting, at least, but was not fun for me to play at all. Likewise, never liked the Advances, couldn't stand the first Rush, but Battle was really good and fun.(it is not perfect, of course)

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

IMO, that's where Unleashed falls. Ugh, the game is just meh at best.


Requires a Japanese n64 or a Gameshark to properly play. You can guess the other ways.


It's a one-sided relationship, so it makes sense. Elise fell in love with her rescuer, and after rescuing her a huge amount of times, it's not that odd. Also, Princess + Knight in Shining Armor is a pretty regular storytelling things.


To be honest, I feel like almost every Sonic game is like that. -_- The stories are just wretched at times. Sonic Battle is another lovely one.


Or he knew what would all happen. That, and we don't know if killing Elise truly would've released the Trigger, so he had to let it happen to set up the right moment. It's not so much a plot hole in this case as a "one way works". Does need better writing, though.


It got destroyed/broken, actually. Not a plot hole.


Not exactly that. The staff wouldn't let them fix the bugs and fired the testers. Honestly, it was a dumb decision to do so. I mean, the game is still fun as hell, especially with multiplayer, but yeah.


But of course.


To be honest, that's why I love the game. Replay value. The problem was some missions were just dumb instead. The gameplay was fine, though, overall. Just had a few issues.

But yeah. Once Unleashed came around, well... I started to ignore the Console games, only owning them just because. Black Knight was fine. Colors are just... not impressive on the console. Generations was terrible as a handheld. Lost World was not bad as a handheld so far, finally feeling like a game I could enjoy. None of this "go hyper fast with almost no control" crap that plagues Unleashed/Colors/Generations quite often. Black Knight had solid enough controls. Secret Rings had almost no real control. It had good music, and good voice acting, at least, but was not fun for me to play at all. Likewise, never liked the Advances, couldn't stand the first Rush, but Battle was really good and fun.(it is not perfect, of course)

I hate almost the entirety of this post. XD

The only things I can agree with are that Black Knight was good and that Sonic Battle is good and fun. Oh, and that Unleashed is meh, but that's solely for the Werehog since I love everything about the daytime stages. Probably why I enjoy the Unleashed Project more than the actual Unleashed game. no BS to deal with.

Oh right, and 06's story is terrible, but that doesn't need to be said. lol

 

[Substitution]

IMO, that's where Unleashed falls. Ugh, the game is just meh at best.

Eh.
Some of the music was okay, it was mostly the night music.
I'm aware of a few which are completely nonsensical.

Requires a Japanese n64 or a Gameshark to properly play. You can guess the other ways.

Ah.
...I say that a lot. Don't I?

It's a one-sided relationship, so it makes sense. Elise fell in love with her rescuer, and after rescuing her a huge amount of times, it's not that odd. Also, Princess + Knight in Shining Armor is a pretty regular storytelling things.

Still, it felt unnatural.
And, to be fair, it kinda started to become a typical fanfic relationship.

To be honest, I feel like almost every Sonic game is like that. -_- The stories are just wretched at times. Sonic Battle is another lovely one.

Some weren't that bad.
Sonic Chronicles has some good moments.

Or he knew what would all happen. That, and we don't know if killing Elise truly would've released the Trigger, so he had to let it happen to set up the right moment. It's not so much a plot hole in this case as a "one way works". Does need better writing, though.

I understand he's an evil genius.
But this is going to conspiracies...

It got destroyed/broken, actually. Not a plot hole.

Really?
...I think I missed that part...

Not exactly that. The staff wouldn't let them fix the bugs and fired the testers. Honestly, it was a dumb decision to do so. I mean, the game is still fun as hell, especially with multiplayer, but yeah.

Actually, the development took around six months to deal with the Christmas Rush.

To be honest, that's why I love the game. Replay value. The problem was some missions were just dumb instead. The gameplay was fine, though, overall. Just had a few issues.

...I think it had a little more than few...

But, one of the biggest problems I had with the "choose you're own story" is that the plot could end up choppy.
Like they'd talk about one element but it's never touched on or one just jumps out of nowhere.

IMO it would've been better linear. At least the plot could've been more focused that way...

But yeah. Once Unleashed came around, well... I started to ignore the Console games, only owning them just because. Black Knight was fine. Colors are just... not impressive on the console. Generations was terrible as a handheld. Lost World was not bad as a handheld so far, finally feeling like a game I could enjoy. None of this "go hyper fast with almost no control" crap that plagues Unleashed/Colors/Generations quite often. Black Knight had solid enough controls. Secret Rings had almost no real control. It had good music, and good voice acting, at least, but was not fun for me to play at all. Likewise, never liked the Advances, couldn't stand the first Rush, but Battle was really good and fun.(it is not perfect, of course)

Honestly, I kinda liked Advance 3.
Then again, it was my first so...

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I hate almost the entirety of this post. XD

The only things I can agree with are that Black Knight was good and that Sonic Battle is good and fun. Oh, and that Unleashed is meh, but that's solely for the Werehog since I love everything about the daytime stages. Probably why I enjoy the Unleashed Project more than the actual Unleashed game. no BS to deal with.

Oh right, and 06's story is terrible, but that doesn't need to be said. lol

To be frank, Unleashed is the worst Sonic game I've ever had the misfortune of playing. The only thing worthwhile to me was the story and characters. Everything else was just plain trash. Forcing me to lock-on with my Homing Attack now? That's just stupid. The high speed day stages? Awful, they're almost as bad as the mach speed sections and not fun at all. Werehog was slightly better, but still trash. It's like playing as Stretch Armstrong with the attack of a damn Magikarp. Horrid. Tails' sky sections were the worst part. Absolutely terrible with the bright idea of "get the button combo pressed right or die". Never got past that. And never want to, since that's how you defeat the bosses in the 360 version or deal them damage in some cases. That is horrid design as is. Frankly, it's a pile of trash overall to me.

Want to know why I like 06 better? I actually could remotely enjoy something besides its visuals. The overall Sonic/Shadow gameplay is nearly perfect, with the only problems being Shadow sometimes is hard to work with in the air, easily failing to lock on correctly with a Homing Attack or, typically, an enemy hitting you at the right time, and Sonic's Mach Speed sections. Silver had no issues. The partners were nigh perfect outside of the wall climbing being absolutely unusable. Their other stuff was fun, though.

For the record, Unleashed is right there with Tails' Sky Patrol, the two worst games I've ever played in the entire Sonic franchise, bar none. In addition, I have played a lot of the other less popular ones, but at least the Advances were somewhat fun, even if they suffered from the same problem that the Mach Speed section was, nearly uncontrollable speed while being able to hit everything or die on the drop of a hat. Ugh. This is also why I love Battle, despite it being a Fighter, it actually made good use of RPG Elements while being fun and had a very well made story.

Eh.
Some of the music was okay, it was mostly the night music.
I'm aware of a few which are completely nonsensical.

I never had much of a chance to hear it, going through a few other stages, the game just... ugh. Was very not fun.

Ah.
...I say that a lot. Don't I?

I won't say more for obvious reasons. But you're free to ask why it's different. :3 I won't tell you how to play it beyond "these are the controls", of course.

Still, it felt unnatural.
And, to be fair, it kinda started to become a typical fanfic relationship.

Agreed.

Some weren't that bad.
Sonic Chronicles has some good moments.

True. But only if you can stomach the gameplay long enough to get there. Same issue as Unleashed with me, but the battle system was somewhat inventive, at least.

I understand he's an evil genius.
But this is going to conspiracies...

Eggman himself probably didn't know he was saving the world. Mephiles is the brains of the Solaris, and actually is a giant mastermind with time travel powers. Him being able to know everything makes a lot of sense.

Really?
...I think I missed that part...

You did, I think. I'd double check, though. I gotta go, so no time.

Actually, the development took around six months to deal with the Christmas Rush.

What I said also happened, mind you. That's why it was so buggy, they wouldn't let them fix it.

...I think it had a little more than few...

Eh.

But, one of the biggest problems I had with the "choose you're own story" is that the plot could end up choppy.
Like they'd talk about one element but it's never touched on or one just jumps out of nowhere.

I thought every route made sense, but I might be wrong. The inconsistencies dealt with Adventure 2 VS Shadow's stories, though. As in, they didn't match up entirely.

IMO it would've been better linear. At least the plot could've been more focused that way...

Oh, god no. Linear stories are the worst thing ever in video games. It doesn't let you really focus on choosing what to do next. It's why games like Adventure 1 were so nice, because you could switch off to different ways to play. Honestly, I loved that it was not linear. That, and having over 300 different paths made the game actually far more interesting than a single story, or barely 6 which are almost entirely identical.

Honestly, I kinda liked Advance 3.
Then again, it was my first so...

They aren't bad, but I'm not a fan of the "mach speed style sections where you bump into everything". It continued to Rush, but finally got dropped in Rush Adventure which fixed it up by balancing it out. Unleashed's idea of "giving you a ring aura to barrel through enemies" to balance out the idea of putting everything in your path feels like a big cop out, IMO. Don't do that, actually properly make the levels so you can go through them at high speeds without getting killed while still putting obstacles here and there. Adventure 1 and 2 did an excellent job with that for Sonic's levels for the most part. Why'd the screw it up? Hell, the old Genesis era did it too(Sonic 4 not counting). It still had enemies, sometimes even screwing up your speed, but it wasn't beyond often. You really could barrel through it or take your time, the only worry being "timed out" at best. Which is something of an idea that can stay dead. And so can the idea that "dying resets your game score" crap. Put it to where you were before you died, except if you got a game over, of course. I mean, really, that's just raising the difficulty bar to crap on the player's progress in a cheap way. I think Sonic Adventure 2 was the last game to keep the "reset to your previous score"?

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

@ Verde Coeden Scalesworth

I'm not going to bother quoting all of that, so I'm just gonna say I disagree and think you're terribly wrong, that you suck at those games and need to just plain get better as I had no problem with them and that you and I will never agree or understand each other on this matter and as such, shouldn't bother trying to.

Problem solved. ¦D

 

[Substitution]

Want to know why I like 06 better? I actually could remotely enjoy something besides its visuals. The overall Sonic/Shadow gameplay is nearly perfect, with the only problems being Shadow sometimes is hard to work with in the air, easily failing to lock on correctly with a Homing Attack or, typically, an enemy hitting you at the right time, and Sonic's Mach Speed sections. Silver had no issues. The partners were nigh perfect outside of the wall climbing being absolutely unusable. Their other stuff was fun, though.

Look, as much as I like bad games.
There no enjoyment out of '06 unless it's breaking. You have to admit that.
The gameplay was far from perfect.

I never had much of a chance to hear it, going through a few other stages, the game just... ugh. Was very not fun.

From what the others have said. It's kinda dull (the night stages).

I won't say more for obvious reasons. But you're free to ask why it's different. :3 I won't tell you how to play it beyond "these are the controls", of course.

I'll look it up later.

True. But only if you can stomach the gameplay long enough to get there. Same issue as Unleashed with me, but the battle system was somewhat inventive, at least.

I think it's good to say it's in the "okay" category.

Eggman himself probably didn't know he was saving the world. Mephiles is the brains of the Solaris, and actually is a giant mastermind with time travel powers. Him being able to know everything makes a lot of sense.

...No, still doesn't make sense.

You did, I think. I'd double check, though. I gotta go, so no time.

I can wait!...
...Bye!...

What I said also happened, mind you. That's why it was so buggy, they wouldn't let them fix it.

Well, that's what happens in a rushed game.
You just end with a mess.

I thought every route made sense, but I might be wrong. The inconsistencies dealt with Adventure 2 VS Shadow's stories, though. As in, they didn't match up entirely.

No, many didn't.
For example, you could go on a route that had the President wanting you dead.
...But then you'd be called a Shadow android.

Oh, god no. Linear stories are the worst thing ever in video games. It doesn't let you really focus on choosing what to do next. It's why games like Adventure 1 were so nice, because you could switch off to different ways to play. Honestly, I loved that it was not linear. That, and having over 300 different paths made the game actually far more interesting than a single story, or barely 6 which are almost entirely identical.

The problem is would you sacrifice stability for variety?
And that's the problem here. I don't mind branching paths. But they did it so poorly it would've been better off linear.

They aren't bad, but I'm not a fan of the "mach speed style sections where you bump into everything". It continued to Rush, but finally got dropped in Rush Adventure which fixed it up by balancing it out. Unleashed's idea of "giving you a ring aura to barrel through enemies" to balance out the idea of putting everything in your path feels like a big cop out, IMO. Don't do that, actually properly make the levels so you can go through them at high speeds without getting killed while still putting obstacles here and there. Adventure 1 and 2 did an excellent job with that for Sonic's levels for the most part. Why'd the screw it up? Hell, the old Genesis era did it too(Sonic 4 not counting). It still had enemies, sometimes even screwing up your speed, but it wasn't beyond often. You really could barrel through it or take your time, the only worry being "timed out" at best. Which is something of an idea that can stay dead. And so can the idea that "dying resets your game score" crap. Put it to where you were before you died, except if you got a game over, of course. I mean, really, that's just raising the difficulty bar to crap on the player's progress in a cheap way. I think Sonic Adventure 2 was the last game to keep the "reset to your previous score"?

I'd hate to sound like a Sonic fanboy, but at least the Genesis games let you play a game.
I understand Sonic is about speed. But you have to be a game as well.
The problem I have with games like Sonic 4 is that it feels like an experience, but not a game.
It was more like an "interactive roller-coaster".

Look, I understand Sonic is about speed. I get that.
But it's also a platformer. It needs platforms.
You can't blame a game for wanting to be well, a game.

That's the thing I believe a lot of people miss.
They just want Sonic to go fast. That's it.
But when that happens, they say "too easy lulz".
Then when they make a platfomer, they say "too slow lulz".

You can either have one or the other.
Experience or game?

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

@ Verde Coeden Scalesworth Didn't Colors do the reset thing?

I'm pretty sure at least one recent game did that.

 

[Substitution]

@ Verde Coeden Scalesworth Didn't Colors do the reset thing?

I'm pretty sure at least one recent game did that.

Maybe.
I dunno, I've been busy playing the Game Gear games...

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I swear, if I'm just going crazy again...

 

[Substitution]

I swear, if I'm just going crazy again...

You'll get used to it.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

You'll get used to it.

Meanwhile, in Poppy's brain...

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Look, as much as I like bad games.
There no enjoyment out of '06 unless it's breaking. You have to admit that.
The gameplay was far from perfect.

No, I enjoyed it because it felt like I had severe control of my character.

From what the others have said. It's kinda dull (the night stages).

Day Stages are far more dull to me.

I'll look it up later.

Okay.

I think it's good to say it's in the "okay" category.

Depends which game we mean. I generally give Unleashed a 5/10 since it wasn't necessarily bad, but the 360 version just had too much bad gameplay that really doesn't reward any skill, just "how to play the game by holding down a button". I hate the whole ring meter crap and wish they'd actually stop using that as a poor excuse for bad stage design.

...No, still doesn't make sense.

Mephiles seems to exist outside of time, so it does cause he see it all. And it was not made clear if Elise dying would release Iblis.

Well, that's what happens in a rushed game.
You just end with a mess.

And sometimes taking too long is the same problem. Brawl is one case where I'd say that. It feels honestly like it has too much while lacking a ton of polish that Melee and 64 had.

No, many didn't.
For example, you could go on a route that had the President wanting you dead.
...But then you'd be called a Shadow android.

Shadow Androids are villains. Makes sense to me in that regard.

The problem is would you sacrifice stability for variety?
And that's the problem here. I don't mind branching paths. But they did it so poorly it would've been better off linear.

The game was extremely stable to me storyline-wise. It just has no known path besides starting at Westopolis and ending with the Final Story. I'd like a statement showing it, but it means little to me. It's a fun game overall, with true replability. I have a goal beyond "yay, get emblem using an annoying goal", which helped. I do agree it is repetitive.

I'd hate to sound like a Sonic fanboy, but at least the Genesis games let you play a game.
I understand Sonic is about speed. But you have to be a game as well.
The problem I have with games like Sonic 4 is that it feels like an experience, but not a game.
It was more like an "interactive roller-coaster".

That's how I feel about Unleashed, Rush(original only), the Advanced, Colors, Mach Speed section of 06... also, that's why I dislike Unleashed so much. Half the time it feels like you're just pressing buttons in a cutscene.

Look, I understand Sonic is about speed. I get that.
But it's also a platformer. It needs platforms.
You can't blame a game for wanting to be well, a game.

That's the thing I believe a lot of people miss.
They just want Sonic to go fast. That's it.
But when that happens, they say "too easy lulz".
Then when they make a platfomer, they say "too slow lulz".

You can either have one or the other.
Experience or game?

Pretty much. Make him fast while controllable and make the stages nice. Lost World actually finally got back to the right path after Unleashed decided to repeat Advance's horrid path of "high speed, little control, hit by everything" gameplay.

@ TheFirstPoppyBro : I'm not sure what reset thing you mean. 06 retconned most of its events out save Sonic going to Soleanna and planning a date in Unleashed. I only played a little of it on the Wii without seeing the story.

 

[Substitution]

Meanwhile, in Poppy's brain...

Seems legit.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

@ TheFirstPoppyBro : I'm not sure what reset thing you mean. 06 retconned most of its events out save Sonic going to Soleanna and planning a date in Unleashed. I only played a little of it on the Wii without seeing the story.

I meant the score reset when you die.

@ Substitution Yeah man, those are the left and right hemispheres of my brain, constantly at odds with each other, just like everyone else, easy.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I meant the score reset when you die.

Ohhhh. I don't know. I know it's not in 06 and Unleashed. I forgot which games have it. I think Shadow and Heroes didn't? You'd have to look that one up yourself.

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

I know it's not in 06 and Unleashed.

Oh yes it is. It's the main reason the Werehog is such a chore.

But the score resetting when you die is in every 3D game that has a score during stages in the corner.

 

[Superyoshiom]

To be frank, Unleashed is the worst Sonic game I've ever had the misfortune of playing. The only thing worthwhile to me was the story and characters. Everything else was just plain trash. Forcing me to lock-on with my Homing Attack now? That's just stupid. The high speed day stages? Awful, they're almost as bad as the mach speed sections and not fun at all. Werehog was slightly better, but still trash. It's like playing as Stretch Armstrong with the attack of a damn Magikarp. Horrid. Tails' sky sections were the worst part. Absolutely terrible with the bright idea of "get the button combo pressed right or die". Never got past that. And never want to, since that's how you defeat the bosses in the 360 version or deal them damage in some cases. That is horrid design as is. Frankly, it's a pile of trash overall to me.

Want to know why I like 06 better? I actually could remotely enjoy something besides its visuals. The overall Sonic/Shadow gameplay is nearly perfect, with the only problems being Shadow sometimes is hard to work with in the air, easily failing to lock on correctly with a Homing Attack or, typically, an enemy hitting you at the right time, and Sonic's Mach Speed sections. Silver had no issues. The partners were nigh perfect outside of the wall climbing being absolutely unusable. Their other stuff was fun, though.

For the record, Unleashed is right there with Tails' Sky Patrol, the two worst games I've ever played in the entire Sonic franchise, bar none. In addition, I have played a lot of the other less popular ones, but at least the Advances were somewhat fun, even if they suffered from the same problem that the Mach Speed section was, nearly uncontrollable speed while being able to hit everything or die on the drop of a hat. Ugh. This is also why I love Battle, despite it being a Fighter, it actually made good use of RPG Elements while being fun and had a very well made story.


I never had much of a chance to hear it, going through a few other stages, the game just... ugh. Was very not fun.


I won't say more for obvious reasons. But you're free to ask why it's different. :3 I won't tell you how to play it beyond "these are the controls", of course.


Agreed.


True. But only if you can stomach the gameplay long enough to get there. Same issue as Unleashed with me, but the battle system was somewhat inventive, at least.


Eggman himself probably didn't know he was saving the world. Mephiles is the brains of the Solaris, and actually is a giant mastermind with time travel powers. Him being able to know everything makes a lot of sense.


You did, I think. I'd double check, though. I gotta go, so no time.


What I said also happened, mind you. That's why it was so buggy, they wouldn't let them fix it.


Eh.


I thought every route made sense, but I might be wrong. The inconsistencies dealt with Adventure 2 VS Shadow's stories, though. As in, they didn't match up entirely.


Oh, god no. Linear stories are the worst thing ever in video games. It doesn't let you really focus on choosing what to do next. It's why games like Adventure 1 were so nice, because you could switch off to different ways to play. Honestly, I loved that it was not linear. That, and having over 300 different paths made the game actually far more interesting than a single story, or barely 6 which are almost entirely identical.


They aren't bad, but I'm not a fan of the "mach speed style sections where you bump into everything". It continued to Rush, but finally got dropped in Rush Adventure which fixed it up by balancing it out. Unleashed's idea of "giving you a ring aura to barrel through enemies" to balance out the idea of putting everything in your path feels like a big cop out, IMO. Don't do that, actually properly make the levels so you can go through them at high speeds without getting killed while still putting obstacles here and there. Adventure 1 and 2 did an excellent job with that for Sonic's levels for the most part. Why'd the screw it up? Hell, the old Genesis era did it too(Sonic 4 not counting). It still had enemies, sometimes even screwing up your speed, but it wasn't beyond often. You really could barrel through it or take your time, the only worry being "timed out" at best. Which is something of an idea that can stay dead. And so can the idea that "dying resets your game score" crap. Put it to where you were before you died, except if you got a game over, of course. I mean, really, that's just raising the difficulty bar to crap on the player's progress in a cheap way. I think Sonic Adventure 2 was the last game to keep the "reset to your previous score"?

May I just say that in all my time being here on SWF, this is the longest post I've ever seen.

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

May I just say that in all my time being here on SWF, this is the longest post I've ever seen.

You mean all half a year? ¦D

Trust me, you haven't seen anything yet. There's been much longer. XD

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

You missed the context. I mean your score goes to 0 in 06. It didn't in Unleashed? Well, I almost never play it, so no surprise I remembered it wrong.

@ Superyoshiom : And? Nothing wrong if you have a lot to say. I unfortunately couldn't really condense it at all. That's just how it goes sometimes. Better to say it all than a short one-sentence answer. Concise is what I prefer, but sometimes you gotta go big or go home.

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

You missed the context. I mean your score goes to 0 in 06. It didn't in Unleashed? Well, I almost never play it, so no surprise I remembered it wrong.

Huh? No, I said it DOES reset. That's exactly what my post said. The score going down to 0 when you die is in all 3D Sonic games with a score counter during stages.

I thought you were saying it doesn't due to how your post was structured.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Huh? No, I said it DOES reset. That's exactly what my post said. The score going down to 0 when you die is in all 3D Sonic games with a score counter during stages.

I thought you were saying it doesn't due to how your post was structured.

Ah. Yeah, I meant they reset to 0. Same page, badly said. Happens.

Anyway, I want that gone for obvious reasons. That might make sense in an Arcade game to challenge you. It's lame in a Console game when you're trying to get 100% completion. -_-

 

[Kaye Cruiser]

Ah. Yeah, I meant they reset to 0. Same page, badly said. Happens.

Anyway, I want that gone for obvious reasons. That might make sense in an Arcade game to challenge you. It's lame in a Console game when you're trying to get 100% completion. -_-

I completely agree with you on that. It's kind of an unnecessary pain in the ass, in my opinion. ¬.¬

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I completely agree with you on that. It' kind of an unnecessary pain in the ***, in my opinion. ¬.¬

More like a pain in the Robuttnik.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

I wrote a Smash Song today.

Yar Har Bandana Dee!
Being a Smasher is alright with me!
Support what you want cause a Smasher is free!
YOU ARE A SMASHER!

 

[8-peacock-8]

 

[Substitution]

You seem to have a video for everything...