Shrine Maiden of Paradise ~ Reimu Hakurei (Touhou Project)

Ayumi Tachibana

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Doujin leak is just saying, "There is a rumor floating around among doujin circles close to ZUN for a while, that blank Koubou, a doujin circle known for their orchestral remixes of Touhou music, is composing some Touhou tracks for Smash." and " due to the amount of tracks (that track list) the leaker has been hearing, they believe that the representation has to be more than just a single Mii costume."
That's it.

Things like Reimu in Smash or her movesets, her stage are all their fantasies. They used the word "fantasy" to relate Touhou, but they were just simply imagining how they wanted to see Touhou representation in Smash with other people in the 5chan thread just like everyone here is doing. They said that they have heard about Reimu moves like in AoCF or something like that but they weren't really sure about those rumors.
Other leaks he made outside of Smash threads were nothing to do with Smash. The leaker is a known one inside Touhou boards.
 

zriL

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I was always doubtful about the doujin leak because it was weird this kind of things could leak so easily, but also because I didn't really want it to be true. I don't know if I'm in the minority but I really don't want doujin remixes made for Smash. I've already heard a lot of doujin remixes so I think it would be just some other remixes by popular circles, but I've never heard the Smash team make Touhou music and that's what I'm most curious about. Sometimes you might think doujin music has done everything that could be done with Touhou, but even after dozens or even hundreds of arrange of the same theme, we still get incredible new stuff every year. Since the Smash team is full of talented people, I hope they would be pretty hyped for doing some Touhou and try to show who's best at making arrangements. It sounds crazy but sometimes I think Smash team Touhou arrangements is the most hype thing about Reimu in smash.
 
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Lyncario

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I was always doubtful about the doujin leak because it was weird this kind of things could leak so easily, but also because I didn't really want it to be true. I don't know if I'm in the minority but I really don't want doujin remixes made for Smash. I've already heard a lot of doujin remixes so I think it would be just some other remixes by popular circles, but I've never heard the Smash team make Touhou music and that's what I'm most curious about. Sometimes you might think doujin music has done everything that could be done with Touhou, but even after dozens or even hundreds of arrange of the same theme, we still get incredible new stuff every year. Since the Smash team is full of talented people, I hope they would be pretty hyped for doing some Touhou and try to show who's best at making arrangements. It sounds crazy but sometimes I think Smash team Touhou arrangements is the most hype thing about Reimu in smash.
Well, you see, those 2 remixes are made by the same guy, so you can already hear some of it.
 

zriL

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I mean one guy is not the Smash team and the context of arranging for Smash and arranging for some relatively obscure mobile music game is quite different.
 

kaithehedgefox

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I almost forgot to mention that the addition of Piranha Plant, Ren (Persona), and Terry (King of Fighters) to the roster is actually good news for us Reimu supporters! Characters who weren't highly requested were chosen, so thus Reimu can still get in. I've aforementioned that Reimu isn't a highly requested character for Smash due to misconceptions stating that Touhou is obscure.
 
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3D Dillon

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While I'm not saying that you can't be hopeful, it should be kept in mind that just because Steve took a while doesn't necessarily mean that everyone will take a while. It should also be noted that not every DLC character is going to be gimmicky. Remember, Banjo came after Joker's Persona mechanics and Hero's RNG frickery, and all they had were a couple specials that worked differently. There's also Byleth, who had no gimmicks whatsoever despite following Terry, who has one of the most loyal movesets in the game. Heck, Sakurai might even decide to have a more simplistic moveset after Steve and Min Min, as to give the devs a break. While I believe that Reimu probably would have a unique and loyal moveset, we don't know that for sure and I'm not confident in basing predictions off an unknown variable.
Byleth had no gimmicks probably because they were a late/late minute pick for FP1 and the Smash team didn't have much time to come up with a good moveset for them. I imagine Byleth could've been more unique, had they been delayed to FP2.
 

SharkLord

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Byleth had no gimmicks probably because they were a late/late minute pick for FP1 and the Smash team didn't have much time to come up with a good moveset for them. I imagine Byleth could've been more unique, had they been delayed to FP2.
I dunno about that. He stated that they were chosen in advance as a character that "people would be playing at that time," and used pre-release version of Three Houses to base them off of. Even then, that changes nothing about Banjo.
 

3D Dillon

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I dunno about that. He stated that they were chosen in advance as a character that "people would be playing at that time," and used pre-release version of Three Houses to base them off of. Even then, that changes nothing about Banjo.
Steve MAY have been planned for FP1, but due to some complications, he was moved to FP2, and Banjo took his place since HIS moveset was not as complex.
 

SharkLord

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All these last minute replacements had to be BEFORE the FP was finalized.
If the pass was finalized, Sakurai would have enough time to give everyone a gimmick. I'll say it again, some characters have gimmicks, some don't. We can't base someone's perceived likelihood off of that.
 

3D Dillon

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If the pass was finalized, Sakurai would have enough time to give everyone a gimmick. I'll say it again, some characters have gimmicks, some don't. We can't base someone's perceived likelihood off of that.
So do you believe the next fighter won't have much gimmicks?
sigh I give up.
 
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SharkLord

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So do you believe the next fighter won't have much gimmicks?
sigh I give up.
No, I'm saying that using the point of "fighters will have gimmicks and therefore will take more time" is shaky logic that doesn't have enough to support itself. Maybe CP8 will be gimmicky, maybe it won't. It's a case-by-case basis that can't be used to determine anyone.
 

3D Dillon

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No, I'm saying that using the point of "fighters will have gimmicks and therefore will take more time" is shaky logic that doesn't have enough to support itself. Maybe CP8 will be gimmicky, maybe it won't. It's a case-by-case basis that can't be used to determine anyone.
Well, in that case, the only thing you can predict right now is... the unpredictability.
 

TheTuninator

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Well, Steve did take a long time compared to other DLC fighters. Due to Reimu's potential being very complex, she has to have longer development time than usual.
I am actually of the opposite opinion here. I think that Reimu's implementation would be much, much smoother than the average fighter because she has an entire fighting game moveset pre-made and ready to go. Even if we assume that she had some kind of unusual gimmick not present in any of the fighting games, it's inevitable that they would go to the well of the fighters for a number of the moves (it'd be either that or create them from whole cloth, and why bother?). She's much closer to Terry than Steve in terms of how the Smash team might go about implementing her, I think. It's worth remembering that Reimu has appeared in more fighting games than a lot of characters from fighting game series, even.

I was always doubtful about the doujin leak because it was weird this kind of things could leak so easily, but also because I didn't really want it to be true. I don't know if I'm in the minority but I really don't want doujin remixes made for Smash. I've already heard a lot of doujin remixes so I think it would be just some other remixes by popular circles, but I've never heard the Smash team make Touhou music and that's what I'm most curious about. Sometimes you might think doujin music has done everything that could be done with Touhou, but even after dozens or even hundreds of arrange of the same theme, we still get incredible new stuff every year. Since the Smash team is full of talented people, I hope they would be pretty hyped for doing some Touhou and try to show who's best at making arrangements. It sounds crazy but sometimes I think Smash team Touhou arrangements is the most hype thing about Reimu in smash.
Yeah, after how phenomenal the Smash team remixes of Aria of the Soul and the ARMS theme were, I would love to see them take a crack at some of the most well-known Touhou tunes.
 
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SharkLord

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I am actually of the opposite opinion here. I think that Reimu's implementation would be much, much smoother than the average fighter because she has an entire fighting game moveset pre-made and ready to go. Even if we assume that she had some kind of unusual gimmick not present in any of the fighting games, it's inevitable that they would go to the well of the fighters for a number of the moves (it'd be either that or create them from whole cloth, and why bother?). She's much closer to Terry than Steve in terms of how the Smash team might go about implementing her, I think. It's worth remembering that Reimu has appeared in more fighting games than a lot of characters from fighting game series, even.
If movements were the issue, Steve would arguably be on the easier side. His problem was that Sakurai had to recode every stage in the game just to make his gimmick work. Compared to that, everyone is small fry, and a lot of Reimu's potential gimmicks could be based off of something already in the game. Flight? Peach's glide, or ROB's up special. Grazing? Phantom hits. Projectile normals? Mega Man. I don't think there's going to be another character in Ultimate's lifespan who needs as much technical witchcraft as Steve.
 

TheTuninator

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If movements were the issue, Steve would arguably be on the easier side. His problem was that Sakurai had to recode every stage in the game just to make his gimmick work. Compared to that, everyone is small fry, and a lot of Reimu's potential gimmicks could be based off of something already in the game. Flight? Peach's glide, or ROB's up special. Grazing? Phantom hits. Projectile normals? Mega Man. I don't think there's going to be another character in Ultimate's lifespan who needs as much technical witchcraft as Steve.
Indeed! Reimu's gimmick, if indeed she had one, would be something like flight, grazing, or power pickups, none of which seem like they'd be a particularly radical divergence from existing characters.
 

zriL

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Isn't this a big blow for Reimu, the armpit legend ? I don't know if they usually hold on certain themes for upcoming characters.
 

Lyncario

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Isn't this a big blow for Reimu, the armpit legend ? I don't know if they usually hold on certain themes for upcoming characters.
If anything, that only goes against her getting spirited in a spirit event, since the spirit coming with the dlc characters don't get in the regular spirit board.
 

SharkLord

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Isn't this a big blow for Reimu, the armpit legend ? I don't know if they usually hold on certain themes for upcoming characters.
I don't think it really means anything. They just kinda throw out Spirit Events whenever and have some random themes to go with it.
 
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zriL

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Oh I misread it as a tourney event. Indeed spirit events don't mean much, I don't even think they would add Reimu spirit in an event like this. If they do Touhou spirits, it would probably get multiple spirits.
 

Commander_Alph

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So, I've been looking around the Smash Ultimate section of Gamefaqs about Reimu and found out that a lot of contradiction about her is that she doesn't have a mainline title on a Nintendo console.

I don't know if I'm the only one thinking about this but... why the heck you wanted a mainline Touhou game as a proof of recognition to Nintendo when Nintendo is actively releasing the fangames on eShop, some even get a physical copy? I mean Touhou is basically live and breathe through fan content and I could see Sakurai giving a shoutout on the day of the presentation, cause not only it shows Touhou relevancy in a Nintendo console but also directly supporting the fans, encourage them to make more games and also cover the very important aspect of the franchise.

The people who only think only official game is alegible and not bothering checking the fangames, let alone calling it "shovelware" just restricted themselves without any one bothering them, and it is literally as clear as day that they won't enjoy the Schumps and probably the fighting game if they aren't a tryhard. Touhou is basically a jack of all trades.


I mean, I could see Sakurai talk about it like this (first posted on Discord):
"To people out there who haven't heard about Touhou don't worry, there's plenty of Touhou games in the eShop that you could enjoy until your heart's content. And yes, I'm aware that these game are all made by fans of the series but, it wouldn't hurt if you tried one, am I right? also, despite the status there's actually a lot of higher quality ones like [insert game here] and [insert game here] for short that even rival [insert other indie game made by another company just to throw shades] as Touhou allow the freedom to express the interest of said fan through many forms of media, and yes, including game."
 
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TheTuninator

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Persona doesn't have a mainline game on a Nintendo console either, so that's a non-issue as far as I'm concerned.
 

Commander_Alph

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Persona doesn't have a mainline game on a Nintendo console either, so that's a non-issue as far as I'm concerned.
They basically dismissed that because "SMT is used to be in Nintendo console before" I mean that is literally more far-fetched than proving Cloud is deserving to be in Smash because he is the face of FF and FF used be on a Nintendo console and some uses his appearance in KH game on DS at that time to justify "Hey, he's in Nintendo console, wdym?" While at the same time shoot down Reimu for the same exact thing cause she made an appearance in Taiko no Tatsujin and just say "nope, because she is not ''''''important'''''' and just as a cameo."
 

GolisoPower

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Something just occurred to me:

It seems that every Touhou appearance Reimu has had, she's had some new Spell Card given to her. Considering this information: what're the chances Sakurai would make a completely original Spell Card for whatever moveset he gives her? I mean, new Spell Cards for a character are a tradition in Touhou, Sakurai'd just be perpetuating it.
 

7NATOR

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I don't think there were any last-minute replacements. Some characters have gimmicks, some don't. Simple as that.
While I won't say it was Last Minute, I could see Steve being First in line to be Playable, but his Gimmick of Representing Minecraft was a Task That Sakurai and the Team had trouble implementing at the Time. I could see Banjo taking what was supposed to be Steve's Place




Also On Reimu, One thing I'm thinking about is that along with her having perhaps having trouble transitioning to Smash and Being Balanced relative to the Cast (Touhou is Primiarily Aerial Based with lost of Projectiles, that will be a Pain to Balance), Wouldn't she also take more Time because Reimu would need Completely new 3D Model, and Same goes for all of the Supporting case (if there are background cameos) and also the Shrine would need to be completely modeled?

I do believe some fangames have 3D Models, So I Don't know with this
 

TheTuninator

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zferolie

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so there is a new Indie smash game on Kickstarter right now, and its looking quite good. Everyone is wondering if Shantae will pop in there... but think Reimu could?

 

Commander_Alph

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She could be DLC :)

For real, this game heavily focused on western indie and flash game so Reimu would have been their least prioritize character.
 
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zferolie

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She could be DLC :)

For real, this game heavily focused on western indie and flash game so Reimu would have been their least prioritize character.
yeah its more western indies but that would be a cool addition. West and west working together
 

Sc_Ev0lution

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so there is a new Indie smash game on Kickstarter right now, and its looking quite good. Everyone is wondering if Shantae will pop in there... but think Reimu could?

I doubt it. The focus is clearly on Western indie games. But either way it doesn't really matter, since day one you'll be able to mod every Touhou character into the game. Plus, it won't be coming out for, like, 2 years, we'll probably have a Touhou 18 by then. This is very back burner.
 

Commander_Alph

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Speaking of which, I'm really interested in the gameplay of Goyouko Ibun or Touhou 17.5 and how it's a literal 2D Platformer just like Shovel Knight and Shantae. I'm happy that Twilight Frontier and ZUN make an entry that is casual friendly to newcomer, I can't say that Touhou 17.5 should also be released on Switch.

I still don't know if the game difficulty is on par to something like MegaMan.
 
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SharkLord

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so there is a new Indie smash game on Kickstarter right now, and its looking quite good. Everyone is wondering if Shantae will pop in there... but think Reimu could?

I'm thinking the team might prioritize Western indies for now, since those are a bit easier to access thanks to the lack of language barrier. Maybe they'll go for an indie from the other side of the Pacific later on.
 
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