Should marijuana be legal? Formerly: Why not ban tobacco?

[Vorguen]

First off, if anyone has read what I am saying, I am implying that I don't believe that all criminals are doing something wrong. Why do you think I keep advocating the decriminalization of marijuana? Because the young people smoking it are not doing anything wrong. The people selling them, the people killing, stealing, and instilling fear in others over it are. What I am saying is these people shouldn't be allowed loose. The teenager smoking marijuana in his basement, should be ignored. If you read my arguments correctly most of the rebutals are implying that I want God to come down in a chariot and punish all infidels, which is not true. The countries laws tend to be very utilitarian and ignoring the needs and rights of many small groups.

 

[Crimson King]

So, let me ask you, how many people do you think are going to get blazed, and then stay at home the entire time? Probably not very many. I'm sorry, but your arguments are all completely backed by the whole, "OH WELL ALCOHOL IS LEGAL WHY CAN'T WEED BE", which, to be frank, isn't a legitimate argument at all.

First, stop posting in this room.

Second, his argument is perfectly valid. If people leave their homes while high and drive, then they are up for prosecution. Roads are publicly owned, ie, the government owns them, and part of the contract that is actually signed by you as a citizen is to agree to follow all laws set forth by the government. So, if you drive on their road, while intoxicated, you are violating their rules of their property, and you will be penalized. Simple. As. That.

Alcohol kills more people than marijuana, directly. So, if it is legal, there is no reason for weed to be.

I imagine there'll be plenty of conflict when students get caught with drugs during school, it'll be beyond easy to obtain. If they did legalize marijuana, they'd have to put an age limit on it anyway. If not, someone will sue.

You act like illegalizing something makes it impossible to get. As I stated before, when something is illegal, demand for it will increase because it is not easy to get. When I turned 21, my desire to drink decreased because it wasn't something that was actually hard to get. When I want alcohol, I can get it, and when I drink it now, I don't have a limited supply reliant on someone else getting it for me, so I am less likely to drink myself towards intoxication. In countries where weed is decriminalized, smoking of it isn't nearly as rampant as here because people grew up with it and they get no added thrill from it.

 

[t3h n00b]

Alcohol kills more people than marijuana, directly. So, if it is legal, there is no reason for weed to be.

Who is to say that the reason why alcohol is responsible for more deaths isn't due to it being legal and widely available? I'd be willing to bet there are far more people who drink than those who use marijuana.

 

[ArcPoint]

Crap, I got nothing against the decriminalization of drugs >_> It's been proven to work, it takes some of the glamor out of them, moves it from the black market to the public market, there's more supply. Price goes down, people don't have to kill over addictions... And it is their own body. Anything you can commit while being high you can also commit during the influence of alcohol. My only concern would be the ordeal over the highly addictive drugs (methamphetamine). But the argument that it's their own body still applies. Take responsibility for what you do to it.

 

[t3h n00b]

I'm in no way saying tobacco is necessarily more harmful than illegal drugs, but do you guys think that it is smoked in a social manner? For example, people drink with friends and often get high with friends. But smoking, to me, seems to be a fairly antisocial behavior. It's not realistic, but would it be more beneficial to a country to ban tobacco and legalize marijuana at a certain age?

 

[Crimson King]

Who is to say that the reason why alcohol is responsible for more deaths isn't due to it being legal and widely available? I'd be willing to bet there are far more people who drink than those who use marijuana.

There was a study that showed people who died from alcohol poisoning were around 19 - 20 because they just entered college, and they were trying to fit in.

 

[.Marik]

It's fine how it is. If the United States government decided to outlaw tobacco, (or any other country for that matter) it would only become like current illegal substances, and be mass-produced by people trying to make a quick buck. They'll be illegally grown in abandoned houses, closets, and anywhere that people can find.

This is something that can only be limited. It's best to just leave it alone.

I agree with this.

You realise that the U.S. had a prohibition alcohol before? It only resulted in riots and illegal distributions of the substance. Alcohol and cigarettes can be closely compared because they both have the same addictive effects towards people. If tobacco becomes banned then the same result will happen all over again. Since it would be illegal anyway to distribute to anyone, what wouldn't stop the spread of the drug being used to a younger audience?

My opinion just leave things the way they are. I know that it is bad but there are people who are highly addicted to cigarettes. They won't give up their drug of choice without a fight.

This is a very good article to read about how prohibition effected America.

http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=1017

Again, I agree with the above statement. It would only cause problems, and set a boundary which people will certantly overcome, in an illegal manner.

What about cases like Meth? Where the narcotic in question is HIGHLY addictive?.

That's what I don't understand. Meth kills. So it's outlawed. Weed is virtually harmless compared to other substances which are legal, yet it's illegal? It's all about profit, these harmful, yet legal, substances.

I agree with the above post.

However, it's all a business. Government need money? Let's put more taxes on tobacco. Tobacco is a large source of the government's profit which keeps us tax-payers from having to pay more.

Sadly, that's why they are still legal. More profit for the economy. Especially the Government.

 

[yummynbeefy]

Your a mod, you can do it.

But by this logic, weed should be legal. I think weed should be legal actually if tobacco and alcohol is. Those actually damage the body. Weed is in no way bad compared to those. imo

its bad just not as bad

seriously the only thing the government cares about nowadays is making money the reason marajuana is illegal is because they cant tax it in any way and youll hear them claim its because its a gateway drug and its far worse than cigarettes WRONG!
weed isnt very addictive weed doesnt have nicotine weed wasnt made for people to get addicted to it, people have smoked weed since man kind has known how to get it
cigarettes were made by greedy people who wanted to get rich quick off of a chemical and the only reason they are still in business is because of millions of dollars in donations to the government

 

[Cheapless Jared]

its bad just not as bad

seriously the only thing the government cares about nowadays is making money the reason marajuana is illegal is because they cant tax it in any way and youll hear them claim its because its a gateway drug and its far worse than cigarettes WRONG!
weed isnt very addictive weed doesnt have nicotine weed wasnt made for people to get addicted to it, people have smoked weed since man kind has known how to get it
cigarettes were made by greedy people who wanted to get rich quick off of a chemical and the only reason they are still in business is because of millions of dollars in donations to the government

Using drugs ultimitely leads to a stupider america, and a reason the government doesn't make it legal is because drugs lead to violence. People are afraid they will get stolen from them, so they carry around guns with them. Much more gun violence, and gangs occur from this. Then because of all the gangs and violence, the hospitals have to heal more people, costing much more. And this new universal health plan would make that much harder to keep up with.

 

[t3h n00b]

Using drugs ultimitely leads to a stupider america, and a reason the government doesn't make it legal is because drugs lead to violence. People are afraid they will get stolen from them, so they carry around guns with them. Much more gun violence, and gangs occur from this. Then because of all the gangs and violence, the hospitals have to heal more people, costing much more. And this new universal health plan would make that much harder to keep up with.

Universal health plan? I don't think it will be quite as confusing as you make it out to be, but I guess none of us really knows about the health plan right now. Correct me if I'm wrong. And all the drugs leading to violence stuff, that is going on now. If marijuana is legalized, there will still be these problems, but perhaps to a lesser degree, since supply would be more plentiful, and prices could feasibly go down.

 

[Cheapless Jared]

Universal health plan? I don't think it will be quite as confusing as you make it out to be, but I guess none of us really knows about the health plan right now. Correct me if I'm wrong. And all the drugs leading to violence stuff, that is going on now. If marijuana is legalized, there will still be these problems, but perhaps to a lesser degree, since supply would be more plentiful, and prices could feasibly go down.

The universal health plan is something obama is going to (vainly) attempt to make. But, if drugs are more quantative, it would result in an increase of people who are high doing things that could depend on a very important decision. I don't think that if I had a 10 year old son, I'd be very gracious of him being taught by a high teacher.

 

[t3h n00b]

The universal health plan is something obama is going to (vainly) attempt to make. But, if drugs are more quantative, it would result in an increase of people who are high doing things that could depend on a very important decision. I don't think that if I had a 10 year old son, I'd be very gracious of him being taught by a high teacher.

That's fair. So do you think marijuana should stay as it is now, or that it should be legalized with restrictions (no driving, not on the job, etc.)?

 

[Cheapless Jared]

That's fair. So do you think marijuana should stay as it is now, or that it should be legalized with restrictions (no driving, not on the job, etc.)?

I am definitely against the use f any type of drug for the affects it has on people are severe. It can make people lose rationality and go bezerk on any situation if the use of marijuana is frequent. Granted, this is the same side effect for alchohaul abuse, but with marijuana, the effects are more imminent. They impair thoughts and cause larger problems in the U.S.

 

[RDK]

I am definitely against the use f any type of drug for the affects it has on people are severe. It can make people lose rationality and go bezerk on any situation if the use of marijuana is frequent. Granted, this is the same side effect for alchohaul abuse, but with marijuana, the effects are more imminent. They impair thoughts and cause larger problems in the U.S.

I'm sorry, but this ^ is absolutely ********.

When was the last time you heard of someone dying due to a marijuana-related accident? Deaths due to alcohol use are obscenely high and growing every year, but for some reason the government sees the need to tell me which poisons I can and can't use recreationally.

Using drugs leads to a stupider America? Are you blind? America is already stupid. The only thing that is accomplished by making drugs like marijuana illegal is forcing people to sneak around to do something they should, by all rights, be able to do freely. I don't like being made into a no-good, pot-smoking criminal by the government, when I'm just another contributing member of society. It's not right.

Point being that it's not the government's job to tell me what I can and can't do to my body. They don't dress and feed me, so why should they worry about my health? And even that's beside the point--in moderation, marijuana is safer than both alcohol and tobacco. This business about people "going berserk" is ridiculous, and if you're going to use such crackpot arguments, then you need to come up with some sources.

 

[Cheapless Jared]

Now I am quoting this,

"(5) Samantha ^and Julians my Brother says:
Tobacco kills about 400,000
Alcohol kills about 80,000
Workplace accidents kill 60,000
Automobiles kill 40,000
Cocaine kills about 2,500
Heroin kills about 2,000
Aspirin kills about 2,000
Marijuana kills 0
There has never been a recorded death due to marijuana at any time in US history.

All illegal drugs combined kill under 20,000 per year, or a small percent of the number killed by alcohol and tobacco.

Tobacco kills more people each year than all of the people killed by all of the illegal drugs in the last one hundred years.

——————————————————————————–

From The National Center On Addiction And Substance Abuse at Columbia University.

All YOU FOOLS WHO WRITE ******** STUFF LIKE THIS HAVENT SMOKED wEED!"

http://alcoholism.about.com/b/2003/11/02/marijuana-causes-many-deaths-reported-as-accidents.htm

I did say stupider, and in the state our country is in right now, that would be bad. You really think that smoking marijuana will do absolutely no harm? It kills your brain cells, damages almost every single organ in your body, and all of that just for a momentary high? The only reason people like it is so that they can get high, while enjoying an early death. This kid on my bus smokes and does drugs. No body likes him, and he smells like the devils backed up toilet. He says that he smokes and does drugs due to stress, but I can understand that. What others don't understand is that it will make you more stressful, having to purchase it, and damaging your body.

 

[RDK]

Now I am quoting this,

"(5) Samantha ^and Julians my Brother says:
Tobacco kills about 400,000
Alcohol kills about 80,000
Workplace accidents kill 60,000
Automobiles kill 40,000
Cocaine kills about 2,500
Heroin kills about 2,000
Aspirin kills about 2,000
Marijuana kills 0
There has never been a recorded death due to marijuana at any time in US history.

All illegal drugs combined kill under 20,000 per year, or a small percent of the number killed by alcohol and tobacco.

Tobacco kills more people each year than all of the people killed by all of the illegal drugs in the last one hundred years.

——————————————————————————–

From The National Center On Addiction And Substance Abuse at Columbia University.

All YOU FOOLS WHO WRITE ******** STUFF LIKE THIS HAVENT SMOKED wEED!"

http://alcoholism.about.com/b/2003/11/02/marijuana-causes-many-deaths-reported-as-accidents.htm

I did say stupider, and in the state our country is in right now, that would be bad. You really think that smoking marijuana will do absolutely no harm? It kills your brain cells, damages almost every single organ in your body, and all of that just for a momentary high? The only reason people like it is so that they can get high, while enjoying an early death. This kid on my bus smokes and does drugs. No body likes him, and he smells like the devils backed up toilet. He says that he smokes and does drugs due to stress, but I can understand that. What others don't understand is that it will make you more stressful, having to purchase it, and damaging your body.

First of all, the sources you used directly contradict your stance.

Second of all, nobody cares about that kid on your bus. He does not represent every pot smoker, and you probably don't even know if he actually smokes pot, or some other nasty drug. We're talking about marijuana, not marijuana and acid, and cocaine, etc.

Thirdly, I smoke marijuana, and know people that do, and not once has my health ever taken a hit from using it, even though I don't overdo it like some people might. That being said, anything taken in excess is bad for you--alcohol and tobacco even more so than pot. Tests show that when taken responsibly, marijuana has limited temporary effects on the brain, and nothing more.

Not only does marijuana not kill brain cells (in moderation), but some tests show that it may actually increases development of the brain. What marijuana does is block, or mimic, neurotransmitters that bind neurons together in the hippocampus. Depending on the THC to CBD ratio of the pot strain, it can positively effect the calcium levels of cell mitochondria.

Here's a link:

http://www.physorg.com/news154280470.html

Please know what you're talking about next time.

 

[Crimson King]

Now I am quoting this,

"(5) Samantha ^and Julians my Brother says:
Tobacco kills about 400,000
Alcohol kills about 80,000
Workplace accidents kill 60,000
Automobiles kill 40,000
Cocaine kills about 2,500
Heroin kills about 2,000
Aspirin kills about 2,000
Marijuana kills 0
There has never been a recorded death due to marijuana at any time in US history.

All illegal drugs combined kill under 20,000 per year, or a small percent of the number killed by alcohol and tobacco.

Tobacco kills more people each year than all of the people killed by all of the illegal drugs in the last one hundred years.

——————————————————————————–

From The National Center On Addiction And Substance Abuse at Columbia University.

All YOU FOOLS WHO WRITE ******** STUFF LIKE THIS HAVENT SMOKED wEED!"

http://alcoholism.about.com/b/2003/11/02/marijuana-causes-many-deaths-reported-as-accidents.htm

I did say stupider, and in the state our country is in right now, that would be bad. You really think that smoking marijuana will do absolutely no harm? It kills your brain cells, damages almost every single organ in your body, and all of that just for a momentary high? The only reason people like it is so that they can get high, while enjoying an early death. This kid on my bus smokes and does drugs. No body likes him, and he smells like the devils backed up toilet. He says that he smokes and does drugs due to stress, but I can understand that. What others don't understand is that it will make you more stressful, having to purchase it, and damaging your body.

You logic here is just wrong. Marijuana kills NO ONE, which your statistics state, but then you say it kills brain cells and leads you to an early death. Um... what?

Excessive usage of ANYTHING will lead to an early death. Go eat 20 hamburgers and see what happens. Likely, if you smoke a few kilos of weed, you will not be well. At the same time, if you smoke daily, you will not be in as good a shape as people who aren't - you are smoking a substance. But the point is, none of that ****ing matters. It is legal to drink yourself to death, but it is illegal to get high. It is legal to smoke cigarettes, which are PROVEN to actually stop oxygen transfer in the lungs, but it is illegal to smoke weed, which doesn't have this property.

I'm not going to smoke weed anytime soon, but the fact is there should be no reason I shouldn't be allowed to. Drug laws are just the government saying "don't do that," without giving a clear, logical example.

 

[Cheapless Jared]

I'm not going to smoke weed anytime soon, but the fact is there should be no reason I shouldn't be allowed to. Drug laws are just the government saying "don't do that," without giving a clear, logical example.

Why aren't you going to do weed? It ****s up your body of course. If someone wants to do that, I suppose I have no controll over that. Marijuana is illegal, and it's illegal just because it's bad. Now, everyone does it. I think some people just want to know that they are able to. As you stated previously Crimson King.

And actually, people don't care about that kid on my bus. He might not represent every smoker, but he definitely represents a massive faction. I know not 1 user of marijuana who is the least bit succesful. I'm only in the middle school however, so I need to get to the high school to find someone who does weed and is a genious.

 

[t3h n00b]

Why aren't you going to do weed? It ****s up your body of course. If someone wants to do that, I suppose I have no controll over that. Marijuana is illegal, and it's illegal just because it's bad. Now, everyone does it. I think some people just want to know that they are able to. As you stated previously Crimson King.

And actually, people don't care about that kid on my bus. He might not represent every smoker, but he definitely represents a massive faction. I know not 1 user of marijuana who is the least bit succesful. I'm only in the middle school however, so I need to get to the high school to find someone who does weed and is a genious.

I don't understand. I don't do weed. And say even half the people in the America do it, which I think is very unlikely, okay- so doesn't that mean that the illegalization of marijuana hasn't really deterred people from using it? That is why a lot of people think that legalizing it would be a good idea: it's already being sold and used, but if it was made legal, prices would feasibly go down, and there will be less violence associated with the drug trade, or at least that's what it seems like to me. Also, the troubled government could make money off of it. But your argument against legalizing it is that you don't know a successful marijuana user? Michael Vick. Michael Phelps. I'm sure countless musicians. Either way, if weed was legal, it's not like anyone has to do it, it just makes it safer, easier, and possibly cheaper for those who do so already.

 

[Cheapless Jared]

If it does get legalized, would you let your children near it.

 

[t3h n00b]

I think that will be some provisions if marijuana is legalized, so that people under a certain age don't do it, and you can't drive while high. Or at least things like that would make sense to me. And I'm not even necessarily saying 21, but obviously you don't want a ten-year-old getting high. I'm in high school, and obviously don't have children, but if it was legal, I wouldn't let my children near it until whatever age it was allowed at, then I'd discourage them not to use it, but what it comes down to is personal choice. Say I have a child and I don't let them touch that stuff. Eventually, they will move out and have the decision to use or not use marijuana completely up to them. This same dynamic will occur whether marijuana is legal or not, with minor differences that I explained in my previous post.

 

[Cheapless Jared]

I think that will be some provisions if marijuana is legalized, so that people under a certain age don't do it, and you can't drive while high. Or at least things like that would make sense to me. And I'm not even necessarily saying 21, but obviously you don't want a ten-year-old getting high. I'm in high school, and obviously don't have children, but if it was legal, I wouldn't let my children near it until whatever age it was allowed at, then I'd discourage them not to use it, but what it comes down to is personal choice. Say I have a child and I don't let them touch that stuff. Eventually, they will move out and have the decision to use or not use marijuana completely up to them. This same dynamic will occur whether marijuana is legal or not, with minor differences that I explained in my previous post.

This is making much more sense... You've inspired me to feel as though marijuana and weed should have the limits of both smoking and beer. If it's legalized, I think thats how it should go down.

 

[DFat2]

Marijuana smoke contains some of the same cancer-causing compounds as tobacco, sometimes in higher concentrations. Someone who smokes 1 to 3 joints can produce the same lung damage and potential cancer risk as smoking five times as many cigarettes.

Regardless of the THC content, the amount of tar inhaled by marijuana smokers and the level of carbon monoxide absorbed are three to five times greater than among tobacco smokers. This may be due to marijuana users inhaling more deeply and holding the smoke in the lungs.

* Marijuana is the most commonly used illicit drug in the United States.1

* The percentage of youth aged 12–17 indicating a great risk of smoking marijuana once a month remained unchanged between 1999 and 2000 (37.2% in 1999 and 37.7% in 2000).2

* Marijuana contains more than 400 chemicals, including most of the harmful substances found in tobacco smoke. Smoking one marijuana cigarette deposits about four times more tar into the lungs than a filtered tobacco cigarette.3

* Harvard University researchers report the risk of a heart attack is five times higher than usual in the hour after smoking marijuana.4

* The risk of using cocaine is estimated to be more than 104 times greater for those who have tried marijuana than for those who have never tried it.5

* Smoking marijuana can injure or destroy lung tissue. In fact, marijuana smoke contains 50–70% more of some cancer causing chemicals than does tobacco smoke.6

* Reaction time for motor skills, such as driving, is reduced by 41% after smoking one joint and is reduced 63% after smoking two joints.7

* There have been over 7,000 published scientific and medical studies documenting the damage that marijuana poses. Not one study has shown marijuana to be safe.7

Marijuana isn't as Harmless as you make it sound. Sure, in moderation, it can be used for increase in the development of the Brian. But, there are people that use it daily to get High. But, whats legal for someone is legal for every one. The law is no exception to no one.

If it's for medicinal purposes, I guess a prescription could work, but having Pot at Walgreens so Grandma could get Better only invites more Crimes. "Gimme all the Weed you Got and Some Skittles Biaaaaach!!". You can't honestly think that having a "Gate Way Effect" drug at a local drug store or a Big Chain one would be a good Idea.

0It's harmful towards the Brain, not just the lungs. Tobacco retains crucial oxygen that the Brain needs to function, but it does not Harm your Memory, Learning ability and Control of Your senses/emotions.

Know that that's the point of Smoking Weed, but I don't think you fully understand the Risks/Effects of Smoking Weed.

If a Bus driver smokes pot regularly, he's putting not only him, but his passengers. Besides, why legalize a drug that you're required to not have in your system while applying for a new Job?

I understand that you want to give people the option of doing what they want when it comes to their bodies and whatnot, but people are stupid enough to get high now and be sorry later. I choose to think that the The Goverment doesn't want you to have to be sorry about it.

If you go to a Corner and Buy it Illegally, it's probably because you need it for 'X' or 'Y' reason. How did you get addicted in the first place?

 

[yummynbeefy]

well the only reason i can think of for it to be illegal is because the government cant tax it

 

[GwJ]

I'm just stopping in. Marijuana is probably one of the least, if not the least, dangerous drug out there. The legality of it compared to tobacco, alcohol, cocaine, weed, etc... is mind my teenager usage of the word, ********. There is no reason to keep marijuana illegal, but keep alcohol and tobacco legal.

 

[Spire]

I've never abused Marijuana once, and despite being somewhat curious years ago, I chose not to because of the mass of fellow students and friends throwing their lives away with it, and over time, with bars, ecstasy, cocaine, shrooms, acid, heroin, angel dust, and even meth. I've seen all types of people abuse all types of drugs, some of which recovered, some of which are still abusing these substances, some of which disappeared off the face of the planet, and few that may be presumed dead.

It's a shame when people have to depend on toxins to stimulate enjoyment. Reveals some great insecurities that people have with themselves and their lives.

However, in order to harm drug trafficking, and furthermore, gang violence, marijuana should be legalized, but under the same, if not similar restrictions and laws that alcohol is subject to. If I'm not mistaken, marijuana is illegal only because it'd be difficult to tax people on it, since so many already grow the plant themselves.

 

[Xsyven]

Don't post in here.

 

[Eor]

Don't post in here.

 

[Crimson King]

Quick reminder: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=222772

This is a room for prospective members of the Debate Hall. I don't want this room to take the main Debate Hall's place, so don't post in here.