Shantae, the Half Genie Protector of Scuttle Town! (A Switch To A New WayForward)

[Veodok]

While I don't typically like throwing this out, Sakurai has already said to not expect too many new challengers. This isn't unlikely.

See my above post to Teeb. We've already surpassed "not too many new fighters" territory.

Two more reveals is nonsensical: Honestly, I agree, though perhaps to a lesser degree. But it's not out of the realm of possibility.

It is if you consider how this game is being marketed. Running this low on content this close to release is completely counter to how Smash's constant "hype cycle". Them going dark for 2 months after revealing one newcomer and one echo does not fit this motive at all.

Yes, but when does something like this change?

??? All the time. Promotional art is almost never final. And again, do you really think that ****ing SAKURAI, the man who has been furious about his **** leaking before he could reveal it, would let the number remaining characters get leaked without his express oversight?

 

[MattX20]

This box theory is just nonsensical, and I refuse to believe there are only 2 characters left. I'm very certain we have 5-6 unique newcomers left and maybe 3-4 echoes.

 

[loozer2]

https://imgur.com/a/Rvw03pR
Here's a visual representation of the box art based on the deluxe edition art released. With this we'd have one unrevealed echo along with one more newcomer. It seems really odd that Sakurai would let us know the total number in the roster and that we would get almost 10 characters between E3 and the August direct only to be left with Isabelle and 2 others between August and December. I'll take it with a grain of salt.

 

[SoupCanMafia]

This box theory is just nonsensical, and I refuse to believe there are only 2 characters left. I'm very certain we have 5-6 unique newcomers left and maybe 3-4 echoes.

Maybe not that much left, but we certainly have more than just two more characters.
Guy's a bloody nut to think that this is a sound hypothesis/"theory".

 

[Teeb147]

Ya got to go out with a bang. I don't know if there'll be 2 more smash directs, but at least one, and you can bet it's going to have a good bunch of fighters.
I don't think it'll be 5-6 unique newcomers (especially if it's just one direct, that would be too high I think, but freakin cool ). But yeah, I think it's bound to be at least 3-4.

If we're wrong, we're wrong, but this is what makes sense to me for now.

 

[Parallel_Falchion]

See my above post to Teeb. We've already surpassed "not too many new fighters" territory.

EDIT: Forget this part. I disagree, though.

It is if you consider how this game is being marketed. Running this low on content this close to reveal is completely counter to how Smash's constant "hype cycle". Them going dark for 2 months after revealing one newcomer and one echo does not fit this motive at all.

It would be odd and a bad choice, yes. Impossible? No.

??? All the time. Promotional art is almost never final. And again, do you really think that ****ing SAKURAI, the man who has been furious about his **** leaking before he could reveal it, would let the number remaining characters get leaked without his express oversight?

First, calm down. I don't want to believe we're only getting one more newcomer and one more echo, either. I just want people to not immediately dismiss this simply because they don't want to believe it.

Second...show me. If this happens all the time, show me an example, similar to this one, where boxart suggested a specific number but was changed for release.

Also, Bloody Tears / Monster Dance leaked on the Smash site itself prior to the Smash direct. Even Nintendo themselves slip up.

On one final note, I want to point out the one thing that is really suggestive to me: the missing character from Palutena to Cloud. If everything was even, 9 character sets from top to bottom, I'd put a lot less stock in this. But the fact that this is suggesting an echo fighter in a very specific location is very telling. Why would this specific area have that gap while everything else is even?

 

[Veodok]

First, calm down.

Why do people always assume that swearing means that somebody isn't calm? And that it couldn't possibly be used to just emphasize a point?

I don't want to believe we're only getting one more newcomer and one more echo, either.

It's not about being let down; it's about not making any sense.

Second...show me. If this happens all the time, show me an example, similar to this one, where boxart suggested a specific number but was changed for release.

What you're asking for is too specific to smash, eliminating any game in existence that doesn't have box art exactly like this one. My point is that promotional art before a game's release is not to be taken as some final thing that can never change.

 

[Kirbeh]

Adding to the points Parallel Falchion has raised, I wouldn't say we we've surpassed "not too many new fighters". Sure we've gotten plenty of "new" characters, but it's possible that Sakurai was referring to completely unique characters and didn't factor Echoes into that statement given that they're easy additions he sees as extras.

As PF said, you don't have to believe that only 2 characters left is set in stone, but I don't think this is something that we should dismiss so easily either.

The boxart might be subject to change sure, but the fact that it already potentially factors in an unrevealed Echo is something of note.

 

[Parallel_Falchion]

Why do people always assume that swearing means that somebody isn't calm? And that it couldn't possibly be used to just emphasize a point?

If people always assume that, perhaps you should look at it from a different perspective and realize that you might be the one in the wrong.

Regardless, it's not appreciated. There are better ways to emphasize.

What you're asking for is too specific to smash, eliminating any game in existence that doesn't have box art exactly like this one. My point is that promotional art before a game's release is not to be taken as some final thing that can never change.

I don't think it is. And this isn't "promotional" art, it's boxart. It's an image of a product that consumers will be able to buy. Promotional art doesn't always truly represent the final game, but to my knowledge, boxart typically doesn't go through such drastic changes, especially in a situation like this.

 

[Captain Hazama]

Ya got to go out with a bang. I don't know if there'll be 2 more smash directs, but at least one, and you can bet it's going to have a good bunch of fighters.
I don't think it'll be 5-6 unique newcomers (especially if it's just one direct, that would be too high I think, but freakin cool ). But yeah, I think it's bound to be at least 3-4.

If we're wrong, we're wrong, but this is what makes sense to me for now.

Sakurai might do that 50 Fact Extravaganza again as another direct.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

I'm really getting on my own nerves. It's so stupid.
No matter how many times you people say it, I still feel like you all hate me, even though I know you probably do not.
I'm just getting really pissed off at myself. This is insane! I know you're all sick of me bringing this crap up, but I can't help it! I'm going insane!

And my opinion on the boxart theory is that it's complete bull. I really hate it. It should just be disregarded, thrown aside, forgotten, left to rot.

 

[Deleted member]

I’m going to sleep please find evedence on shantae as a fighter and don’t lose hope I still believe daisy is bumping shantae in the art!

 

[Veodok]

Regardless, it's not appreciated. There are better ways to emphasize.

Regardless, it's allowed because it's censored.

I don't think it is. And this isn't "promotional" art, it's boxart. It's an image of a product that consumers will be able to buy. Promotional art doesn't always truly represent the final game, but to my knowledge, boxart typically doesn't go through such drastic changes, especially in a situation like this.

And yet, it's still guaranteed to change because the final characters are not yet on the box. If they have the leeway to add more images to the box, then they have the leeway to edit the spacing of said images. I'm done arguing this theory.

See you tomorrow, thread.

 

[Teeb147]

Sakurai might do that 50 Fact Extravaganza again as another direct.

What was that? I don't remember it.

Adding to the points Parallel Falchion has raised, I wouldn't say we we've surpassed "not too many new fighters". Sure we've gotten plenty of "new" characters, but it's possible that Sakurai was referring to completely unique characters and didn't factor Echoes into that statement given that they're easy additions he sees as extras.

As PF said, you don't have to believe that only 2 characters left is set in stone, but I don't think this is something that we should dismiss so easily either.

The boxart might be subject to change sure, but the fact that it already potentially factors in an unrevealed Echo is something of note.

Well, I thought about it and I don't think it's impossible. Not that I like it, but I think it might be good to expect 1-5 unique newcomers instead. I'm still leaning towards the 'more', though.

I'm really getting on my own nerves. It's so stupid.
No matter how many times you people say it, I still feel like you all hate me, even though I know you probably do not.
I'm just getting really pissed off at myself. This is insane!

And my opinion on the boxart theory is that it's complete bull. I really hate it.

Hmm. I can somewhat understand in my own way, and I'm sorry you feel that way and that we can't seem to convince you otherwise. ...I like the vision of you being able to feel at ease and just be yourself too, and not worry about what others think or feel about you, but I can't do much more than I've offered. I hope you feel better, and everyone can just be themselves and feel whatever comraderie we can. *hug*

Leaving for an hour. Take care.

 

[Shadowknight1]

I'm really getting on my own nerves. It's so stupid.
No matter how many times you people say it, I still feel like you all hate me, even though I know you probably do not.
I'm just getting really pissed off at myself. This is insane! I know you're all sick of me bringing this crap up, but I can't help it! I'm going insane!

And my opinion on the boxart theory is that it's complete bull. I really hate it. It should just be disregarded, thrown aside, forgotten, left to rot.

If we keep overthinking this stuff, I hesitate to think what might happen to us. Maybe something like...this?

 

[Baws]

Okay so what I'm about to say is super negative as it basically soft deconfirms not only Shantae, but almost all the "most popular as far as we know" character choices... but I want to just get it out there.


Basically, I'm doing a full circle all the way back to the stages thing from the Smash Direct. So before I didn't hold much stock in the no more stages theory, but now we have two brand new fighters and still no new stage.

I'm basically reviving the concept that after Sakurai went out of his way to give such detailed statistics on the stages back when Dracula's Castle was revealed, that we are not getting any new ones before DLC.

I do realize there is no way Isaac or any 3rd Party could possibly get in without a stage, so if that turned out to be right, they would basically all be deconfirmed.

At BEST Geno could MAYBE get away with not having a stage.

Edit: I love that this post went up like right at the same time Shadowknight1 made their overthinking post lol

 

[SoupCanMafia]

If we keep overthinking this stuff, I hesitate to think what might happen to us. Maybe something like...this?

I think it's safe to say that it takes relatively more strength from Rottytops to pluck her own head from her neck than just simply poking herself. Though this is still pretty cute.

 

[Hollywoodrok12]

Even if there are more than 2 fighters there's no way Shantae's getting through Incineroar, Ken, Geno, Skull Kid, Steve, Shadow, Isaac, Dante (please no) AND Banjo. Considering that, along with the stage theory and the fact that all of the evidence we have thus far could just point to her being an Assist Trophy, I think i'm jumping ship.

 

[Shadowknight1]

Even if there are more than 2 fighters there's no way Shantae's getting through Incineroar, Ken, Geno, Skull Kid, Steve, Shadow, Isaac, Dante (please no) AND Banjo. Considering that, along with the stage theory and the fact that all of the evidence we have thus far could just point to her being an Assist Trophy, I think i'm jumping ship.

What stage theory? That we've seen them all? Bunk, immediately bunk, there's space for 5 more stages and a DLC button. And STOP BRINGING UP DANTE. He is 100% deconfirmed. And frankly, I'm sorry to say, but I think Banjo can be considered Deconfirmed too since Microsoft has talked about them in Smash, therefore no NDA is applied. And Steve? Really? Minecraft is getting an AT or stage. Not a character.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

R.I.P Hollywoodrok12

He jumped ship because of Smash's mother****ing boxart. May his soul finally be laid to rest.

 

[Veodok]

Dante

Already not happening.

Steve

Laughable.

Skull Kid

No disrespect to Skull Kid thread, but it's unlikely.

I think i'm jumping ship.

 

[SoupCanMafia]

rip hollywoodrok12
taken too soon by theories without much basis
will see later if she's revealed or not.

 

[Stephano]

Even if there are more than 2 fighters there's no way Shantae's getting through Incineroar, Ken, Geno, Skull Kid, Steve, Shadow, Isaac, Dante (please no) AND Banjo. Considering that, along with the stage theory and the fact that all of the evidence we have thus far could just point to her being an Assist Trophy, I think i'm jumping ship.

Oof

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Even if there are more than 2 fighters there's no way Shantae's getting through Incineroar, Ken, Geno, Skull Kid, Steve, Shadow, Isaac, Dante (please no) AND Banjo. Considering that, along with the stage theory and the fact that all of the evidence we have thus far could just point to her being an Assist Trophy, I think i'm jumping ship.

Welp, see you in a better plain of existence, I guess. Remember, our lord Sakurai is always watching over you!

But no seriously, you are one gullible little bugger aren't you?

 

[Shadow Novus]

Okay so what I'm about to say is super negative as it basically soft deconfirms not only Shantae, but almost all the "most popular as far as we know" character choices... but I want to just get it out there.


Basically, I'm doing a full circle all the way back to the stages thing from the Smash Direct. So before I didn't hold much stock in the no more stages theory, but now we have two brand new fighters and still no new stage.

I'm basically reviving the concept that after Sakurai went out of his way to give such detailed statistics on the stages back when Dracula's Castle was revealed, that we are not getting any new ones before DLC.

I do realize there is no way Isaac or any 3rd Party could possibly get in without a stage, so if that turned out to be right, they would basically all be deconfirmed.

At BEST Geno could MAYBE get away with not having a stage.

Edit: I love that this post went up like right at the same time Shadowknight1 made their overthinking post lol

We have at least one more Smash direct coming guaranteed and the only new ground they would have to cover is the story mode, newcomers and stages. Give Sakurai a chance to surprise you, as he often tends to do.

Besides by 2 new characters I'm assuming you mean K. Rool and Isabelle? 'cause you could make the argument they didn't need a new stage because their franchises are already well represented. Ridley didn't get a new stage either.

You're worrying a tad much

basically us right now

UUUUUGH MACBETH. I *hated* that stage as a kid, especially trying to get to the Venom hard route from it. Stupid train switches... xD

Even if there are more than 2 fighters there's no way Shantae's getting through Incineroar, Ken, Geno, Skull Kid, Steve, Shadow, Isaac, Dante (please no) AND Banjo. Considering that, along with the stage theory and the fact that all of the evidence we have thus far could just point to her being an Assist Trophy, I think i'm jumping ship.

People have already dissected your posts but, yeah no.

Incineroar, Ken, and Shadow are the only ones from there I'll argue is likely. I'm fairly certain there will be a pokemon rep 'cause there's always been one each game.

Ken and Shadow, sure I could see them being echos.

Skull Kid is iffy, but I'm honestly on the side he'll be a boss. If I'm wrong and he's playable, at least I'll get to see LeakyPandy get cancelled because they are 100% adamant on their source(s) saying so to the point they are willing to risk being labeled as un-credible forever.

Dante and Steve are not happening. The former has been shot down repeatedly and the latter just doesn't make sense. Yes I know Sakurai and his team can be very creative, after all they gave Duck Hunt, Wii Fit, R.O.B. and Mr Game and Watch movesets but...just no.

The rest are as up in the air as Shantae only they don't have their companies being NDA levels of silent in regards to the subject.

But you seem to have made up your mind so I won't stop you from leaving. Hope you find a more positive state of mind.

 

[Captain Hazama]

What was that? I don't remember it.



Well, I thought about it and I don't think it's impossible. Not that I like it, but I think it might be good to expect 1-5 unique newcomers instead. I'm still leaning towards the 'more', though.



Hmm. I can somewhat understand in my own way, and I'm sorry you feel that way and that we can't seem to convince you otherwise. ...I like the vision of you being able to feel at ease and just be yourself too, and not worry about what others think or feel about you, but I can't do much more than I've offered. I hope you feel better, and everyone can just be themselves and feel whatever comraderie we can. *hug*

Leaving for an hour. Take care.

Here ya go: https://youtu.be/j0BBGzfw0pQ

 

[Biometal]

All I can say is...

Spoiler

 

[Parallel_Falchion]

Regardless, it's allowed because it's censored.



And yet, it's still guaranteed to change because the final characters are not yet on the box. If they have the leeway to add more images to the box, then they have the leeway to edit the spacing of said images. I'm done arguing this theory.

See you tomorrow, thread.

Do you even want me to take you seriously? I wanted you to calm down so this discussion wouldn't get heated, but for some reason you seem intent on making that happen anyway. I didn't say I was reporting you or that you'd be warned, just that such behavior breeds discontent. Just because something is allowed doesn't mean it's good.

Scrubbing a couple characters is a hell of a lot simpler than redesigning the whole thing.

 

[LunarLiv]

This box thing is super weird, we haven't seen the other two sides yet so nothing can really be confirmed.Might just be a placeholder, who knows.

 

[SoupCanMafia]

This box thing is super weird, we haven't seen the other two sides yet so nothing can really be confirmed.Might just be a placeholder, who knows.

I think it is either the final box design or maybe a beta, but it's certainly not at all a good indication of the roster's overall size. It's like saying "Oh, sorry, let me include Cloud and Ryu in the cover after all the DLC's been released for Smash 4". It's just stupid to definitively say this when it's been constantly proven wrong time and time again.

 

[Hyfiner]

You'd think people would from the changing Everyone is Here poster that anything and everything can be a placeholder or cover up for something. Why are people now taking pictures of the fighters as fact? It just sounds like the next bandwagon for people to latch on to.

 

[AngrySun88]

I get keeping expectations low, but to believe every conspiracy that comes along is only setting yourself up for disappointment. I don't believe for a second that we're only getting two more characters. There's no way that Sakurai would intentionally allow the final roster amount to be revealed before he showed off the characters. This is just so out of character for him considering how much he hates leaks and goes out of his way to prevent them.

We also should keep in mind that these promotional materials can always be changed before launch just like how the character poster keeps on getting updated. I'm still calling bunk on the box theory.

Even if there are more than 2 fighters there's no way Shantae's getting through Incineroar, Ken, Geno, Skull Kid, Steve, Shadow, Isaac, Dante (please no) AND Banjo. Considering that, along with the stage theory and the fact that all of the evidence we have thus far could just point to her being an Assist Trophy, I think i'm jumping ship.

Let's be honest, I don't think you were ever fully on board. Almost every post you made on this thread was negative speculation that you said for sure was "bad news" that automatically deconfirmed a character that the rest of us want.

 

[LunarLiv]

You'd think people would from the changing Everyone is Here poster that anything and everything can be a placeholder or cover up for something. Why are people now taking pictures of the fighters as fact? It just sounds like the next bandwagon for people to latch on to.

Speaking of the Everyone is Here mural, I'm so hoping that I can get a printed or poster version of that after all the characters have been announced (Which might take a year if there's DLC), it's so cool.

 

[Parallel_Falchion]

Because hey, I don't want to believe it either, someone on GameFAQs of all places provided what is to me the best counter argument yet. Both the quote and the reply to it (Link: https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/77004278/908782849):

 

[PichuMain]

Alright...fill me in! Whats this box theory??

 

[SoupCanMafia]

Let's be honest, I don't think you were ever fully on board. Almost every post you made on this thread was negative speculation that you said for sure was "bad news" that automatically deconfirmed a character that the rest of us want.

I felt that he either was a vehement believer of VergeBen's "leaks" or a GameFAQs guy, or perhaps even both. It's not surprising, considering that this "shantae supporter" wanted to abandon ship at every slight drop of news, good and bad, trying to twist it to make it seem that Shantae's not coming in.

Alright...fill me in! Whats this box theory??

Box Theory is a conspiracy that relates to Smash Ultimate's Deluxe Set, which "features every character" and has an apparent "limit" of 70-72 characters.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Skull Kid is iffy, but I'm honestly on the side he'll be a boss. If I'm wrong and he's playable, at least I'll get to see LeakyPandy get cancelled because they are 100% adamant on their source(s) saying so to the point they are willing to risk being labeled as un-credible forever.

LeakyPandy was already cancelled by "Luigi's Mansion Kingdom DLC for Odyssey" and some other stuffs.

Skull Kid could be a boss but only if it's the Twilight Princess design, otherwise it isn't true to canon like these other bosses (you never fight MM Skull Kid).

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Alright...fill me in! Whats this box theory??

So, ya see, there's some people on a box right? And that's the entire theory, a GAME THEORY, thank you for watching.

Ignore it. It's a crap theory.

 

[NukeA6]

Alright...fill me in! Whats this box theory??

Something to keep your expectations low.
https://twitter.com/ConnorEatsPants/status/1040744991176486912/photo/1

 

[Shadow Novus]

I'm surprised people like PushDustin are rolling with the box theory. You'd think Sakurai with how hard he's been trying to keep surprises wouldn't have his efforts undermined by a boxart of all things.

Among other reasons, I don't want it to be true because if it is, some poor graphic designer is getting his ass fired.
And unemployment sucks.