Rumor Confirmed- Havok Physics in Brawl

[susu_atari]

I'm looking forward to playing it with the new engine. It doesn't matter what's new, to be honest. Brawl is not Melee, and I'm looking forward to playing Brawl.

 

[Jaykizzle]

propz to the post above me

 

[Stuhddabahkz]

i personally think that if they were to take out those barriers it would mean many suicides in the near future. so no barriers would = bad.

Nah. You must not have seen the Nintendo World trailer extra footage. We all know what a tech is, right? When you press L/R as you land while in the stunned animation. Anyway, in the extra footage, Pikachu tech'd, and rolled off to the right as she landed.. right off the platform. She rolled off the stage, but, was near a ledge, and grabbed it. So, rolling may become the new way to edgehog. So in someway, those invisible walls are gone, which is good, IMO. Still getting hit even when you dodged because you ran out of platform = fail. If you think rolling off the stage is bad, I'd suggest learning to dodge (L + down (like I need to). But you'll probably grab the ledge if you decide to roll, so, it's all good in my book.

EDIT: Oops. I was sorta wrong. I went to check my sources to make sure I was right, I was wrong on some minor s---, so, quoted from Smashwiki (Wiki IS our friend), here you go:

Smashboards user Devastlian, while watching the footage, noticed what appears to be a gameplay tweak in Brawl. In the last scene of the short trailer, Pikachu is attacked in the air, causing him to tumble onto a platform. After very briefly laying on his side Pikachu avoids an attack from Pit by what appears to be a roll, which can be done in SSBM by simply hitting left or right on the joystick when laying on the ground. What Devastlian noticed was that Pikachu rolled right off the side of the platform and down onto the main platform of the stage. In SSBM, the character would simply stand up at the edge of the platform. It appears that the roll is a bit faster than other trailer footage of characters rolling, so some argue that the animation is a tech.Regardless, this small detail was an interesting find for SSBB anticipators.

The said thread can be found here: http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=95137&highlight=Devastlian
Said footage: http://www.gametrailers.com/umwatcher.php?id=41546

 

[Jakatsu]

I got a feeling that the Havok Physics Engine won't be the actual Physics engine. I'm sure the team molded it to do what they wanted, Ie. Destructible objects, Thrown Objects, and Footstools. It wont effect game play other than what Sakurai's team wants.

 

[Ophelius]

Home Run Contest with the new physics = Ophelius + Jimbo's car = PWNED!!!

 

[Littleonetwo]

So, rolling may become the new way to edgehog. So in someway, those invisible walls are gone, which is good, IMO. Still getting hit even when you dodged because you ran out of platform = fail. If you think rolling off the stage is bad, I'd suggest learning to dodge (L + down (like I need to). But you'll probably grab the ledge if you decide to roll, so, it's all good in my book.

well what i meant was just rolling off and being unable to do anything kinda like when you >B with Falcon off an edge. if you could use it to edgehog, which i thought was possible in Melee, it would be fine with me that way.

P.S. i also need to work on my Dodge.

 

[Stuhddabahkz]

well what i meant was just rolling off and being unable to do anything kinda like when you >B with Falcon off an edge. if you could use it to edgehog, which i thought was possible in Melee, it would be fine with me that way.

P.S. i also need to work on my Dodge.

Nah, you'd have to WD in order to edgehog, or short hop off the stage. If you rolled, you'd just stop at the edge.

 

[DippnDots]

Thank god guitar hero 3 is gonna have this physics engine.

 

[Stuhddabahkz]

Thank god guitar hero 3 is gonna have this physics engine.

I've been wonderin' - what does Guitar Heroes need physics for?

 

[Littleonetwo]

I've been wonderin' - what does Guitar Heroes need physics for?

lol thats a good question, the only thing i can think of would be in like the background would be random animations that react realistically with each other.

but it would seem kinda pointless.

 

[Exoah]

So... lets say you and a opponent get thrown into the air at eachother would you collide in midair or is it only with things like the footstool jump?

 

[Drascin]

Really?!?! I didnt know that, I just thought it looked very similar to melee.

So what the heck is with all these people saying brawls going to be an entirely new game and should be completly different from melee like the transition from super smash 64 to melee?

I am one of those people. And, you know, it's not an statement, it's a wish . I'd like it if it was very very different. If I want to play melee, I still have melee, right? Of course, if Melee's engine was indeed heavily used, this will probably won't be the case.

 

[Moon Monkey]

If the characters are now a ''mass'' and cannot pass through eachother, then that would be horrible for smashbros.

Why? Because when you're doing a 1v1 with a fast character like fox vs a swordsman like marth, and you KILL marth, and he comes back all invincible and stuff, you cant attack him. You gotta run. How are you gonna do that?

Are you gonna roll backwards and forwards like a gay noob? are you going to hang on the edge which can really put you in a bad position vs marth sometimes? Or are you going to simply run back and forth on the stage, dodging his attacks without worrying about colliding with marth himself.

If you bump into your opponent and you dont go anywhere, that forces you to jump over your invincible opponent, probably even double jump since a normal fullhop will probably get you punished anyway.

But once you land from jumping awkwardly over marth instead of just running through him, he'll probably grab you, chainthrow you, and tipper you a la M2k or Ken.

So I hope that you can still pass through characters while running. Remember that in both 64 and in melee you can ''push'' your opponent by walking very slowly. This is useful basically for positioning an opponent for a combo after having just broken his shield (See isai's ssb64 vids for details)

Anyhow, this havok thing sounds like its a quality physics system. I look forward to what it brings, I just hope it doesn't change what I mentioned above.

But you can already pass through people, they tell us in the Gooey bomb update

 

[vZakat]

how will this effect disjointed hitboxes? If characters are "solid masses" now, I can't imagine being able to fsmash through anything (i.e. marth through the tree on PK stadium).

 

[smash_fo_life]

crack down(360) used the havoc engine

 

[Keku]

Imagine a level with a lot of crates and other items on it, and then a Devil-AT appearing. I bet it'll look quite neat when the stage turns around and the crates and barrels are bouncing around and falling into nothingness. I don't think it's going to affect the characters all that much though.

 

[Mistle]

Umm, I don't know if any of you have noticed this yet, but it's not on the website anymore o_O

Either Nintendo didn't want us to know yet, or it was false news.

 

[Takeshi245]

Umm, I don't know if any of you have noticed this yet, but it's not on the website anymore o_O

Either Nintendo didn't want us to know yet, or it was false news.

Could you show us the hyperlink?

Edit: It was on the first page. Sorry about that.

 

[Stuhddabahkz]

Oh ****, he's right. It's gone.

 

[Takeshi245]

What's this suppose to mean? Any ideas?

 

[MookieRah]

If you guys are referring to the paragraph about the melee code, that is from the old page that was taken down. It was archived though, and here is the link:
http://web.archive.org/web/20060717223706/www.smashbros.com/en/story/page_3.html
The 10th paragraph is what I quoted.

I am one of those people. And, you know, it's not an statement, it's a wish . I'd like it if it was very very different. If I want to play melee, I still have melee, right?

I want it to be different as well, but probably not like what you are wanting. I want them to improve upon Melee with their additions. I do not want change for the sake of change though, which is not a solid way to go seeing how Melee has outsold every other gamecube game.

 

[Ondo]

I've been wonderin' - what does Guitar Heroes need physics for?

It doesn't. The page lists games that use any Havok product. Guitar Hero is almost certainly using Havok Animation, not Havok Physics. It's possible the same is true of Brawl.

 

[SCOTU]

several comments.
1: Brawl isn't on that list on the havoc site when i just checked.
2: That list said only utilizing Havok Producs, which includes animation libraries, and collision detection.
3: say it does uses Havok Physics, Probably only for collision detection. It'll probably run on the same physics in melee.
4: Melee uses a physics engine too you realize, just not for physics really, for hitbox/ hurtbox collisions.

 

[Sanjuinuthus]

Imagine a level with a lot of crates and other items on it, and then a Devil-AT appearing. I bet it'll look quite neat when the stage turns around and the crates and barrels are bouncing around and falling into nothingness. I don't think it's going to affect the characters all that much though.

I thought the Devil AT scrolls the stage, not tilts it.

 

[cccck]

I thought the Devil AT scrolls the stage, not tilts it.

You thought right.

 

[blayde_axel]

Off-topic: Recently played Devil world... it's actually pretty fun!

On-Topic: I think we need to see some thorough gameplay to see a huge difference... some clips aren't gonna help.

Besides what someone pointed out about the Cracker Launcher's reaction to players. They said that Bowser was blasted "realistically..." I don't see a difference between melee and brawl. lol.

 

[Kazuya]

great engine, I read it over a few times, looks really good.

 

[Banks]

looks like they are involved in many big games, should be good

 

[freddybones]

It pretty much means it'll use the physics engine though. All of Havoc's products are tied heavily to it's physics engine. Even if they're using Havoc Animation or Havoc FX, they almost have to use the physics engine as well. It's just how the software works.

 

[behemoth]

It pretty much means it'll use the physics engine though. All of Havoc's products are tied heavily to it's physics engine. Even if they're using Havoc Animation or Havoc FX, they almost have to use the physics engine as well. It's just how the software works.

Almost being the key word. Although, knowing how expensive (rightfully so) packages like the Havok package are, it would be a waste of money not to use it.

If they have completely switched over to a Havok-based physics engine, and if indeed wavedashing was an accidental by-product of the old engine, then byebye wavedash. For them to "put" it into Brawl would be over the top as far as development manpower, because of the way licensed engines work. It still could be done, but would be a big pain in the neck.

 

[TheManaLord]

looks like they took it off the list

 

[raptorbaby10]

looks like they took it off the list

What does that mean?

 

[Fastinyoh]

Havok has been featured in countless recent games. Some have bad / not noteworthy physics, and some (HL2, etc) have great physics.

It all depends on how well they implement Havok's capabilities into the game.

 

[Link Sharingan]

this is good i tink

 

[Unknownlight]

What does that mean?

It means that the Havok website no longer states that Brawl uses the Havok engine. Was it all just a lie?

 

[Zantetsu]

It means that the Havok website no longer states that Brawl uses the Havok engine. Was it all just a lie?

Yes it was a lie

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=115267

 

[Scissors Sir]

Why would anyone think that you're not gonna be able to walk or run through other characters?

Can anyone say gooey bomb?

After it's stuck to you, you can transfer it to another character by running through them.

That alone tells u that u can

If this was already covered in this thread my apology..

I was just too lazy to read past page 2