Shantae, the Half Genie Protector of Scuttle Town! (A Switch To A New WayForward)

[Teeb147]

Thats fine. I can easily see them creating moves just for this game. I just wanted to try to challenge myself with pulling as much as I could from her games.

As for pistol, the fox crews all have guns, as does Diddy, so guns as a B move is not uncommon. I did try to make it different enough from the others, letting it go through walls for her weak one, and also giving it a charge shot mechanic as well

I was at first putting the Transform on her B... but then I thought of Kirby... and that could be a nightmare for the programers and character model makers as you would need to make kirby themed transformations too. if you didn't its possible that having both transform at once could lead to confusion. I guess you could add a little kirby hat onto the 4 transformations though to try and differentiate them.

I meant they didn't like putting actual bullets in the game, and that was one of the reasons snake only had explosions. But maybe it doesn't matter, though I do like the idea of shooting fire with her with b-moves.

I do agree with you that the transform makes more sense for down-b because of kirby. Though they could do what they do with some characters and shorten in, like changing into a random animal to make the move (with his eyes instead?), but.. then again if he can use the monado arts and easily transfer over the code but just change the eyes, it'd be possible too. I dunno.

Anyway good job again, I'll probably look back at your post and images again for reference in the future

 

[DOTBHDD]

https://mobile.twitter.com/DOTBHDD/status/1029777729221283840

Twitter is one of my favorite places to support Shantae or any Smash content. The amount of Smash fans roaming around on there is quite amazing.

 

[Shinuto]

Thats fine. I can easily see them creating moves just for this game. I just wanted to try to challenge myself with pulling as much as I could from her games.

As for pistol, the fox crews all have guns, as does Diddy, so guns as a B move is not uncommon. I did try to make it different enough from the others, letting it go through walls for her weak one, and also giving it a charge shot mechanic as well



Thanks! Interesting thoughts on the up and down smash. those could work well.

I was at first putting the Transform on her B... but then I thought of Kirby... and that could be a nightmare for the programers and character model makers as you would need to make kirby themed transformations too. if you didn't its possible that having both transform at once could lead to confusion. I guess you could add a little kirby hat onto the 4 transformations though to try and differentiate them.

Remember though Kirby when Copying Olimar just throws Pikmin, so for Shantae he could just do say Monkey Bullet.

 

[EarlTamm]

Is there that much of a problem with guns? Sure, Snake only has a rocket launcher, but look at Bayonetta and her 4 guns. What about K.Rool and his blunderbuss, even if it's a tad cartoony.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Just came here to drop a little support on Shantae.

I've been playing the original game a lot lately for the first time, and I'm loving it.
I beat Pirate's Curse last year, and I love her DLC in Blaster Master Zero.

I'm just getting to know what Shantae can do without the pirate gear (I regret playing that game first... so many spoilers) so for every passing minute playing that game, I like the idea of Shantae in Smash more and more.

I'd love to see her pulling off her dance moves to transform. Heck.... maybe she can pull a ditto with a specific dance move, and transform into your opponent!

I'd love to see Risky Boots with her own moveset. But chances are, that could only happen through an assist trophy.

Anyway, crossing fingers for Shantae!

 

[Wademan94]

Thats fine. I can easily see them creating moves just for this game. I just wanted to try to challenge myself with pulling as much as I could from her games.

As for pistol, the fox crews all have guns, as does Diddy, so guns as a B move is not uncommon. I did try to make it different enough from the others, letting it go through walls for her weak one, and also giving it a charge shot mechanic as well



Thanks! Interesting thoughts on the up and down smash. those could work well.

I was at first putting the Transform on her B... but then I thought of Kirby... and that could be a nightmare for the programers and character model makers as you would need to make kirby themed transformations too. if you didn't its possible that having both transform at once could lead to confusion. I guess you could add a little kirby hat onto the 4 transformations though to try and differentiate them.

Admittedly I completely forgot about Kirby at first I think it’d be best to just have Kirby perform the Monkey Dash when he copies Shantae (as well as maybe just having a hat based off her Monkey transformation if her ponytail is too big to fit on Kirby’s model)

Also just a quick point about the guns, the issue is more so if they’re realistically designed. If I remember Sakurai’s Miiverse post about it correctly, that was one reason why the Ray Gun was redesigned in 4. I believe the blasters on the Starfox characters were redesigned with that in mind as well and Diddy had a wooden gun, but considering Bayonetta and K Rool’s Blunderbuss, Risky’s pistol might be okay.

 

[Teeb147]

Is there that much of a problem with guns? Sure, Snake only has a rocket launcher, but look at Bayonetta and her 4 guns. What about K.Rool and his blunderbuss, even if it's a tad cartoony.

It was something more for around Brawl, because clearly they allowed more and more maturity over the years. Just look at the last direct.
But bullets that are big and cartoony is probably fine in whatever case.

 

[zferolie]

I meant they didn't like putting actual bullets in the game, and that was one of the reasons snake only had explosions. But maybe it doesn't matter, though I do like the idea of shooting fire with her with b-moves.

I do agree with you that the transform makes more sense for down-b because of kirby. Though they could do what they do with some characters and shorten in, like changing into a random animal to make the move (with his eyes instead?), but.. then again if he can use the monado arts and easily transfer over the code but just change the eyes, it'd be possible too. I dunno.

Anyway good job again, I'll probably look back at your post and images again for reference in the future

yeah it could maybe work. I would be fine it being the B move, but was trying to make it easier. But would would the down B be then? a pistol shot for a Down be seem odd.

Remember though Kirby when Copying Olimar just throws Pikmin, so for Shantae he could just do say Monkey Bullet.

That is true. just the monkey dash would be a bit sad, or maybe Kirby just does a random one, as with Pikmin he throws a random Pikmin, though 4 random attacks could not be the best thing for Kirby to copy, but you don't need to use the skill as kirby either

Admittedly I completely forgot about Kirby at first I think it’d be best to just have Kirby perform the Monkey Dash when he copies Shantae (as well as maybe just having a hat based off her Monkey transformation if her ponytail is too big to fit on Kirby’s model)

Also just a quick point about the guns, the issue is more so if they’re realistically designed. If I remember Sakurai’s Miiverse post about it correctly, that was one reason why the Ray Gun was redesigned in 4. I believe the blasters on the Starfox characters were redesigned with that in mind as well and Diddy had a wooden gun, but considering Bayonetta and K Rool’s Blunderbuss, Risky’s pistol might be okay.

Yeah Kirby could just do the monkey if needed. The other problem is what would her down B be then? Pistol I feel feels best as a B move. Down B would be odd, though thats mostly do to almost every projectile attack being a B move.

And ok I understand, but like you said, With K rools musket how it is nothing should be wrong with RIsky's gun

 

[EarlTamm]

You know, one of the biggest hurdles for Shantae in the speculation scene is that there are people who think Shantae has no chance to get in because "Not even Shovel Knight could get in as a fighter" or something along those lines. We need to shatter that very two dimensional view. When we can, we need to highlight the things that she has over SK as well as things he has over her. I guess it would be some sort of chart dissecting there advantages and disadvantages to each other. Just highlight that it is not so clear cut as iconicness.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Well... Shantae has seniority over Shovel Knight, so there's one.

Not only that, but her first 2 games were Nintendo exclusive for a while (the first one still is, and not sure for how long Risky's Revenge was DSi exclusive).

So Shovel Knight came in with thunderous fanfares.... But he's still the new guy, you know? And I love SK, but that's what it seems to me.
Also... maybe the fact that SK appears in everything is another reason why Sakurai could decide to go for Shantae.

Just my 2 gems.

 

[EarlTamm]

Well... Shantae has seniority over Shovel Knight, so there's one.

Not only that, but her first 2 games were Nintendo exclusive for a while (the first one still is, and not sure for how long Risky's Revenge was DSi exclusive).

So Shovel Knight came in with thunderous fanfares.... But he's still the new guy, you know? And I love SK, but that's what it seems to me.
Also... maybe the fact that SK appears in everything is another reason why Sakurai could decide to go for Shantae.

Just my 2 gems.

Yeah, that sort of stuff. I have been thinking about this sort of "Highlight all there advantages" thing ever since I saw the Skull Kid evidence image that has been passed around. It's a great way to showcase info quickly and concisely.

 

[MattOnwheels]

Anyone find it odd WF is much quieter than last year on this?

 

[EarlTamm]

Anyone find it odd WF is much quieter than last year on this?

Yeah, especially when it comes to Shantae. Wasn't that part of the reason Jammies Mode was such a surprise? And when was the last time they even discussed the possibility of Smash? Wayforward was definitely the most vocal when it came to the Smash ballot, with both the alternate color concept they made along with the mass email they sent to backers(I just heard about this one, did it actually happen?).

 

[zferolie]

Well them being quite could mean something or could mean nothing. its hard to say.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

You know, one of the biggest hurdles for Shantae in the speculation scene is that there are people who think Shantae has no chance to get in because "Not even Shovel Knight could get in as a fighter" or something along those lines. We need to shatter that very two dimensional view. When we can, we need to highlight the things that she has over SK as well as things he has over her. I guess it would be some sort of chart dissecting there advantages and disadvantages to each other. Just highlight that it is not so clear cut as iconicness.

Shantae has a design that appeals to Japanese sensibilities (that is to say, cutesy). Shovel Knight is a masked man.

Shantae has an established personality that's easy to relate to, while SK has a standard heroic persona, and you don't see his "true" one unless you play as a member of the Order of No Quarter.

On the other hand, SK's gameplay is simple, and easy to master, as for Shantae hers is more involved and intricate in comparison.

That's my two cents on the topic.

 

[Camc10]

Has anyone played SSB Crusade, because something from that game really made me think about Shantae in SSBU.

 

[EarlTamm]

On the other hand, SK's gameplay is simple, and easy to master, as for Shantae hers is more involved and intricate in comparison.

But that makes Shantae's potential moveset more attractive. While Shovel Knight could certainly be unique, he alway felt kinda standard when it came to his moveset. So many third parties have something standing out in there moveset, and Shantae can fulfill that much better than SK.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

But that makes Shantae's potential moveset more attractive. While Shovel Knight could certainly be unique, he alway felt kinda standard when it came to his moveset. So many third parties have something standing out in there moveset, and Shantae can fulfill that much better than SK.

That is certainly true. Only thing is we don't know what they'll go for in terms of picking and choosing for Shantae, although what's been brought up earlier in this thread seems like the best compromise.

 

[EarlTamm]

That is certainly true. Only thing is we don't know what they'll go for in terms of picking and choosing for Shantae, although what's been brought up earlier in this thread seems like the best compromise.

True, but the potential is there. SK had an easier to visualize moveset, which is always a benefit, but that moveset was not the most impressive t the end of the day. There is a lot more speculation and factors to take in with Shantae, leading to more discussion and thus, more creativity. Also, I am a fan of Shovel Knight and I was quite overjoyed to see him in the game at all, I just don't think his moveset is that unique or interesting. Heck, the other playable Order of no Quarter characters would be more interesting in my eyes.

 

[Staarih]

Great to see this thread so active!

I've found myself pretty invested in the idea of Shantae in Smash, but I'm also really conflicted - it's honestly 50/50 for her, I feel. She's got a lot of things going for her, but also things against her.

I began thinking about how WayForward themselves were pretty much the start of any "Shantae4Smash"-movement, and even though lots of fans did indeed do all the voting in the end, I hope it's not a red flag for Sakurai: seeing it as the company pushing their character, rather than the fans. Then again, if she did place high on the ballot, it's because of her fans voting for her. I just hope Sakurai doesn't categorize Shantae in any "box" but rather just judges her like he would any other character, essentially looking for fun moveset potential (which she definitely has).

Oh well, it's a waiting game - especially since WayForward has indeed been awfully quiet for a while.

 

[EarlTamm]

Great to see this thread so active!

I've found myself pretty invested in the idea of Shantae in Smash, but I'm also really conflicted - it's honestly 50/50 for her, I feel. She's got a lot of things going for her, but also things against her.

I began thinking about how WayForward themselves were pretty much the start of any "Shantae4Smash"-movement, and even though lots of fans did indeed do all the voting in the end, I hope it's not a red flag for Sakurai: seeing it as the company pushing their character, rather than the fans. Then again, if she did place high on the ballot, it's because of her fans voting for her. I just hope Sakurai doesn't categorize Shantae in any "box" but rather just judges her like he would any other character, essentially looking for fun moveset potential (which she definitely has).

Oh well, it's a waiting game - especially since WayForward has indeed been awfully quiet for a while.

I don't think Sakurai would do that. Plus, every company called for support. At the end of the day, he is gonna look at what fans voted for, plain and simple. If the character is pass a certain point, he is gonna look into the series and company. Sakurai does not seem like a judgmental person(Unless you are a leaker), and this game seems all about what fans want over what he knows he would ultimately want. When it comes to that, we are fine.

 

[Teeb147]

I think it's enough to say that Nintendo at least is introducing indie game stuff in smash, and do you really expect both shovel knight and shantae in it? that would be farfetched. Who would you choose between the two, if you were Nintendo? The choice is kind of obvious.

And if that's not enough, you just say 'you'll see. you'll see..' and walk off and laugh

 

[DOTBHDD]

I don't think Sakurai cares about the "indie" title. He just looks at 3rd parties as 3rd parties. Which may work in favor for Shantae because she is practically an underdog in the gaming community.

 

[Indie DevoTee]

People need to remember that ultimately, at the end of the day, you can never predict Sakurai. He is known for throwing out a lot of curve balls our way. If relevance was really the only playing factor? Simon and Richter would not have been added. Castlevania, while popular among fans, is a series that has been unfortunately put into the grave for years and is now just a... *cringes* ...sex pachinko machine. Sakurai cares about history, fans, and what would make them happy.

IF Shantae has made it in? It's because we as fans were respectfully vocal and showed we really wanted our character to be represented. Now, more than ever, Sakurai is listening to feedback from the fans of the Smash community and of particular series. I think it's a good 50/50 for her, but lately, I've been leaning towards the chance of it being possible she is playable.

 

[Teeb147]

I think my view of her chances has increased some in the last days, thanks to this thread & stuff. I'd say I'm at about 30+% right now, when I was less than 10 not long ago. so thanks.

And I do think being indie makes a big difference. Big companies you know more what you're dealing with. With indie developpers you don't know how much you can trust their integrity because they're more average people without as much business and legal knowledge. But also they're less popular, with some exceptions.. like SK and Shantae

 

[Indie DevoTee]

I think my view of her chances has increased some in the last days, thanks to this thread & stuff. I'd say I'm at about 30+% right now, when I was less than 10 not long ago. so thanks.

And I do think being indie makes a big difference. Big companies you know more what you're dealing with. With indie developpers you don't know how much you can trust their integrity because they're more average people without as much business and legal knowledge. But also they're less popular, with some exceptions.. like SK and Shantae

As long as we have hope? There's a chance! :3

 

[EarlTamm]

I think my view of her chances has increased some in the last days, thanks to this thread & stuff. I'd say I'm at about 30+% right now, when I was less than 10 not long ago. so thanks.

And I do think being indie makes a big difference. Big companies you know more what you're dealing with. With indie developpers you don't know how much you can trust their integrity because they're more average people without as much business and legal knowledge. But also they're less popular, with some exceptions.. like SK and Shantae

Well, if we go by that logic, Nintendo has nothing to worry about when it comes to Wayforward. Why? Because Wayforward is not some new company. They have been credited for over 60+ games going back to the mid 90's. They aren't some young company with no track record. Heck, Yachtclub is made up of former Wayforward developers. Sure, alot of there library is made up of licenced games, but even alot of those games aren't bad, and they try much more than other developers to make those games good and more than a cash grab. Now as of why Shantae is seen as indie, I think it's because Wayforward at the end of the day is still independent, despite the companies age and library, as well as Shantae becoming a major player in the Nindies scene.

 

[Teeb147]

Maybe it's time they not be considered Indie anymore? Or is it once Indie always Indie?

Anyway, seeing SK in smash only increased her chances for me. Others can think differently.

 

[DeltaSceptile]

I see Shantae happening, especially with WF’s history on Nintendo platforms like many have stated.

 

[EarlTamm]

Unofficial fighter ballot being held, if anyone is curious.
https://mobile.twitter.com/SSBUNews/status/1030202551696875521

 

[Camc10]

Can someone remind me when Sakurai visited Wayforward

 

[Captain Hazama]

Unofficial fighter ballot being held, if anyone is curious.
https://mobile.twitter.com/SSBUNews/status/1030202551696875521

A lot of Shantae votes I've seen just browsing some of the comments there.

 

[MajestyIndigo]

Hi guys, I just joined given the current smash hype. I've been stalking reading your conversations here and am very pleased to see that I am far from being the only one who wants her.
I'm really hoping to see Shantae join in this time around, she is by far my most wanted newcomer now that I got Daisy ( although she is a meh echo fighter ).
I happen to be very deluded positive regarding her chances to make it in :
Let's not underestimate the fact that she has such a unique and fun moveset potential compared to many other characters including SK. SSBU devs are most importantly looking to make THIS game as fun as possible and have to use other game's characters in the process. Shovel Knight didn't have nearly as much potential as she has which I think always made her stand out as the top indie choice for that game. ( Without talking about her seniority, her under-represented gender, amazing music ect ect ect ).
Plus, everyone assumes that SK was more popular during the smash ballot, but it still has yet to be proven.
Let's all take that unofficial poll and make it bow down to our queen half-genie.

 

[DOTBHDD]

Now that most popular charcaters are already in Smash in some capacity, Shantae is climbing higher on that list of wanted charcaters.

Shantae has come a long way.

A lot of Shantae votes I've seen just browsing some of the comments there.

 

[DeltaSceptile]

Unofficial fighter ballot being held, if anyone is curious.
https://mobile.twitter.com/SSBUNews/status/1030202551696875521

So after browsing every comment I found Shantae, Bandana Dee, and Shadow to be the top 3. This would pretty much finish the roster for me... except for the fact I need my boi Tails and/or Grovyle/Sceptile to complete that. Also, there’s votes for waluigi... still people choose not to believe the meme of an AT he is.

 

[EarlTamm]

Here is the results of a reddit poll from a while ago. While she was not in the top 10 for most wanted, she actually got secound in underrated wanted original fighters, so that's an interesting insight.
https://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/97x206/smash_bros_ultimate_survey_results_based_on_over/

 

[Wyvern 0m3g4]

Just coming by to lend some support and love to Shantae and her (hopeful) inclusion into SSBU. Considering it was thanks to the Smash Ballot that I learned who Shantae was, and later ended up playing all the Shantae games, I figure this is the best way I can show my gratitude and thanks to everyone and everything that lead me up to that. My only regret is that I didn't discover Shantae, or heck, even WayForward sooner. After seeing their latest trailer for Jammies Mode, and seeing how much they devoted themselves to their fans, supporters and backers, I can't help but want to cheer them on even harder than before.

I'm praying more so than ever before that Shantae gets added to the game. I think she's paid her dues and deserves this much at least. ...Oh yeah, and I decided to vote for her in that ballot that was linked earlier. I highly doubt I can make a difference at all, and I'm more worried than hopeful at this point, but I haven't given up just yet either.

 

[Teeb147]

dont worry be happy.

happy feeds hope healthier. or feel through the pain under the worry, towards not being scared. And enjoy the ride, wondering if she'll come about

 

[Wyvern 0m3g4]

Thanks for the comforting words. It's the pessimist in me that keeps nagging away at the back of my mind, going, "Sakurai's unpredictable, so you never truly know," or, "there's plenty of strong competition that Shantae is up against, like Isaac, so she may continue to be an underdog for who knows how long," OR even, "if it all seems too good to be true, then it probably is." That last one kills me every time.

I know most people would call it being "realistic," but I still think I'm being jaded at the moment. Ah well, only time will tell, right? Until then, I guess I should put on a brave face and dance through the danger with you all. ...Yeah, sorry, couldn't resist.

 

[DeltaSceptile]

The next three months (not 4, as I doubt we’ll get anything after October/early November) are going to go very slowly. I hope Sakurai has Shantae to make it worth the agonizing wait.