Show Me Ya Gimps! Pit General Disc.

[Strong Badam]

how the **** is this character supposed to beat fox god dammit armada stop cheating

 

[Phoenix502]

while we're asking for help against characters, I could use help figuring out how to effectively keep Luigi at bay... Arrows can stop him from sliding, and jabs help if he's still sliding at me, but when there's platforms involved, I can't aim very well, so he'll often get in close and around the usual guards... and then there's the Luigi cyclone... gah

how in the WORLD does one keep this oil footed plumber still?

and on an unrelated note, why is nintendo so stubborn in giving this "obviously superior character to Mario" confidence problems... this guy needs an intervention, badly

 

[Nguz95]

It sells. Simple as that.

Luigi is my favorite mario character tho.

 

[Player -0]

Don't forget as Pit you don't need to stay still, you have a ton of mobility options. So vs. Luigi you can put pressure/retreat, you can use platform to your advantage by jumping out of WoI to a waveland. Luigi should have trouble chasing you down because of the combination of arrows + mobility.

 

[otter]

I dunno 3.0 Mario is pretty OP

 

[Sharkz]

Just got done with another tournament. Got 5th again but was hoping to make top three. I lost to a Mario in winner's semis (dang, he's so tough to punish) and the same TL I lost to before. I've really got to learn that mu. I have the hardest time approaching.
Won a really close match vs a Charizard. That mu was a lot harder than I thought. It's not easy to have consecutive hits on him. He's a lot lighter than I previously thought.

 

[Phoenix502]

Don't forget as Pit you don't need to stay still, you have a ton of mobility options. So vs. Luigi you can put pressure/retreat, you can use platform to your advantage by jumping out of WoI to a waveland. Luigi should have trouble chasing you down because of the combination of arrows + mobility.

Arrows can only do so much, and just playing keep away gets tougher the longer you do it. and by the way I wasn't meaning how to keep Pit Still, I have lousy aim with arrows, so i meant how do you keep Luigi still for just long enough to do some respectable damage...

Meanwhile, what are some ideas for dealing with Lucario? I'm used to shielding when rolling isn't a smart option, but because of Force Palm being a command grab at point blank, that reflex gets me wrecked. Arrows can keep the distance a little bit, but besides that and mirror shield when an aura sphere/bomb is coming, I'm not sure what to look out for.

 

[Nguz95]

Try up-b oos and wavedash oos. Those two will help you alleviate pressure big time.

 

[Sharkz]

Try up-b oos and wavedash oos. Those two will help you alleviate pressure big time.

This is something I need to experiment with a lot more. I guess it scares me because it can be punished with nearly anything if you whiff. My training partner uses Lucas and when he traps me with dair pressure I should try that out.
But why should I use up oos instead of usmash oos?

 

[Nguz95]

I didn't think about usmash, but i know it has more cooldown than up-b does.

 

[otter]

Up B oos whiffs alot for me,

 

[Nguz95]

i don't think it has a lot of horizontal range. Who knows, maybe the usmash is better.

 

[FrootLoop]

me having no answer to laser:

WF: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNh4-yAIIS4
LF: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CfpNk1zEGk
GF: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERqDj7WpR4U

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

Dood
How do I get up B to kill!!!?

I was playing against a Marth today, we were on the warioware stage. I got him around the top platform, I uair'd and up B'd him around 100ish% I don't remember the percent exactly, but anyway, he didn't die. WAT DA SHEZ!!

 

[Player -0]

Arrows can only do so much, and just playing keep away gets tougher the longer you do it. and by the way I wasn't meaning how to keep Pit Still, I have lousy aim with arrows, so i meant how do you keep Luigi still for just long enough to do some respectable damage...

Meanwhile, what are some ideas for dealing with Lucario? I'm used to shielding when rolling isn't a smart option, but because of Force Palm being a command grab at point blank, that reflex gets me wrecked. Arrows can keep the distance a little bit, but besides that and mirror shield when an aura sphere/bomb is coming, I'm not sure what to look out for.

You don't really have to play keep away the whole game, if he's rushing in that's a prime candidate for some SHFFL nair, just don't get up smashed. You can retreat back with WoI then do some ground stuff.

If you're just spamming arrows at ground level it'll break up his wavedash distance so he'll have to WD OoS or jump over them, then once he gets close you can kind of play like Jiggz?

Just giving some suggestions.

 

[Sharkz]

Dood
How do I get up B to kill!!!?

I was playing against a Marth today, we were on the warioware stage. I got him around the top platform, I uair'd and up B'd him around 100ish% I don't remember the percent exactly, but anyway, he didn't die. WAT DA SHEZ!!

You have to sweetspot it. If you barely hit him, they will not die. You have to be right below the character to use it. Easiest to sweetspot when the opponent is around 90% and you dthrow. When they get around 120% I usually give up using it for the kill because it's much harder to sweetspot since they fly higher.

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

You have to sweetspot it. If you barely hit him, they will not die. You have to be right below the character to use it. Easiest to sweetspot when the opponent is around 90% and you dthrow. When they get around 120% I usually give up using it for the kill because it's much harder to sweetspot since they fly higher.

When does it start to kill % wise? And since I've haven't been able to sweet spot it yet, does that just send the person straight up?

 

[Sharkz]

When does it start to kill % wise? And since I've haven't been able to sweet spot it yet, does that just send the person straight up?

It looks the exact same, you can just tell it's not sweetspotted because the knockback is much weaker. (I guess sweetspot would be the right word to use) I usually can get a dthrow>upb kill in the mid-90%'s. Of course, it depends on the character though, and nearly everyone can DI out of it. Most of my up-b kills usually come after uair, but you can't be overzealous with it.

 

[Phoenix502]

You don't really have to play keep away the whole game, if he's rushing in that's a prime candidate for some SHFFL nair, just don't get up smashed. You can retreat back with WoI then do some ground stuff.

If you're just spamming arrows at ground level it'll break up his wavedash distance so he'll have to WD OoS or jump over them, then once he gets close you can kind of play like Jiggz?

Just giving some suggestions.

hmm... I'll keep those in mind.

what would you know about Lucario? @ Nguz95 mentioned that you can try wavedash or UpB out of shield to shake him off, but I don't wavedash like most others (waveland, sure, but I can't wavedash consistently enough to be reliable for me), and UpB is a bit point blank for it to hit...

any general ideas?

 

[Nguz95]

Wavedash out of shield is actually huge. I would definitely recommend you try to implement that as much as possible.

Lucario is fairly one-dimensional in the neutral game. He has only a few approach options (fair, dash attack, etc.) and all of them are pretty poor unless they make contact with you or your shield. That means Lucario places a premium on hitting something. For Pit, or any other character for that matter, avoiding contact with Lucario is very important. For Pit specifically, that means firing a lot of arrows at long range to goad Lucario into approaching, and then punishing him with your disjointed moves (fair, ftilt, whatever). Alternatively, you can take the offensive, and body Lucario with pressure, as Lucario's defensive options are notoriously poor. If you do find yourself getting hit by Lucario a lot, try crouch-canceling his moves. Pit has an excellent dtitl/dsmash, and Lucario's hits have poor priority in comparison. You'll find that it's much easier to escape Lucario's combs strings if you're crouching.

 

[otter]

Dood
How do I get up B to kill!!!?

I was playing against a Marth today, we were on the warioware stage. I got him around the top platform, I uair'd and up B'd him around 100ish% I don't remember the percent exactly, but anyway, he didn't die. WAT DA SHEZ!!

keep in mind you have to activate up b in the air to get the killing "version". I know you were in this example but just something to keep in mind. On the ground, your trade knockback for invincibility.

 

[bksbestbwoy]

Hello guys, newbie Project M Pit player here. I was playing a lot of him in vBrawl in the past but definitely bumped him up to "main" after Apex. At the same time, I realize that in the past month or so of me playing the game more regularly, my Marth (trademark character since 2001) and my Fox (recent pickup) are both getting better at a more rapid rate. With that said, what things/techs are most important to learn or get a grasp of while playing Pit?

 

[5-oNe]

DO NOT CROUCH CANCEL LUCARIO! if this person is any good they will eat that alive.it would be the worst option because you are also forcing yourself into his combos by ccing and u wouldnt di out of them.just stay out of your shield.if you get hit then di away.

 

[Sharkz]

DO NOT CROUCH CANCEL LUCARIO! if this person is any good they will eat that alive.it would be the worst option because you are also forcing yourself into his combos by ccing and u wouldnt di out of them.just stay out of your shield.if you get hit then di away.

Yeah, if a Lucario catches you crouch cancelling, prepare to eat usmashes for days. Won't take long to rack up a ton of damage on you.

 

[Conti]

So curious? How many of you have played Pit since brawl came out? He was my original main xD...
Anyways hi im Conti and i love pit <3 I'm am above average smash player for my area, [i top every local in my county and consistently win or 2nd place choke brawl and i am just starting to get into P:M] but im not really on the map in terms of the smash community, getting as good as top players and going to real events [but thats changing :D] Even when he was bad with Brawl i still played him and won against about everyone locally [i loved beatin MKs xD] with him because i love him as a character. With that being said honestly the P:M rework in my personal opinion has put him AT LEAST in the Top5 on Tiers for P:M. But yet Armada is the only person who is consistently Winning/Topping with him in the competitive scene, and only because he is an extremely talented player and is learning a new character with alot of potential that noone understands how to fight yet. The worst part is Armada in my opinion is only at maybe 50% in terms of fully using pit. He is creating the Pit Metagame and doesnt even realize he is the Ken of Pit for P:M. From the DthrowCG Tech chases, Dair low percent shuffle combos, and so much more. He is creating pit, ivebeen watching low level players after pit, The "Armada" [Dthrow, to double Fair, WaveDash Grab Dthrow Fair fair Arrow Fair] is starting to become a standard combo for pit.
I really want to see Pit break this game, he has so much I'm still learning. But i feel i have a couple ATs/Discoverys that may or not be known to public, its simple information but i feel extremely useful interms of Pits MetaGame and i feel if players like Armada or anyone else on a top level with Pit, can master some of these techs Pit will definately not just be a gimmick in peoples eyes and be truely considered a top threat of P:M.

Anyways, Curious, how many of you are utilizing ArrowLooping? they made it very viable in P:M because of the speed and angle increase. When you get good at it, it can create very good situational mindgames, [you dont spam arrow loops, its a mix up]. Ive shot arrows and have them come straight down thru platforms or go horizontal, seeing how arrows = combos i highly advice people should start picking up this simple tech. You can catch people off guard easily [especially when the arrow goes offscreen because you are somewhat close to an approaching oppenent] Its a practice makes perfect type of thing so give it a try.

Arrows are shot and u control it at a 45degree behind on the stick [example: shoot an arrow, u tap Directly up and it goes 45degrees up and right, then if u go up/left on Control stick it goes straight up and u follow the motion, getting good at feeling where the arrow is shooting from the 45degrees is what takes time, [for me its simple because ive played pit for years]

Next thing i want to see P:M Pits doing is utilizing "Wing Renewal" a brawl AT that they worked into pits Side-B. If you Side-B off the ground jump out of it you can get a 2nd Side-B, compaired to just using it in air and only having 1 Side-B. Running to chase a gimp is slightly more efficient [or atleast thats what i see Armada do], but if say its jiggly or someone who is reallly far off stage but has a chance of recovering, instead of wasting one of your 3 jumps to position to get there, just Grounded-SideB to where u need to go, then gimp and use ur 3 jumps and still have a side b to come back. Its yet again situational but people need to start doing it.

Another AT i see noone doing is WaveLanding out of pits Glide. Pits glide has many outs, From jump cancling, to ariels, Glide attack, hitting b to have that laggy get out, but one out noone is utilizing [because its hard honestly] is WavedashLanding out of the Glide.

If ur gliding and u try to wavedashland, normally if ur at ur usual SH height or whatever, it will just look like a crappy fail wavedash airdodge into the ground bs, but If you glide then see an opprotunity to waveland, you must tap down on the glide, as Pits face is about to touch the floor you can put in a wavedash input and you will waveland whichever direction. It looks quite sick kinda like a boosted waveland type of thing. Its good if you see urself getting caught and see a safe landing spot.

I have a couple other ATs and things but i wanna make sure they are legit and useful before i post and make myself sound stupid.
Hope this was useful and honestly there should be a Pit Guide thread with ATs and stuff.
Thanks - Conti

 

[FrootLoop]

Arrow looping is basically useless. It should always be better to fight for position instead.

Gliding in neutral is probably bad unless you're just outspeeding an absurdly slow character. It makes your position telegraphed without really giving more options except maybe surprise.

Double glide is probably fine as long as you're careful to never over extend, but if you don't overextend I'm not sure how threatening you actually are so I prefer standing at the edge and spamming arrows.

I think Pit's top 10, certainly out of top 5.

Loads of characters have low representation just because of scene size & increased viable character pool.

 

[Sar]

So what are the advantages of using glide attack? If/when is it better to use it instead of fair out of glide?

 

[Player -0]

I believe Glide attack sends your opponent vertically.

It has a sweeping hitbox under Pit but I think the real question is when should you use Dair vs. Glide attack.

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

I like dair as a everything.

 

[Conti]

Arrow looping is basically useless. It should always be better to fight for position instead.

Gliding in neutral is probably bad unless you're just outspeeding an absurdly slow character. It makes your position telegraphed without really giving more options except maybe surprise.

Double glide is probably fine as long as you're careful to never over extend, but if you don't overextend I'm not sure how threatening you actually are so I prefer standing at the edge and spamming arrows.

I think Pit's top 10, certainly out of top 5.

Loads of characters have low representation just because of scene size & increased viable character pool.

Well theres the complete disagreement i was looking for,
just because No1 knows how to properly utilize them is not a reason why you cant fight for position while keeping this AT in mind. they made arrow looping so easy and no1 is doing it, and if you get good at them, you can wavedash/roll, jump, and most importantly attack while arrow looping... i do but practice makes perfect i dont have it completely mastered.
Gliding is not as great as a dash jump but it is not bad, its situational for postioning in mind games, its better to use towards to ledge and not the stage [unless ur recovering obv] its in his moveset so why not use it to mix your movement up even more?, [example sometimes a glide approach on say, zelda you could go inbetween her dins fires cancle into an easy FF-Fair, [its comparable to why people would use marths dash to duck under attacks because it tightens up his hurtbox to more horizontal and not be as tall]. So an AT like the last one i mentioned could be useful if you missed your punish opprotunity from her side B and need a safe position to land and re position i think it is useful for people to know.
As for ur last statment, my example of optimal use of the AT is hitting them into to corners, being on the edge or doing a running SH Arrow, land-SideB immediately, then it becomes situational depending on where they are, but typically you just need one double jump to get the Fair K.O. but say its jiggs/kirby/peach/mewtwo/any1 who can stall in the air and they find a way to get out of it having those extra jumps make it easier to chase without overextending then just Uair/Up+B/Fair/Bair K.O. then side b to recover, Why not abuse something you can normally use 1 of when you can safely utilize it twice? Spamming arrows works, im just trying to idk, acknowledge a viable option.
It's funny i had this debate with someone when Diddy Kong in brawl on the very 1st tier list they had was considered to be top 10 [he was 10th], then he jumped to 2nd for a bit and now sits happily in 4th which is pretty much where he belonged [in the top 5]. I'm just saying, From seeing how this games meta is developing, Pit is completely underrated and i like i that way [he has tons of tools, combos, recovery options, Gimpablility and he is just solid], When he's considered Top i'll just laugh and say i said this months ago xD

As For Glide Attack, idk what to think of it either, at like 20-40 it seems useful, its just like brawl pit, it has slightly more range then your Fair, it swoops under weak sheilds, and it pops people horizontal and slightly up. [with the difference being, its terrible in terms of killing, brawl pits glide attack could k.o people]
I rarely use it, unless you see a fair wont connect but the glide will and you need to win a challenge, its kinda "yolo", And yeah Dair is just much better to use out of glide, but sometimes dair isnt an option.

 

[FrootLoop]

In an ideal world you could shoot an arrow and then engage your opponent as your arrows is looped back towards them and have the arrow positively influence your engagement. However, you need to react to your opponents actions/options and controlling the arrow with full mobility is unfeasible. It is certainly not worth the 'sitting duck' time it takes to fire an arrow where it's not traveling towards the opponent as a layer of defense.

Gliding may have extremely situational uses in neutral but Pit's air-to-ground is bad at least on paper so I'm not sure what those uses would even be. Gliding at Zelda is just asking to get kicked or otherwise slapped on the wrist (Neutral B/teleport).

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

Arrow loop like gallo guys, it's amazing.

 

[Player -0]

Too busy looping 50 arrows while taunting to pay attention to the other dood

Come at me bro.

 

[Sharkz]

If I could make one 'for fun' change with Pit, it would be that the further his arrow travels the more % damage it would do (knockback doesn't really matter). It'd make arrow looping just a bit more rewarding. Nothing's as depressing as hitting your opponent with a looped arrow and they take 0%. I never did understand the logic of losing percent damage the longer it has been out.

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

If I could make one 'for fun' change with Pit, it would be that the further his arrow travels the more % damage it would do (knockback doesn't really matter). It'd make arrow looping just a bit more rewarding. Nothing's as depressing as hitting your opponent with a looped arrow and they take 0%. I never did understand the logic of losing percent damage the longer it has been out.

I've been saying this 5ever dood
You and I, YOU AND ME, our brains probably look the same.

I think it would be a little bit better if it was like how it is now, but once they have gone so far, they start to scale up again. That way, you don't have people camping.

 

[Player -0]

Yeah, they would have to drop down in percent for at least the distance of Dracula's and then scale up or it would promote camping too much.

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

I rather them get the average distance it takes to loop an arrow and go from there.

 

[Conti]

In an ideal world you could shoot an arrow and then engage your opponent as your arrows is looped back towards them and have the arrow positively influence your engagement. However, you need to react to your opponents actions/options and controlling the arrow with full mobility is unfeasible. It is certainly not worth the 'sitting duck' time it takes to fire an arrow where it's not traveling towards the opponent as a layer of defense.

Gliding may have extremely situational uses in neutral but Pit's air-to-ground is bad at least on paper so I'm not sure what those uses would even be. Gliding at Zelda is just asking to get kicked or otherwise slapped on the wrist (Neutral B/teleport).

Well im practicing hard to be a part of that ideal world because this tech is part of my style, i dont abuse it, i use it in clutch situations as a mix up and im extremely accurate at doing it, perfect sheilds, grabs, FH/SH air with c stick while loopin, Smashs, the extremely rare roll/sidestep, wave dash when ur loop is in the lower part, theres so much going on... also there is the situation where u go for it, u realize its unsafe and u drop the arrow loop and position safely away or punish your opponent]. You disagree because you feel it leaves u open, but honestly, in my eyes as long as you react right to the situation its a safe option. And as for hitting my target [id say about 8 out of 10 arrows [from any positon on the map], i want 100% consistency].
As for zelda, its situational, you can get there before she can Side-B depending on posotioning, otherwise u just glide slightly up and Dair.
We have our disagreements sir, Yes regular arrow spam is standard and effective. but this is a Mix-Up and part of Pit's MetaGame which is what i want people to really understand.

 

[FrootLoop]

Just because you use it sparingly doesn't mean it's good. If you have to use it as some surprise weapon then it can't be that good since if it was that good you would be abusing it. Pit's main movement technique is dashdancing, which I think is good enough that arrow looping is not worth giving up dashdancing for. Do you have any examples of it's effectiveness at cutting off options?

Aren't arrows from above ruined on most stages anyway because they can't go down through platforms?

I think you're doing something very wrong if you're worried about zelda's side-b spam.

 

[Hinichii.ez.™]

Guys, like I said, watch gallo play pit. In his hands, arrow looping is 100% viable. He loops his arrow while he is attacking/whatever and if you don't pay attention, you wouldn't even know he was controlling an arrow at times.