Roster Prediction Discussion Thread

[Arcanir]

...I'm drawing a blank here.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Not sure if getting the entire shtick of his character or genuinely asking.

(The joke is that everybody forgets about him all the time in-game.)

What is up with these weird blank spaces anyway? Some kind of programming bug?

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Clearly what I'm trying to get across is being mistooken entirely. Ridley is necessary, but not essential. Maybe I worded it wrong, but one could even argue that Mario & Luigi are all that are necessary, but it's opinion, k. Clearly Ridley is deserving and necessary for obvious reasons, but I don't feel he is absolutely essential to get by in Smash Brothers 4 as a playable character.

Uh...not to be a ****, but i'm studying to be an English Teacher.

Necessary is basically the same thing as essential.

 

[?????????????]

Clearly what I'm trying to get across is being mistooken entirely. Ridley is necessary, but not essential. Maybe I worded it wrong, but one could even argue that Mario & Luigi are all that are necessary, but it's opinion, k. Clearly Ridley is deserving and necessary for obvious reasons, but I don't feel he is absolutely essential to get by in Smash Brothers 4 as a playable character.

Nope. If he was THAT essential, he would have been in Brawl.

...That's my feeling anyway.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Wait wait wait...are we really getting into a discussion where two Samus' are better than Samus and Ridley? I need to lie down...

Considering there are so many forms of our hero and this one in particular is rather important I'd say yes. Just like I'd say Toon Link is a better idea than Ganondorf. (which it originally was to Sakurai during Melee.

 

[TumblrFamous]

Now, this is all hypothetical, but if I'm going into Devil's Advocate extremities on this point...

This means that Samus, Zero Suit Samus, Fusion Suit Samus, Gravity Suit Samus, etc. should outprioritize Ridley in SSB.

Thus, this means that Mario, Baby Mario, Raccoon Mario, Metal Mario, Dr. Mario, etc. should outprioritize Bowser in SSB.

Please don't. I'm just saying that Samus is Zero Suit Samus. She was added in Brawl to be part of Samus's moveset, yet as her own playable character.

It's a stupid argument, that's what I'm trying to say. Ridley should have been the next character instead of ZSS, but wasn't. ZSS, who represents another part of herself, got in instead. Dr. Mario and Mario, for example, were planned to be two different characters, as two different slots. ZSS and Samus, while counting as two different players, share the slot name of SAMUS. Which means they are both the main character Samus. So, yes, Samus outprioritizes Ridley, IMO, if and only if they are counted towards the same slot.

 

[Johnknight1]

My point exactly. It's just toobigot fodder from people who have never played a Metroid game, and yet know too few people will call them out on this.

If we only played as the main playable characters in other games, we wouldn't have a lot of the playable characters thus far, like Peach (she's only been playable in a few games), Bowser (he's only been playable in RPG's and spin-offs), Ganondorf, Zelda, Sheik, Falco (multiplayer Star Fox aside), Wolf (same as Falco), any number of Pokémon (technically we're the trainer), Captain Falcon (outside of his in the ship action), etc.

 

[Hotfeet444]

Clearly what I'm trying to get across is being mistooken entirely. Ridley is necessary, but not essential. Maybe I worded it wrong, but one could even argue that Mario & Luigi are all that are necessary, but it's opinion, k. Clearly Ridley is deserving and necessary for obvious reasons, but I don't feel he is absolutely essential to get by in Smash Brothers 4 as a playable character.

He's the main villain and the reason the series exists, how much more essential do you need to be? It's like saying Link is the main hero of the game, and even though there are villains who are orchestrating the plot and are the reason said plot exists, Link is all we need.

Edit: Your argument doesn't hold weight, especially when you compare said logic other franchises.

 

[?????????????]

Please don't.

Aw, okay. But it's so fun!

 

[Johnknight1]

Uh...not to be a ****, but i'm studying to be an English Teacher.

Necessary is basically the same thing as essential.

I thought they were synonyms.

Also, in after Grammar Nazi Teacher.

*waits for someone to make an accountant joke*

 

[TumblrFamous]

*waits for someone to make an accountant joke*

*Sweats nervously*
Um... pennies!

 

[MargnetMan23]

Uh...not to be a ****, but i'm studying to be an English Teacher.

Necessary is basically the same thing as essential.

OK I will admit Ridley is way too large but he is NOT too big!

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I thought they were synonyms.

Also, in after Grammar Nazi Teacher.

*waits for someone to make an accountant joke*

Well yes. If I were to tell you, "It is absolutely necessary that you finish reading that book", and then said to somebody else, "It is essential that you do the reading" it means the same thing. So yes. They are synonymous.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Uh...not to be a ****, but i'm studying to be an English Teacher.

Necessary is basically the same thing as essential.

I assumed Necessary justifies having a damn good reason for something, and that essential means you literally HAVE to do something.

He's the main villain and the reason the series exists, how much more essential do you need to be? It's like saying Link is the main hero of the game, and even though there are villains who are orchestrating the plot and are the reason said plot exists, Link is all we need.

• Nintendo is the reason the series exists
• Unlike other characters, I'd say he's about as essential as the last 3 games.
• Being important to canon will justify your appearance as much as Demise & James McCloud. I would have use the fact that he's the most iconic to justify his inclusion.

Ridley should have been the next character instead of ZSS

That's opinion.

 

[BKupa666]

Zero Suit Samus is more important than Ridley, just like Tanooki Mario is more important than Bowser, Fierce Deity Link is more important than Ganondorf, and Fighter Kirby is more important than King Dedede. Obviously.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Zero Suit Samus is more important than Ridley, just like Tanooki Mario is more important than Bowser, Fierce Deity Link is more important than Ganondorf, and Fighter Kirby is more important than King Dedede. Obviously.

Good examples (not at all)

 

[Hotfeet444]

• Nintendo is the reason the series exists
• Unlike other characters, I'd say he's about as essential as the last 3 games.
• Being important to canon will justify your appearance as much as Demise & James McCloud. I would have use the fact that he's the most iconic to justify his inclusion.

Have you even played a Metroid game before?

 

[Ridley_Prime]

Those "deserving" debates of Ridley vs Zero Suit Samus never end well, but BKupa pretty much summed it up, as well as my thoughts on the matter. pizzadude I guess nailed it pretty well too.

 

[BKupa666]

Good examples (not at all)

Enlighten me as to how they're different.

 

[Johnknight1]

*Sweats nervously*
Um... pennies!

*sigh*
I was expecting "don't fudge your post count numbers."

Because if I did, I could finally crack that elusive top 12 list in terms of post count on Smash Boards!

 

[TumblrFamous]

Ridley is the reason Samus is who she is...he's the very reason the series exists. Zero Suit Samus is still Samus, and was a single overall form used by her for combat and exploration in one title. Ridley is just as important to the franchise as Samus.

Well yes, and I never said that. Ridley certainly is. But Samus just simply got an extension instead to represent the other side of her in Brawl. Being under the same slot, the two of them are still Samus together. The main hero outprioritized the villain, that's all. I don't think it was necessarily fair, but it happened like that, and I think it's because Sakurai found that pushing Samus to her full potential in that she gets an entirely new form was more necessary than having the next best thing.

I think Ridley definitely should have been in in Brawl, he is the second most important character, losing only to Samus. It's just I think it can be understood why ZSS got in instead of Ridley.

But Ridley is certainly essential to the franchise.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

I think what Tumblr was trying to say is that ZSS Samus is Samus while also a very important persona of her in the series. Comparing that to Tanooki Mario is pretty dumb. Not to mention it was technically an addition to an already existing character on the roster even if it wasn't by much.

 

[Johnknight1]

Have you even played a Metroid game before?

Yeah, Ridley has been in all of them, sans Metroid II (which wasn't that popular), Metroid Prime Hunters (kind of a spin-off), and Metroid Prime 2: Echoes.

And in Metroid Prime 2: Echoes' case, incomplete data suggest he was originally gonna be in that game.

On top of that, Ridley's Space Pirate crew is the reason for a lot of the stuff that happened in that game happens, including the creation of Metroid Prime, aka Dark Samus, which is the ultimate foe/enemy in the sub-series of Metroid known as the Metroid Prime Trilogy.

 

[Zhadgon]

Once, again I'm not talking about who is most important to a series, but who is absolutely necessary as a playable character that we clearly can't get by without.

Then I will tell you this Luigi, Bowser, Peach, Falco, Meta Knight, Dedede, Diddy Kong, Zelda, Ganondorf, Falco, Wolf are in the same boat as Rdiley as to what they represent to their series respectively. The worst thing for Metroid is that between all the series is the one which need more the boost than anyone else in Smash. If ridley would be a playable character in the time of Melee probably no one will be arguing to have another character from Metroid (especially because it has the two mayor characters Samus and Ridley).
.n_n.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I assumed Necessary justifies having a damn good reason for something, and that essential means you literally HAVE to do something.

• Nintendo is the reason the series exists
• Unlike other characters, I'd say he's about as essential as the last 3 games.
• Being important to canon will justify your appearance as much as Demise & James McCloud. I would have use the fact that he's the most iconic to justify his inclusion.

That's opinion.

Nope. They're the same thing.

Stop making nonsensical arguments.

Sure Nintendo made the game, but it is Ridley's role in the storyline that gets the ball rolling. He is essential/necessary to the plot for the rest of the events to occur. Ridley is much different from Demise and James McCloud. Ridley reappears in important roles on a regular basis, while James is merely referenced or makes cameo appearances in 64 and Assault. Demise is basically Ganondorf, thus already in Smash Bros.

 

[Rebellious Treecko]

Ridley is more important to Metroid than Zero-Suit Samus. End of story.

ZSS should be able to be selected on the character screen like Sheik.

----

 

[Johnknight1]

Nintendo is the reason the series exists

People buying Nintendo games, hardware, and whatnot is the reason Nintendo continues to exist, herpa derpa.

 

[Hotfeet444]

I think what Tumblr was trying to say is that ZSS Samus is Samus while also a very important persona of her in the series. Comparing that to Tanooki Mario is pretty dumb. Not to mention it was technically an addition to an already existing character on the roster even if it wasn't by much.

Zero Suit Samus = form from one small part in Zero Mission.
Tanooki Mario = A rare form obtainable in multiple Mario games

If anything, Tanooki Mario is more important than Zero Suit Samus, because at least it was used essentially in more than one game while Samus never touched that emergency pistol after Zero Mission.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

People buying Nintendo games, hardware, and whatnot is the reason Nintendo continues to exist, herpa derpa.

I lol'd

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Have you even played a Metroid game before?

I don't need to play Metroid to know that Ridley is the most iconic and basically the Bowser of the series, but that doesn't mean he's more essential to Smash than ZSS clearly.
We need to clarify that there is a difference between who is absolutely needed for Smash, and who clearly should be in it. God forbid somebody thinks ZSS is a better and more ideal addition then our almighty Ridley. Which one of those people is Sakura, btw.

 

[Hotfeet444]

I don't need to play Metroid to know that Ridley is the most iconic and basically the Bowser of the series, but that doesn't mean he's more essential to Smash than ZSS clearly.
We need to clarify that there is a difference between who is absolutely needed for Smash, and who clearly should be in it. God forbid somebody thinks ZSS is a better and more ideal addition then our almighty Ridley. Which one of those people is Sakura, btw.

So I'll take that as a no...that explains so much. Why not leave the discussion of Metroid to the people that actually play the games?

 

[BKupa666]

I think what Tumblr was trying to say is that ZSS Samus is Samus while also a very important persona of her in the series. Comparing that to Tanooki Mario is pretty dumb. Not to mention it was technically an addition to an already existing character on the roster even if it wasn't by much.

What's different about Samus' persona in and out of her suit? And why is the 'persona' of the Zero Suit different than the 'personas' of any of the other suits she wears? Sakurai choosing to attach an additional moveset to Samus' Final Smash as a gimmick (and as an easier character to program than Ridley) doesn't render her more important within her series of origin.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

If anything, Tanooki Mario is more important than Zero Suit Samus, because at least it was used essentially in more than one game while Samus never touched that emergency pistol after Zero Mission.

You realize Samus has been out of her suit in other games besides Zero Mission and is one of the more interesting and notable parts of that character, right? Now I ask if YOU have played Metroid.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

Your reaction: there is only one Metroid rep. Seamus riding Ridley.

 

[Deleted member]

Game & Watch's moveset was pretty good in Melee. The problem was his defense sucks, due to him having weird defensive frame amounts and how easy it was to juggle him.

Ness just had frame issues. He had too much pre- and post-move lag, and too little range. Oh, and his recovery sucked. In Smash 64, this all was less of an issue. His moveset truth be told is pretty amazing, it is just it hasn't been fully realized in terms of how great it could be if he got it going on a few cylinders.

And all Mewtwo needed was a few buffs as to not be pathetically lobbed around like a pinball so easily.

 

[Johnknight1]

I lol'd

Nintendo didn't lol so hard when they found out people need to buy the Wii U in order to buy Wii U games and play them, and thus satisfy customers and 3rd party game companies.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I don't need to play Metroid to know that Ridley is the most iconic and basically the Bowser of the series, but that doesn't mean he's more essential to Smash than ZSS clearly.
We need to clarify that there is a difference between who is absolutely needed for Smash, and who clearly should be in it. God forbid somebody thinks ZSS is a better and more ideal addition then our almighty Ridley. Which one of those people is Sakura, btw.

>gets shot down
>uses Sakurai as his argument

That isn't what it means at all. If characters that are added first are the "essential" characters, why are there going to be 5 Smash Bros games, each building the roster? Bowser wasn't in 64. Guess he wasn't essential. Oh wait, he was in Melee. As was Peach, Zelda, Falco, Ganondorf, Young Link, etc... Diddy Kong must not have been essential because he wasn't in Melee. Oh wait. He's in Brawl.

This argument is pointless and doesn't really mean anything. Can we please just change the subject to something that won't get heated?

 

[Gene]

Spoiler

 

[Johnknight1]

Your reaction: there is only one Metroid rep. Seamus riding Ridley.

My reaction is a question:

Is Ridley topless like the hookers in GTA V=???

Also, why isn't Ridley riding Samus=???

 

[Hotfeet444]

You realize Samus has been out of her suit in other games besides Zero Mission and is one of the more interesting and notable parts of that character, right? Now I ask if YOU have played Metroid.

It was never used in the same context as it was for Zero Mission. In Zero Mission it's a fast but weak form you use to sneak your way through the Space Pirate mothership, in every other game it's just her clothing and never used in any sort of combat ever, not even being able to play as Samus in said form either. And interesting and notable? The only thing interesting and notable is how much it shows off her ass.

And please, don't play sarcasm with me when you yourself haven't played Metroid.