Sakurai "aiming to make Super Smash Bros. best character game in the world"

[Nielicus]

I'll believe it when I see Mewtwo.
I mean if he's trying to make this the best character game in the world, and doesn't add the most requested character for the game I just.

I just will never understand how he thought he accomplished that.

Come on now... a lot of people want Mewtwo, OK I get that, but we can already make Pac-man, Sonic, Mega man and Mario fight each other.... Mewtwo does not compare to that.

 

[FoxBlaze71]

higher-priority

putting in more characters, stages, items, trophies, Assists, and such.

 

[MasterofMonster]

Come on now... a lot of people want Mewtwo, OK I get that, but we can already make Pac-man, Sonic, Mega man and Mario fight each other.... Mewtwo does not compare to that.

No, but remember that Mewtwo is, worldwide, the most wanted character at least. He is pretty much the one character to make the game grander than anyone right now.

As long as he has his male voice...

 

[Nielicus]

No, but remember that Mewtwo is, worldwide, the most wanted character at least. He is pretty much the one character to make the game grander than anyone right now.

As long as he has his male voice...

OK, but, that person basically said the goal is not met because we haven't seen Mewtwo yet, which IMO is not ****ing true at all lol.
Dont get me wrong I love me some Mewtwo doe

 

[Devil G.]

Because those things aren't important at all in a party game, right?

 

[FoxBlaze71]

Just curious, out of all the people crying for Mewtwo, how many bothered to main him in Melee, or even his buffed PM version? It's essentially a reaction of "Oh, cool, another character slot".

Because those things aren't important at all in a party game.

They don't really need to be there, either. Even Sakurai said in an interview that there's a point where adding more **** just doesn't cut it anymore.

 

[strawhatninja]

I think he has done that already. Yeah people make argue character wise for anime fighting games like Jump Ultimate Stars, J Stars vs, and Dragon Ball Z fighting games. The problem with those games is most of the characters are clones, and the fighting game is shallow. Now don't get me wrong I like those games, but they don't compare with Smash in my opinion.

 

[MasterofMonster]

OK, but, that person basically said the goal is not met because we haven't seen Mewtwo yet, which IMO is not ****ing true at all lol.
Dont get me wrong I love me some Mewtwo doe

Don't get me wrong, I don't actually know what you are talking about really. Just thought I'd explain that Mewtwo is/would be a very big deal for this Smash. ^^ So, just saying.

Mewtwo or not, this Smash is already Amazing anyways.

 

[Devil G.]

Just curious, out of all the people crying for Mewtwo, how many bothered to main him in Melee, or even his buffed PM version? It's essentially a reaction of "Oh, cool, another character slot".



They don't really need to be there, either. Even Sakurai said in an interview that there's a point where adding more **** just doesn't cut it anymore.

Well, I didn't hate the SSE mode in Brawl, but if I have to choose between something similar and having more of that kind of content, I'll go with the latter, just my own opinion. So far I'm enjoying all the new content this installment is giving us, and I haven't thought "we would be better off without this" even once. But hey, to each his own, I just feel like we aren't over-saturated just yet.

 

[FoxBlaze71]

Well, I didn't hate the SSE mode in Brawl, but if I have to choose between something similar and having more of that kind of content, I'll go with the latter, just my own opinion. So far I'm enjoying all the new content this installement is giving us, and I haven't thought "we would be better off without this" even once. But hey, to each his own, I just feel like we aren't over-saturated just yet.

How about, instead of adding either random campaign or item ****, he focuses on revamping the gameplay and making it good again for the first time in 13 years?

Mewtwo or not, this Smash is already Amazing anyways.

Do I seriously need to go dig up another .jpg to express my disappointment? It looks like a slightly faster Brawl.

 

[MasterofMonster]

I do not see why you would HAVE to post Disappointment to counter my personal opinion that I like the New Smash game, no.

Believe it or not, many, many, many love Brawl. Many more than loved Melee. It being Close to Brawl, yet faster and mor ecompetetive, can ONLY be a good thing anyways.

 

[Devil G.]

How about, instead of adding either random campaign or item ****, he focuses on revamping the gameplay and making it good again for the first time in 13 years?

Oh, I agree that gameplay is important, but those things aren't mutually exclusive, let's not judge the game before it comes out ( I'm fine with it so far, anyways ). Perry also mentioned that on the post you quoted:

higher-priority things such as gameplay tuning, balance, putting in more characters, stages, items, trophies, Assists, and such. I think this game's gonna be a blast because of it.

 

[FoxBlaze71]

@ MasterofMonster : Nope, you said Smash 4 will be good. It is now beyond the point of necessity.

Edit: Seriously? More people loved Brawl? Maybe casuals in 2008, but if you'll take notice, PM, a mod that aims for MELEE-LIKE gameplay, has pretty much killed off Brawl, along with OG Melee, which is still doing fine.

@ Devil G. : True, but it's scary he puts those things on par with new items.

 

[MasterofMonster]

Um. Of course this Smash will be good. No one said it would be good for literally anyone. You are allowed to be disappointed and post the same unecessary Picture about it as much as you want, though. Not sure what it has to do with me knowing I will like Sm4sh with or without Mewtwo.

But on topic.

 

[ScottyWK]

I'm worried that the "sweet spot" Sakurai is aiming for won't actually be a sweet spot. He said he wanted to appeal to both newcomers to the franchise and Smash veterans, but followed it up again by stressing the new players to the franchise.

I just don't see why a game like Melee in terms of speed and techniques would turn off new players. Melee brought in a TON of new players, so speed obviously doesn't turn those people off.

 

[MasterofMonster]

I'm worried that the "sweet spot" Sakurai is aiming for won't actually be a sweet spot. He said he wanted to appeal to both newcomers to the franchise and Smash veterans, but followed it up again by stressing the new players to the franchise.

I just don't see why a game like Melee in terms of speed and techniques would turn off new players. Melee brought in a TON of new players, so speed obviously doesn't turn those people off.

Well, in the very least, it appears that this new Smash will be better than Brawl for both sides of Smash. It is Close to Brawl, but still much better for the 'hardcore' players. Of course, many won't be happy and say it is 'not enough', but I am sure most will agree that the game is more 'for everyone' than Brawl was.

I also honestly see MeleeHD coming in a few years anyways.

 

[FoxBlaze71]

I'm worried that the "sweet spot" Sakurai is aiming for won't actually be a sweet spot. He said he wanted to appeal to both newcomers to the franchise and Smash veterans, but followed it up again by stressing the new players to the franchise.

I just don't see why a game like Melee in terms of speed and techniques would turn off new players. Melee brought in a TON of new players, so speed obviously doesn't turn those people off.

The scenario here is like that of kings who try to placate both the masses and nobility. It never works and somebody gets guillotined.

I think most people who complain about Melee physics are just those who started with Brawl and are too scrubby to adjust. Brawl was the first Smash game I really got into, but I enjoy PM more and was able to get acclimated just fine.

Edit: @ MasterofMonster : Seriously? What about Melee? There were lots of people who were totally casual and never knew a competitive scene existed and still loved it. There's no harm in making it good enough for the competitive community, but bads will just whine about there being not enough "content".

Melee HD will also never happen, BTW. That ain't Microsoft.

 

[Dinoman96]

Just curious, out of all the people crying for Mewtwo, how many bothered to main him in Melee, or even his buffed PM version? It's essentially a reaction of "Oh, cool, another character slot".



They don't really need to be there, either. Even Sakurai said in an interview that there's a point where adding more **** just doesn't cut it anymore.

I'm all for Smash being a viable competitive game, but to say "oh, characters don't matter" is pretty wrong in my eyes. New character are a big part of why people get excited for a new Smash.

I always roll my eyes when people say "Oh, it was ONLY the gameplay that made Smash what it is today!". That's true to a degree, but I believe it's the gameplay AND characters that made SSB a great series. It's the gameplay that gave Melee its longevity among certain fans, sure, but it's the characters and overall Nintendo theme that gave it its charm, atmosphere, and appeal. I feel like Air Dash Online is what happens when you try to make a Melee-like game without the recognizable character aspect (As in, it fell flat on its face).

 

[FoxBlaze71]

I'm all for Smash being a viable competitive game, but to say "oh, characters don't matter" is pretty wrong in my eyes. New character are a big part of why people get excited for a new Smash.

I always roll my eyes when people say "Oh, it was ONLY the gameplay that made Smash what it is today!". That's true to a degree, but I believe it's the gameplay AND characters that made SSB a great series. It's the gameplay that gave the series its longevity among fans, sure, but it's the characters and overall Nintendo theme that gave it its charm, atmosphere, and appeal. I feel like Air Dash Online is what happens when you try to make a Smash-like game without the recognizable character aspect (As in, it fell flat on its face).

There are already a lot of "iconic" characters. Now, tell me why ****ing Wii Fit Trainer is necessary.

 

[MasterofMonster]

@ FoxBlaze71
I don't even know what's going on here. I said I will enjoy Smash with or without Mewtwo, and then you start talking about sxpressing Disappointment with the game to me or something. What do I have to do with this? I have no interest in being in any argument about Melee vs Brawl anyways.
And Melee HD can happen, yes. Please don't act as if you know what Nintendo will do.
Also, Wii-Fit Trainer is never necessary. Neither are most of the characters.

Done with this, btw.

@ Dinoman96
Yeah, we saw what happend to PSASBR. It really didn't have the characters for that type of game. Or the Gameplay, as the Super mechanic seems to be Another major thing that killed it.

Really, Smash has the best characters and gameplay (and variation) ever for a game like this.

 

[Dinoman96]

There are already a lot of "iconic" characters. Now, tell me why ****ing Wii Fit Trainer is necessary.

Perhaps Sakurai felt it was important to represent that era when Nintendo was finally back on top of the console market after years of middling to poor hardware sales? It's like how he choose Ice Climbers in Melee to represent early one-off arcadey NES games.

Once again, I understand that you want Melee-esque gameplay. Most people do. I just don't see why it has to be at the expense of everything else the game has to offer.

 

[ScottyWK]

Characters and gameplay are what made Smash amazing in the first place. Melee improved on both of these elements, adding a lot of great new characters and improving the gameplay to make exciting and fast-paced (I don't know anyone that played Smash 64 that liked it more than Melee). Brawl improved on characters, but took a MASSIVE step-back with gameplay. This, for the first time in the series, isolated players.

It Smash 4 doesn't make worthy strides in that department, it's going to receive the same acclaim. I'm not saying it will or won't - I'm just being realistic with how the community will react.

 

[FoxBlaze71]

@ FoxBlaze71
I don't even know what's going on here. I said I will enjoy Smash with or without Mewtwo, and then you start talking about sxpressing Disappointment with the game to me or something. What do I have to do with this? I have no interest in being in any argument about Melee vs Brawl anyways.
And Melee HD can happen, yes. Please don't act as if you know what Nintendo will do.
Also, Wii-Fit Trainer is never necessary. Neither are most of the characters.

Done with this, btw.

@ Dinoman96
Yeah, we saw what happend to PSASBR. It really didn't have the characters for that type of game. Or the Gameplay, as the Super mechanic seems to be Another major thing that killed it.

Really, Smash has the best characters and gameplay (and variation) ever for a game like this.

I believe you said Smash 4 will be good, which is what caused my disappointment. I highly doubt the casual market will be playing it in six years because HURR DURR CALL OF BADASS HETERO DUTY will have new installments by then and the gameplay won't be solid enough to keep people around.

@ Dinoman96 : I understand what you're getting at, but how many people do you think were serious about Wii Fit Trainer? It's doubtful sales are what got her in. It's doubtful sales got such a tangential, non-iconic character in. I know Sakurai likes to take old, forgotten characters and bring them back, but this merely seems to be a case of honoring some really dumb requests.

 

[Leonyx]

Well, this thread went downhill in a hurry...

 

[MasterofMonster]

@ FoxBlaze71
But I don't see why you have to be disappointed that I Think the game will be good. Brawl was good enough for me to be my most played game ever, and I am super hyped about this game already, and I will undoubtably play this game for many years. I've seen no indication that the gameplay won't be solid. In fact, it looks more solid than ever.
Anyways, as I said, I don't feel like arguing about this and getting on someone's bad side or so, but do know that you are fully allowed to be disappointed in the game as much as you want. And I will be happy about it until I see a reason not to. ^^

 

[FoxBlaze71]

It's easy to say that pre-release, but when it's a mess because nutSakurai failed to focus on basic things like balance and mechanics in favor of ridiculous character additions, you may not feel quite the same rush.

 

[MasterofMonster]

It's easy to say that pre-release, but when it's a mess because nutSakurai failed to focus on basic things like balance and mechanics in favor of ridiculous character additions, you may not feel quite the same rush.

They are focusing more on Balancing than ever (it is bound to be better than Melee in balance at this Point, and MetaKnight is obviously nerfed from Brawl). They have more new mechanics, and have bettered many old ones than ever. You really Think characters like Wii-Fit Trainer ruins all that?

That has no logic in it whatsoever.

 

[A Lucky Person]

He is continuously victorious in his goal with each release of the game. With each installment a fantastic amount of characters have been added.

Regardless of whether or not Ridley, K. Rool, Toad, Geno, Lip, Isaac, or that one obscure character the current reader of this post wants gets in it, Smash will continue to be the best mascot fighting franchise there is.

I can't wait for this game!

 

[Hydde]

I'm worried that the "sweet spot" Sakurai is aiming for won't actually be a sweet spot. He said he wanted to appeal to both newcomers to the franchise and Smash veterans, but followed it up again by stressing the new players to the franchise.

I just don't see why a game like Melee in terms of speed and techniques would turn off new players. Melee brought in a TON of new players, so speed obviously doesn't turn those people off.

Sakurai just doesnt know how to excuse himself, or how to say in nicer words what he really wants.

He mentions "smash veterans" and appeal to everyone, because im pretty sure nintendo is kind of pushing him to make the game tournament viable to some extent . I suppouse this because now we see Nintendo wanting to enter in the tournie scene to PROMOTE and merchandise Smash in a new way. I think this has something to do with the rought times Nintendo is facing right now. They just cannot let pass any opportunity to keep the boat afloat, and nowadays competitive games and broadcast are HUGE marketing. And Smash is their biggest title and will always be, as it attract masses.

Anyways going to back to Sak, i think Ninty has suggested him to make the game tournie viable.... and to some extent Sakurai has bended over a little... but he will not completely abandon his idea that smash is, in his eyes, a party game AND NOT a competitive game.

SO he will try as hard as he can to make the game Brawl-like, and at the same time,,, trying to do the less damage pòssible to the vocal hardcore fanbase. But we all know who will get te stick in the end, and those are the hardcore fans.

His talks about "sweetspots"...is just diplomatic talk. We all know that Sak deep inside , wants to keep his game far away from Melee´s gameplay.

Sometimes i feel Sakurai acts like if a random dude from Hal´s laboratory OBLIGED him to make Melee the game it was, and he got traumatized because of it, now looking to erradicate everything he did in melee.

 

[MasterofMonster]

He is continuously victorious in his goal with each release of the game. With each installment a fantastic amount of characters have been added.

Regardless of whether or not Ridley, K. Rool, Toad, Geno, Lip, Isaac, or that one obscure character the current reader of this post wants gets in it, Smash will continue to be the best mascot fighting franchise there is.

I can't wait for this game!

You are a lucky person to Think so.


So, yeah, I don't see what people are so worried about. Not everyone wants Another Melee. I am pretty sure most people prefered Brawl over Melee anyways. This game apparantly works more like Brawl, but is faster and much more balanced, and introduces a LOT of new battle styled and mechanics.

Melee isn't automatically better just because one loud majority Thinks so. Just because Melee works for all types of players, it doesn't mean Smash 4 won't as well.

 

[Dinoman96]

Sakurai just doesnt know how to excuse himself, or how to say in nicer words what he really wants.

He mentions "smash veterans" and appeal to everyone, because im pretty sure nintendo is kind of pushing him to make the game tournament viable to some extent . I suppouse this because now we see Nintendo wanting to enter in the tournie scene to PROMOTE and merchandise Smash in a new way. I think this has something to do with the rought times Nintendo is facing right now. They just cannot let pass any opportunity to keep the boat afloat, and nowadays competitive games and broadcast are HUGE marketing. And Smash is their biggest title and will always be, as it attract masses.

Anyways going to back to Sak, i think Ninty has suggested him to make the game tournie viable.... and to some extent Sakurai has bended over a little... but he will not completely abandon his idea that smash is, in his eyes, a party game AND NOT a competitive game.

SO he will try as hard as he can to make the game Brawl-like, and at the same time,,, trying to do the less damage pòssible to the vocal hardcore fanbase. But we all know who will get te stick in the end, and those are the hardcore fans.

His talks about "sweetspots"...is just diplomatic talk. We all know that Sak deep inside , wants to keep his game far away from Melee´s gameplay.

Sometimes i feel Sakurai acts like if a random dude from Hal´s laboratory OBLIGED him to make Melee the game it was, and he got traumatized because of it, now looking to erradicate everything he did in melee.

How much does Nintendo of Japan really care about the competitive scene, though? It seems like it's only mainly Nintendo of America doing that.

Sakurai has always been an auteur of sorts. Nintendo has basically so much faith and respect in him that they pretty much let him do whatever he wants, so I doubt there's been an influence from them from above. Remember that Iwata and Sakurai were tight together back at Hal Labs. Iwata has said on record that he feels that Sakurai is the best to lead a new Smash game.

 

[Hydde]

I am pretty sure most people prefered Brawl over Melee anyways.

Really?.
I would like to hear your reasoning on this

 

[FoxBlaze71]

You are a lucky person to Think so.


So, yeah, I don't see what people are so worried about. Not everyone wants Another Melee. I am pretty sure most people prefered Brawl over Melee anyways. This game apparantly works more like Brawl, but is faster and much more balanced, and introduces a LOT of new battle styled and mechanics.

Melee isn't automatically better just because one loud majority Thinks so. Just because Melee works for all types of players, it doesn't mean Smash 4 won't as well.

No, most people did NOT prefer Brawl over Melee. Hell, even quite a few people I've met who know nothing of competitive Smash and were your usual 10 stock all items on kind of scrubs but still thought Melee was more solid. Within the competitive community itself? Brawl is treated like the ******* child it is.

Like I said earlier, faster gameplay and meaningless new mechanics don't mean anything if the focus isn't put in the right place.

 

[Networker1]

Jut though I'd point out that in 10 years, Nintendo won't give a darn if people are playing smash 4 or not. They care that people will have bought Smash 4 and are now buying the next game in the franchise.

Sorry, but companies generally like making money, not making a single game to last forever.

 

[MasterofMonster]

Pretty sure they most do, yes. But as I have said multiple times, I have no interest in being in Another pointless argument about Brawl vs Melee. Especially not when apparantly Wii-Fit Trainer ruins balancing in the game somehow, lol.

Now, again, on topic.

Sakurai keeps outdoing himself with the games, and judging by the roster here, he will do it yet Another time. Even if the only remaining newcomers are Chorus Men, Shulk and Mewtwo*, the roster will be better than ever. And being the most likely most balanced Smash yet, can't wait to see some competetive battles involving Bowser for a change~¨

And Metaknight. Whom Bowser is apparantly still the best counter to. For some reason.

 

[FoxBlaze71]

You don't get balance by tossing in every random character you can think of. Sakurai overstretched himself in Brawl and we ended up with Beta Knight and his godlike priority.

 

[MasterofMonster]

I'm pretty sure it doesn't matter what character you put it. Wii-Fit Trainer isn't random, and she has nothing to do with balancing. Except for on Balance boards...

They have a much bigger team now. A whole different studio to help them. Many more that works specifically on balancing. And no gigantic SSE to take away time from. They have specifically said they are balancing this game very hard. And I still don't see why you Think 'random characters' will make the game unbalanced.

 

[Hydde]

How much does Nintendo of Japan really care about the competitive scene, though? It seems like it's only mainly Nintendo of America doing that.

Sakurai has always been an auteur of sorts. Nintendo has basically so much faith and respect in him that they pretty much let him do whatever he wants, so I doubt there's been an influence from them from above. Remember that Iwata and Sakurai were tight together back at Hal Labs. Iwata has said on record that he feels that Sakurai is the best to lead a new Smash game.

Still, at simple view, something has changed in Nintendo.
They want to promote their game in a tournament enviroment. If the game is not good for tournament play, then why they are doing this?. If it was for hype, they would have done that in Brawl too.
I still think the enviroment is influencing in their decitions.

Also, i think Sakurai is a good developer and he is the best in terms of producing smash games, its just his mentality towards hardcore gamers that **** ups all his good work.

 

[FoxBlaze71]

@ MasterofMonster : You're forgetting two very basic things.

1.) Wii Fit Trainer is a completely random choice and waste of a character slot, and not just her.

2.) Sakurai is still at the helm and he will do his best to make it a random party game that will inevitably be unbalanced because of the way it's structured.

 

[Hydde]

I'm pretty sure it doesn't matter what character you put it. Wii-Fit Trainer isn't random, and she has nothing to do with balancing. Except for on Balance boards...

They have a much bigger team now. A whole different studio to help them. Many more that works specifically on balancing. And no gigantic SSE to take away time from. They have specifically said they are balancing this game very hard. And I still don't see why you Think 'random characters' will make the game unbalanced.

Random characters from different franchises is what makes this game appealing.
Badly implemented characters like Meta knight and Poketrainer is what Sakurai needs to avoid.

IM pretty sure the SSE killed Brawl. I have no doubts about it...because the SSE was almost a standalone game. Sak was nuts to do it. A supremely bad decition.