Sheik (semi) confirmed

[The Real Gamer]

With the influx of new Zelda pics we can now confirm the clear difference between her Din's Fire pose and her Transformation pose. We also have an idea of what her Phantom Knight pose might likely be.

Din's Fire wind up pose:

Spoiler

Transform/Sheik pose:

Spoiler

Take note of the different hand poses + the fact that Zelda directly faces the camera in her Transformation pose. Sure... It COULD be a new taunt, but why would she share the exact same pose as our favorite Sheikah? The answer should be pretty obvious at this point.

Sheik fans rejoice!

"So if it really is Zelda's Transformation pose, what's the deal with her Phantom Knight pose?"

Not sure exactly, but we know for sure it isn't the following:

1) Not Forward Tilt

Spoiler

2) Not Forward Smash

Spoiler

3) Not her side B (Din's Fire pics above)

So based on process of elimination I'm most likely sure it's her new grab animation while the Phantom Knight is an assist trophy. The lack of the Phantom Knight in the bottom pic below makes me think it was only present in the first pic to make it seem as though it was being summoned by Zelda cause we all know how much Sakurai loves to tease.

EDIT - Apparently the pose is likely to be Zelda's assist trophy summon animation! Refer to page 2. Either way this proves why Phantom Knight likely isn't a new move. Zelda seems to have retained most if not all of her Melee-inspired, OoT based moveset, and Sheik is a major part of that.

Spoiler

 

[Morbi]

How can something be semi-confirmed?

Edit- Also InB4 Impa.

 

[The Real Gamer]

How can something be semi-confirmed?

There's enough info to deduce that Sheik is most likely in the game, but just not officially.

Sort of like Captain Falcon since Sakurai talked about him in a recent interview, despite the fact that he hasn't been revealed yet.

 

[Morbi]

If this is truly the case, I am going to need to prepare my apology speech. I was so certain that Phantom wasn't an Assist Trophy, looks like it could be though. Unless they replaced Nayru's Love with Phantom. That would be ridiculous though, we already have Farore's Wind and Din's Fire.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Really hoping for Sheik's official confirmation soon, for a number of reasons. (mostly for just Sheik himself/herself)



Also isn't gonna be happy about this.

 

[Morbi]

Really hoping for Sheik's official confirmation soon.



Also isn't gonna be happy about this.

I also want official confirmation soon. I really want to see her new design, seeing as Zelda's bust was increased. No one will ever again speculate that Sheik is a man.

 

[The Real Gamer]

Ehh when it comes to a potential Skyward Sword character I'd much rather see Ghirahim than Impa, personally.

 

[TumblrFamous]

I think I feel the same way. I feel as if we have Farore's Wind and Din's Fire, Nayru's Love would have to be all but confirmed. It would be weird to change all of her OoT-based moveset, but I'm still a little skeptical. I mean, what is that pose she does in the Phantom pic?

 

[Sonicguy726]

It looks more like a taunt referencing sheik to me it just doesn't really look like she's transforming cause if she was there would be light around her also the top one looks like she's going into the sheik pose
(I still want impa)

 

[The Real Gamer]

It looks more like a taunt referencing sheik to me it just doesn't really look like she's transforming also the top one looks like she's going into the sheik pose
(I still want impa)

The top pic is most definitely Din's Fire

I mean, what is that pose she does in the Phantom pic?

I'd guess it's her new grab animation and the Phantom Knight is merely an AT.

 

[The Real Gamer]

Just added why her Phantom Knight pose is most likely her new grab animation in the OP.

 

[HylianHeroBigBoss]

Um is that pose even from Zelda's transformation? It just looks like sheiks taunt, and normally by the time Zelda's starting her transformation there is far more light than that all over. Sorry but I don't think this proves a thing yet, not that I doubt sheik I know sakurai is a sucker for tradition and many fans fear change so I still believe sheik will be back regardless.

 

[The Real Gamer]

Um is that pose even from Zelda's transformation? It just looks like sheiks taunt, and normally by the time Zelda's starting her transformation there is far more light than that all over. Sorry but I don't think this proves a thing yet, not that I doubt sheik I know sakurai is a sucker for tradition and many fans fear change so I still believe sheik will be back regardless.

1) That isn't Sheik's taunt pose, it's her Brawl pose.

2) The Transform animation likely changed. It was changed from Melee to Brawl so there's no reason to suspect it wouldn't be changed from Brawl to Smash 4. Her new "Phantom Knight" pose demonstrates Zelda's moveset/animation clearly have been tweaked so there's no reason to believe her Transform animation wasn't changed as well.

 

[Sonicguy726]

1) That isn't Sheik's taunt pose, it's her Brawl pose.

2) The Transform animation likely changed. It was changed from Melee to Brawl so there's no reason to suspect it wouldn't be changed from Brawl to Smash 4. Her new "Phantom Knight" pose demonstrates Zelda's moveset/animation clearly have been tweaked so there's no reason to believe her Transform animation wasn't changed as well.

but she would probably be sparkling or covered in light or something to show that she is transforming

 

[The Real Gamer]

but she would probably be sparkling or covered in light or something to show that she is transforming

Not necessarily... In Melee at the very end of Zelda's transformation to Sheik she's barely sparkling at all. We're probably looking at the end of Sheik's transformation to Zelda which would explain the lack of glowing hands.

Either way it's a direct reference to Sheik since the pose was originally Sheik's alone in her Brawl Dojo pose. It's pretty obvious it's a tease/foreshadow.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Would be ****ty if true

 

[HylianHeroBigBoss]

1) That isn't Sheik's taunt pose, it's her Brawl pose.

2) The Transform animation likely changed. It was changed from Melee to Brawl so there's no reason to suspect it wouldn't be changed from Brawl to Smash 4. Her new "Phantom Knight" pose demonstrates Zelda's moveset/animation clearly have been tweaked so there's no reason to believe her Transform animation wasn't changed as well.

I forgot sheiks in game taunt was different, but in any case if that is sheiks artwork pose she's using I'd say that woul be a strike against her unless her and sheik shared that as a taunt.

And sure animations could be changed, but it could also be something different as well so your basis for that in her favor really isn't since we could assume it's another thing that got changed as well. There's simply not enough there to make that claim and even less with the possibility that they aren't using the same animation for transform while all others remain unchanged.

 

[The Real Gamer]

I forgot sheiks in game taunt was different, but in any case if that is sheiks artwork pose she's using I'd say that woul be a strike against her unless her and sheik shared that as a taunt.

It's a direct reference to Sheik. That's most definitely not a strike against Sheik's chances lol.

And sure animations could be changed, but it could also be something different as well so your basis for that in her favor really isn't since we could assume it's another thing that got changed as well. There's simply not enough there to make that claim and even less with the possibility that they aren't using the same animation for transform while all others remain unchanged.

At this point we know it's either her new Transformation pose or a new taunt, but based on everything we've seen so far (Zelda retaining her TP look, Phantom Knight looking more and more like an assist trophy as opposed to a new move, Zelda's lack of any new moves in general, the direct Sheik reference, etc) it's much more likely the former than the latter.

 

[HylianHeroBigBoss]

It's a direct reference to Sheik. That's most definitely not a strike against Sheik's chances lol.

In the same way you assume its a transformation pose i can assume its just a nod to a sheik herself even if shes not present. The same thing can be done both ways so that cant be proven in her favor

At this point we know it's either her new Transformation pose or a new taunt, but based on everything we've seen so far (Zelda retaining her TP look, Phantom Knight looking more and more like an assist trophy as opposed to a new move, Zelda's lack of any new moves in general, the direct Sheik reference, etc) it's much more likely the former than the latter.

Zelda doesnt have to have a complete revamp to get one single new special, mario got fluud and retained all his other moves, much like pit lost his mirror shield too, so zelda can still retain the majority of her moveset regardless if theres a change so it being the same means nothing. Theres nothing that says its likely other than what was in the past, it doesnt mean anything definitive like you are "semi" claiming here.

 

[Erotic&Heretic]

Ah, I do like the supposition of the pose being a new grab animation. It's weird in Melee and Brawl for some reasons.

But I guess we would better wait for more informations.

 

[The Real Gamer]

In the same way you assume its a transformation pose i can assume its just a nod to a sheik herself even if shes not present. The same thing can be done both ways so that cant be proven in her favor

You're blatantly ignoring the fact that I've already covered that it could possibly be a taunt in the OP. I'm merely arguing which scenario is MORE LIKELY based on all of the other evidence compiled. First the Impa/anti-Sheik crowd tried to argue that her pose could simply be Din's Fire (which is now deconfirmed), then you guys clung to Phantom Knight being her new down B (which is looking less and less likely as more Zelda pics are revealed), now you guys are hoping the Sheik pose is merely a taunt and a "nod to Sheik," which would be a pretty crappy nod tbh considering Sheik doesn't even use that pose in game. Most of you are grasping at straws at this point.

Zelda doesnt have to have a complete revamp to get one single new special, mario got fluud and retained all his other moves, much like pit lost his mirror shield too, so zelda can still retain the majority of her moveset regardless if theres a change so it being the same means nothing. Theres nothing that says its likely other than what was in the past, it doesnt mean anything definitive like you are "semi" claiming here.

If she has move revamps then where are they? So far Sakurai has been quick to show off veteran revamps (Bowser and Pit for example). All evidence points to Zelda retaining most of her Melee inspired OoT-based moveset, and Sheik is a critical part of that.

 

[Sonicguy726]

You're blatantly ignoring the fact that I've already covered that it could possibly be a taunt in the OP. I'm merely arguing which scenario is MORE LIKELY based on all of the other evidence compiled. First the Impa/anti-Sheik crowd tried to argue that her pose could simply be Din's Fire (which is now deconfirmed), then you guys clung to Phantom Knight being her new down B (which is looking less and less likely as more Zelda pics are revealed), now you guys are hoping the Sheik pose is merely a taunt and a "nod to Sheik," which would be a pretty crappy nod tbh considering Sheik doesn't even use that pose in game. Most of you are grasping at straws at this point.

I just think it's not transform because there are no sparkles or light effect around her whatsoever what do you just do the move, she makes that pose and then she's suddenly sheik

 

[Sailor Princess Twenty-Two.]

@the phantom knight picture- That's not her grab animation its one of her taunts she's had since melee.


as for "transform?" I've always been of the opinon that its either the start up or the end of her up-b. It could very well be a taunt but i don't think it points either way to sheik being in the game.

I'd also like to point out that all of your pictures of "transform" are from the move that we don't know for sure yet, and underneath it is a picture of Sheik that has nothing to do with transform. It would be much stronger evidence if you added pictures from zelda's transform pose from melee/brawl. If they are the same then yay zelda and sheik have bad down-b's again, if not it draws the questions "did they change the transformation pose, has it not been revealed yet and sheik is in the game, or is sheik not in the game/is she going to be replaced by impa."

I will admit I didn't read through the entire thread so if you responded to those points already I apologize.

 

[Morbi]

@the phantom knight picture- That's not her grab animation its one of her taunts she's had since melee.


as for "transform?" I've always been of the opinon that its either the start up or the end of her up-b. It could very well be a taunt but i don't think it points either way to sheik being in the game.

I'd also like to point out that all of your pictures of "transform" are from the move that we don't know for sure yet, and underneath it is a picture of Sheik that has nothing to do with transform. It would be much stronger evidence if you added pictures from zelda's transform pose from melee/brawl. If they are the same then yay zelda and sheik have bad down-b's again, if not it draws the questions "did they change the transformation pose, has it not been revealed yet and sheik is in the game, or is sheik not in the game/is she going to be replaced by impa."

I will admit I didn't read through the entire thread so if you responded to those points already I apologize.

That is one of the taunts she has had since Melee? You might want to go back... and re-play that game, mate. You might also want to play Brawl again... as that taunt doesn't appear in Brawl either.

 

[Katy Parry]

Not necessarily... In Melee at the very end of Zelda's transformation to Sheik she's barely sparkling at all. We're probably looking at the end of Sheik's transformation to Zelda which would explain the lack of glowing hands.

Either way it's a direct reference to Sheik since the pose was originally Sheik's alone in her Brawl Dojo pose. It's pretty obvious it's a tease/foreshadow.

Yeah, I agree with this. I mean, Zelda's pose matches Sheik's perfectly, down to the T. I never noticed that. I mean, her fingers are exactly the same, her pose is, her arms are, I mean everything.

 

[Morbi]

Yeah, I agree with this. I mean, Zelda's pose matches Sheik's perfectly, down to the T. I never noticed that. I mean, her fingers are exactly the same, her pose is, her arms are, I mean everything.

So common consensus is that it is merely an allusion? Nothing more?

 

[Katy Parry]

You're blatantly ignoring the fact that I've already covered that it could possibly be a taunt in the OP. I'm merely arguing which scenario is MORE LIKELY based on all of the other evidence compiled. First the Impa/anti-Sheik crowd tried to argue that her pose could simply be Din's Fire (which is now deconfirmed), then you guys clung to Phantom Knight being her new down B (which is looking less and less likely as more Zelda pics are revealed), now you guys are hoping the Sheik pose is merely a taunt and a "nod to Sheik," which would be a pretty crappy nod tbh considering Sheik doesn't even use that pose in game. Most of you are grasping at straws at this point.



If she has move revamps then where are they? So far Sakurai has been quick to show off veteran revamps (Bowser and Pit for example). All evidence points to Zelda retaining most of her Melee inspired OoT-based moveset, and Sheik is a critical part of that.

Preach, please. Finally someone who gets it.

 

[Katy Parry]

So common consensus is that it is merely an allusion? Nothing more?

Quote the raven, nevermore!

 

[Sonicguy726]

Not necessarily... In Melee at the very end of Zelda's transformation to Sheik she's barely sparkling at all. We're probably looking at the end of Sheik's transformation to Zelda which would explain the lack of glowing hands.

Really is she not sparkling at the end

We can see in the last one that she has just finished transforming and yes there are sparkles around her

 

[Diddy Kong]

Why wouldn't Zelda reference Sheik if she's actually gone? I doubt it's her new Transform animation at all. It lacks the sparkles of the animation she had in Melee and Brawl. To me, it looks most like a pose, nothing more, nothing less.

And why again is the Phantom an AT now? Or less likely being a move? Nothing to me seems like strong effidence which has been said already. We know as much know as we did when Zelda was revealed. Note that characters can have significant changes even if their basical moveset is still the same. For example, Mario and Samus in Brawl. Mario got F.L.U.D.D, but most of his moves outside of Down Air remained the same. In Brawl, Samus has the exact same moves as in Melee but gains a new mechanic with her Final Smash, a transformation to Zero Suit Samus.

Phantom is still very likely to be a move, ESPECIALLY now that all her other Specials have been revealed outside of Transform.

 

[Erotic&Heretic]

Well, even if the Phantom can be an attack, and Impa can appear (wich is unlikely to me, considering Zelda and Link kept their TP appearance) as you support, adding the Phantom and deleting Sheik from Zelda's moveset is really a step backward.

I mean, Mario's FLUDD add something to his gameplay. He somewhat retained his Down-B as his Down-Air.
Now, spawning an armor that act as an independant NPC (it can't be a normal move, it's somewhat confirmed now) sounds like a bad idea, compared to the ability to transform and have a different moveset, and so new tactics.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Impa can easily appear with TP Link and TP Zelda. Hyrule Warriors has Zelda in a more TP-based design to. And has Impa playable in it. Why can't Impa fit in with a more realistic appearance? She might even be in Zelda Wii U, and get her looks based on that game. And if nothing else, TP Link and SS Link are quite similar anyway, I don't think it's impossible at all to make Impa fit in.

Why is Phantom a bad idea? Zelda with her zoning-heavy playstyle could use a major distraction like Phantom to be able to land her moves far better.

 

[Erotic&Heretic]

Impa can easily appear with TP Link and TP Zelda. Hyrule Warriors has Zelda in a more TP-based design to. And has Impa playable in it.

Source?

Why is Phantom a bad idea? Zelda with her zoning-heavy playstyle could use a major distraction like Phantom to be able to land her moves far better.

It's probably only me, but I really don't like the idea of just leaving an armor do the job. For exemple, ZWEI in SoulCalibur 5 can summon EIN, but it's part of his moveset, you control him, and is cool, as he does what you want him to do. If you want him to do a circular attack, you can, and it leaves you the opportunity to attack.

Now, the phantom. It's seems obvious that, if it's a move, you don't control him, as you already have to move yourself and she have plenty of moves. And it would be weird for the phantom to act like the luma. Would be bad if a veteran becomes a rip-off of a newcommer.
I agree it can protect her. It's even obvious. But landing moves far better? I really don't see how a giant armor with a big sword can help Zelda with her particular playstyle that need accuracy. The phantom can distract, but it would just be a pain to land a lighting kick with an armor slashing ennemies on it's own.

 

[Frostwraith]

Although it doesn't warrant anything, I can agree that it's a likely possibility. The argument is well-constructed, using evidence to support the points made.

I'd like to add that two of her taunts have been confirmed:
[collapse="Zelda's taunts"]

[/collapse]

The unknown animation looks similar to one of her taunts but has some differences that shouldn't be overlooked:

Spoiler

I do agree about the possibility of her Sheik pose being part of a new transformation animation, though it shouldn't be taken as granted. If it is, indeed, her transformation animation, the lack of sparkling effects could be due to the game being in development and the feature wasn't implemented yet, or perhaps, the new animation doesn't involve sparkles. She could simply make the pose, be enveloped in light for a short moment and suddenly appear as Sheik.

All in all, this doesn't confirm anything, but everything seems to point that Zelda is keeping her moveset overall, receiving some tweaks, as it is expected from all veterans in the new game. In the end, it's a matter of waiting patiently for more information.

EDIT: I forgot to add that her A attack has been revealed too:

Spoiler

 

[Sonicguy726]

Well, even if the Phantom can be an attack, and Impa can appear (wich is unlikely to me, considering Zelda and Link kept their TP appearance) as you support, adding the Phantom and deleting Sheik from Zelda's moveset is really a step backward.

I mean, Mario's FLUDD add something to his gameplay. He somewhat retained his Down-B as his Down-Air.
Now, spawning an armor that act as an independant NPC (it can't be a normal move, it's somewhat confirmed now) sounds like a bad idea, compared to the ability to transform and have a different moveset, and so new tactics.

well getting rid of sheik would add something, they could make zelda good and seem at least as good as sheik

 

[Frostwraith]

well getting rid of sheik would add something, they could make zelda good and seem at least as good as sheik

They can make Zelda good independently of whether or not she has the Sheik transformation.

Having a new special move wouldn't fix her moveset instantly.

 

[Sonicguy726]

They can make Zelda good independently of whether or not she has the Sheik transformation.

Having a new special move wouldn't fix her moveset instantly.

zelda and sheik are supposed to be opposites so they had to make her slow but since she is tall and floaty she gets knocked off really easily

 

[Erotic&Heretic]

The real problem for Zelda in Brawl is the game physic. She wasn't that bad in Melee, and she got good buffs in brawl, but the game itself ruined everything. The gravity didn't help doing combos, and the momentum cancel (via air dodging for exemple) is just ridiculous. Zelda was easily able to kill an opponent at 80% in melee, but it was hard to do so in brawl. Also, landing aerial kick was harder.

 

[Sonicguy726]

The real problem for Zelda in Brawl is the game physic. She wasn't that bad in Melee, and she got good buffs in brawl, but the game itself ruined everything. The gravity didn't help doing combos, and the momentum cancel (via air dodging for exemple) is just ridiculous. Zelda was easily able to kill an opponent at 80% in melee, but it was hard to do so in brawl. Also, landing aerial kick was harder.

but you've still got to admit she's far to slow and thats because of sheik

 

[JamesDNaux]

It's baffling that people think Sheik is going anywhere, it was understandable during Brawl days, when we got the new Zelda and it was thought Sheik would be gone because she wasn't in Twilight Princess. But near the end of the updates we indeed got Sheik, in her new updated look based on the concept art, with Zelda keeping the same look, it's pretty much a given that Sheik is still here (even so, Sakurai would have just BS'd a new look for Sheik anyway). Sheik was revealed far after Zelda was in Brawl, this is simply the same thing, Sakurai screwing with us. The Phantom obviously isn't part of her moveset, even without the fact that she pulls off the same pose without the Phantom, the thing just does not mesh with her art style, when Sakurai kept Sheik in Brawl, he made sure she matched Zelda's look. Why would he keep Zelda the same and then just throw in a random Toon Phantom for one of her attacks? This makes no sense in the slightest.

Diddy is really starting to grasp at straws over Impa here too, there is no evidence that she is in that new Zelda spin-off (may I remind you that the game will have little to no bearing on Smash Bros?) other than a really blurry picture of a person that slightly looks like Impa. Even if said person turned out to be Impa, it is not clear at all if she is playable or not, no one other than Link has been shown to be playable, Diddy is stating theories as though they are facts, we simply do not know if Impa is in that game or if she would be playable. As much as Diddy will keep trying to say that Sheik isn't in the game, remember, Diddy isn't Sakurai, he is not making the game, and Sheik will be in whether he likes it or not, his wining will not change anything. One person disliking something means absolute ****.