Social Skyworld Hub - "Soaring through the Skys"

[TMNTSSB4]

Are you implying that Ganon is an idiot?

I meant whoever would bring Hades back to life, the only Ganon that's an idiot is the CD one("or else you will DIE")

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Also, gonna say this now, i love how every Nintendo Series that introduces Gods into the plot is mostly about the Gods ****ing over the world and it's people. Kid Icarus is like this,

Spoiler

Fire Emblem's had a case of this with Radiance, Xenoblade is another case, lol.

Hades did it better though, made all of them look like a sweet, cuddly bunny.

 

[meleebrawler]

I meant whoever would bring Hades back to life, the only Ganon that's an idiot is the CD one("or else you will DIE")

What about the cartoon?

 

[Wintropy]

I did not know this. So Palutena is basically Athena then by that logic, which means i don't think we'll see a real Athena in this, lol.

Yep~

Pit is inspired by Cupid, known as Eros in Greek mythology (his name comes from "Cu-pit"); Viridi is inspired by the archetype of the nature deity, though she definitely possesses connotations of Demeter; Pyrrhon is a conflation of the archetypal sun deity, particularly Apollo and Helios; Dyntos is inspired by Hephaestus, though it's implied he's also an updated version of Kamisama (literally "Lord God", the Japanese name for the Judaeo-Christian archetype of God), a character in the original Kid Icarus who was known as Zeus in the localised versions, depicted as an old man in a robe who bestowed upon Pit divine weapons - since Zeus has yet to make an appearance in the Uprising canon, it's possible that Dyntos is an amalgamated quantification of both of these deities.

Oh, I should also add that, in the mythology, it was Athena who turned Medusa, one of her shrine maidens, into a hideous abomination. Again, parallels~ ;3

Kid Icarus is surprisingly attuned to its source inspiration. Read up on it, you may find something interesting!

 

[TMNTSSB4]

What about the cartoon?

Never seen the cartoon, except for a video with Link saying over and over "Well excuse me princess". Watched it because of the Palutena Guidance with Link(plus Viridi obsessing over him)

 

[The Merc]

I meant whoever would bring Hades back to life, the only Ganon that's an idiot is the CD one("or else you will DIE")

Well, I could see Thatos reviving Hades. He is the God of Death after all.

 

[Wintropy]

Well, I could see Thatos reviving Hades. He is the God of Death after all.

Hades was the one who revived Thanatos, though. ;3

 

[The Merc]

Hades was the one who revived Thanatos, though. ;3

Even more of a reason for Thanatos to revive Hades. :3

 

[Wintropy]

Even more of a reason for Thanatos to revive Hades. :3

No I mean Thanatos is only alive because Hades revived him.

Presumably, without Hades, Thanatos is as good as dead.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

No I mean Thanatos is only alive because Hades revived him.

Presumably, without Hades, Thanatos is as good as dead.

There could be Pandora, who we don't know her fate of living, just to piss off Dark Pit. That and so that there could be more interaction with her and Pit.

 

[The Merc]

No I mean Thanatos is only alive because Hades revived him.

Presumably, without Hades, Thanatos is as good as dead.

But then how did he get revived if he died in the original Kid Icarus?

 

[Wintropy]

There could be Pandora, who we don't know her fate of living, just to piss off Dark Pit. That and so that there could be more interaction with her and Pit.

I was kinda under the impression that all of those beings only exist because Hades revived them.

Pandora was only "alive" in the sense that her soul had been absorbed by Dark Pit, and when he came in contact with the Rewind Spring, she regressed back into a state of existence - and then regressed back so far that she reverted to her original form, prior to being transformed into an evil blob by Palutena.

But then how did he get revived if he died in the original Kid Icarus?

Hades.

It's implied that he's been around since the beginning, just hiding in the shadows and letting Medusa do the dirty work for him.

 

[The Merc]

Hades.

It's implied that he's been around since the beginning, just hiding in the shadows and letting Medusa do the dirty work for him.

Oh, I see. Well, like @ TMNTSSB4 said, Pandora could revive Hades. Unless she died when fighting Dark Pit

You know what? I really need to play the original Kid Icarus games.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

I was kinda under the impression that all of those beings only exist because Hades revived them.

Pandora was only "alive" in the sense that her soul had been absorbed by Dark Pit, and when he came in contact with the Rewind Spring, she regressed back into a state of existence - and then regressed back so far that she reverted to her original form, prior to being transformed into a blob by Palutena.

I meant after Dark Pit defeated Pandora in her Amazon state, she could still be alive for all we know.

 

[Wintropy]

I meant after Dark Pit defeated Pandora in her Amazon state, she could still be alive for all we know.

She could be. It's difficult to grasp how "death" works in the Kid Icarus universe, since most of the main characters are deities.

Like, we know Phosphora's alive even after Pit defeated her, and it's kinda-sorta implied that Arlon's still around too, but when you can get revived from the dead anyway, it's a bit difficult to quantify how it actually operates.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

She could be. It's difficult to grasp how "death" works in the Kid Icarus universe, since most of the main characters are deities.

Like, we know Phosphora's alive even after Pit defeated her, and it's kinda-sorta implied that Arlon's still around too, but when you can get revived from the dead anyway, it's a bit difficult to quantify how it actually operates.

If this was Fire Emblem, everyone would be dead. If we ever get a sequel, at least there's a mystery question to be solved.

 

[meleebrawler]

I was kinda under the impression that all of those beings only exist because Hades revived them.

Pandora was only "alive" in the sense that her soul had been absorbed by Dark Pit, and when he came in contact with the Rewind Spring, she regressed back into a state of existence - and then regressed back so far that she reverted to her original form, prior to being transformed into an evil blob by Palutena.

Pandora's figurine says she lost her body due to an "accident". Doesn't really imply Palutena had anything to do with it
other than Pandora being a strong warrior for the Underworld Army. She certainly doesn't seem to harbour resentment
towards Palutena like Medusa does.

...Does anyone think the Kid Icarus gang might want Medusa back in light of everything Hades did and so she can
manage the now ruler-less Underworld (unless Hades's death killed them all?)?

 

[Wintropy]

Pandora's figurine says she lost her body due to an "accident". Doesn't really imply Palutena had anything to do with it
other than Pandora being a strong warrior for the Underworld Army. She certainly doesn't seem to harbour resentment
towards Palutena like Medusa does.

...Does anyone think the Kid Icarus gang might want Medusa back in light of everything Hades did and so she can
manage the now ruler-less Underworld (unless Hades's death killed them all?)?

Ah, you're right, sorry. I was under the impression it was Palutena's doing somehow, thanks for clarifying that!

Would Medusa returning really be such a good idea? Especially with Hades out of the way, perforce the one thing that insinuated any sort of mutual alignment between herself and the heroes - why couldn't she just rise up against the heroes again without anybody to pull on her strings?

 

[meleebrawler]

Ah, you're right, sorry. I was under the impression it was Palutena's doing somehow, thanks for clarifying that!

Would Medusa returning really be such a good idea? Especially with Hades out of the way, perforce the one thing that insinuated any sort of mutual alignment between herself and the heroes - why couldn't she just rise up against the heroes again without anybody to pull on her strings?

Depends on if, as you say, Hades has been pulling the strings from the very beginning, to the point that he was
the whole reason she became evil (well, by Underworld standards anyway). Whether she'd still be hostile towards humans
and Skyworld would depend on how much influence Hades had on her, if at all. And if there's any sort of redeeming qualities
in her, I don't any reason for Palutena not to remove her curse (or the curse could just make her less ugly itself since it "reflects
what's in her heart).

I just the read the wiki, and... apparently she used to be a Skyworld goddess?

DANG IT HADES NOW I DON'T KNOW IF THE PAST 25 YEARS HAVE BEEN A LIE.

*Ahem*

Anyway, ruler or no ruler, the Underworld is an important part of the Kid Icarus universe since it's charge of
controlling the souls of the departed... or at least it's supposed to be.

 

[Wintropy]

Depends on if, as you say, Hades has been pulling the strings from the very beginning, to the point that he was
the whole reason she became evil (well, by Underworld standards anyway). Whether she'd still be hostile towards humans
and Skyworld would depend on how much influence Hades had on her, if at all. And if there's any sort of redeeming qualities
in her, I don't any reason for Palutena not to remove her curse (or the curse could just make her less ugly itself since it "reflects
what's in her heart).

I just the read the wiki, and... apparently she used to be a Skyworld goddess?

DANG IT HADES NOW I DON'T KNOW IF THE PAST 25 YEARS HAVE BEEN A LIE.

*Ahem*

Anyway, ruler or no ruler, the Underworld is an important part of the Kid Icarus universe since it's charge of
controlling the souls of the departed... or at least it's supposed to be.

Yep, she used to be co-ruler of Skyworld with Palutena. She became envious of humanity and tormented them with her power, and Palutena transformed her into a vile creature to reflect the evil in her heart, then banished her to the Underworld for her crimes.

My own interpretation of it is that Hades offered Medusa power and let her take the helm at his army, though he never got involved himself. It's also possible that Medusa took charge of the Underworld forces herself, and Hades let her do it from behind the scenes - after all, ousting Palutena could only be of benefit to him in the long run. He is quick to remind us that the Underworld forces lack intelligence ("Seriously, they're all idiots. I don't even know if any of them have actual brains.") and just mindlessly kill and murder even without anything to tell them what to do. I doubt it would be difficult for Medusa to rally them together and get them to kidnap Palutena, leaving Pit to wander on down to the Underworld and rescue her.

There's also the question of whether Of Myths and Monsters is canon. I think it is, though it's more of an interlude between the two main adventures, and nothing of significance really happened - I think Orcos was just a powerful Underworld entity (in this case, "Evil Land" is either a place in the Underworld or just another name for it - or it's Hades screwing about and pretending he had no involvement whatsoever, heavens hells no, perish the thought, ahaha~) that got loose and decided to cause trouble.

I think Hades's death would cause something of a power vacuum in the Underworld. Then again, he is the God of the Underworld, and it's intrinsically linked to him - maybe a lesser deity was appointed to take over? I think Medusa would still bear a grudge against humanity and the good guys, even if it's just because she's so full of piss and vinegar after the whole "cursed and killed" thing, but I also think she could reconcile her relationships to an extent and return as a begrudging ally, or at least a neutral party. Or she could just be dead.

tl;dr - My headcanon is that Hades has always been involved, just not doing much, and Medusa turned to the darkness of her own volition. Anything after that is up to interpretation.

 

[meleebrawler]

Yep, she used to be co-ruler of Skyworld with Palutena. She became envious of humanity and tormented them with her power, and Palutena transformed her into a vile creature to reflect the evil in her heart, then banished her to the Underworld for her crimes.

My own interpretation of it is that Hades offered Medusa power and let her take the helm at his army, though he never got involved himself. It's also possible that Medusa took charge of the Underworld forces herself, and Hades let her do it from behind the scenes - after all, ousting Palutena could only be of benefit to him in the long run. He is quick to remind us that the Underworld forces lack intelligence ("Seriously, they're all idiots. I don't even know if any of them have actual brains.") and just mindlessly kill and murder even without anything to tell them what to do. I doubt it would be difficult for Medusa to rally them together and get them to kidnap Palutena, leaving Pit to wander on down to the Underworld and rescue her.

There's also the question of whether Of Myths and Monsters is canon. I think it is, though it's more of an interlude between the two main adventures, and nothing of significance really happened - I think Orcos was just a powerful Underworld entity (in this case, "Evil Land" is either a place in the Underworld or just another name for it - or it's Hades screwing about and pretending he had no involvement whatsoever, heavens hells no, perish the thought, ahaha~) that got loose and decided to cause trouble.

I think Hades's death would cause something of a power vacuum in the Underworld. Then again, he is the God of the Underworld, and it's intrinsically linked to him - maybe a lesser deity was appointed to take over? I think Medusa would still bear a grudge against humanity and the good guys, even if it's just because she's so full of piss and vinegar after the whole "cursed and killed" thing, but I also think she could reconcile her relationships to an extent and return as a begrudging ally, or at least a neutral party. Or she could just be dead.

tl;dr - My headcanon is that Hades has always been involved, just not doing much, and Medusa turned to the darkness of her own volition. Anything after that is up to interpretation.

Actually Palutena is held captive in Skyworld, and Pit had to fight his way out of the Underworld to get to her
while reclaiming the Three Sacred Treasures.

I do admit that resurrecting Medusa would probably be seen as a very risky gambit in-universe, and would probably
only be considered if a ruler-less Underworld really was worse than the alternative. After all, who's gonna stop them from
killing and pillaging with no one to call the shots or restrain them?

Seems weird that Hades complain about the intelligence of his minions when he made them, but then he probably
doesn't care when his strategy boils down to "make more soldiers than anyone else and win by attrition", which he does
by having humans slaughtered for their souls and using them with reckless abandon. He doesn't seem that great at long-term
strategy, but when you're in it for the evulz I guess you don't really care about concerns like sustainability. I honestly don't think he'd have planned for anything past his death, considering how smug and arrogant he was in his power he probably couldn't fathom anyone ever defeating him, not even Pit.

 

[Wintropy]

Actually Palutena is held captive in Skyworld, and Pit had to fight his way out of the Underworld to get to her
while reclaiming the Three Sacred Treasures.

I do admit that resurrecting Medusa would probably be seen as a very risky gambit in-universe, and would probably
only be considered if a ruler-less Underworld really was worse than the alternative. After all, who's gonna stop them from
killing and pillaging with no one to call the shots or restrain them?

Seems weird that Hades complain about the intelligence of his minions when he made them, but then he probably
doesn't care when his strategy boils down to "make more soldiers than anyone else and win by attrition", which he does
by having humans slaughtered for their souls and using them with reckless abandon. He doesn't seem that great at long-term
strategy, but when you're in it for the evulz I guess you don't really care about concerns like sustainability. I honestly don't think he'd have planned for anything past his death, considering how smug and arrogant he was in his power he probably couldn't fathom anyone ever defeating him, not even Pit.

Oh sugar you're right.

DANG IT HOW CAN THREE GAMES HAVE SUCH COMPLEX LORE?! ;w;

Yeah, I doubt Hades considered his death as a possible contingency. His long-term strategy is "war by numbers" - he's basically an Advance Wars CO on a cosmic scale.

 

[meleebrawler]

Oh sugar you're right.

DANG IT HOW CAN THREE GAMES HAVE SUCH COMPLEX LORE?! ;w;

Yeah, I doubt Hades considered his death as a possible contingency. His long-term strategy is "war by numbers" - he's basically an Advance Wars CO on a cosmic scale.

Greek Mythology man. No but seriously Uprising just added so much while staying true to the original's story
that the older games indirectly got added depth.

Too bad for Hades that souls aren't truly unlimited like funds. Sooner or later if no one stopped him he'd run out
of things to kill, and then he'd... go to another planet? Could he do that? 'Cause if not he's gonna go mad with
boredom like Shao Khan in one his endings. But of course he's having too much fun to even consider that.

 

[Wintropy]

Greek Mythology man. No but seriously Uprising just added so much while staying true to the original's story
that the older games indirectly got added depth.

Too bad for Hades that souls aren't truly unlimited like funds. Sooner or later if no one stopped him he'd run out
of things to kill, and then he'd... go to another planet? Could he do that? 'Cause if not he's gonna go mad with
boredom like Shao Khan in one his endings. But of course he's having too much fun to even consider that.

Considering the Kid Icarus universe canonically has alien worlds and interstellar voyages, it's possible. Not sure if that's possible even for a god, though. Then again, Pyrrhon seems to have no issue with it. Then again, Pyrrhon's credentials as a deity are open to interpretation at the best of times.

It's interesting that Hades doesn't really have an end goal in mind. He just craves destruction and relishes chaos for its own sake. Bowser wants to marry Peach and take over the Mushroom Kingdom, Ganondorf wants to gather the Triforce and attain ultimate power, K. Rool wants to exterminate the Kongs, Hades...is just in it for the lulz. As long as people are dying and he's getting stronger, he doesn't seem to care much about the technicalities. He'd probably bring everybody back to life just to kill them again if he ran out of souls to pillage - he's that kind of self-perpetuating maniac, which is pretty interesting from a narrative perspective, if you ask me.

 

[meleebrawler]

Considering the Kid Icarus universe canonically has alien worlds and interstellar voyages, it's possible. Not sure if that's possible even for a god, though. Then again, Pyrrhon seems to have no issue with it. Then again, Pyrrhon's credentials as a deity are open to interpretation at the best of times.

It's interesting that Hades doesn't really have an end goal in mind. He just craves destruction and relishes chaos for its own sake. Bowser wants to marry Peach and take over the Mushroom Kingdom, Ganondorf wants to gather the Triforce and attain ultimate power, K. Rool wants to exterminate the Kongs, Hades...is just in it for the lulz. As long as people are dying and he's getting stronger, he doesn't seem to care much about the technicalities. He'd probably bring everybody back to life just to kill them again if he ran out of souls to pillage - he's that kind of self-perpetuating maniac, which is pretty interesting from a narrative perspective, if you ask me.

Does one soul equal one human? Because it sure didn't work like that for Underworld monsters, otherwise, as Palutena
points out, the world would have been overrun easily. And as Viridi points out "...but that's a huge waste!".
Based on this, whenever Pit blasts Underworld monsters the souls that were used to make them don't just go back
into the stream. To say nothing about the souls Hades eats.

 

[Wintropy]

Does one soul equal one human? Because it sure didn't work like that for Underworld monsters, otherwise, as Palutena
points out, the world would have been overrun easily. And as Viridi points out "...but that's a huge waste!".
Based on this, whenever Pit blasts Underworld monsters the souls that were used to make them don't just go back
into the stream. To say nothing about the souls Hades eats.

Nope, it takes a lot of souls to make even a single monster. Hades just toys with souls like they're his own personal playthings, or a cheap snack to chow down on when he's got nothing else to do. He's essentially using his powers for his own twisted ends, which in this case is satisfying his own indulgent whims.

Hades is the ultimate decadent deity. He doesn't care about anything as long as he's content.

 

[meleebrawler]

Nope, it takes a lot of souls to make even a single monster. Hades just toys with souls like they're his own personal playthings, or a cheap snack to chow down on when he's got nothing else to do. He's essentially using his powers for his own twisted ends, which in this case is satisfying his own indulgent whims.

Hades is the ultimate decadent deity. He doesn't care about anything as long as he's content.

It's official: Hades is the GREEKEST god in Uprising.

 

[The Merc]

O, you guys are talking about theories and you didn't invited me?!

It's okay though, I have only played Uprising, so I don't know anything about the last two games.

DANG IT HOW CAN THREE GAMES HAVE SUCH COMPLEX LORE?! ;w;

Have you seen FNAF's lore?

 

[TMNTSSB4]

It's official: Hades is the GREEKEST god in Uprising.

And one of the best Nintendo villans of all time

 

[The Merc]

And one of the best Nintendo villans of all time

This is so true.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

This is so true.

Who needs Grima when you have Hades.

 

[The Merc]

Who needs Grima when you have Hades.

........

I don't know. Grima was pretty freaking awesome.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

........

I don't know. Grima was pretty freaking awesome.

He may have been awesome, but he felt like Thanos. Badass, but way to serious. Hades on the other hand, had everything down.

 

[The Merc]

He may have been awesome, but he felt like Thanos. Badass, but way to serious. Hades on the other hand, had everything down.

For a second I though you said Thanatos XD.

But you do have a point. Grim is a badass, but a little no the serious side. while Hades acts like his done nothing wrong. It's hilarious. Though, if you think about it, Grima's play was doomed to fail as soon as he started it.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

For a second I though you said Thanatos XD.

But you do have a point. Grim is a badass, but a little no the serious side. while Hades acts like his done nothing wrong. It's hilarious. Though, if you think about it, Grima's play was doomed to fail as soon as he started it.

To me, it felt doomed before they even showed his face(talking to Validar before his "death".

 

[The Merc]

To me, it felt doomed before they even showed his face(talking to Validar before his "death".

Oh, don't get me wrong. That is exactly how I first felt, you know, with Robin killing Chrom and all. But if you think about it after you played the game a few times, by Grima following Lucina back in time, he stuffed up his plan before it began.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Oh, don't get me wrong. That is exactly how I first felt, you know, with Robin killing Chrom and all. But if you think about it after you played the game a few times, by Grima following Lucina back in time, he stuffed up his plan before it began.

I admit that was smart. Reminded me of Cell from DBZ before he achieved his perfection. Still waiting on a Kid IcarusXFire Emblem game though.

 

[The Merc]

I admit that was smart. Reminded me of Cell from DBZ before he achieved his perfection. Still waiting on a Kid IcarusXFire Emblem game though.

Sorry, haven't really watched DBZ, so I don't know who Cell is. Now that sounds like an awesome idea.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Sorry, haven't really watched DBZ, so I don't know who Cell is. Now that sounds like an awesome idea.

Cell was a bug looking android who went to the past to absorb(suck on with his tail) 2 androids to 9 get to his perfect form. I can imagine Pit being nice to Chrom while Palutena and Viridi continuously mocks him for not being in Smash.

 

[The Merc]

Cell was a bug looking android who went to the past to absorb(suck on with his tail) 2 androids to 9 get to his perfect form. I can imagine Pit being nice to Chrom while Palutena and Viridi continuously mocks him for not being in Smash.

Oh, and his play stuff up before it begins by making a Paradox I am guessing? But Palutena and Viridi already do that